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Protegimus

Zeus AI Combat Skills

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NickLomas: What version are you using and in what configuration?

Have you tested with/without Zeus AI and what other mods are you using?

If you are certain it is Zeus AI that is causing this, then I'll take a look, though you should try the latest build first in addition to the above.

What weapons/mission do you see the problem in as acidd did post about AI using Javelin.

Protegimus

Thanks Protegimus, i'll see which version i have and report back. Its not a problems with the Javlin, just the units don't seem to like hold fire possible due to changes in the engagment range. Before specualting though i'll check things as you recomended and report back

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Mr_Centipede & Katipo66: I have an alternative suggestion for you - if you don't want the AI to use smoke, why not simply remove their smoke grenades?

zordak: it's a nice option to add more fine grained control over AI skill and it's great that Robalo has given us a practical way to implement it from GL4.

Developing some good reference values for specific roles will definitely be worthwhile.

NickLomas: that would be appreciated.

domokun: thanks for assisting.

Protegimus

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Mr_Centipede & Katipo66: I have an alternative suggestion for you - if you don't want the AI to use smoke, why not simply remove their smoke grenades?
Id have to say there a numrouse situations where this would only be a long winded work around. I would love to see a var added for a user config to have smoke on/off to be honest.

Only becuase it gives position away if using AI (friendly) on-line and is sometimes a give away as to enemy position which you might not want to know directly. Seeing as this was an AI specific behaviour mod I see smoke as an option to be honest (my view of course), and anyone with smoke seems to want to throw it, which isnt a great result and can delay while they go about running the routine. I have seen some smoke spamming on occasion from AI enemy and team AI, yes not giving smoke is true, but as its an autoexec addon you have no options in pre made missions.

Could a switch for smoke be added? I noticed you include some on/off option for the mod, a nice user config version would be a great addition if possible :)

EDIT: how about putting the smoke element into a pbo of its own, so it can be included or not included as another way?

Edited by mrcash2009

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AI using smoke is cool, the problem is that they use it way too much. Often I will not even know an AI was in a certain place until I see a big puff of smoke there. Smoke should be used when taking more direct fire, and not as a "look at me I'm right over here shoot me please" signal. So yes to smoke, but no to using smoke over just about anything.

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@Protegimus: Currently that is what I've been doing... So I guess it's too much work then? I'm okay with it... it's your project and your call.

Cheers :)

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First of all, to ensure we don't get carried away with our perception of how often AI use smoke due to my mod, the conditions of use are as follows:

1. Unit is injured, 35% chance they will deploy smoke

2. Unit is under direct enemy fire, ~5% chance they will deploy smoke

If an AI is given smoke I think these is reasonable opportunity to use it.

Perhaps condition 1 could be tuned slightly and I could also add a check to stop or reduce probability of AI in a player controlled group from using smoke.

Another very useful thing would be a check for whether an AI is in a building, however my current code for this is too expensive to run frequently, any suggestions would be appreciated.

galz: it's already toned down from initial test versions where it was more about getting AI to deploy it than anything else (documentation appears to be totally inaccurate in this area), so are you referring to the current version or original version you tested?

Where have you been btw, haven't seen you for a few weeks?

Protegimus

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Do you know if the difficulty slider on units in the editor, does it have any influence at all on multiplayer? Just so I'm sure what I should put the slider on, or if I should leave it be.

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Which version should a Combined Operations + ACE2 server use?

ACE2 version is from june, and vanilla version from August.

My question is, ACE2 version works ok for OA + ACE or just ARMA2+ACE?

Thx

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Perhaps condition 1 could be tuned slightly and I could also add a check to stop or reduce probability of AI in a player controlled group from using smoke.

Another very useful thing would be a check for whether an AI is in a building, however my current code for this is too expensive to run frequently, any suggestions would be appreciated.

Perhaps this addon is being augmented in a lot of cases with the VFAI addon that does the same smokeshell logic.

As for the 35% upon injury, is there any logic for a knows-about of the firer? I admit that smokeshell usage seems to be quite effective in that I've not noticed any smokes going in odd directions, but I mention it here.

Also, now that I think on it, DAC also spawns smoke upon enemy contact. So maybe this addon is not all that's happening in some cases.

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any suggestions would be appreciated.
The reduction method you mention would be good, but I must say that I cent help but refer to my last post about an option for not having it at all.

I guess from your reply the option to not have it is not going to happen, but reduction as mentioned would go along way.

I just see this addon having nothing taken away from it with "optional" smoke realy.

Edited by mrcash2009

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Zeus doesn't directly affect accuracy, but recommends precision settings for us to adjust, right?

Because a machinegunner with a scope really should be able to hit me at 300m at some point in the first hundred rounds, especially when I am at his exact level and not firing back.

And does the ACE version have functionality for AI using smoke? I have never seen it happen.

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I installed Zeus recently and I was pretty impressed. The infantry AI are much more effective than in vanilla! A scenario I set up for myself in the editor that I could always beat became much more challenging and I had to change my tactics.

I do have some suggestions though: The AI still does bone headed things with respect to armored units, both defensively and offensively.

First off the AI's defending against armor do not remain as aware of it as they should. They should always pay attention to the direction that the armor is known to be in. If that could be implemented it would be a huge improvement. Last night my squad came under attack by a tank with some infantry and I ordered my units to take cover: They decided to do that by running across the road in front of the tank to the building on the other side, the result being they all got mowed down.

So that's one thing--if they could become more aware of armored units that would be great, but maybe that's hard to implement.

Here is an easy suggestion:

When an armored unit forms part of a squad that includes infantry be sure and use the infantry to defend that armor against anti-tank weapons. A relatively simple way to do that is to make sure that the tank is held back from the rest of the squad with infantry units out in front, and if there's a large squad, some flankers left and right.

That way if an tank progresses down a street the infantry encounter the AT weapon before the tank does, and it naturally puts the tank in an overwatch position, so that it can effectively suppress the enemy the infantry is advancing on.

When I played last night the enemy squad had the tank in the point position of a wedge which made it a really easy target, I just had to lay in wait for it then when it came into view boom one shot kill.

Finally a suggestion I've made elsewhere--

When an armored unit is hit all the units abandon it. I think whether that's correct is situationally dependent. In some cases the gunner at least should remain in the unit to continue laying down fire, even though it's now immobilized.

Obviously there are cases where that just makes you a sitting duck, I guess it should depend on whether the AI are aware of a viable target to shoot at. If not, if they're getting hit, and they don't know from where, then getting out is probably better.

Edited by Polar Bear

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Dumb question - But once I have Zeus installed (activated mod within A2/OA) it is always "on", isn't it?? Meaning any and all single player games I create via the editor...the AI will be using Zeus, correct?

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yeah Im a little noob about this stuff as well.

If I download this mod and use it, will the AI be better on the multiplayer servers, or does that solely matter on the server you joined whether they have it or not?

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Current version is still too much smoke. I would guess this is caused by either:

1. The 5% chance is rolled too often, resulting in high chance to use smoke.

2. The definition of "direct fire" is simply not strict enough, and AI decide they are under "direct fire" even when the bullets don't fly anywhere near them.

Most likely it's #2, because a lot of times we would detect AI purely because we saw their smoke being deployed, and since we didn't even see them there is no way someone was shooting directly at them. Of course I'm not sure if much can actually be done about that (that is, if you can actually define "under direct fire" in a more strict fashion).

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yeah Im a little noob about this stuff as well.

If I download this mod and use it, will the AI be better on the multiplayer servers, or does that solely matter on the server you joined whether they have it or not?

The AI will be Zeus AI on the machine where the addon is installed.

They do not create addon dependancy for missions, therefore no other client or server needs to be running them. Obviously the ideal situation is everyone is running them.

The addon is a rewrite of the BIS AI behaviour and config values, no new units are created etc

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Protegimus,

I only ask because I haven't seen you mention it in awhile...any luck w/ the aircraft and their ability to attack ground targets? Or their lack of ability to climb? Helos like to stay too low when under fire and end up hitting things, regardless of a setflyinheight command.

I really enjoy this addon/mod, but it limits my use of CAS when I make missions for myself.

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Protegimus,

I only ask because I haven't seen you mention it in awhile...any luck w/ the aircraft and their ability to attack ground targets? Or their lack of ability to climb? Helos like to stay too low when under fire and end up hitting things, regardless of a setflyinheight command.

I really enjoy this addon/mod, but it limits my use of CAS when I make missions for myself.

Place: this setVariable [""zeu_AIBypass"", true] in air unit initfield. That should solve it .. I think.

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Place: this setVariable [""zeu_AIBypass"", true] in air unit initfield. That should solve it .. I think.

I mentioned this back in my first post a couple pages back, but I tried this and it didn't solve the problem. Aircraft won't engage laser targets, helos (and planes) fly lower still, and helos aren't as aggressive shooting soft-target vehicles. I'm only running Zeus and then unit addons. Loading the game w/out Zeus (but same unit addons...Tier One, TF86, RH weapons...) "fixes" the problem, though obviously I lose all the other fantastic things about Zeus.

I'll try it again w/ the new beta, but I doubt that will solve it.

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Are you sure Zeus AI really working for you? They use smoke all the time. Next time I'll take a screenshot for you...

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I don't see smoke hardly ever with Zeus, either. Now, I mainly play small SP missions against Takistan Militia....

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