European Politics Thread.

[chops 111]

Everything you've described above sounds like the fault of British people doing the wrong thing, from the temp agencies, to the factory managers.

A lot of people here in Australia are pissed off that their manufacturing jobs have disappeared to China, tabloid media would have you believe it's the fault of the Asian Hordes plotting the downfall of down under, when in fact it's Australian/multinational companies making the decisions, who just plain don't give a fuck about anything but the money.

[Sennacherib 0]

Everything you've described above sounds like the fault of British people doing the wrong thing, from the temp agencies, to the factory managers.

A lot of people here in Australia are pissed off that their manufacturing jobs have disappeared to China, tabloid media would have you believe it's the fault of the Asian Hordes plotting the downfall of down under, when in fact it's Australian/multinational companies making the decisions, who just plain don't give a fuck about anything but the money.

yeah, this is the same thing, in all the occidental countries.

but China doesn't follow the rules of WTO. an example: the chinese money should increase its valor.

i think that the world will know a general crisis in the near future. why?

- Overpopulation (in poor countries); immigration increasingly important; unemployment; poverty; declining resources or an excessive cost (metals, oil, water ...)

[Sheps 0]

I can only hope that when Poland goes to the Euro it won't be worth their time to stay, creating more jobs for British people.

The companies are the worst of them, sad thing is i have to go through them because pretty much every job here employs through them.

Theres only ever been one company that has ever proven to me that they will put a British person before a Foreign worker, the rest of the job agencies will easily hire a Eastern Euro any day as they can under pay them.

At the end of the day the government doesn't give a toss, British companies can get rich off of foreign labour when they move their factories abroad, and then sell them back to us with even greater profit.

I think its just all effed up, pretty much every major organization uses Indian call centres, alot of the factories are being moved to places like China, and now Europeans are taking alot of the jobs, atleast in my case.

Im sure there will be major repercussions in the future if things carry on the way they do.

I mean we constantly can't get work, and the foreigners get slave wages that only gives them enough to make it through. At the end of the day, whos going to be left to pay for their overpriced crap if none of us can get work?

[echo1 0]

As an Irish person, I was curious to know what other European folk around here think of our rejection of the Lisbon Treaty/Reform Treaty. Any opinions?

[lwlooz 0]

Hello there,

my reaction to the Irish "vote" is utter and complete disbelief.

That the people of a nation that profited a lot from the European Union don't care about EU matters(45% only voted afaik) or simple vote "No" because they haven't got a clue what the "Lisbon Treaty" is about reinforces my somewhat cynic view that people in general(No just the irish) are way too stupid for any direct democracy to take place.

Thats why we have representative democracies in the first place.

I read up on the arguments of the "No" campaign and I simply can't believe people still buy the "Rich unelected elitist Bruessels bureaucrats are going to take away all our freedom, long LIVE NATIONALISM!!!" crap in a globalised world where our little european nations will achieve fuck all if everyone acts by himself.

The "Lisbon Treaty" isn't perfect , but it is way better than what we have now , alone that should qualify for a "Yes" vote.

I am really disappointed that the politicians and media of all European countries again and again fail to point out that our era of peace and prosperity in Western Europe (hopefully in Eastern Europe in the future as well) is largely the consequence of European cooperation(economical AND political) and therefore an achievement of the EU as well.

I do wonder how long we want to keep on with the farce and if we shouldn't just split Europe up into an "Trade&Security Cooperation Union"

and a core political union that can tackle important issues without being sabotaged by people who seem to care little about cooperation in the first place.

Of course that has little to do with the idealistic idea that instead of fighting each other the european nations work together to achieve a better future , but alas the euro-sceptics seem to be spreading out of the UK and winning over the popular opinion in other countries as well.

Just another sad day for europe it is.

[xawery 0]

Well put Lwlooz. I couldn't believe my eyes when I read it; if there's one country that has profited from the EU, it's Ireland.

What irks me are the reasons why people voted no. Worries about Irish sovereignty as well as sheer ignorance were on the top of the list. This treaty is the first to codify the subsidiarity principle! If one's worried about independence, one should vote in favour of the treaty.

What really worries me is that 75% of the nay-sayers actually believe that negotiations about the treaty can be opened again and that voting no will have no negative consequences for Ireland's economy. Well, if they think they can repeat Nice 2001 I fear they're in for a nasty surprise. If anything, Ireland is losing influence. If the idea of a political two-speed Europe (something I oppose) actually takes ground, Ireland will find itself at the short end of the stick.

I am against a political two-speed Europe because it would mean a victory for the Anglo-Saxon efforts to undermine European unity. I admit it does sound appealing on a basic level, kind of like "don't want to play by our rules? get the fuck out of the sandbox then". But what good will it do? Sure, we might get more things done in the short-term, but it will cost us territory and economic power. The EU has always been a long-term project; the EU would do better to stay an inclusive club and exercise its soft power to get people in line. If we can get the British to ratify the Lissabon Treaty, anything is possible given time. And we have time...

It's just like with the expansion of the EU. Many people (including myself at the time) were opposed to the idea; the EU should have consolidated instead of accepting even more members. However, expansion was strategically a very sound move. Given Russia's increased assertiveness, expanding the EU was a brilliant move of snatching away the countries which Russia could try to pull into its own zone of influence. No wonder the Russians threw such a fit over Kosovo; Serbia was the last foothold of Russian influence on mainland Europe.

On an unrelated note: take a look at this CNN item on

. Pure gold I especially love how text blocks like "NEW TREATY" suddenly appear square in the middle of the screen. Kind of reminds me of

[opteryx 1562]

I recently watched a rather interesting lecture about a charity organization that goes by the name of Common Purpose, you can watch it here:

http://video.google.com/videopl....purpose

Some might say it's rather controversial, perhaps even befitting of the Tinfoil hat stamp, but at any rate I found it intriguing.

I was wondering if anybody here have had any personal contact with this organization and what is your experience and/or opinion about it.

[Baff1 0]

I've heard of these people once before in online forums.

I looked up what they do, they are a government quango.

A charity that works for the government training and recruiting and placing staff in government offices or as government advisors.

@CH 123's post above....Go Ireland. Nice to see a country where democracy still means something.

[chops 111]

I was living in Ireland when they voted 'No' to the Nice Treaty. What really made me giggle was that some government minister or official of some kind was, iirc fired, because for some reason, it was his fault that it got voted down.

Didn't they just have another vote at the next election anyway? "If you vote no, we'll just keep having elections until you vote they way we want."

[Sennacherib 0]

France is officially in economic recession; sad

[echo1 0]

@CH 123's post above....Go Ireland. Nice to see a country where democracy still means something.

It didnt really help that the EU's sole incentive for us to vote in favour was something to the rough effect of "Vote yes or we will get angry, you ungrateful bastards...", without really explaining why it was all necessary, and why exactly concerns about our sovereignty and neutrality were supposedly rubbish as was claimed but never elaborated upon. The big problem with the "But the EU did great things for Ireland" argument is that whilst that is true, it doesnt automatically mean that the EU will continue to do so and that we should always trust them. Over here, we call that sort of thing a confidence trick.

[Baff1 0]

Perversely they will continue to do exactly that as long as you have them over a barrel.

Over here we just do whatever they tell us and resent it a lot.

[Second 0]

I'm not expert and writing about these things in english is soooo tiring and frusturating, that i'll just say.

Ireland saying 'NO' to EU was good thing, result was approved. Then again aftermath of it showed once again that democracy and support of people in EU isn't as important than building stronger EU. I got feeling of temporarily set-back. Sadly it seems that from people's point of view EU is now going to be built stronger behind curtains of bureaucracy, not in front of people.

EU doesn't have much of support anywhere in EU, i believe (isn't the supporting side in minority pretty much everywhere?) . More and more it's seems to be giant faceless mastodont, which simply doesn't care about how people sees it. It would be much more nicer to belong to European-federation which i can support, current path seesm to be more the opposite.

My writing is bit rough, but i don't feel like smoothing the edges so it's bit black and white. I've noticed that politics is one of hardest thing to write about when using third language.

[Thunderbird 0]

I would like to point the finger at the interventions and the unsightly decisions of our president Sarkozy who disgraces the republican values and the French values. By deciding to dismantle the Gypsies camps within the French territories and by differentiating the French people according to their origins, He made France fall into Vichy's regime like in 40-45 ...

I would like to highlight that 70 % of the French population gets indignant at these acts and are against these shameful decisions, and that the French government is not representative of the French global opinion.

Most of us here, wait for 2012 to get ride of this blinkered president.

Regards,

TB

Edited August 15, 2010 by Thunderbird

[Prydain 1]

the French global opinion.

?

Most of us here, wait for 2012 to get ride of this blinkered president.

Try having Gordon Brown, an actual walking diplegic, abusive, retard-fuckhole as head of government. Sarkozy ain't got shit on Brown. Firstly, Sarkozy was elected so think yourself lucky.

[Big Mac 19]

Try having Gordon Brown, an actual walking diplegic, abusive, retard-fuckhole as head of government. Sarkozy ain't got shit on Brown. Firstly, Sarkozy was elected so think yourself lucky.

Please Bush tops em all.

"Too many good docs are getting out of the business. Too many OB-GYNs aren't able to practice their love with women all across this country."

or this one

"Our enemies are innovative and resourceful, and so are we. They never stop thinking about new ways to harm our country and our people, and neither do we."

Edited August 15, 2010 by Big Mac

[Devil Dogs SF 13]

I thought Bush was a funny guy xD

[Big Mac 19]

I thought Bush was a funny guy xD

No just scary in his stupidity. If he did stand up or had his own sitcom then he would have been funny.

[TechnoTerrorist303 10]

Lol. Problem is now instead of Brown we have Cameron who seems to be attempting to break the record of how many stupid things he can say in his first 6 months.

Junior partner in WW II, Pakistan exports terrorism etc.

Bush and Camerwrong would have been a fantastic double act.

[Big Mac 19]

Lol. Problem is now instead of Brown we have Cameron who seems to be attempting to break the record of how many stupid things he can say in his first 6 months.

Junior partner in WW II, Pakistan exports terrorism etc.

Bush and Camerwrong would have been a fantastic double act.

You can't beat superhero Gordon Brown now. He should have a mask and a cap. It's amazing any laws get passed in the UK with a parliament like that. Seeing that makes feel lucky with hoe the Senate and House operate although they just spend what little time they're there acting like spoiled children.

7iPaiylUYW0

Edited August 15, 2010 by Big Mac

[Baff1 0]

and by differentiating the French people according to their origins,

I would like to highlight that 70 % of the French population gets indignant at these acts and are against these shameful decisions, and that the French government is not representative of the French global opinion.

Speaking as a foreigner, I have to say this principle is something I have always very much admired the French people for.

---------- Post added at 01:56 PM ---------- Previous post was at 01:55 PM ----------

I thought Bush was a funny guy xD

Me too, especially his appearance in Harold and Kumar.

Other good ones were the shoe throwing speech and the one in Georgia where they didn't throw shoes becuase they had hand grenades.

ROFL. He never went back to Georgia!.

---------- Post added at 02:01 PM ---------- Previous post was at 01:56 PM ----------

You can't beat superhero Gordon Brown now. He should have a mask and a cap.

Comically thye released the sales figures for his new book this week.

He has sold 32 copies.

John Major (The last PM to lose a general election) sold 90,000. Alistair Campbell (Gordon Brown and Tony Blair's press officer) sold 20,000.

Tony Blair has got a £4.6 million advance on the sales of his.

Hahahahahahaha. So much for your million pound retirement fat boy!

32!

That's a lot of people.

Edited August 15, 2010 by Baff1

[txalin 2]

wow, #spanishrevolution is growing very very fast here, about 50000 people camp on Madrid asking for real democracy, now seems to be that movement is expanding to italy and germany..... god, what have we done... :)

[CriminalMinds 10]

To Germany? No, you must be joking! We germans put up with everything.

[VanhA-ICON 11]

As do we it seems...

Despite the elections and such it always seems that in the end it's only the market forces which dictate the course of EU.

One could say that having tried democracy and seeing it's failure I'd rather embrace totalitarianism and dictatorship, but I'm too late... EU has already adopted them both.

I hate EU... not the countries.. it's become a monster which needs to be taken down asap.

[KEVINMGXP 20]

To Germany? No, you must be joking! We germans put up with everything.

And so is belgium its freaking crazy how they just can not form a Government lol what a joke! So much for democratic votes, even when they will put in the regular elections here in will not be vallid because the former govenment did not formed propper. Djees! I gonna buy a box of clown noses and send it to them because thats how they look now just clowns!

lol

kind regards