official complaint to BIS

[Heatseeker 0]

Im waiting for the 505 release and i know BI are working to solve most issues by then. Future support should take care of the rest...

I think this topic is a rant because the game doesnt have a publisher for NA wich is too bad.

After the game is patched up it will only need some new environments and units because the theme/design is a bit poor (sorry but it really is lol).

I see Arma as the most promissing game out there (only game with a bright future ahead) .

[Scrub 0]

I said it before and I'll say it again, since only time will really tell:

Making a fine wine takes time, but when it matures, it lasts and only gets better.  Take a taste of what will be a $80 bottle a year too early, it's horrible.  The proper year, it's great.  A few years after that, it's even better.

ArmA is staged for such a life, and the proper year looks to be 2007.  Distributed by 505.  Feel free to complain and say you'll leave in pointless threads until they get locked.  But you'll miss a great game.

[whisper 0]

Quote[/b] ]Read Balshoiw posts, it's written all over there : "BI are making me angry purposefully".

Yeah sure...

At least I want to have that things we were told before it was released and that are now magically missing in the retail version.

Even an explanation from BIS would be enough.

If you had followed my posts over the last years you´d know that I was one of those guys who always kept people from pushing BIS into releasing a bugged and unfinished product and tried to spread word about Armed Assault whenever I could. Now that it´s here it´s just a really big dissapointment and I can assure you that I haven´t had my hopesup too high, but as I already said, bugs that were there in OFP 1.0 definately shouldn´t have a second run in Arma. Face it, Arma is bugged, Arma has been sold incomplete, features that were proposed are not in but there is no single word from those who are responsible for this to explain or to lay out their thoughts.

You´ll be certainly not the one who will put me into a box along with all that bugseekers and nitpickers as I´m simply not one of them.

It's not what I meant. I was talking about (sorry for mixing post, but the above comment was more in topic here) :

Quote[/b] ]People who play the latest demo are cheated because the full product they can buy right now doesn´t even have the same version history as the demo.

Cheap tricks for cheap bucks.

No, they don't "trick" you. I mean, what would be their benefit here? You'll get the final version (1.04?) in what? 2 weeks? Why on earth would they "trick" people into buying something? Why would they PURPOSEFULLY only patch demo to "trick" people into buying the full game? Winning 2 weeks? Let's be serious.

No, they simply don't do this to trick people or infuriating them.

Exactly like they don't document the whole Wiki in 3 days.

Same reason here in both cases : they are not enough in the team. Simple as that.

They started ArmA project like nearly 2 years ago now, this being at the time porting OPF XBox for PC platform, nothing new in the engine, while working in parallel on Game 2. ArmA screenshots by that time were crappy tbh, and I was feeling an incoming disaster (ie a game 2 years late for the content proposed, at the very least). Then suddenly, don't ask me why, around 1 year ago, we began to see completely new style screenshots, to the point we didn't know which were Game 2, which were ArmA.

It looks like they made a complete change in ArmA design to incorporate on the fly the latest update they were putting in Game 2, early 2006. HDR, today's models, perhaps even terrain streaming (is it in OFP:E?), 3D ironsight, destroyable bridges and buildings, there was nothing of all this in early screenshots.

Now take a rapid look on the current dev team, and you'll see that all the dirty work that should be done around the main project has not much chance to be done even half properly in such a timeframe.

That's probably why also they had a hell hard time finding a publisher, because publishers were seeing a product still in developement. It's perhaps because of some early comment from publishers about how crappy their product was that they took such a radical turn, btw.

So simply put, imho, they don't have the manpower to dev for both software (demo + full game) so they implement and test fast on demo, and plan for more stable and tested release for full game after, and why we have no complete documentation.

I don't try to find excuses, just an explanation, and this one fits with what I've seen so far. It doesn't make bugs dissapear, MP 100+ players persistant battlefield missions be done, or performance improve, I'm not saying everything is perfect, far from it.

But there is no evil behind how it is done.

btw DM is completely right, there's no game with any proper documentation, so that's nothing new here.

[Paco454 0]

315 posts... I assume he's read at least 315 others... and still so ignorant. I'm not saying he has no valid points, but the whole gestalt of the post is overwrought and underinformed.

And I'm not sure why people seem to want to spooge all over everything before they vanish into oblivion- perhaps it's some latent DNA code that we got when our branch of the evolutionary chain diverged from the one that eventually produced the salmon. I suppose if you have absolutely nothing worthwhile to say, you may as well make a tears-soaked thread and then blow. I have to wonder what ever happened to dignity.

I'm not surprised you jumped on him, in fact I was expecting it like fly paper, just like you jumped on me when I made a simular post bashing BIS. BIS released ArmA game so full of bugs that to suggest, "well all games come with bugs" is a gross under statement.

As I suggested BIS used the community, those German and Czech customers as beta testers and lead the community to think the game was finished and polished when in fact it was bug ridden to an extremely high level, touching off a high level of complaints and concerns over the BIS's motivation. BIS knew about the grossly under stated bugs and released anyway, a very sneaky and under-handed ploy.

On the topic of the author's message, no publisher in the US would allow a game to be sold under their label with such a high level of bugs, perhaps this is why 505 games didn't start to sell the game earlier as it may have asked the game be brought up to certain standard so as not to make 505 games look bad for selling a bug ridden piece of junk.

Moreover, as BIS has said before "they are gamers who make games for gamers and not publishers". As with most publishers today, especially those in the US, they put such high demands on the game makers, like demanding it be console compatible or demanding they add this feature or request they remove this feature, in most cases, these demands cause delays in getting the game out and also result in the game being changed to suit the publisher. In effect the game maker gets put on the bus, "do it our way or no way". A form blackmail. BIS wanted no part of it and I don't blame them.

The author makes valid points. BIS should have come to the community and ask for our help first instead of leading everybody to believe otherwise. Poor managment and very poor communication along with poor marketing of a weak un finished product.

Nevertheless, BIS will continue to work to address all the bugs and will in the end polish the game in which I have no doubt, but how they get to that point will always be a point of contention.

PACO454

[granQ 293]

just release on steam and everyone is happy.. then you can release as many patches you want. I dont care about if there is 1 or 20 patches if its done automaticaly..

Lets say a normal gamer, not the OFP/ARMA/BIS fans that will defend into their death but a normal gamer.

He plays lets say 5 games during one year kinda regular.

BF2

ArmA

Red Orchestra

IL-46

Now what would happen is: Red Orchestra is on steam, always up to date.. he can play anytime he like, just press the icon. For the other games he just "bought" for playing, not being part of the community he needs to first find officiall homepage, download the patches need and figure out what is needed, then he can play.

So he probaly cant bother with one of the game, maybe he stops with BF2, maybe with arma.. who knows.

This is not about me, i am a dedicated ArmA fan that will keep track of teh community, but we have to see a bigger picture then that.

Join the mainstream, release on steam. Free "marketing", people dont whine if there is bugs/patches because they are used to the concept. Low cost.. i know you made all this rocket shit with IDEA game.. but why be so damn independent, I love to buy online but wouldnt use your stuff because you not good on it. Steam are good on online distrubution.. i trust them to be there when its 2012..

[dm 9]

@DeadMeatXM2

lol u are wrong, that is just the excuse of lazy hackers.

I mean if you sell an engine suggesting you have a kind of programming interface, then you have to describe it.

BTW it is BI claiming they are a professional SW developer.

Since there are ties between VBS and ArmA the Q is:

Do they just do not give the doc to us? Or will an VBS owner get a similar NON-documentation.

Do not tell me it is difficult to create a reference guide for all ArmA functions/commands/parameters. They are just to lazy.

They burn our lifetime to find out how it works which takes x times longer then creating the related docs.

I mean I would spend a part of my holidays if I would get the chance to be the ghostwriter for one those developers to assemble the first draft of such a docu which is then easier to maintain once the structure is there.

Should I tell you the BI answer for that offer? No, I guess you know the answer.

No, I am not.

VBS is handled by a subsiduary company (BIA) who do a lot of their own development, and are funded by military sales (there is plenty of info on the various contracts, even some info on sums of money which change hands. You just have to know where to find it)

Its the same arguement about "Oh noes, we should have VBS features in ArmA", and it has the same answer: No we shouldnt, because we are not paying for these specific items to be developed.

As for "lazy hackers", well thats a very short sighted and naieve veiwpoint. Games are not designed, marketed, or in any other way aimed at anyone other than gamers. If you want professional documentation, seek the professional software sector - i.e. the "serious games" market which BIA targets with VBS. Also expect to pay "professional" sums of money for the privellage.

BI IS a professional software developer. They are a professional GAME studio, no more, no less. And unlike "professional" software which is designed to be managed by QUALIFIED professionals, games are designed to be operated by anyone, from the age limit and up, and the documentation is tailored to suit.

The whole ghostwriter thing is a fantasy anyway. Yes big companies who require serious documentation for their products will empoly people to do so. It is something that is WAY outside the scope of a game. Especially one where the sourcecode its self is not available outside of the company.

Edit: you HAVE to stop thinking of ArmA as anything more than a game. To do so would build false hopes of attaining information or privellages that will never be granted to you.

[CsonkaPityu 0]

Quote[/b] ]First of all it would be Marek who would answer the questions, not Suma.

Ondrej is the one leading the ArmA dev team. Marek is working on G2.

I think this game needs polish more then anything else, by this i mean that the animations are robot like, not fluent at all, the soldiers have an anatomical weirdness about them that's constantly distracting me (they look like they're wearing catsuits). Bullet penetration is not accompanied by anysort of effect so it looks more like a glitch (wallhax! ). The vehicle selection is absurd, beyond anysort of explanation. The tracers are the same ones that were in OFP. I know i'm being a brat here, but these minor things, when they all come together they just distract me too much.

Tanks lack the very basics like togglable SUO (when the turret keeps aiming the same way despite the main body movig - it would be nice if i could turn that off so infantry could hop on my tank), no rangefinder either, or a damage system.

Helicopter physics are still trash (well sorry but they are, atleast you can fly around for a while now), you can't turn using the tail rotor, you have to fly a helicopter like a plane (seriously... just revert to OFP's system). You can make flying require skill without making helicopters so hard to control.

The lack of polish is also obvious in the way the game handles the terrain, look at a farming field from a distance and you'll see rows of dirt, walk up to it and you'll see nothing but grass, a 50m area around the player is constantly just either green grass or desert. This is more annoying then any bug, it disorients me because i'm thinking i'll walk through a field of crops then all of a sudden i'm in thick grass... The current mix of satellite maps in the distance and greenness in the near vicinity is annoying me, what i liked about OFP was that when i saw something it was there and i could walk to it.

These tiny things, when they all come together they just ruin the fun for me. In 2001 it was ok, what's my 800mhz CPU gonna do about it? But today it's not good anymore... I'm waiting for mods, maybe i'll start modding myself to try and fix these, but right now, in january '07 i cannot enjoy the game.

Today there is Red Orchestra that absolutely pounds this game into the ground when it comes to realism (yea i like the view distance too but that's not enough on it's own), Steel Beasts kills the tanks in this game and flight sims offer a better flying experience and then there's arcade and co when you need some hollywood moments of smoke and drama. There are so many games out there that do one thing right, they overshadow ArmA in it's current state.

I hope Game 2 comes with some more polish cause i just cannot immerse myself into ArmA or any game that will be like it in the future.

I like BIS, the great support they gave to the community so far is really nothing i've seen before and i trust they have good inentions with ArmA too.

But they focused too much on brute graphics this time and less on polish and improvement, look at the newest Zelda; it's low poly with smudged textures but it's oozing design and cohesiveness. If it's possible to make a gamecube game that's pretty then it should be possible to make one with the minimum requirements of ArmA.

Anyways, i hope the people at BIS don't get too disheartened by ArmA's harsh reception and learn from the whole thing instead.

edit: These are just from a pure gameplay standpoint, technically i'm amazed by ArmA. So i really don't wanna look at ArmA as just a game cause then i'd just uninstall...

[Powerslide 0]

BTW Balschiouw and others, has anyone of you tried contacting Suma by Private Message and ask him all the questions you want to about the release etc and confront him with what everyone (with imagination) has been discussing with eachother?

How are the devs supposed to give any answers when they are unsure themselves.

I didn't start this thread to slam the devs, or the game, this game has MASSIVE potential, just as OFP did. It was revolutionary, easily modified, and damn fun to play. I am just extremely dissapointed due to the fact I loved OFP so much, and hate to see this project falter.

I really feel that BIS needs to re-assess their direction and focus, and work hard at North American distribution and marketing, because this will make or break this game guys, there is no way to deny it. I don't know why Codemasters and BIS couldn't reach a distro deal, it's very unfortunate as OFP distro wasn't bad with Codemasters.

I would strongly urge BIS to not be hasty, to hold back a bit and to speak to Valve about Steam distribution. They have a massive audience geared towards this genre of game and for whatever percentage Valve is going to take BIS will make it up 10 fold in sales over trying to distribute the game independently or though a third rate distributor.

And I also suggest losing the current copy protection system as this is a major turnoff to prospective buyers. The lost revenue due to this system will be far greater then lost revenue due to crakced versions, the key selling feature of this game is the MP play, and a cd key takes care of this, or better yet a steam ID.

-Propaganda-

[sluggCDN 0]

Quote[/b] ]As I suggested BIS used the community, those German and Czech customers as beta testers and lead the community to think the game was finished and polished when in fact it was bug ridden to an extremely high level, touching off a high level of complaints and concerns over the BIS's motivation. BIS knew about the grossly under stated bugs and released anyway, a very sneaky and under-handed ploy.

Paco454,

agree. the ploy was to cash in on Christmas sales. And the game was released before the demo was avaiable. Ideally knowing how many bugs and performance issues were there, what would make more sense would be releasing the demo first. But I guess the greed got the upper hand. Ppl would rather download a demo to take a sneak-peek rather than trying to "contrabanda" a ger. version from Europe. What happened is very underhanded "cat-in-a-bag" kinda ploy. They just cashed in on empty promises, but cashed in on the dedicated BI fans who would buy it anyways, even if the demo would stink. The premature release simply compromised their reputation in the community. I hope the february patch will do the trick. Forget about the bugs, it's not working properly on the Core 2 Duo cpu's let alone the promised Pentium4. How many ppl in the community will be willing to buy a new top-of-the-line computer just to play ArmA?

All I want to say is why hadn't they chosen to concentrate on the demo, getting a decent teaser out while still working on the full version? They wouldn't get that much flak at all - a demo is a demo. Look at the online servers, ppl are playing the demo now instead of the full version anyways. Releasing ArmA, BI didn't get anywhere - ppl new to ArmA who bought the full version most likely got very disappointed and have no desire to go back to it even if it's patched to the absolute perfection. The true fans are still waiting for the better. And after all this BI is heroically trying to work miracles by mid-feb. with the new patch, all the while putting out fires all over the place.

[max power 21]

blablablabla

I can see that you're hot for me, Paco454, but ours is a love that can never be.

What I was saying was that his argument is glib and neglects a lot of facts, such as the different levels of control between the publisher and developer. There have been a lot of well informed posts on this topic covering many of the issues that I was referring to, and I don't believe that I could paraphrase them and do them any more justice than how they are already written.

I do also believe that it is unfortunate that ArmA was released prematurely, but I don't believe that it is a beta or that we are beta testing. I think we are just playing an immature game, as is quite common these days with the very long development cycles and very high budgets that game development is moving towards.

I have to disagree with Shinzon in that this is a platform and not a game product. It is a game product, and it is a platform. On the platform end, we don't have the power to use it because the tools are incomplete. On the game end, I guess it is quite buggy. I don't know if having some bugs in a huge program are necessarily reasons to throw your arms up and wail. I've never felt much either way towards the 'patch-ware' development process- but it certainly does seem to favour those with broadband internet connections and the inclination to go looking for them (the patches).

It is unfortunate that the game was released so early, but it was also fortunate that it was released so early. It at least changed the tone of the whining on these forums! On the subject of whining, why not just report a bug and then be done with it? Why the constant screeching? This is the only reason I reply at all on these forums... the absurdity of some of the things that people say on these forums is what keeps me from just lurking most of the time.

[Hostilian 11]

Agree that it will get a lot better..

Annoyed that I shelled out 30 quid for a German retail product that should have been a lot better. I would be a lot less pissed off had I actually been able to play it bug free (I mean - Game-ruining-bug free. The smaller ones I could put up with).

I've shelved it until the next patch. So essentially I have paid up front in good faith and ended up with an unfinished version that noone is going to make it easy to patch.. (Well, except 6thsense)

If I had known it was so unfinished, I would have waited..

I was a committed OFP'er so I went out of my way to buy early. However, I feel like I've been kicked in the 'nads in return.

#C

[Paco454 0]

blablablabla

I can see that you're hot for me, Paco454, but ours is a love that can never be.

LOL!!!

Your edited post is well written, on topic and you make valid points and I'm glad you decided not to take anymore shots at me, eventhough you decided you and I will never make it together, LOL!! I think over-all the whole issue and problems with ArmA is a hot topic and lots of issues are misunderstood by those who might not know exactly whats going on or what took place, as I personally found it, but nevertheless, BIS through it's own design, be it unseen or unknown issues we were not aware of and the failure to comminucate with the community has left my questions for those, in the know concerned and those no so well informed also concerned, hench some complaints seem lop-sided, but the bottom line, there are big problems. Moreover, the points are being comminucated but because the community is made up of long time OFP fans and newbies, the issue, "BIS FOOLIES" as I fondly put it, will always be a point of contention even on a good day.

Thanks for you post plaintiff1

PACO454

[MR_TROUBLE 0]

I dunno dudes..I'm having a blast playing ArMa. I get the occasional desktop crash and texture weirdness. But the bugs in the game don't "bug" me, the people who play it bug me...pun intended.

I get more pissed off at tk'ing or the player who doesn't know how to fly a chopper flying me and 4 other players into a tree than I do at any of the bugs I've seen.

Look at how many patches the Tom Clancy series of games has had? What about EA Games and BF2 and 2142. You hear the same complaints on the EA forums about people who complaint about EA releasing a buggy game after buggy game.

And I'm not saying that EA games and BIS don't owe the gaming community an explanation for all of this, they do.

What people should do, to send a message, is return the product, demand your money back. If you paid with a credit card, dispute the charges through your financial institution.

As far as BIS making mistakes and killing ArMa I dont know. OFP and ArMa have never had the draw that BF1942, BF2, and BF2142 does. Even if ArMa was revamped and bug-free it's still too complicated for the typica player. The user console/interface/whatever is too "deep" for most players who are used to CS, BF2, Raven Shield, Quake, Doom, type of play. Most people like to run and gun...they dont like hiding in a forest with an RPG and sniper rifle for an hour waiting for the perfect kill. They don't like a map so large you can literally get lost driving around or get stranded somewhere and not fire a shot the whole game.

But I think it's a great game. I had got away from OFP Resistance for a couple of years and I'm glad I rediscovered it with ArMa.

It's like an old girlfriend that you used to date....she used to be fat...now she's thinner...her hair is shinier...she got a boob job....but she's got some of the same mental issues that drove you away the last time...plus some new issues....but man she's great in the sack most of the time.

That's how ArMa is for me.

[CanadianTerror 0]

-I feel sorry for the poor schmoes who dont have a net connection to get some of these game saving patches and arent privy to all this "useful" debate about why their game sucks the big one out of the box.

-Bring back codemasters.

-Just a guess but I'll bet that vbs2 runs a shitload better than arma does in the early stages.

[Paco454 0]

-I feel sorry for the poor schmoes who dont have a net connection to get some of these game saving patches and arent privy to all this "useful" debate about why their game sucks the big one out of the box.

-Bring back codemasters.

-Just a guess but I'll bet that vbs2 runs a shitload better than arma does in the early stages.

-Bring back codemasters.??

Why, what good would that do?

PACO454

[CanadianTerror 0]

Last time I looked, my OFP had codemasters plastered all over it.

I was happy then.

Things seem to have gone to hell since.

[max power 21]

Last time I looked, my OFP had codemasters plastered all over it.

I was happy then.

Things seem to have gone to hell since.

Yes! Codemasters are clearly responsible for all of your happiness! Codemasters is excellent. If only they published girlfriends!

[CanadianTerror 0]

Your stand up comedian act is pretty sad son. Stop jumpin on people like your a somebody.

I'm saying that when codemasters was working with BIS, it "appeared" that things went a lot more smoothly. Yes there were bugs but distribution and having them as a backup seemed to work out far better than whats going on now.

[max power 21]

Your stand up comedian act is pretty sad son. Stop jumpin on people like your a somebody.

I'm saying that when codemasters was working with BIS, it "appeared" that things went a lot more smoothly. Yes there were bugs but distribution and having them as a backup seemed to work out far better than whats going on now.

Clearly, I am a somebody. My mom says I'm cool. She has her doubts about you, though :/ She's judgemental.

I wasn't intending to be funny. I was saying that that is an oversimplification of the issues. I certainly didn't find what you were saying to be amusing! I found it a little repugnant, actually. The reason why it was smoother before was not because of codemasters per se, it was because they had a worldwide distributor of any sort.

I'm deeply sorry that you feel jumped upon.

[CanadianTerror 0]

Quote[/b] ]Clearly, I am a somebody. My mom says I'm cool.

You're mom called me and admitted that you are an idiot.

Sorry for the offtopic to everyone.  

My original point stands though that BIS don't seem to have what it takes to make a game on their own.

Past releases should have given them the experience to get this game out in a more smooth fashion.

[slingblade20000 0]

This is really starting or it has happen to become a really sad state of affairs when it comes to this game. I am surprised by the people who say that BIS isnt on the forums, if you look at the same people who post and post to shoot down someone who post something negetive about this game its kinda easy to figure out who is bought and paid for by BIS to do there dirty work for them.

I think its only the right thing to do for those im taking to that are known so your comments can be taken in the content there given.

[BraTTy 0]

Alot of you are slamming BIS pretty bad.

Let me say that I have been gaming since PC's went public.

Back in the day I used to buy 2-3 games a week and I will say that most were crap.Games looked good on the cover and showed you scenes from the movies and intros just to get the sale.

You make it sound like 50$ is alot of money.I could bring my kids to the fair and spend way more than that and get nothing out of it.Stop to the store and buy munchies.

Min wage is USA is almost 8$ an hour, my son would work a few hours to own a game

You didn't buy stock or own any part of BIS.

I feel that I got my moneys worth...I spent 80$ on BF2 and Special Forces for my wife and she didn't play it for a year.

Just grow up!!

BIS put hard work on this game and alot of us begged and said release it now,if they listened to the public then and now we whine?

I also do Autobody for a living and can spend long hours and long work on a car and have a customer be upset for something they assumed I would throw in even though I always give extra

People are weird...all this complaining isn't helping BIS drive to satisfy, its depressing them

I do feel we missed some of the promised items, I have confidence that the game will be pleasing in the end.

Or Game2 even..just chill out

[znashin 0]

Quote[/b] ]BIS don't seem to have what it takes to make a game on their own

I'll go out on a limb, at the risk of someone beating me down with figures, by saying that the PC game industry isn't what it was five years ago. The niche market games industry certainly isn't what it was five years ago. Please just let BIS try to do what they can, the way they think it should be done. After all, they are probably the only ones posting in this forum, save a precious few, who are in the gaming industry. Have a little faith. If all else fails uninstall arma and pretend it's not going to be released for another six months. Those that already bought it might even save some money in inflation.

Quote[/b] ]I am surprised by the people who say that BIS isnt on the forums, if you look at the same people who post and post to shoot down someone who post something negetive about this game its kinda easy to figure out who is bought and paid for by BIS to do there dirty work for them.

That's a shitty thing to say. I've encountered devs that won't allow anywhere near the level of negative posts these forums have been recieving. I played SOE's Star Wars Galaxies for afew weeks, years ago, had a complaint and found myself having to post in a forum called The Glass House. I'm assuming your first language isn't English so I'll elaborate. There's a saying in English that goes "People in glass houses shouldn't throw stones". It means don't make a noise/fuss if you are in a delicate or volatile situation. Quit SWG soon after and haven't bought an SOE game since, nor will I.

Read the posts without prejudice and you'll see the flaming posts come from both sides. People are hot posting because this game means alot to them and isn't all that it could be or isn't as bad as all that, depending on which side you sit. People typing posts that border on flames I can tolerate. It shows they care. You suggesting that BIS are posting positive propoganda on their own forums under assumed names is wrong. Flat out wrong.

BIS have said that they try to read everything they can on all forums regarding arma, but if you want your post read by them your best bet is to post on BIS forum. Good enough for me.

Saying BIS aren't giving much away isn't the same as saying BIS isn't taking anything in. Remember that! I read on another games forum that devs saying negative things about a game before a said publishers release date is a breach of faith in the contract that the devs have with their publishers.

[Homefry 0]

Guys, normally I wouldn't waste my time replying but this seems pretty ridiculous.

Complaining isn't going to cause BIS to work any faster. I'm sure they are quite aware of what is wrong with the game and the anger some of you are feeling. The problem with this thread is that it serves no purpose other than to offer a place for people to complain. It's not going to cause anyone to be more productive, and it's just going to cause needless bickering and arguing.

All we as a community can do is sit, offer constructive suggestions, and wait. If you're unhappy with the game, return it.

[adumb 0]

I have taken the time to make a small web page for all BIS complaints. the point of this web page is for BIS to track all the of the complaints/dislikes/bitching/moaning, all on one web page. you may view the web page from the flowing web page url.

BIS Complaint tracker.

Thanks,

Sniper Skull