mr_centipede 31 Posted December 3, 2009 About SAFE mode: Have anyone noticed the confused AI that being led by human on/along a road? Especially on intersections/crossroads? Players walk along a road, comes to intersection, cross it and you see the AI goes for merry go round for quite a bit then after you stop and a while later, they will form back on you Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
nkenny 1051 Posted December 3, 2009 (edited) 5 Steps to greatness Bounding Steps are too short-While the current bounding distance (and time) may be theoretically correct, in practice it often proves inefficient. Often an AI soldier will end a bound between covers, such as the middle of a road. This would not be a problem if they did 'quick bounds' and only crouching; but when getting down involves going prone. They spend too much time posturing and not moving.-Increasing bounding distance by some 20-40% would be a functional compromise of realism and utility. Not to mention greatly speeding combat speed. Immediacy of Commands (Get in, First aid, others)-When a commander orders a soldier to 'Get in' or 'Heal' whilst in combat mode; the AI will often spend an inordinate amount of time posturing, bounding, and messing about. With a human commander he will in a vast amount of situations have the foresight to provide area security before ordering any such thing. Finally in the dynamic nature of a firefight speed is often of the essence! -Therefore I suggest that AI commanded to perform those type of tasks; temporarily gets shifted to 'aware' mode. AI does not recognize crouched position-Going crouched, perhaps to peek over the ubiquitous grasslayer or a low wall, is a death sentence for your AI subordinates. The AI will cheerfully stand up (no matter the ROE) and possible expose themselves both to enemy fire and observation.The AI should ideally recognize this. Stealth mode in its current form is near useless-The latest beta makes it possible to go prone without triggering combat mode. Even so an AI set to stealth mode is entirely overconcerned with getting into cover, and will might run or even sprint to achieve it! -This works entirely against the purpose of sneaking and breaks the visual immersion. A simple fix would be to force a limited speed while STEALTH mode is used. The AI might bound or seek cover; but only while sneaking or creeping forward at slower speed. Drop down to a knee-Sometimes when moving towards a possible enemy location I will order AI troops to take up overwatch positions. While they do so quite efficiently (often using cover in the process) they often stand up. When a squad leader orders someone to take a specific position; he often does so for a reason! In ARMA2 where weapons are accurate and deadly, being seen is often a death sentence.-It would be great if soldiers ordered to "stop" or "move-there" would prefer going crouched upon reaching their destination. Theyll be better hidden and better able to return fire. Betas The new changes to DELTA and LINE(compact) are welcome. Albeit the new 'soft' formations somewhat limit the effectiveness of these formations. It'd be great if the AI would prioritize staying close when these are used. Also LINE(compact) seems somewhat broken. In a squad of six soldiers. If soldiers #2, #3, and #4 are set to move somewhere. Soldiers #5 and #6 won't stack up close to the squad leader. Instead occuping the spots they would normally be in; if the entire group was set to follow the Squad leader. - k Edited December 3, 2009 by NkEnNy Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Barely-injured 0 Posted December 3, 2009 Beta 60803 is up...... no changes in the log so far Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
twisted 127 Posted December 3, 2009 (edited) 5 Steps to greatness Bounding Steps are too short-While the current bounding distance (and time) may be theoretically correct, in practice it often proves inefficient. Often an AI soldier will end a bound between covers, such as the middle of a road. This would not be a problem if they did 'quick bounds' and only crouching; but when getting down involves going prone. They spend too much time posturing and not moving.-Increasing bounding distance by some 20-40% would be a functional compromise of realism and utility. Not to mention greatly speeding combat speed. Immediacy of Commands (Get in, First aid, others)-When a commander orders a soldier to 'Get in' or 'Heal' whilst in combat mode; the AI will often spend an inordinate amount of time posturing, bounding, and messing about. With a human commander he will in a vast amount of situations have the foresight to provide area security before ordering any such thing. Finally in the dynamic nature of a firefight speed is often of the essence! -Therefore I suggest that AI commanded to perform those type of tasks; temporarily gets shifted to 'aware' mode. AI does not recognize crouched position-Going crouched, perhaps to peek over the ubiquitous grasslayer or a low wall, is a death sentence for your AI subordinates. The AI will cheerfully stand up (no matter the ROE) and possible expose themselves both to enemy fire and observation.The AI should ideally recognize this. Stealth mode in its current form is near useless-The latest beta makes it possible to go prone without triggering combat mode. Even so an AI set to stealth mode is entirely overconcerned with getting into cover, and will might run or even sprint to achieve it! -This works entirely against the purpose of sneaking and breaks the visual immersion. A simple fix would be to force a limited speed while STEALTH mode is used. The AI might bound or seek cover; but only while sneaking or creeping forward at slower speed. Drop down to a knee-Sometimes when moving towards a possible enemy location I will order AI troops to take up overwatch positions. While they do so quite efficiently (often using cover in the process) they often stand up. When a squad leader orders someone to take a specific position; he often does so for a reason! In ARMA2 where weapons are accurate and deadly, being seen is often a death sentence.-It would be great if soldiers ordered to "stop" or "move-there" would prefer going crouched upon reaching their destination. Theyll be better hidden and better able to return fire. Betas The new changes to DELTA and LINE(compact) are welcome. Albeit I wish the new 'soft' formations somewhat limit the effectiveness of these formations. It'd be great if the AI would prioritize staying close when these are used. Also LINE(compact) seems somewhat broken. In a squad of six soldiers. If soldiers #2, #3, and #4 are set to move somewhere. Soldiers #5 and #6 won't stack up close to the squad leader. Instead occuping the spots they would normally be in; if the entire group was set to follow the Squad leader. - k very good list. would add one thing - in stealth mode ai could call enemy spotted and ask for premission to fire if undetected by enemy. now sneaking ends as my guys fire too soon. sort of like a hold fire that should be a part of stealth mode but a bit more 'human'. 1st prize would be Ai showing much of the tactics in here - http://ttp2.dslyecxi.com/basic_rifleman.html and http://ttp2.dslyecxi.com/tactics.html yes that is ambitious, but the devs are really making great things here. Edited December 3, 2009 by twisted Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Leopardi 0 Posted December 3, 2009 The removal of mouse smoothing made it unplayable for me that didnt have mouse lag...Like BF2 now but worse. It skips pixels and even though i have 5 speeds on my mouse - the slowest is fast as f***. Unplayable. ARMA feeling is gone. Completelly. Glad you mouse laggers are happy though. ... The "speeds" on your mouse is your mouse DPI resolution. Put it to highest, and then turn down the sensitivity form ingame settings to adjust the amount of pixel movement to 1:1. Voila, now you can have responsive mouse with high sensitivity without skipping any pixels. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
JuggernautOfWar 1 Posted December 3, 2009 Beta 60803 is up......no changes in the log so far Anybody know what the changes are? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Pauldarrington 9 Posted December 3, 2009 Beta 60803 is up......no changes in the log so far Just gave it a quick test performance is back up im able to fly without stuttering like the last beta i think they have lowered the draw distance which has given me the extra fps. Now its A.I time Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Alex72 1 Posted December 3, 2009 The "speeds" on your mouse is your mouse DPI resolution. Put it to highest, and then turn down the sensitivity form ingame settings to adjust the amount of pixel movement to 1:1.Voila, now you can have responsive mouse with high sensitivity without skipping any pixels. Hey thanks but that was a pretty old post i think. ;) Dont have any probs since long time back. Time to test latest one. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
zeep 3 Posted December 3, 2009 Beta 60803 is up......no changes in the log so far ..I have seen they were still considering themselves "partially combat" once they have acquired the target, which affected their pathfinding and made them move slower. This should be fixed in 60803 (which is being deployed right now). FYI for the people not reading all the last pages. Performance is still down for me.. :'-( Q9650 @ 3ghz, 3mb ram, 9600 GT, XP sp2 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Mr.X 10 Posted December 3, 2009 I have just quickly tested beta 60803 and overall the performance is good; even on lower fps its run quite smoothly. However, I noticed a massively reduced fps when aiming and zooming into forests and towns. I would provide pictures but I'm not sure how :(. I think once the trees are fixed performance will be great and AI can be worked on. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
cossack8559 10 Posted December 3, 2009 Can somebody test the a.i on safe mode please... i am still having the same problem as the last.... when i have my squad in safe mode after they have been in combat mode and back to safe mode they will not form on me in any formation except for column... but if i order them on aware they will form in any formation i tell them too... kinda hard to explain :( Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
dogz 10 Posted December 3, 2009 803 is very smooth for me (no post proc) Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
mr_centipede 31 Posted December 3, 2009 Can somebody test the a.i on safe mode please... i am still having the same problem as the last.... when i have my squad in safe mode after they have been in combat mode and back to safe mode they will not form on me in any formation except for column... but if i order them on aware they will form in any formation i tell them too... kinda hard to explain :( The only formation in safe mode is column. Always been like that The only problem with safe mode now is that they got terribly confuse when the human leader lead them along roads or intersections/crossroads Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Alex72 1 Posted December 3, 2009 I rarely use SAFE. AWARE usually works equally good. Sometimes they can get stuck up on some enemy, and thats when i go SAFE to get my AI back faster. SAFE seems to be a bit borked however. Im sure its being worked on. And the performance is good for me too in the latest build. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
maturin 12 Posted December 3, 2009 The AI simply cannot go into unmarked Danger mode when under fire. I crashed my chopper into a field and the pilot, who should have followed my mad dash to the treeline, spent five minutes "taking cover" behind blades of grass and scanning the horizon. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
JuggernautOfWar 1 Posted December 3, 2009 The AI simply cannot go into unmarked Danger mode when under fire. I crashed my chopper into a field and the pilot, who should have followed my mad dash to the treeline, spent five minutes "taking cover" behind blades of grass and scanning the horizon. I agree, it's bullcrap having your units and self constantly killed off because they can't figure out how to walk to the next corner. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
thr0tt 12 Posted December 3, 2009 i dunno man, i went ingame and cranked it max. on war welcome, 12 man squad, there are guys doing what they do and explosions, fire, gunfire all over the place, it played absolutely flawelessly. thats with view distance maxed too. i only have 2 gig of 667 ram and its cheap stuff ddr2 so i dunno it seems to have worked the oposit way for me. Weird isnt it, if they fix the issue in this beta then it may be better for me and work worse for you... this is the world of ArmA. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
kklownboy 43 Posted December 3, 2009 Weird isnt it, if they fix the issue in this beta then it may be better for me and work worse for you... this is the world of ArmA. maybe maxframes-ahead has changed for you? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
fabrizio_t 58 Posted December 3, 2009 (edited) 5 Steps to greatness [*]Bounding Steps are too short -While the current bounding distance (and time) may be theoretically correct, in practice it often proves inefficient. Often an AI soldier will end a bound between covers, such as the middle of a road. This would not be a problem if they did 'quick bounds' and only crouching; but when getting down involves going prone. They spend too much time posturing and not moving. -Increasing bounding distance by some 20-40% would be a functional compromise of realism and utility. Not to mention greatly speeding combat speed. Yet current bounding distance is quite fine in urban CQB ;) Also i doubt that increasing it will make group move sensibly faster. I see the no. 1 factor in slowing down group movement is number of units, small groups do move faster. Edited December 3, 2009 by fabrizio_T Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
cross 1 Posted December 3, 2009 (edited) Latest beta 803 gives me 10-12 FPS less on the start screen Win7 X64 3.5Ghz 6GB Ram 8800 GTS 512k Edited December 3, 2009 by Cross Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Falco1.01 19 Posted December 3, 2009 Latest beta 803 gives me 10-12 FPS less on the start screen Win7 X64 3.5Ghz 6GB Ram 8800 GTS 512k While on start screen is not a big issue dont you think? Let get more contructive on here... By the way, fps on start screen depends directly from the angle on the camera. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
randir14 10 Posted December 3, 2009 My performance in the last few betas has actually been really good, in fact better than it's ever been. The red and orange trees still cause huge FPS drops though, if they ever get fixed performance will be almost perfect. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
cross 1 Posted December 3, 2009 (edited) ..... Think about it... let the box work..R&R Edited December 3, 2009 by Cross Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
NoRailgunner 0 Posted December 3, 2009 Quicktest - Infantry dont engage enemy infantry within weapon range! Testing range - near Pustoshka, July, sunny and clear place a group of Blufor infantry moving in formation line from hill 346 to Vybor. place a group of Opfor infantry moving in formation line from hill 305 (farm houses) to hill 346. - AI dont see Opfor units/group - no contact reports even if they are in line of sight - AI dont use binocs or weapon scopes to scan area (like in OFP and ArmA) - doesnt matter if waypoints have "fire" or "fire and engage at will" - if AI hear shots they suddenly see, report and engage the Opfor group :confused: - observed that the combat formation the AI is switching to/using now is too tight for combat in open terrain Possible solutions: + increase AI spotting/scanning range for units with binocular and scopes (add a small delay to verify them as neutral or friendly or enemy) + increase the AI firing range according to their weapons but avoid 1000m sniper-headshots with assault rifles + increase the distance between AI units in groups if they are in combat in open terrain and make 2-3 formations - specific for urban combat (CQB) Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Falco1.01 19 Posted December 3, 2009 I just testet 803, for me is already OK with combat/awareness mode. Performance and stability seems better however I need to do more testing on stability (grey freeze upon exit?). Keep up the good work +1 about the orange trees (I heard they was going to look at it...Suma what do you know about that issue?) Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
