Steam discussion

[Iroquois Pliskin 0]

Just stating the obvious.

As always.

Steam is here to stay (for A3A). Steam is the reason I was able to launch ArmA III Alpha// on the 5th of March, after a 2 minute purchase order & 60 minute download no less.

[zopzodeman 2]

State what ever you like , like i will say i dont want ANY game thats using any form of 3rd party client needed to play .

BI just got added to those game companies i will never buy again from (like EA,UBISOFT and numerous others ...), as long as they use STEAM or any kind of client needed to play as the only option.

If thats making me an obsolete kind of gamer/oldtimer...so be it... I can live with it. I dont NEED to buy games from such companies.There are other developers and game companies that will get my money, because they treat their customer as king.

[Iroquois Pliskin 0]

Then don't do business with said company? You're being offered a deal/product, you can walk away from that deal, but I understand the emotional need to express your dependency on said product, that has changed slightly, yet you still crave it.

... I can live with it. I dont NEED to buy games from such companies.

I dont NEED to buy games

I dont NEED

Freud would argue otherwise. It's okay.

[dm 9]

BI just got added to those game companies i will never buy again from

I dont NEED to buy games from such companies.

I wish there was an auto-ban on the forum for every time people announce this.

Mostly because I dont NEED to read the same uniformed rants all the time :)

[zopzodeman 2]

I wish there was an auto-ban on the forum for every time people announce this.

Mostly because I dont NEED to read the same uniformed rants all the time :)

What do you want to say with uniformed? That im dumb? Or that i didnt get me informed enough in your eyes?Just because YOU defend BI doesnt mean everyone has to.

Edited March 10, 2013 by Zopzodeman

[jblackrupert 14]

Handing over credit card data

That's not a problem nowadays since VISA and Mastercard sell Gift cards that function exactly like Credit cards.

There's no name attached and you usually only need to register to have the ability to check the cards balance

even then you can use a throwaway email address and fake name.

[k3lt 3]

That's not a problem nowadays since VISA and Mastercard sell Gift cards that function exactly like Credit cards.

There's no name attached and you usually only need to register to have the ability to check the cards balance

even then you can use a throwaway email address and fake name.

Ooops. And that's another myth broken, Steam haters running out of arguments...

[mrcash2009 0]

I wish there was an auto-ban on the forum for every time people announce this.

Mostly because I dont NEED to read the same uniformed rants all the time :)

That could be put in reverse too.

Then don't do business with said company?

Software house made that decision for business reasons and not directly on customers behalf remember.

You're being offered a deal/product,

With a 3rd party attached in said deal & addition EULA contract that software house decided to include not the customer which is not in software house control nor you as a customer.

you can walk away from that deal, but I understand the emotional need to express your dependency on said product, that has changed slightly, yet you still crave it.

Whens the tipping point that you cant, becuase wherever you try to buy the content its centralised to steam with more and more supporting it? Or you could say, customers wanted the data (content) not the additional extras on purchase.

People still forget that the more steam gets placed under peoples noses through such 3rd party linking via content they wanted, Valve in actual fact per unit has just put a shop on every customers hard drive overriding any other alternatives with the convenience carrot, can you imagine a store in the physical world doing this, ah yes the analogy of the supermarket, the control of the food chain, lovely.

You have to take into account that there are people in this world that never installed steam and purchased games elsewhere digitally before, and now have the steam shop dumped onto the PC strapped to a single game they might like (crave for as you might put it) not everyone craves valve crow barring in at every turn though. And then to use the other few control hungy alternatives in some kind of "well they do it" and "its just a game" and "its the 21st century" ... is, kind of diluting the point a little when you truly look at it.

Allot of steam supporters seem to assume people just ran out and downloaded steam and simply started shopping and purchasing via Valve from the year it started. Thats not the case, steam attached itself (via internal sales and marketing strategies to software houses not your best interest as a customer & just business reasons) to content that arrived to some people without request.

Please take that little lot into consideration when taking sides and making them & us comments (generally speaking) no matter what side of the fence you may sit.

Edited March 11, 2013 by mrcash2009

[dmarkwick 261]

So if I'd like another ArmA3 license, do I need to strike up another Steam account? Or can I have 2 licenses for the same game under one Steam account?

[Herbal Influence 10]

Maybe I am too nervous about privacy but in fact I assume:

Your PC gets uniquly identified and this stored.

Your playing time gets stored.

Your scores get registered and stored.

Your anonymous email-adress gets stored.

Your nickname gets stored.

All your IPs get stored.

Your payment data get stored.

The games you own get stored.

The version of the games own get stored.

The frequency you play each game and version gets stored.

The online-gamer-steam-friends you have.

Probably also all this data is transfered and stored: www.ip-check.info ..

To be continued ...

I don't know about your communication as I never used steam.

But what about:

- chat logs?

- in-steam-communication?

- ingame-communication?

To be continued ...

The so-called anonymous payment method is paypal? Insert paypal and "angry" into a search machine ...

Another long list of what data paypal stores of personal data from you?

I have NEVER seen a US company that - before energetic public protests arose - ceased to store personal information about everyone and everything.

Whereas I have seen e.g. Google telling the world they deleted huge amounts of special illegally gained personal data and they didn't. They did a few years later. Sure they just forgot about that ... :rolleyes: :j:

And I know that it's cheaper to collect and store data than to delete it.

And I know that there are people that simply don't care about their data.

And I know that there are people that simply don't have nothing to lose. Poor guys ...

I know that there are a lot of young people who cannot imagine today that in ten years it's painful and scaring for them that somebody exactly knows what they did on July 7th, 2013 at 01:41:23 a.m..

Mostly it will in fact be unimportant. But those who don't end their life just in front of a gaming PC but act publicly, get influential, rich or important in any way - they will be frightened. And they will feel hindered to act against the interests of those who know. Too much.

But I know "privacy" and "data protection" is hard to understand for many people. It's quite abstract. It doesn't hurt, smell, you cannot touch it. And there is no sound when they are grabbing your data and form a profile here and there. And later combine and aggregate it.

But it destroys your future slowly. Like radioactivity. Only a few get really hurt but all get more ... silent.

I understand BIS can earn - at last for some time - earn more money this way. And that I like.

I love BIS games.

For their freedom.

For their european kind of treating privacy: No obligatory gaming paths, no obligatory online-connection, no data collection, no scanning your harddisk, free server software and support for own gaming servers ...

Oh, I don't protest.

I am just so sad.

I loved to play BIS games since 2001 quite often.

And only BIS games.

[mrcash2009 0]

Come on Herbal influence, this is the 21st century, you old guard paraniods with your tin foil need to get with the programme. After all we share our data in all manner of ways in every day life so why does this matter? Man, this is just a game, you dont like it then you dont have to use Steam.

This is what I would have posted as a reply if it wasnt of the fact that you too see things a little more open ended than just the "steam hate" argument which I do too :) Plus I thought I would get in before anyone else this time rather than being on the end of it, pre-emptive tin foils strike so to speak :)

Im surprised (unless someone can correct me) that steam doesn't have a "login via facebook" options ... every thing else and its cat seems too, why not. Everything and this included is a transparency data whoring jamboree now anyway (with an individuals unquestioned consent I might add), anything less and you have something to hide, otherwise theres nothing to worry about *sick bag*.

[k3lt 3]

So much Steam hate ;), i present you my favorite Steam skin. (i have to say i never did care about skins and pretty much was using default forever, but when tried it never looked back)

http://pulseh.deviantart.com/art/PixelVision-Skin-for-Steam-211426153

Notice there are 2 versions, 1 for stable steam version and 1 for the beta. (install instructions inside archive)

[W0lle 1050]

You, and everyone else, now stop calling the people who don't like Steam 'haters'. I have enough this childish crap here now. If you can't accept that some people have another opinion then maybe it's better to leave the thread and don't come back.

Same goes of course for the other side who calls them "Steam fanboys". ;)

[jblackrupert 14]

So if I'd like another ArmA3 license, do I need to strike up another Steam account? Or can I have 2 licenses for the same game under one Steam account?

You need multiple accounts if you want multiple copies of the same game.

[dmarkwick 261]

You need multiple accounts if you want multiple copies of the same game.

How stupid. But, thanks for the reply :)

[John Spartan 89]

I have a question, just because of ARMA 3 ALPHA being distributed by steam at the moment, it held me back to purchase it even thou I would love to get supporters edidtion to support BIS (I am a big fan of ARMA game series since 2004). In general I refuse to buy thru steam, i dont like idea that game developer not geting all he deserves and some middleman for just putting up a website milking both sides by adding their service fees (still investment from their side but, its not actual product worht the money in my eyes) also I dont agree to setams "terms and conditions".

I compleatly undersatnad BIS policy on pushing one version for easier and more convinient development/update process but why steam in this is needed I cant.

So the question is about possible boxed edittion release latter when game reaches 1.0 version. I read in this official BIS announcment that there will be one. But it will require steam log on on first time (so tehnicaly I still will be forced to agree that I have rights to use not actualy owning a softwre that i bought).

So my question is simple - has enyone more info about possible boxed editions being released latter and maybe without steam or what type of steam account and EULA will aplly to this version aswell?

Maybe this has been disscussed already here, sorry if I missed it and bring it up again.

Thanks

[chortles 263]

A boxed version will literally be a DVD (or Blu-ray, who knows by then :P) of the Arma 3 Steam installer plus a voucher with a Steam key on it; ALL versions of Arma 3 will require a Steam account and agreement to the Steam EULA to play.

You can buy Arma 3 through the BI Store so that BI will get more of a cut (than if bought through Steam's storefront) -- that's why the Supporter Edition is only available through the BI Store -- but that results in a Steam key which you would then have to manually add to your Steam Library or gift to someone else to redeem, whereas buying through Steam would immediately add it to your account or put it into your Steam Inventory if you bought it as a Gift, redeemable by yourself or by whoever you might send it to.

[Iroquois Pliskin 0]

I have a question, just because of ARMA 3 ALPHA being distributed by steam at the moment, it held me back to purchase it even thou I would love to get supporters edidtion to support BIS (I am a big fan of ARMA game series since 2004). In general I refuse to buy thru steam, i dont like idea that game developer not geting all he deserves and some middleman for just putting up a website milking both sides by adding their service fees

Get it thru BIStore, devs will receive all (most) of the cash. Steam only takes a cut from copies sold within Steam system AFAIK - the original devs themselves generate & send out CD-KEYs to Steam for them to be sold.

[John Spartan 89]

Will see then, I definetly want to OWN a copy of software that I pay for and I dont agree to steam EULA that I only have rights to use not own (dvd or digital it does not matter).

Like ACR DLC i bought from BIS store the last after ARMA X boxed version - digital download with cd key, but no steam bulshit and I have a copy of that download (by EULA I own it) burned on DVD with a serial on it.

I'll wait then on what happens on this matter, in worst case thats me done with ARMA series in future, since the choice is simple take it or leave. I hope ARMA 2 servers will be kept alive for a while or maybe I'll just get my own running to make sure people like me can atleast play ARMA 2 if they dont want to play ARMA 3 on such conditions in future.

You can call me oldfashioned idealist, but I belive in freedom and my rights and do not wish to give them away. I fought two wars as a soldier, on US/NATO side as a Legionere for almoust a decade to defend the lifestyle we once called freedom but it seems to fade in a shadow of global corparate money making machine, sad to see that greed drives the world that much these days.

Edited March 13, 2013 by John_Spartan

[Placebo 29]

How many million people use Steam, 7 million apparently? What percentage of those people have had their games removed for no reason other than they had the audacity to breathe?

[Iroquois Pliskin 0]

...it seems to fade in a shadow of global corparate money making machine, sad to see that greed drives the world that much these days.

Excuse me, but greed is good - PROFIT is good, and it is Good that BIS is racking in the cash, and because of Steam's "greed", which actually is an innovative entrepreneurial solution, I was able to play ArmA III Alpha on release day, after going through 2.5 hours of timeouts on BIStore. I can't imagine downloading from Sprocket with the demand that they were having; would probably take days.

I'm looking out for myself, so are you, and circumstances suggest that it is time to move on - free to choose whether to buy or not, just as with every other product.

[John Spartan 89]

I'm looking out for myself, so are you, and circumstances suggest that it is time to move on - free to choose whether to buy or not, just as with every other product.

I'll agree with you on this one, I will eventualy make a choice - take it or leave it as I said. I will keep my right of choice, I was just trying to clarify the information I had about BIS policy regarding all this "full steam ahead".

Where I definetly I wont agree on your statment "greed is good" I have seen to much bloody avidence where somones greed may leed to, how much suffering can be caused to others by this human weeknes.

Also have you heard and acient saying "PATIENCE IS A VIRTUE" not everyones character is strong enough thou.

[Dwarden 1125]

How many million people use Steam, 7 million apparently? What percentage of those people have had their games removed for no reason other than they had the audacity to breathe?

correction, this is concurrent users, so 7 millions at same time online, the service user base is over 60 millions users ...

[jibemorel 10]

correction, this is concurrent users, so 7 millions at same time online, the service user base is over 60 millions users ...

That's scary, one to bind them all

[NoRailgunner 0]

There are millions of addicted - "greed is good - PROFIT is good" .... good to know where you get your new "fix" first for free or as cheap as possible, hugh? :rolleyes: