Targeting improvements

[CaptainAzimuth 714]

One other major thing i have an issue with is the scale at which the head of a pilot moves in Fixed Wing Aircraft when pulling turns. at anywhere above 300 speed, the way the head moves left, right, up and down of the center is very disorienting. It should be less swaying like that, but should have tilt as well, for example, when you bank left or right, your head tilts to compensate with the horizon just slightly, and it makes it feel less like your going to throw up. This would improve flying in first person so you can manage everything else without getting sick of the jerky swaying motions.

 

Also, in regards to APC locking air targets, i don't think it's necessarily a censor thing, or am i  wrong? Because i've recently seen Korean APC's behold a freakishly accurate capability to shoot down aerial drones, but the APC itself isn't even designed to do so, however, if need be, it can do just that, probably a bit too well. I understand it's balance, but i mean missions could just exclude medium armor... then again, if you place AI in APC's and fly around them, they still have pin point accuracy anyway, so this "balance" only applies to Multiplayer (PVP Only) regardless.

[teabagginpeople 398]

(Reality can often be the best "game balance inspiration" after all).

This. 100%.

[CaptainAzimuth 714]

Alright, well i've just experienced the new Targeting pod first hand in actual combat... My impressions are... bad. What i mean by this is that using the Camera lock is extremely buggy, even with the ability to move the cross-hair with the Numpad. Basically, the fact that the motion of the Aircraft (direction at speed in which the aircraft is traveling) effects the camera, is extremely clunky, and it's a HUGE problem. Add that in with the fact you have to be aware of both AA, and that view distance is limited, causing you to have to constantly leave the camera spin around for another pass, and try to find the spot again, is a straight pain in the arse.

 

That Cam-Lock system really does need a hard polish, as it's sort of hit and miss at this point.

 

Secondly, not sure what it is that was changed, but when pressing the button to search and lock vehicles, it stops the game. In other words, lag spike as you press it. So i'm flying and i see something i radar i want to investigate, i look in the general direction, and press the lock key. The game stops for .3-1.0 seconds, and then either nothing will pop up, or a box will select the vehicle, if i was accurate. What i'm saying is when locking targets, the game spikes, and freezes for a short time, which is the most annoying thing in the world. This never happened in Arma 2. This didn't even happen in Arma 3 awhile ago. Not sure why it's happening now, but it's game breaking.

[Bamse 223]

The one main thing I love about Arma is that you, in almost all cases, have a choice. Choice is the word I'm going to base my whole argument on because it really is a beautiful frikkin' word. Don't like X? Script it away. Don't like Y? Mod it away.

As we all know, in order to balance a mission you need to factor in a multitude of variables. Island, terrain types, type of opposing force, strength of that said force and so many more ... but maybe foremost; the number of players.  I'm coming from a modded coop point of view here and but some games you might get 30 ppl, some games 60 ... but also sometimes 6.

If you're lucky to get enough players you will be able to have TACP on the ground and most targeting related issues (being the targeting thread and all ;]) will be solved given enough time. If you don't have enough and still want to dabble in CAS, you might want to at least have the option to self designate no matter how hard it might be to actually do it. Difficulty in performing stuff is a matter of practice. Not even having the option is not :)

[dr. hladik 231]

good news: prototype of laserDesignator is ready

more good news: controls are improved

bad news: you have to wait after my vacation  :P

 

rev 137959

 

pilot camera improvements

 - improved controls when camera is lcoked

 - supported laser designator

 - pilotCameraRotX and pilotCameraRotY anim sources

 - new script commands: getPilotCameraPosition, getPilotCameraDirection, getPilotCameraRotation, getPilotCameraTarget, hasPilotCamera, setPilotCameraDirection, setPilotCameraRotation, setPilotCameraTarget

[x3kj 1247]

It should be less swaying like that, but should have tilt as well, for example, when you bank left or right, your head tilts to compensate with the horizon just slightly, and it makes it feel less like your going to throw up. This would improve flying in first person so you can manage everything else without getting sick of the jerky swaying motions.

Automatic tilting would be dissorienting as well. Any non-playerinduced motions can be dissorienting. Especially when VR Goggles are used.

[en3x 209]

rev 137959

 

pilot camera improvements

 - improved controls when camera is lcoked

 - supported laser designator

 - pilotCameraRotX and pilotCameraRotY anim sources

 - new script commands: getPilotCameraPosition, getPilotCameraDirection, getPilotCameraRotation, getPilotCameraTarget, hasPilotCamera, setPilotCameraDirection, setPilotCameraRotation, setPilotCameraTarget

 

Good news everyone!

 

On the similar note, how big is step between current manual locking to target to continuously "locked"* view which we can

still move up down left and right.

 

*Locked in sense of tracking point of aim without your input with ability to move point of aim at any given moment.

 

Here is example footage linky

[nodunit 397]

One other major thing i have an issue with is the scale at which the head of a pilot moves in Fixed Wing Aircraft when pulling turns. at anywhere above 300 speed, the way the head moves left, right, up and down of the center is very disorienting. It should be less swaying like that, but should have tilt as well, for example, when you bank left or right, your head tilts to compensate with the horizon just slightly, and it makes it feel less like your going to throw up. This would improve flying in first person so you can manage everything else without getting sick of the jerky swaying motions.

 

Also, in regards to APC locking air targets, i don't think it's necessarily a censor thing, or am i  wrong? Because i've recently seen Korean APC's behold a freakishly accurate capability to shoot down aerial drones, but the APC itself isn't even designed to do so, however, if need be, it can do just that, probably a bit too well. I understand it's balance, but i mean missions could just exclude medium armor... then again, if you place AI in APC's and fly around them, they still have pin point accuracy anyway, so this "balance" only applies to Multiplayer (PVP Only) regardless.

Wouldn't the emulation right now be more accurate in that the aircraft would not tilt from the view of our stabilized eyes? 

[CaptainAzimuth 714]

Automatic tilting would be dissorienting as well. Any non-playerinduced motions can be dissorienting. Especially when VR Goggles are used.

Yes and no? I mean for VR, yes, of course all automated movements of player view in the cockpit should then be disabled if a VR is in use, as real world input would replace that. So you can tilt your head in VR to compensate for that. I mean, it's not that big of a deal having the slight tilt, just a suggestion i thought would be nice based on experience in DCS, basically how pulling tight turns doesn't necessarily knock the view around the cockpit as violently as it does in Arma 3.

 

Wouldn't the emulation right now be more accurate in that the aircraft would not tilt from the view of our stabilized eyes? 

Yes and no. Depending on the pilot really, if you bank maybe 10-15 degree's, say for example you  were scanning a hill for something while in a slight orbital turn, you'd then want to tilt your head/upper torso so that you're not just leaning over 10-15 degrees. You used to be able to simulate this in a very clunky way when you could access VR level freedom without having VR via. holding Crtl+Q or E. This would make your character lean in the cockpit, but was horrible to have as a control  because if you did it accidentally, you would be in a terrible situation. (i've done it, not fun) But anyhow, it's not THAT crucial of a feature. Just a suggestion. Though, the level of view being thrown about the cockpit does indeed need to be vastly less traumatic.

[oukej 2910]

It's a little bit off-topic. What you're describing are some basic camera effects we have (G-forces for swaying, speed for FOV changes). The strength of the effect can be adjusted. Tilting or other FPV/camera effects you may know from other games are currently not planned.

[.kju 3244]

> The strength of the effect can be adjusted

How (in configs)? Or do you mean engine wise?

[nikiforos 450]

Sorry I'm on vacation so I can't test . So lasing a locked target is working now?

[Imperator[TFD] 444]

Sorry I'm on vacation so I can't test . So lasing a locked target is working now?

 

I'm not sure how this works now, there's no laser designator on the aircraft and I cannot find any key binds for it.

[oukej 2910]

The vanilla CAS airplanes don't have the laser designator (yet). All you need is a configured laser designator in the airplane's weapon's list (plus some batteries ;)).

> The strength of the effect can be adjusted

How (in configs)? Or do you mean engine wise?

crewShake property in anims

[da12thMonkey 1943]

Does the laser weapon just naturally follow the pilotCamera direction now then, instead of memoryPointGun= for the vehicle/turret? We don't need to add extra mem points or model.cfg animations for moving the laser direction?

 

Looking at how the laser turret works on UAV I was curious how aiming the laser weapon through pilotCamera (not a turret) would be separated from the plane's gun axis when we only get one "gun" memory point per plane/turret. i.e. you don't want the Wipeout's cannon muzzle to slew around like the IRST/laser designator and act like an AC-130 :D

---

nvm: I tried it out with simply adding

this addmagazine "Laserbatteries"; this addweapon "Laserdesignator_mounted"

on the Wipeout init line (or e.g. RHS A-10, or other aircraft with pilotCamera), and I can see that it works in following pilotCamera without anything doing to the model :D

[CaptainAzimuth 714]

It's a little bit off-topic. What you're describing are some basic camera effects we have (G-forces for swaying, speed for FOV changes). The strength of the effect can be adjusted. Tilting or other FPV/camera effects you may know from other games are currently not planned.

Yes. So sorry for going off topic for a bit, but it does need an adjustment, as it's currently too much. 

[Imperator[TFD] 444]

The vanilla CAS airplanes don't have the laser designator (yet). All you need is a configured laser designator in the airplane's weapon's list (plus some batteries ;)).

 

Yep I thought of doing that after my post.  Excellent work on these new updates mate they're brilliant and will definitely enhance the fixed wing gameplay.

Any chance while they're updating the configs to add the laser designators we could see some new variants of the existing aircraft to be more Laser Guided Bomb orientated?

 

For example:

TO-199 Neophron (LGB)

A-143 Buzzard (LGB)

 

As it is the above to planes only have 2 guided bombs each and it would be Splendid to see them with more.

[xxgetbuck123 945]

I think this is the right thread to ask haha

 

Ok so I'm in process off adding a pilotCamera to an aircraft, was curious if I could get some clarification on what the following actually means from BI standpoint. 

initAngleX = 0;
minAngleX = 0;
maxAngleX = 0;
initAngleY = 0;
minAngleY = 0;
maxAngleY = 0;
initFov = "(30 / 120)";
minFov = "(30 / 120)";
maxFov = "(30 / 120)";

Also if there are more available gunner optic modes, would be good to have a library of screenshots displaying all the possible gunnerOptics (if there are more available) and also with their .p3d for easy copy and paste?  

gunnerOpticsModel = "\A3\Drones_F\Weapons_F_Gamma\Reticle\UAV_Optics_Gunner_wide_F.p3d";

 Apologies if this isn't the right place to ask but I presume since it is the targeting thread that it's pretty close. 

[snoops_213 75]

I like this ability to self lase, its easy to do unopposed, but when you add SAMs/AAA well it becomes a whole lot more interesting and the want for someone on the ground to help increases, any supposed unbalance is counter acted by a simple AA team or 2. A nice little static AAA emplacement wouldn't go astray to help mission makers make air missions a little more rewarding, but i guess thats what mods are for.   Will the turret stabilization, target tracking be added to helicopters anytime soon? And with the possible addition of laser designators to aircraft will the AI get some sort of basic understanding of how to use them?  Awesome fun so far looking forward to see what else is coming.

[goldenfiver 11]

great work! keep it up! 

 

Are there any plans to let us shoot air to ground missiles on TGP position (like AGM-65 in real life)? ATM we cant shoot a building or an empty vehicle and that's a shame.

[oukej 2910]

Ok so I'm in process off adding a pilotCamera to an aircraft, was curious if I could get some clarification on what the following actually means from BI standpoint. 

initAngleX = 0;

minAngleX = 0;

maxAngleX = 0;

....

Added https://community.bistudio.com/wiki/A3_Targeting_config_reference#class_pilotCamera; let me know if that helps or needs better description.

 

Also if there are more available gunner optic modes, would be good to have a library of screenshots displaying all the possible gunnerOptics (if there are more available) and also with their .p3d for easy copy and paste?  

gunnerOpticsModel = "\A3\Drones_F\Weapons_F_Gamma\Reticle\UAV_Optics_Gunner_wide_F.p3d";

Here's some kind of a quick-made list

UAV_Optics_Gunner_F.p3d
UAV_Optics_Gunner_narrow_F.p3d
UAV_Optics_Gunner_wide_F.p3d
UAV_Optics_Gunner_medium_F.p3d
UAV_02_Optics_Gunner_F.p3d
UGV_01_Optics_Driver_F.p3d
UGV_01_Optics_Gunner_F.p3d
Optics_Commander_01_F.p3d
Optics_Commander_01_m_F.p3d
Optics_Commander_01_n_F.p3d
Optics_Commander_01_w_F.p3d
Optics_Commander_02_F.p3d
Optics_Commander_02_m_F.p3d
Optics_Commander_02_n_F.p3d
Optics_Commander_02_w_F.p3d
Optics_Commander_03_m_F.p3d
Optics_Commander_03_n_F.p3d
Optics_Commander_03_w_F.p3d
Optics_Commander_OPFOR_F.p3d
Optics_Driver_01_F.p3d
Optics_Gunner_01_narrow_F.p3d
Optics_Gunner_01_wide_F.p3d
Optics_Gunner_02_F.p3d
Optics_Gunner_AAA_01_m_F.p3d
Optics_Gunner_AAA_01_n_F.p3d
Optics_Gunner_AAA_01_w_F.p3d
Optics_Gunner_APC_01_m_F.p3d
Optics_Gunner_APC_01_n_F.p3d
Optics_Gunner_APC_01_w_F.p3d
Optics_Gunner_APC_02_m_F.p3d
Optics_Gunner_APC_02_n_F.p3d
Optics_Gunner_APC_02_w_F.p3d
Optics_Gunner_APC_03_m_F.p3d
Optics_Gunner_APC_03_n_F.p3d
Optics_Gunner_APC_03_w_F.p3d
Optics_Gunner_MBT_01_m_F.p3d
Optics_Gunner_MBT_01_n_F.p3d
Optics_Gunner_MBT_01_w_F.p3d
Optics_Gunner_MBT_02_m_F.p3d
Optics_Gunner_MBT_02_n_F.p3d
Optics_Gunner_MBT_02_w_F.p3d
Optics_Gunner_MBT_03_m_F.p3d
Optics_Gunner_MBT_03_n_F.p3d
Optics_Gunner_MBT_03_w_F.p3d
Optics_Gunner_MTB_01_F.p3d
Optics_Gunner_MTB_01_m_F.p3d
Optics_Gunner_MTB_01_n_F.p3d
Optics_Gunner_MTB_01_w_F.p3d
Optics_Gunner_MTB_01_z_F.p3d
Optics_Gunner_MTB_02_F.p3d
Optics_Gunner_MTB_02_m_F.p3d
Optics_Gunner_MTB_02_n_F.p3d
Optics_Gunner_MTB_02_w_F.p3d
Heli_Attack_01_Optics_Gunner_medium_F.p3d
Heli_Attack_01_Optics_Gunner_narrow_F.p3d
Heli_Attack_01_Optics_Gunner_wide_F.p3d
Heli_Attack_02_Optics_Gunner_medium_F.p3d
Heli_Attack_02_Optics_Gunner_narrow_F.p3d
Heli_Attack_02_Optics_Gunner_wide_F.p3d
Heli_Transport_01_Optics_Gunner_F.p3d
reticle_sdv.p3d
reticle_sdv_driver.p3d
GMG_01_Optics_Gunner_F.p3d
HMG_01_Optics_Gunner_F.p3d
optics_laserDesignator_02.p3d
reticle_arco_F.p3d
reticle_CDTES.p3d
reticle_HAMR.p3d
reticle_LAW.p3d
reticle_LRPS_F.p3d
reticle_LRPS_z_F.p3d
reticle_MAPL.p3d
reticle_marksman_F.p3d
reticle_mortar_01_f.p3d
reticle_MRCO_F.p3d
reticle_nightstalker_F.p3d
reticle_NLAW.p3d
reticle_nvs_F.p3d
reticle_pso_F.p3d
reticle_RPG_F.p3d
reticle_sniper_F.p3d
reticle_sniper_z_F.p3d
reticle_TLD.p3d
reticle_tws.p3d
reticle_tws_mg.p3d
reticle_tws_mg_NFOW.p3d
ENVG.p3d
optics_erco.p3d
optics_night.p3d
optics_night.p3d
optics_soflam.p3d
optics_TOW_TI.p3d
optics_binoculars.p3d
optics_empty.p3d

[revolt-decoy 0]

Its very simple, Arma is intended to be a simulator, but it is far from real life.
You have 2 gameplay modes in this thread;
1. Arma full map battle simulation
2. Game Mod, KOTH, Life, Exile, Epoch etc.... 

I think BIS is already aware of this, but if not, this is a fact!
ARMA WOULD BE DEAD IN THE WATER, IF IT WAS NOT FOR THE GAME MODS!
Oh and your DLC's are pay to win as well as killing Tanoa.

My complaint is Mod related, particularly for "King Of The Hill"

To fix the JET/Wipeout fix the tigris/cheetah AA, thermal, radar and armament.
I and many other players have given up using AA against the Wipeout, and given up playing most game Mod's that utilise AA and Wipeouts. 

RADAR:

• Jets that are 1000m + above you, Vehicle Radar reports them on the outer edge or as being 3km + away.
• Radar shows enemy vehicles/jets as friendly (GREEN) or (GRAY) then turn red once the vehicle is within 1500m  and in most cases after Jet has already opened fire on you. 
• Target Lock "T" in most cases fails with no lock on until well within 1500m, FFS.
• Jets and choppers can horizon spam "T", locking onto vehicles beyond their visible range??? 

Thermal:

• Both Normal and Thermal targeting visibility is very low, you can see the target on Radar and search for it, then all you see/hear is a hail of bullets hitting you, the jet then emerges, FFS..
• Thermal targeting on Jets and tanks have good visibility beyond 4000m+

Armament:

• On many occasions I have fired 4 AA missiles at a Jet within 1000m, all 4 detonated on target with no kill... WTF.. FFS.. with most of them its a combo of missiles and cannons with no kill. 

To quote "The Ferryman" on our forums, advocating the use of tanks to take down Jets.. this must be a REAL LIFE FACT, tanks shooting donw Jets..

Yes enemy tanks become targets for wipeouts for sure (although if your paying attention, any decent tank gunner can put down a wipe out thats got them lined up).

The comments are correct, players are posting vid's shooting down Jets with Tanks, Pawnee's and titan AT's, YES wire guiding Titan AT, not AA,  all resulting with one shot kills.. WTF!!!

Youtube Vid showing Jet already attacking before I could Identify, sight or lock on.
You will notice at 0:05 the Jet is 1.5-2km out, I start to spot and hear cannon rounds and the jet apears at 0:06, my gun is disabled by 0:07 and the jet is still reported as unidetified.   
I tried T spamming while looking up and down.from 0:01, "you can see the info marker on the left move up and down', with no lock, the jet was within 2000m.
https://youtu.be/mSRigSLWo0w
 
Firing 4 missiles at a Jet, point blank, at least 3 of them are seen hitting the jet.
https://youtu.be/WitDuuTVeYU

[x3kj 1247]

If you dont like planes, play on servers and with communities that restrict use of heavy hardware

https://youtu.be/mSRigSLWo0w
https://youtu.be/WitDuuTVeYU

1) no fail - gun was destroyed
2) utter incompetency on AA gunner.. Locked way before in effective gun range. Used locking missiles when in spitting range instead of gun. Terrible anticipation skills of pilots movement and reaction. All missiles fired when plane was dumping a gazillion of flares. Lonewolfing a multicrew vehicle.

 

Radar shows enemy vehicles/jets as friendly (GREEN) or (GRAY) then turn red once the vehicle is within 1500m  and in most cases after Jet has already opened fire on you.

A valid point for AA vehicles. The radar should pick up what an enemy is and what not at any range.  there should be an "accuracy modifier" in the locking system, which improves recognition range governed normally only by "accuracy" cfgvehicle config value.

[xxgetbuck123 945]

Added https://community.bistudio.com/wiki/A3_Targeting_config_reference#class_pilotCamera; let me know if that helps or needs better description.

 

Here's some kind of a quick-made list

UAV_Optics_Gunner_F.p3d
UAV_Optics_Gunner_narrow_F.p3d
UAV_Optics_Gunner_wide_F.p3d
UAV_Optics_Gunner_medium_F.p3d
UAV_02_Optics_Gunner_F.p3d
UGV_01_Optics_Driver_F.p3d
UGV_01_Optics_Gunner_F.p3d
Optics_Commander_01_F.p3d
Optics_Commander_01_m_F.p3d
Optics_Commander_01_n_F.p3d
Optics_Commander_01_w_F.p3d
Optics_Commander_02_F.p3d
Optics_Commander_02_m_F.p3d
Optics_Commander_02_n_F.p3d
Optics_Commander_02_w_F.p3d
Optics_Commander_03_m_F.p3d
Optics_Commander_03_n_F.p3d
Optics_Commander_03_w_F.p3d
Optics_Commander_OPFOR_F.p3d
Optics_Driver_01_F.p3d
Optics_Gunner_01_narrow_F.p3d
Optics_Gunner_01_wide_F.p3d
Optics_Gunner_02_F.p3d
Optics_Gunner_AAA_01_m_F.p3d
Optics_Gunner_AAA_01_n_F.p3d
Optics_Gunner_AAA_01_w_F.p3d
Optics_Gunner_APC_01_m_F.p3d
Optics_Gunner_APC_01_n_F.p3d
Optics_Gunner_APC_01_w_F.p3d
Optics_Gunner_APC_02_m_F.p3d
Optics_Gunner_APC_02_n_F.p3d
Optics_Gunner_APC_02_w_F.p3d
Optics_Gunner_APC_03_m_F.p3d
Optics_Gunner_APC_03_n_F.p3d
Optics_Gunner_APC_03_w_F.p3d
Optics_Gunner_MBT_01_m_F.p3d
Optics_Gunner_MBT_01_n_F.p3d
Optics_Gunner_MBT_01_w_F.p3d
Optics_Gunner_MBT_02_m_F.p3d
Optics_Gunner_MBT_02_n_F.p3d
Optics_Gunner_MBT_02_w_F.p3d
Optics_Gunner_MBT_03_m_F.p3d
Optics_Gunner_MBT_03_n_F.p3d
Optics_Gunner_MBT_03_w_F.p3d
Optics_Gunner_MTB_01_F.p3d
Optics_Gunner_MTB_01_m_F.p3d
Optics_Gunner_MTB_01_n_F.p3d
Optics_Gunner_MTB_01_w_F.p3d
Optics_Gunner_MTB_01_z_F.p3d
Optics_Gunner_MTB_02_F.p3d
Optics_Gunner_MTB_02_m_F.p3d
Optics_Gunner_MTB_02_n_F.p3d
Optics_Gunner_MTB_02_w_F.p3d
Heli_Attack_01_Optics_Gunner_medium_F.p3d
Heli_Attack_01_Optics_Gunner_narrow_F.p3d
Heli_Attack_01_Optics_Gunner_wide_F.p3d
Heli_Attack_02_Optics_Gunner_medium_F.p3d
Heli_Attack_02_Optics_Gunner_narrow_F.p3d
Heli_Attack_02_Optics_Gunner_wide_F.p3d
Heli_Transport_01_Optics_Gunner_F.p3d
reticle_sdv.p3d
reticle_sdv_driver.p3d
GMG_01_Optics_Gunner_F.p3d
HMG_01_Optics_Gunner_F.p3d
optics_laserDesignator_02.p3d
reticle_arco_F.p3d
reticle_CDTES.p3d
reticle_HAMR.p3d
reticle_LAW.p3d
reticle_LRPS_F.p3d
reticle_LRPS_z_F.p3d
reticle_MAPL.p3d
reticle_marksman_F.p3d
reticle_mortar_01_f.p3d
reticle_MRCO_F.p3d
reticle_nightstalker_F.p3d
reticle_NLAW.p3d
reticle_nvs_F.p3d
reticle_pso_F.p3d
reticle_RPG_F.p3d
reticle_sniper_F.p3d
reticle_sniper_z_F.p3d
reticle_TLD.p3d
reticle_tws.p3d
reticle_tws_mg.p3d
reticle_tws_mg_NFOW.p3d
ENVG.p3d
optics_erco.p3d
optics_night.p3d
optics_night.p3d
optics_soflam.p3d
optics_TOW_TI.p3d
optics_binoculars.p3d
optics_empty.p3d

 

 

This is great mate thanks, appreciate it! Everything on the Wiki is great so far, just one more addition below perhaps? And that .p3d list strewth! 

 

One this you could possibly add is some info about what dictates the camera zoom level? I'd like to have more than 8.2x zoom on my TGT camera however I'm not sure what I need to change in the config to achieve that? 

[revolt-decoy 0]

If you dont like planes, play on servers and with communities that restrict use of heavy hardware

1) no fail - gun was destroyed

2) utter incompetency on AA gunner.. Locked way before in effective gun range. Used locking missiles when in spitting range instead of gun. Terrible anticipation skills of pilots movement and reaction.

1. ??? no fail gun destroyed, what do you mean with that comment???

2. This was done to show that tigris AA missiles are a piece of shit, and that I would have had more luck shooting the jet with a TRG!

I take it you fly wipeouts?...