Realtime immersive - Militar simulator cryengine

[DancZer 65]

rendered scenes or photos?

cause rendering correctly photo-realistic scenes is dream all simulations and games will try to reach for many years to come

We had class with cryengine developers at the university. I asked one of them about the future graphics plan. And he told us they always want to create beautiful graphic where they show what they can, not the realistic graphics.

I hope the Arma isn't that way, becouse i really don't like the shiny over colored visuals.

[metalcraze 290]

If anything BIS should ditch all those bloom and motion blur effects and the only PP effect they really need in addition to their "clean" rendering is SSAO. Nothing else.

(Well and finetune HDR somewhat so it won't go into extremes like it does now when in a jungle at Lingor f.e.)

[spotter001 82]

this looks stunning, the NV part looks so real...

[max power 21]

I think part of that might be that normal people don't spend a lifetime looking through nightvision goggles so the bar for realism is substantially lower than for realistic images in visible light.

[dm 9]

AMyoQhUcPgM

DSTS using VBS and not crytek

I'm sure I saw a youtube interview from I/ITSEC where the guys making DSTS said they'd switched to VBS because it was better than what crytek is offering, but I'm struggling to find it again now...

[danny96 80]

I want that cave creating! and editor of terrain!

[bobocz 10]

I'm sure I saw a youtube interview from I/ITSEC where the guys making DSTS said they'd switched to VBS because it was better than what crytek is offering, but I'm struggling to find it again now...

DM see my previous posts about DSTS, 1,2 and also SAbre4809's post, it is last press releases from December.

I'm almost lost here.

description from DM's video :

An overview of US Army's First Immersive Dismounted Soldier Training System (DSTS). The system is based on Quantum3D's ExpeditionDI Immersive Training Platform

and comment there made by bisimmedia (2 days ago). So BiSim confirm that they are using VBS2.

The virtual environment driving DSTS is VBS2. The standard US Army VBS2 build is employed, facilitating re-use of 3D models and terrain, and of course the DSTS can interoperate with normal VBS2 classrooms or a wider HLA/DIS network.

There are so many names and contradicting information. Now DSTS is made by Quantum3D, or Intelligent Decisions hired them, or something else. It is weird now. Total chaos (for me).

------------

Now this is starting to be interesting. Another CryEngine3 "success"?

uwhKWiDftKI

(I was looking for this video because I saw it couple months ago and now I found it :))

press releases from BAE (20 Sep 2011)

http://www.baesystems.com/Newsroom/NewsReleases/autoGen_11182093455.html

press releases from KBR from last month, they talked about Cryengine3. (these contracts starts to fascinate me, who is contracting with whom :), many people set up with contracts, it looks very efficient)

http://www.kbr.com/Newsroom/Press-Releases/2011/11/22/KBR-to-Develop-and-Deliver-Virtual-Training-Program-for-Royal-Australian-Navys-Landing-Helicopter-Dock-Ship/

and surprisingly this ship from video is very similar to BiSim version from their facebook, also australian ship and they also simulate all decks.

http://www.facebook.com/media/set/?set=a.253033651416678.65723.232473470139363&type=1

What's going on here. Competitors fight? Some problem with Cryengine3?

Simulation business must be really tough. I'm not saying that they are using VBS2 now. I just sort all information.

Edited December 20, 2011 by BoboCZ

[dm 9]

DM see my previous posts about DSTS...

Now DSTS is made by Quantum3D

Quantum3D make the wearable computers that form the hardware part of the system. See Expedition DI info page

You're right tho, it is pretty confusing with all the announcements and counter announcements.

I think what we can take from the I/ITSEC and BISim Press Release (see the DSTS section) is that DSTS is currently using VBS2 and not some cryengine system.

[Cripsis 10]

Floyd West, Director of Strategic Programs, Orlando Division of Intelligent Decisions said that Cryengine 3 is the best video game technology on the market today. 102 combat simulation systems will be using this advanced combat simulation in combination with advanced motion sensor technology globally by January 2012.

http://www.examiner.com/fps-in-national/us-army-s-57m-cryengine-3-combat-simulator?fb_comment=33700386

[dm 9]

Intelligent Decisions said that Cryengine 3... ...combat simulation systems will be using this... ...technology globally by January 2012.

If it was going to be deployed next month, surely they would have been showing a cryEngine based demo at I/ITSEC last month, and not something running VBS2? (That article is from May, I/ITSEC showing VBS2 based DSTS was in November, deployment is in January... Just sayin...)

Like I said before, it all seems suspiciously like the Army has been sucked in by the shiny graphics, spent millions on the project, only to be told at the end of it that the cryEngine cant do what they want it to, so they've switched back to good ole VBS... just like they did last time with the $40 million [failed] cryEngine project...

[Dwarden 1125]

or they seen VBS2 2.0 in action (A2:OA engine) and A3 alpha renderer :) as bonus

[max power 21]

And hey, if the army wants to spend 6 times the amount on a single asset, then let them.

[Cripsis 10]

If it was going to be deployed next month, surely they would have been showing a cryEngine based demo at I/ITSEC last month, and not something running VBS2? (That article is from May, I/ITSEC showing VBS2 based DSTS was in November, deployment is in January... Just sayin...)

Like I said before, it all seems suspiciously like the Army has been sucked in by the shiny graphics, spent millions on the project, only to be told at the end of it that the cryEngine cant do what they want it to, so they've switched back to good ole VBS... just like they did last time with the $40 million [failed] cryEngine project...

"PEO STRI is looking for a system that offers everything VBS2 does, plus higher fidelity graphics and the ability for it to be plugged into a combined live, virtual and constructive training environment through the use of personal computers and other mobile devices.

Intelligent Decisions plans to be a major player in this effort as it already has shown the ability to run the VBS2 software on the Dismounted Soldier system."

http://www.nationaldefensemagazine.org/archive/2011/December/Pages/GamingTechnologyPutsSoldiers%E2%80%99BootsonGround.aspx

[walker 0]

Hi all

This is the bit where I get to say I told you so. :rolleyes:

Kind Regards walker

[Mr. Charles 22]

http://www.pcgamer.com/2011/12/21/us-army-dismounted-soldier-training-system-is-the-greatest-game-youll-never-play/

Now the conventional gaming press picks it up ;)

[Tonci87 163]

http://www.pcgamer.com/2011/12/21/us-army-dismounted-soldier-training-system-is-the-greatest-game-youll-never-play/

Now the conventional gaming press picks it up ;)

Now I´m confused!

[bobocz 10]

Now I´m confused!

Why confused? They nailed it perfectly.

US Army Dismounted Soldier Training System is the greatest game you’ll never play.

Maybe it is more difficult, we don't have all information, perhaps it ends up differently, but if it is like it looks like. It is really hilarious. :D

[Tonci87 163]

But didn´t DSTS ditch Cryengine in favour of VBS?

[bobocz 10]

But didn´t DSTS ditch Cryengine in favour of VBS?

So far it looks like, but press have old information, or they know more (I don't know). They've been hyped by graphic, cool videos, but apparently army is looking for something different.

Edit: I mean that you will not see any DSTS with cryengine ;).

Edited December 21, 2011 by BoboCZ

[rksl-rock 1300]

I know im going to regret pitching into this debate but:

But didn´t DSTS ditch Cryengine in favour of VBS?

I dont have the original links for this anymore but my understanding is that they didnt "ditch" anything. They are just demonstrating on the current platform. From memory "US Army Dismounted Soldier Training System" is focused on the hardware not the software I believe. Part of the RFP spec listed way back when was that it should work with the "current" and "future" virtual training environments. Which to my mind would mean it has to work with VBS2 and the next gen Sim environment. What ever that turns out to be.

Maybe it will be VBS2.0 or Cryengine 3 based solution. Give it time the market is only just picking up speed.

[bobocz 10]

I dont have the original links for this anymore but my understanding is that they didnt "ditch" anything. They are just demonstrating on the current platform. From memory "US Army Dismounted Soldier Training System" is focused on the hardware not the software I believe. Part of the RFP spec listed way back when was that it should work with the "current" and "future" virtual training environments. Which to my mind would mean it has to work with VBS2 and the next gen Sim environment. What ever that turns out to be.

Maybe it will be VBS2.0 or Cryengine 3 based solution. Give it time the market is only just picking up speed.

I agree. We don't have all information, maybe they use VBS2 temporary.

But project was not smooth as seems to meant to be, I will quote

Floyd West, Director of Strategic Programs, Orlando Division of Intelligent Decisions said that Cryengine 3 is the best video game technology on the market today. 102 combat simulation systems will be using this advanced combat simulation in combination with advanced motion sensor technology globally by January 2012.

http://www.examiner.com/fps-in-national/us-army-s-57m-cryengine-3-combat-simulator?fb_comment=33700386

or it was plan to use VBS2 meanwhile. I know that is not as simple.

It is all only speculation. I use what I found on internet and it is really confusing. I hope that I'm not harm anybody.

We will see.

[Cripsis 10]

But didn´t DSTS ditch Cryengine in favour of VBS?

The CryEngine version of the Dismounted Soldier Training System is still in development.

http://www.gamefront.com/take-a-close-look-at-the-us-armys-dismounted-soldier-training-system/

[Dwarden 1125]

it seems as just same old news constantly recycled by media ...

[walker 0]

Hi all

In reply to Cripsis:

The CryEngine version of the Dismounted Soldier Training System is still in development.

http://www.gamefront.com/take-a-close-look-at-the-us-armys-dismounted-soldier-training-system/

Yes. Exactly as I pointed out over a year ago:

...The game engine environment is Rapid Application Development.

The Prime's market is the Bespoke Government Pork Business of: secure a contract to do a research project, secure another contract to expand it into test environment, secure another to create a product based on the test environment, secure increased costs to test it, secure bigger costs to implement it on a small scale, secure, bigger costs to implement it on a medium scale plus a support contract that the costs are kept to maximum to ensure the maximum cost, on which to the base the cost plus percentage on so that profit is maximised. And also ensuring the product is out of date when it comes to market, so that the process must now be repeated so that the gravy can continue to flow in.

The sales models are also completely different COTS means you have already developed the product and supply it ready to work out of the box at a set up front cost. Maybe even let the customer try it for free first. Agree a license and some support package over a fixed term

The Bespoke is secure a flexible budget first then develop maximising cost at every oportunity...

As always follow the link to the original text in full. :D

So nothing has changed in this product in over a year.

It never has been and never will be a COTS product, the other posts made around the same time also predicted the CRY product failings.

Kind Regards walker

Edited December 22, 2011 by walker

[metalcraze 290]

Because people think for some reason that the quality of engine is measured by the amount of shaders per pixel.

Through all of their existence CryTek developed nothing but beautiful, but unrealistic looking, tech-demos. Hiring a developer that can't make anything apart from shaders to do a serious game is naturally a mistake.

It's like asking Infinity Ward to make submarine simulation to compete with Sonalysts, who develop real sonars for real submarines. It will still be that CoDMW3 level where you'll have to turn keys at the same time after blasting the sub crew away.

BIS, eSim, Eagle Dynamics - all started with developing simulation games for an average consumer market. All became military contractors afterwards and keep doing what they do best without any radical changes asked of them.

It takes the right set of developer mind to develop a sim.

Some problem with Cryengine3?

More like "we tried to play a game on it"

Edited December 22, 2011 by metalcraze