AI Discussion (dev branch)

[Brisse 78]

Changed: AI sight now limited by object view distance, not landscape view distance

This one just makes 100% sense. Can't understand why it hasn't been like that before :)

[Bouben 3]

This one just makes 100% sense. Can't understand why it hasn't been like that before :)

Yes, it is a good change.

[fn_Quiksilver 1636]

AI-teammates have big issues to find their way into vehicle, especially in urban enviroment.

http://feedback.arma3.com/view.php?id=22853[/rl]

[/rl]

I would suggest however you are setting your waypoints, put a timestamp in and then if after X time they are not in the vehicle, just move them in automatically. Give them a chance, but I'd suggest don't risk mission stability on AI waypoints/movement commands.

[SaOk 112]

I was using the ingame command menu to make them board in (4-2-1 if I remember right). Was not mission related event, just trying to travel with my AI team. :) I have no scripts running for team-mates, but if it changes something those were spawned mates with custom gear set. AI behaves else good (except also the dissempark issue, will try to have repro soon), much nice firefights.

[ImperialAlex 72]

Sorry, wrong thread.

Edited February 26, 2015 by ImperialAlex
Removed message

[froggyluv 2136]

Theres a longstanding problem with AI AT soldiers not firing when at an angle to armor and within 50m. Twice in the campaign now we have 1 AT guy whos are only hope against so much armor, placing him above the hill looking down at them its clearly an open shot but the AI will run off up to 500m or more to insanely look for a better angle. When I say happened twice, I really mean 100 times in two situations -very frustrating,

Please address this maybe watch Fury for inspiration on insanely close AT shots.

[Alwarren 2767]

Empty truck, myself and 2 subordinate soldiers in Kavala.

Problem happens when truck is close to the houses.In that case they traverse

into buildings, usually to a second floor.

No mods.Poster above got point.

AI always aims at a specific entry point. Try using a large carrier vehicle with ten or more people getting in, looks almost comical. This is meant to prevent them from getting stuck on e.g a weapons pod of a chopper, but hqs these side effects since the wont comoensate for buildings

Send from my tablet, so pardon any autocorrect bollocks

[twisted 128]

i find that recently the ai are very resitant to move and fall back in orders. they first want to regroup and then kill any close by enemy and maybe then return but by then they have all been killed. would really like to have a get the fuck over here now command that they pay attention to.

[bonham 10]

Has anyone ever noticed that the AI can sense that it has been revealed/targeted? I was playing around in the editor, driving around in an armored vehicle that the enemy AI only engages with frag grenades once it's close enough. If the vehicle is a little further away, the AI will flee. Even a little further away they just take cover and don't do anything besides keeping an eye on the vehicle. But when you target and/or reveal them while they're laying on the ground, they will suddenly get up and run away. You can point a turret at them for minutes and the enemy AI doesn't move. But revealing them triggers something and the reaction is instantaneously.

I'll throw a repro together later.

[f2k sel 164]

If you place an BLUFOR unit looking away from an empty vehicle (car 20 meters) nothing happens but if you then move in an OPFOR unit in as cargo the BLUFOR unit will now turn and target the vehicle. This only happens when less than 25 meters and no obstacles between the units.

If the Vehicle has weapons the distance can be greater and the unit will turn and target.

The AI cheat as occupied vehicles are automatically revealed.

Also while on the subject it's also annoying that AI in your group call out enemy vehicle locations but only when they have a crew.

It takes away drama of not knowing if it has a crew or not, if they don't shout out you know it's safe.

Edited February 28, 2015 by F2k Sel

[Bouben 3]

If you place an BLUFOR unit looking away from an empty vehicle (car 20 meters) nothing happens but if you then move in an OPFOR unit in as cargo the BLUFOR unit will now turn and target the vehicle. This only happens when less than 25 meters and no obstacles between the units.

If the Vehicle has weapons the distance can be greater and the unit will turn and target.

The AI cheat as occupied vehicles are automatically revealed.

Also while on the subject it's also annoying that AI in your group call out enemy vehicle locations but only when they have a crew.

It takes away drama of not knowing if it has a crew or not, if they don't shout out you know it's safe.

Nice info, thanks.

[Guest]

I'm glad to see that it looks like the developers are trying to fix and improve the ai. I've been working on a minor ai overhaul system that helps to support stealth style missions, and I have seen the ai do some very strange things though some pretty refined testing. Right now, I think the worst things are: Units not responding to DoMove orders when they know about a nearby enemy, and units under certain conditions will randomly not fire on enemy units that are in sight. The not firing thing, I have been able to randomly produce the bug by moving units to a position near a building wall, then I step out from cover roughly 10-20 meters away in view of them, and then don't move, and they just sit there and target, yet do nothing until either I move a good degree, or I have found SetPos (GetPos) on them sometimes gets at least one of them firing. The inability to get units to move while they know about a nearby enemy, it seems has been an issue with Arma for a long time - I don't know if maybe the addition of a high level DoMove command that would override the default behavior, either way it is something of a bug that really puts a hurt on mission content overall, and limits the quality of combat scenario experiences involving the player and AI units in general.

/Edit - I should note that the issue with the AI not firing on an enemy has been produced with three individual one man groups nearby eachother. This issue may not happen as often with bigger groups due to communications between group units.

Lastly, it would be nice if the game checked on whether or not separate groups have radios or not before communicating combat information when not in sight of eachother, as this is another issue I personally have fought with to create stealth oriented missions. Right now, you can hit a member of a group and another group roughly within 40 meters that is not is sight of the group members of the hit unit will go into combat mode, and start turning direction towards the shooter. This was tested with a suppressed weapon, at a distance where the firing itself was not detectable. I do understand that this could be considered a 'shout', on the other hand, this also happens instantly and up to 40 meters (which is a pretty big area), and leaves no margin for error, either kill with one shot or set an entire area of 40 meters around the target on alert, which is too strict imo.

Edited March 3, 2015 by Guest

[Variable 322]

I'm glad to see that it looks like the developers are trying to fix and improve the ai. I've been working on a minor ai overhaul system that helps to support stealth style missions, and I have seen the ai do some very strange things though some pretty refined testing. Right now, I think the worst things are: Units not responding to DoMove orders when they know about a nearby enemy, and units under certain conditions will randomly not fire on enemy units that are in sight. The not firing thing, I have been able to randomly produce the bug by moving units to a position near a building wall, then I step out from cover roughly 10-20 meters away in view of them, and then don't move, and they just sit there and target, yet do nothing until either I move a good degree, or I have found SetPos (GetPos) on them sometimes gets at least one of them firing. The inability to get units to move while they know about a nearby enemy, it seems has been an issue with Arma for a long time - I don't know if maybe the addition of a high level DoMove command that would override the default behavior, either way it is something of a bug that really puts a hurt on mission content overall, and limits the quality of combat scenario experiences involving the player and AI units in general.

Lastly, it would be nice if the game checked on whether or not separate groups have radios or not before communicating combat information when not in sight of eachother, as this is another issue I personally have fought with to create stealth oriented missions. Right now, you can hit a member of a group and another group roughly within 40 meters that is not is sight of the group members of the hit unit will go into combat mode, and start turning direction towards the shooter. This was tested with a suppressed weapon, at a distance where the firing itself was not detectable. I do understand that this could be considered a 'shout', on the other hand, this also happens instantly and up to 40 meters (which is a pretty big area), and leaves no margin for error, either kill with one shot or set an entire area of 40 meters around the target on alert, which is too strict imo.

Very painful points indeed. I hope these two particular issues will be addressed in the marksman DLC.

[oukej 2911]

...units under certain conditions will randomly not fire on enemy units that are in sight. The not firing thing, I have been able to randomly produce the bug by moving units to a position near a building wall, then I step out from cover roughly 10-20 meters away in view of them, and then don't move, and they just sit there and target, yet do nothing until either I move a good degree, or I have found SetPos (GetPos) on them sometimes gets at least one of them firing.

/Edit - I should note that the issue with the AI not firing on an enemy has been produced with three individual one man groups nearby eachother. This issue may not happen as often with bigger groups due to communications between group units.

Not the first time I hear such report. But I wasn't able to reproduce the issue. Do you happen to have a mission or do you know about a place & conditions where this happens somewhat regularly? Could you please also try it with the new update if it's still behaving the same?

Right now, you can hit a member of a group and another group roughly within 40 meters that is not is sight of the group members of the hit unit will go into combat mode, and start turning direction towards the shooter. This was tested with a suppressed weapon, at a distance where the firing itself was not detectable. I do understand that this could be considered a 'shout', on the other hand, this also happens instantly and up to 40 meters (which is a pretty big area), and leaves no margin for error, either kill with one shot or set an entire area of 40 meters around the target on alert, which is too strict imo.

Actually it can alert units even farther away. What distance you think would be reasonable? (the units around are only alerted, don't receive any details about the threat)

[das attorney 858]

Actually it can alert units even farther away. What distance you think would be reasonable? (the units around are only alerted, don't receive any details about the threat)

Why don't you set a default (like 50 meters for example), then have a a scripting command to let mission makers define it for their purposes?

Like:

group this broadcastDCToGroups = 120;

[froggyluv 2136]

40m is a pretty close distance, go to your nearest track and note how if anyone was shot with you at that hash mark -people would be talking. Would be interested to know if noise pollution is taken into account at all. In a huge firefight, someone would not be as aware as a shot in the silent drop of a quiet night.

[Bouben 3]

40m is a pretty close distance, go to your nearest track and note how if anyone was shot with you at that hash mark -people would be talking. Would be interested to know if noise pollution is taken into account at all. In a huge firefight, someone would not be as aware as a shot in the silent drop of a quiet night.

I would be very surprised if nose pollution was considered or even simulated in the first place.

[Brisse 78]

My AI team-mates have no respect for my safety at all. Lately I have been killed by my own comrades several times. I'm pretty sure there was a system in place that would keep the AI from firing if it would endanger friendlies. Am I right? If so, it seems to be broken. Anyone else noticed?

[2nd ranger 282]

Actually yeah, I have been shot or killed by AI team mates quite alot recently. More often than not, it's the automatic rifleman. I think they still do that thing where they fire a burst and then turn sharply while their finger is still on the trigger.

[ice_age0815 37]

Is there a way to make ai shoot less accurate? If so like to know plz using rhs mod and new up date there are like super good with ak 200 to 300 meters

[Bouben 3]

Actually yeah, I have been shot or killed by AI team mates quite alot recently. More often than not, it's the automatic rifleman. I think they still do that thing where they fire a burst and then turn sharply while their finger is still on the trigger.

Interesting. It has to be something with your gameplay style too as I get friendly-killed only sporadically in Arma3.

[froggyluv 2136]

Never get killed by them nor even hit.

[PTV-Jobo 820]

Is there a way to make ai shoot less accurate? If so like to know plz using rhs mod and new up date there are like super good with ak 200 to 300 meters

TBH I've noticed since the new stable patch that I'm getting mercilessly slaughtered. I too also use the RHS mod and Leights OPFOR. I also use bCombat. Prior to the update, everything was quite enjoyable, but after the update--for whatever reason--the opfor are like doped up hulks with ak's. Getting hit from nowhere a mile away from some ak wielding maggot. Not sure what is going on, personally.

[Variable 322]

Actually it can alert units even farther away. What distance you think would be reasonable? (the units around are only alerted, don't receive any details about the threat)

Why don't you set a default (like 50 meters for example), then have a a scripting command to let mission makers define it for their purposes?

Like:

group this broadcastDCToGroups = 120;

Of course Das Attorney makes a point, but the more important factor here is not the range, it's the other group's reaction time. If the other group does not have an LOS with the unit that is hit, it's not reasonable for them to immediately go into danger mode. The time it takes to communicate "under fire" between separate groups should be simulated in this case, and I think it should be something like 20 seconds.

[cyruz 103]

There was something in the changelog regarding zeroing

Tweaked: Improved soldier zeroing precision (by 0.05%)

Is this whats causing the increased accuracy from AI? I'm going to re-adjust down for now as it's changed pretty aggressively.