ArmA II: Operation Arrowhead discussion thread

[Big Dawg KS 6]

Great AI you say? How come this enemy aiming at me for 5 seconds BEHIND me doesn't shoot me? Apparently I killed it.

Ya bro... that has nothing to do with the AI. That's just the animations.

more ranting

Meh. So, what, Crysis does it better? Crysis has some of the worst AI I've ever seen. Total crap. Name me a game with AI that can do all the things they do in ArmA2, do it in the same circumstances and scope as ArmA2, and do it better.

Btw, there are none, so don't even bother trying...

You're complaining about the most trivial things. Ok, choppers crash into hills. Happens all the time with real pilots, don't see why we need to make the AI in ArmA2 have super-human piloting skills. You can run circles around a tank eh? Well no shit, it's a big metal box afterall. IRL tanks are very vulnerable in close quarters, that's why infantry support is often needed.

You have completely overlooked all of the aspects of ArmA2's AI that are lightyears beyond any other games, and because of some little trivial things you go and call it shitty? You're nothing but a troll.

[PacX 10]

Ya bro... that has nothing to do with the AI. That's just the animations.

Meh. So, what, Crysis does it better? Crysis has some of the worst AI I've ever seen. Total crap. Name me a game with AI that can do all the things they do in ArmA2, do it in the same circumstances and scope as ArmA2, and do it better.

Btw, there are none, so don't even bother trying...

You're complaining about the most trivial things. Ok, choppers crash into hills. Happens all the time with real pilots, don't see why we need to make the AI in ArmA2 have super-human piloting skills. You can run circles around a tank eh? Well no shit, it's a big metal box afterall. IRL tanks are very vulnerable in close quarters, that's why infantry support is often needed.

You have completely overlooked all of the aspects of ArmA2's AI that are lightyears beyond any other games, and because of some little trivial things you go and call it shitty? You're nothing but a troll.

I think the AI in OPF:DR is better, atleast they do what they're told to do, and they do it well.

Maybe it's too complex huh? Because obviously it can't even do the most simple things, BI should start at the bottom of the ladder not try and jump to the top because obviously they can't.

And no, also, good point. We also have crap animation system that slows down our AI apparently.

[Big Dawg KS 6]

Fanboy alert!!

Fine, I'll be willing to grant that I am, if that means that I can see ArmA2's greatness for what it is. But I assure you, I'll be the first to admit that ArmA2 has some serious flaws. The difference is that I don't let that get in the way of enjoying the game.

[Mad-h 0]

PacX have you tried setting the ai skill level to max?

[SASrecon 0]

The current AI imo is to process-hogging and tbh I don't see the advantages of the micro-AI. The AI should use supression by default and directly go to heal team-mates/board vehicles, instead of get 'stuck' doing something else. Its priority-system needs to be re-vamped.

Fine, I'll be willing to grant that I am, if that means that I can see ArmA2's greatness for what it is. But I assure you, I'll be the first to admit that ArmA2 has some serious flaws. The difference is that I don't let that get in the way of enjoying the game.

Explains why people like you and me stay with BIS' games :D

[cossack8559 10]

Ofp DR a,i is shocking,

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FB3beipbwx4

this guy also has videos of the same situation in arma2 and he is dead within 10 seconds.

The only thing better in DR is how the a,i take cover. nothing else what so ever.

i just hope some of the a.i mods for arma2 work with OA... because although they can be brilliant they can also be very dumb.

[Shadow NX 1]

I think the AI in OPF:DR is better, atleast they do what they're told to do, and they do it well.

Maybe it's too complex huh? Because obviously it can't even do the most simple things, BI should start at the bottom of the ladder not try and jump to the top because obviously they can't.

And no, also, good point. We also have crap animation system that slows down our AI apparently.

1. When you play with latest patches the Ai is actually very smart, for example i tested some tanks with flamethrowers and added two infantry groups with simple waypoints ( no additional orders exept go there were given ) that were supposed to run towards them.

I was quite surprised when they started to cover each other while advancing and used the buildings as cover instead of simply running into their death.

Offcourse there are also many examples of Ai being stupid but hey its gigantic maps full of units that interact with each other and their surroundings without need of being heavy scripted.

And even if Dragon Failing had better Ai ( i didnt see that in the demo, it felt more like in OFP ) then that still doesnt change the fact that the game overall was a huge failure.

Why else would they cancel support after 3 months already if not because they know it was a sinking ship?

And if you still cant accept that then maybe GTFO ;)

[Zipper5 74]

I think the AI in OPF:DR is better, atleast they do what they're told to do, and they do it well.

Okay, some of your other points made may have some legitimacy behind them, but this completely voids everything. You have to be blind to say that DR has better AI than Arma 2. That is a fact. They may do almost exactly what you tell them to, but what happens when you don't tell them? Nothing. They're worse than OFP's AI, and it's a game made in 2009. :rolleyes:

[Big Dawg KS 6]

I think the AI in OPF:DR is better, atleast they do what they're told to do, and they do it well.

And now you are overlooking the fact that DR was a huge piece of crap alltogether. Your problem is that you single things out and try to compare them. You don't seem to understand that the AI in games like Crysis and Codemaster's failure of a game are entirely different than the AI used in ArmA2.

I'm not going to waste my time arguing with you, but you obviously haven't been playing ArmA long enough to make valid judgements.

[PacX 10]

And now you are overlooking the fact that DR was a huge piece of crap alltogether. Your problem is that you single things out and try to compare them. You don't seem to understand that the AI in games like Crysis and Codemaster's failure of a game are entirely different than the AI used in ArmA2.

I'm not going to waste my time arguing with you, but you obviously haven't been playing ArmA long enough to make valid judgements.

You can't decide whether or not I can judge a game like Arma II, and I never said anything about Crysis' AI funnily enough, I commented on the performance compared to graphics part.

You're overlooking the fact that I said DR had better AI only, it was indeed a shitty game all together, but it had successfully done some parts.

I also fail to see how Dragon Rising's AI is so different from Arma II?

[whisper 0]

You never knifed a OFP:DR AI aiming its AK at you? It was easy as hell... I'm sorry, but OFP:DR AI were subpar to say the least, A2 ones are way above that level, even though they ain't too good in every situation.

[Zipper5 74]

TWkbNboZwUg

There's your differences. ;)

[PacX 10]

You never knifed a OFP:DR AI aiming its AK at you? It was easy as hell... I'm sorry, but OFP:DR AI were subpar to say the least, A2 ones are way above that level, even though they ain't too good in every situation.

Yer it had it's flaws too, but atleast it had very good use of cover, surpression etc.

[Big Dawg KS 6]

I also fail to see how Dragon Rising's AI is so different from Arma II?

They are, entirely. I'm not an expert on DR's AI, but when you are talking about very different games with two very different engines, you have to realize there are differences in how the AI were designed. Back in OFP (not DR, the real OFP), the AI were a lot less independent and followed every order to the letter. While further developing the AI in ArmA and ArmA2, BIS decided they didn't like this, so they made them act more independently. They still follow orders quite well, but they also have their own priorities (like their own safety). Now I'll admit I only spent about an hour messing around with DR, but from what I saw the human-ness of DR's AI is worse than that of OFPs.

Another key difference is that BIS always follows an equal opertunity policy for their AI. If a player can do it, BIS makes sure the AI can do it. They put a lot of effort into making AI a suitable replacement for actual players. Codemasters does not do this. In DR, the AI just plays a support role.

[EDcase 87]

Who cares about that other dead game. We're talking about ARMA2:OA here...

My comments on ARMA2 AI:

They are really good sometimes and I've seen them react just like a human taking cover etc.

BUT other times its as if AI caluations have been turned off and they just stand in place while being attacked.

It seems that the AI get worse the closer you get which I suppose isn't that surprising as the calculations would need to be faster to react quickly in CQB mode.

When there are lots of AI that need to share the CPU time for their algorithms the close AI in CQB mode are at a dissadvantage.

In general I'm happy with the AI but of course I wouldn't complain if they are improved ;)

On a side note:

What do you think of the maps? I'm not too keen on the new terrain in A2:OA There just isn't enough cover in the landscapes to make a town approach feasible. There should be more rocks or boulders. We will see....

From the italian review footage: The IR scope looking the same in daylight as it does at night is a huge oversight in the new IR simulation. With all the effort and detail thats gone into it this is a big mistake. I hope its just because it was unfinished (yes I know its gone gold but may have been older version in review)

Edited June 16, 2010 by EDcase

[Big Dawg KS 6]

ARMA2 AI are really good sometimes and I've seen them react just like a human taking cover etc.

BUT other times its as if AI caluations have been turned off and they just stand in place while being attacked.

It seems that the AI get worse the closer you get which I suppose isn't that surprising as the calculations would need to be faster to react quickly in CQB mode.

When there are lots of AI that need to share the CPU time for their algorithms the close AI in CQB mode are at a dissadvantage.

Indeed, when a lot of people misjudge ArmA2's AI as "poor", it is likely actually limitations of the hardware that are hindering them. Don't forget, ArmA2 AI requires exclusively an entire CPU core, and some don't even believe that's enough.

Another problem is that people don't know how to judge AI in a game to begin with. IMO, it really depends on what is required of them in the game and how well they do it. ArmA2's AI does what it needs to do very well. It doesn't matter what another game's AI can do if that game doesn't have the same requirements of their AI as ArmA2.

[W0lle 1046]

That is indeed the problem. Many players, especially those coming from other games, compare the dynamic AI from ArmA2 with the scripted AI from "their" game.

Of course a scripted AI might react better because they know always what to do in that particular mission (and on a way smaller map) while the ArmA2 AI reacts completely on its own (to some extend) on a map x times bigger than those in other games.

[EDcase 87]

Perhaps this is alreay implemented but the AI calculations should be given priority the closer they are to a human player. That way AI fighting each other would be equally matched but the ones fighting humans would be "smarter" and react faster.

Edited June 16, 2010 by EDcase

[Muahaha 10]

Perhaps this is alreay implemented but the AI calculations should be given priority the closer they are to a human player. That way AI fighting each other would be equally matched but the ones fighting humans would be "smarter" and react faster.

They seems to outsmart me all the time... even scarier than playing pvp on some public servers with gung-ho kids going rambo all the time....

The AI flanked, suppress and worst throw grenades at me while I try to hide behind a cover.... Darn bloody AIs...

[Nightrain 10]

They seems to outsmart me all the time... even scarier than playing pvp on some public servers with gung-ho kids going rambo all the time....

The AI flanked, suppress and worst throw grenades at me while I try to hide behind a cover.... Darn bloody AIs...

Yah, I have this happen to me too. I was hiding behind a rock wall up against a building in Kameny and an AI walked around the corner shot me in the leg but then I killed him. Next thing I know a little black ball bounces off the building and I'm dead.

[ModeZt 0]

I have Russian A2. I want to buy English A2:OA.

I want the whole game to convert to English. Will it work?

[mrbinkels 10]

I have Russian A2. I want to buy English A2:OA.

I want the whole game to convert to English. Will it work?

This post, my friend, is the most pithy I have seen and not only gets to the point but is well deserving of a most pithy answer.

To answer your question, IDK.

[andromedagalaxe 10]

my guess is you would have to buy the "combined" package. I can't imagine that buying OA in English alone would somehow convert the entire game to English ...

[glowbal 13]

my guess is you would have to buy the "combined" package. I can't imagine that buying OA in English alone would somehow convert the entire game to English ...

Well.. OA is an entire game.

If you got both, and OA in English, I think it will just stay in English. It's not like you will use the A2 core, just the content of it.

Though perhaps in the editor the A2 content might be in that other language, but perhaps not.

[STALKERGB 6]

Perhaps this is alreay implemented but the AI calculations should be given priority the closer they are to a human player. That way AI fighting each other would be equally matched but the ones fighting humans would be "smarter" and react faster.

I actually remember with ARMA1 getting a new computer (and much faster processor). The game seemed to get much harder because the AI was being calculated quicker lol so yeah this could be a good suggestion.