a.i. Tactical Combat Link - TypeX

[snkman 351]

6 hours ago, velzevul said:

 

glad to read it. 🙂 seems, FFE is ready and good solution and it is wise to just integrate it. thanks, and keep up the good work!

Yap it really is! Thanks! Will do...

 

@domokun

Quote

 

Definitely, since I've been using GL4 user since 2010 🤣

I simply meant that it's great to see so much forward compatibility.

 

Oh okay sorry than i read it wrong...

 

Quote

 

BTW is there any chance of reducing the AI's instant awareness? 

e.g. player attacks 1 enemy AI and instantly all other enemy AI converges on player's last known location

 

Which scenario did you set up to get this result?

Well there are some A.I. features which make A.I. much more intelligent.

E.g.: A.I. weapon fire detection and A.I. communication feature.

Those features were made to make A.I. react so specific events much more faster and realistic and of course those features will make A.I. aware of combat situations close to them and even if not involved directly!

 

Also it depends if A.I. unit(s) are in a group or solo?

 

I've already tested and used the newer targetKnowledge command which i have to admit is pretty nice as well and which returns last time enemy(s) was spotted and last time attacked by enemy(s) but this maybe would require another big re-wrote and testing cycle.

[TPM_Aus 137]

Does this work with zeus placed units and headless client?

[kothen 57]

So Ive been doing more testing. and the reactions of the AI are really good. But it seems like no matter what I put the accuracy settings at in the in game difficulty. They always seem to have dead on aim. In your last post you said if the unit skill was set it would take that into account. Does that mean the overall AI skill difficulty isn't taken into account? 

[tanin69 17]

Hi @sknman,

 

I'm testing your mod for a few days now. As far as I've tested it, it behaves really realistic. Many thanks and congratulations to you for this great job !!!

 

I was wondering how I can help and contribute : I'm on the way to read and understand the code, perhaps have a few suggestions, we also need a better documentation for mission maker, etc.

 

Are you open to propositions about sharing your code on a structured way, for example a repository like Github ? I'm ready to manage the repository for you and/or explain how to do that if you are not comfortable with git repositories. My main concern is documentation at the moment. Even if I'm very enthousiast, feel free to say no : it's your creation, and it's deadly cooool 😎

[AirShark 147]

Hello 

is there any updates coming for this mod 

i also have some weird * in the userconfig 

here is an image 

https://imgur.com/CVdjxuK

 

and is there a way to add addon options and configurations  in game instead of userconfig i think all recent mods that is using cba have that...

 

and great job it reminds me of GL indeed ....i never played arma without it😉

[kremator 1065]

Hi AirShark. 

 

Those * have already been commented out, so don't worry about them.

[otarius-big 16]

glad to see it.will it on steam workshop?

[snkman 351]

@TPM_Aus

Zeus yes as it initialize spawned A.I. unit(s) / group(s) automatically.

Headless Clients... Still doesn't really know what exactly this is used for...

 

@kothen

Where or how do you change the "Accuracy" in game?

Guess you are using the A.I. group / unit skill slider in Eden Editor?

Yes the lower the A.I. skill the lower all the skillArray / Sub-Skill values will be e.g. Aiming Shake / Aiming Accuracy / Spot Distance and so on...

Sub_Skill WIKI

 

Quote

They always seem to have dead on aim.

You mean they kind of 1 shot you even with low values?

 

@tanin69

Thanks!

 

Quote

I was wondering how I can help and contribute : I'm on the way to read and understand the code, perhaps have a few suggestions, we also need a better documentation for mission maker, etc.

Sure! I'm always open for help and suggestions!

So far i did it on my own and never messed around with any kind like G.I.T. repository.

I know it from other software i'm using and clearly see the benefit of using such repository.

So sure! If you like to do it! Would be much apprichiated!

 

@AirShark

Thanks!

Those * are place holder for upcomming feature settings.

 

Quote

and is there a way to add addon options and configurations  in game instead of userconfig i think all recent mods that is using cba have that...

Yeah would love to have it this way as well but when it comes to GUI / Interface modding i'm lost... So far i didn't really spend much time on it.

Would love to have the "TCL_AI" settings selectable directly from within the A.I. group(s) Eden Editor composition field or at least have some of the basic settings changeable directly from somewhere in - game. But it is what it is...

To me using "UserConfig" folder is the easyest way right now to provide custom settings.

 

@otarius-big

Right now there are no such plans.

[oldy41 61]

@snkman, as stated before I really love this mod!

 

However, I am afraid there is a fundamental problem caused by the information sharing between AI units:

With TCL active it is nearly impossible to sneak up on enemy APCs or static weapons manned by AI, since AI gunners exactly know your position as soon as another AI unit knows it.

So when you crawl around a house corner or pop up of your cover hoping to score a lucky RPG hit you directly face the APCs barrel. (If only for the fraction of a second, since your virtual existence comes to a sudden end then )

 

I assume that is simply a side effect of the fundamental principle behind the mod, but maybe it can somehow be alleviated?

Maybe reduce the frequency of broadcasting knowledge about enemy units between AI, or 'blur' the information somehow?

 

Imho a solution to this problem would make the mod nearly perfect. 😉

[domokun 515]

@oldy41 IMHO the behaviour you described is one of Arma's biggest flaws, i.e. the instant sharing of battlefield intelligence among AI units.

So it would be great if a mod added a coefficient or slider that allowed users to change the speed at which intelligence is shared among AI units.

 

For example, if a unit doesn't have a radio then their ability to share information should be limited to the range a which they can whisper (<10m), talk (10-30m) or shout (200m).

Even with a radio, units should take several minutes to share information and even then, range of information sharing should be limited by radio size, e.g. handheld = 1-2km, manpack = 8-15km & vehicle = 25-50km.

 

This is particularly important in scenarios where radios are limited or non-existent, e.g. in WW2 most infantry had no radios except for officers.

In the early war, 2-ways radios were often limited to battalion level due to high costs, weight and reliability. In fact, most vehicles, even tanks and few or no radios at this stage

And it wasn't until late war that radios appeared regularly at company level.

Again even, if a unit has a radio, the ability to share information should be slowed as only the radio operator can receive or transmit the info.

 

I really think that a mod that simulated this organic sharing of information would have a considerable and positive impact on gameplay.

Imagine searching for and targeting the radio operator!

Imagine nearby troops trying to recover the radio once an operator had been killed...

[Defunkt 431]

Agree with what's been said on the apparent speed with which accurate knowledge is disseminated among AI.

 

Wonder if I might also posit that one of the things I find unnatural about combat involving AI is the shear volume of fire, like once engagement begins it's just constant firing where most combat footage I've watched small arms fire is vastly more sporadic. Most players I think also shoot significantly more sporadically than the AI. Support weapons (i.e. suppressive fire) aside I think authenticity would be increased by making AI less inclined to fire (i.e. only with higher certainty of target location and when the shooter is not under fire themselves). Might come about naturally if AI are less adept at sharing target knowledge.

 

But I'm looking forward to trying TCL. Doesn't require CBA, works with (rather than against) the native AI - where have you been all my Arma-life TCL?

[froggyluv 2136]

2 hours ago, Defunkt said:

Agree with what's been said on the apparent speed with which accurate knowledge is disseminated among AI.

 

Wonder if I might also posit that one of the things I find unnatural about combat involving AI is the shear volume of fire, like once engagement begins it's just constant firing where most combat footage I've watched small arms fire is vastly more sporadic. Most players I think also shoot significantly more sporadically than the AI. Support weapons (i.e. suppressive fire) aside I think authenticity would be increased by making AI less inclined to fire (i.e. only with higher certainty of target location and when the shooter is not under fire themselves). Might come about naturally if AI are less adept at sharing target knowledge.

 

But I'm looking forward to trying TCL. Doesn't require CBA, works with (rather than against) the native AI - where have you been all my Arma-life TCL?

 

 Thats weird i find AI the absolute opposite -that being they just dont nearly fire enough. Something like 60,000 shots fired/Kill in Iraq and maybe 100,000/Kill WW2 IIRC. Obviously thats overkill for a video game but i honestly find theres just not enough live fire keeping everyone/and AI supressed like they should be, allowing for flanking maneuvers which improves the shotsFired/Killed rate exponentially. Thats why I use so much doSuppressiveFire for AI, to keep them firing and giving the sense of an active battlefield. Cant stand the old days in which a tank would pull up to an AI infested town, fire single little - too clean shots with each one being  a kill -awful.

[Defunkt 431]

Weird indeed, I guess perhaps it's a subjective/taste thing, if I waypoint two squads toward the same location I find the whole engagement is over in much shorter order (under 5 minutes) than I think a real encounter would be with persons properly concerned for their own safety. Mainly it just sounds wrong.

[ricoarma 5]

Hi! Excellent mod.

Do you think you can create modules for the initialization of groups?
Instead of having to put in each time in the init  line of the AI?

Thank you for your answer and thank you again for the mod 🙂

[kothen 57]

@snkman

 

I was actually changing the game difficulty settings overall. I haven't messed with the individual unit skill.

[AirShark 147]

it seems that the Ai is filling the sky with a lot of flares at night (approximately every 5 seconds) especially when having large groups of Ai .....i was encountering this problem since GL4 and the Ai is not reactive that much especially during CQB i think TCL needs a lot of tweaking because a lot of changes happened during the updates and i really miss the way the Ai was hiding in the corners and giving me PTSD during CQB in GL4 .....the GL4 was truly Hard core realism mod.

i also wish to see more  TCL features that enhance the Ai like the ability to plant mines, deploy statics,suppressing and rearming,changing formations automatically and other features that will make it more immersive.

im hoping for another level to TCL/GL.

[chrisb 196]

I see this as one of the most important mods for A3, certainly for sp and coop. GL series of mods have always been very good for setting up fairly complex military terrains. However the main thing that puts some players off is that, this isn't really a type of mod to look at, as an ai mod to add-into missions, or lets say I/we didn't. This type of ai mod is better served for the terrain setup, well gl3-4 were great at that. The missions come via infiltrating the terrain once its setup. These can involve various mission types (depends on setup). I.e. the missions simply bounce off that terrain. Little tweaks later on give huge numbers of oppotunities to players or groups for keeping a terrain active, before a further setup is required.

 

Players have to remember that previous GL's didn't always work well with pre-made missions that did not use the format as the base. This mod may not be the same (not sure).

GL5 had a go and did work to some extent, but unfortunately game dev updates can make the mod very hard to keep up, plus I would think, soul destroying at times.

GL4, along with a couple of others, worked for me in A3 at the beginning quite well, other than the odd error popup. 😕

 

Good quality ai mods that are freely available do a nice job for many players. But if you have the time to put into a terrain setup, especially sp & groups that really like coop against the ai, this type of mod (should it be like its predecessors), would be ideal. It would mean a fair bit of work at the beginning setting up a terrain, but lots of missions from that setup. Whole gaming world really, could and were built from GL3-4. Hopefully for A3 players, this mod could do the same.

 

I certainly wish you well with this and if your the same snkman as the one that worked on previous GL's, then thanks for some great Arma ai gaming in the past. We used GL3/4 like it was going out of fashion back in the day. Obviously mixed with a few others.. 😉

 

I know that GL4 was a springboard for the ai mod I use now, its not based on it, but progressed to suit a play style that was realised through this series of ai mods.

 

Good luck with it.

[snkman 351]

@oldy41

Quote

 

However, I am afraid there is a fundamental problem caused by the information sharing between AI units:

With TCL active it is nearly impossible to sneak up on enemy APCs or static weapons manned by AI, since AI gunners exactly know your position as soon as another AI unit knows it.

 

Well this is some general ARMA A.I. behaviour... As soon as 1 A.I. unit has knowledge about an enemy the knowledge will be shared with the entire group.

Guess the Infosharing ( Communication ) feature of T.C.L. will increase this behaviour.

Did you already check the TCL_Tweak.sqf settings?

Bottom of the file there are 2 settings to tweak or disable this feature.

Maybe it will help solve this problem or at least lower it.

 

Quote

 

This is particularly important in scenarios where radios are limited or non-existent, e.g. in WW2 most infantry had no radios except for officers.

In the early war, 2-ways radios were often limited to battalion level due to high costs, weight and reliability. In fact, most vehicles, even tanks and few or no radios at this stage

And it wasn't until late war that radios appeared regularly at company level.

Again even, if a unit has a radio, the ability to share information should be slowed as only the radio operator can receive or transmit the info. 

 

I really think that a mod that simulated this organic sharing of information would have a considerable and positive impact on gameplay.

Imagine searching for and targeting the radio operator!

Imagine nearby troops trying to recover the radio once an operator had been killed...

 

Agree 100%!

I will try to improve it!

 

@Defunkt

Quote

Wonder if I might also posit that one of the things I find unnatural about combat involving AI is the shear volume of fire, like once engagement begins it's just constant firing where most combat footage I've watched small arms fire is vastly more sporadic.

Well so far i'm not using any command to order A.I. to fire!

The way of how A.I. unit(s) shoot their enemy(s) is kind of native ARMA 3 A.I. combat behavior.

Maybe tweaking their skill in the editor can help lowering / increasing it?

 

Quote

where have you been all my Arma-life TCL?

Oh well... Yes i know... Bit late to the party... ARMA 3 developement almost has reached it's end and IF there will be another ARMA game it will by very high chance use the Enfusion engine which will make T.C.L. kind of useless because of the new enfusion script language.. Pretty sad...

 

@froggyluv

See @Defunkt replay.

 

@ricoarma

Thanks!

Quote

Do you think you can create modules for the initialization of groups?
Instead of having to put in each time in the init  line of the AI?

Sure it would be possible!

The main idea behind not using modules is to keep the mod free of any AddOn requirement.

You can use / create trigger(s) to initialize specific A.I. group(s) with specific A.I. group types as well!

Trigger(s) can be created once and used / synchronized with as many A.I. group(s) as you need.

 

@kothen

Quote

I was actually changing the game difficulty settings overall. I haven't messed with the individual unit skill. 

I will add a divider setting so users can set how much additional skill A.I. unit(s) should have.

 

@AirShark

Quote

it seems that the Ai is filling the sky with a lot of flares at night (approximately every 5 seconds) especially when having large groups of Ai .....

To be honest with you!

I did not check this feature for month's! But now that i know it...

 

Quote

i also wish to see more  TCL features that enhance the Ai like the ability to plant mines, deploy statics,suppressing and rearming,changing formations automatically and other features that will make it more immersive.

When i started to create T.C.L. i was thinking of doing a sweet little pretty basic A.I. mod.

But well... As usuall... It's already grown to a damn complexe kind of thing which already is pretty hard to develope and keep track of...

I already did this mistake with GL4... Adding bunch of features not spending much time with code optimization and testing...

Right my goal is to improve and optimize what's already there and of course try to tweak things requested by the community!

 

This didn't mean i will never add new features but right now that's what i'm able to do with the time i'm able to spend on modding...

 

@chrisb

Thank's for your replay!

I know you spend a lot of time with GL4 helping people to set up Group Link and explaining how it works!

Well a lot of thing's have been changed from GL4 to T.C.L.

It still use many ideas and features from back than but the whole system has been build from scratch to solve some limitations GL4 had and to improve the system in general.

Also with T.C.L. i really focused on A.I. improvement instead of working on multiple types of things at the same time.

 

Quote

Players have to remember that previous GL's didn't always work well with pre-made missions that did not use the format as the base. This mod may not be the same (not sure).

Yes that's right!

With T.C.L. most of those problems should be solved because you are able to use T.C.L. without any A.I. movement and / or reinforcement request.

It can be set to use A.I. combat behaviours only for example.

 

Quote

I certainly wish you well with this and if your the same snkman as the one that worked on previous GL's, then thanks for some great Arma ai gaming in the past.

Many thank's chrisb!

And well... Yes pretty much the same except some year's older...

[snkman 351]

Well... Pretty sorry for not updating T.C.L. for quite a while...

Currently time for modding has become very little...

But! Finally! It's time for an update!

Lot of stuff has been fixed and optimized.

Please make sure to check the ReadMe folder for further informations!

As always... Please post any bugs and / or requests in this thread!

 

Tactical Combat Link - ( TypeX ) Beta v.1.0.19
==============================================

 

Download: ( drive.google.com )

Tactical Combat Link - ( TypeX ) Beta v.1.0.19

[Defunkt 431]

2 hours ago, snkman said:

Oh well... Yes i know... Bit late to the party... ARMA 3 developement almost has reached it's end and IF there will be another ARMA game it will by very high chance use the Enfusion engine which will make T.C.L. kind of useless because of the new enfusion script language.. Pretty sad...

 

Given we've not yet had an announcement that's likely still years away, and still more years until we have the level of content available now in A3.

[ayoung 29]

Thank you Snkman.  I luv T.C.L.

[ayoung 29]

Thank you Snkman.  I luv T.C.L.

[ayoung 29]

Thank you Snkman.  I luv T.C.L.

[tanin69 17]

Hi snkman,

 

We've played our first mission with TCL in my community a few days ago (30 players, 140+ AIs). It was great and appriciated ! No performance impact with more than 140 AIs ! You're doing really a good and useful job for the community and this mod is very promising, at least.

 

Thank you for the last release and for the user documentation that's been a lot improved. I have some very basic question, sorry for this. I'm using the script based TCL. I'll improve the documentation based on your answer, as you said you are OK with it (improving the readme files, for example).

 

At first, I have a bunch of questions about your visual debug system (really very powerfull !!)

 

1) First, would you please explain a bit more about these TCL_Debug settings :

 

- T.C.L. Map Marker Debug: ( Objects ), what is the difference with Map Marker Debug ( System ) ?

- T.C.L. Cursor Debug: ( System ) : do you confirm it's about informations on unit under player cursor (knowsAbout, etc.) ?

- T.C.L. Mission Debug: ( System ) : what is it ?

- T.C.L. Development Debug: ( System ) : what is it ?

 

2) Visual markers, now :

 

- VR arrows : they are indicating future/desired positions, right ? The color code seems to be :

+ purple for a position with no cover

+ blue for a future position ?

+ green for a position occupied by a unit ?

+ red ?

Would you explain a bit more about what is marked ?

 

-What is precisly indicated with lines between an AI and a hostile unit ? knowsAbout value ? Direct sight ? There are white and red lines.

 

Same question about color codes on the map view about group/unit markers : red, yellow, green, blue : I'm confused with it !

 

Please, feel free to point the code portions that I can read to better understand this mecanims : I've a relativly poor coding skill at the moment, but I'm working to improve it ;-).

 

Even more very basic question : is there a really non ambiguous (ideally simple) way to exclude a group from TCL control ?

 

[snkman 351]

@ayoung

Thanks!

 

@domokun

Quote

 

For example, if a unit doesn't have a radio then their ability to share information should be limited to the range a which they can whisper (<10m), talk (10-30m) or shout (200m).

Even with a radio, units should take several minutes to share information and even then, range of information sharing should be limited by radio size, e.g. handheld = 1-2km, manpack = 8-15km & vehicle = 25-50km.

 

Did you already check the "UserConfig > TCL > TCL_AI.sqf" settings?

There you can tweak radio ranges for specific vehicle types.

  // ==============================================================
  // T.C.L. A.I. Reinforcement Request: ( Distance )
  // ==============================================================
  // Choose distance within A.I. group(s) are able to request reinforcement(s).
  // 0 - 50000, default is [3000, 5000, 7000, 10000, 13000] - [Man, Car, Tank, Air, Ship]
    // TCL_AI set [3, [3000, 5000, 7000, 10000, 13000] ];

 

Also time needed for A.I. to request reinforcement(s) can be tweaked too.

"UserConfig > TCL > TCL_Tweak.sqf" settings.

  // ==============================================================
  // T.C.L. A.I. Request: ( Time )
  // ==============================================================
  // Choose how much time A.I. group(s) should need to request reinforcement(s).
  // Note: This value will be recalculated with the knowledge of the requesting A.I. group(s) about their enemy(s).
  // 0 - 70, default is 15 seconds
    // TCL_Tweak set [0, 15];

Of course several minutes would be much more realistic for A.I. to request reinforcement(s) but increasing it that much may would result in A.I. never requesting reinforcement(s) because they will get killed in most cases befor the 1 - 2 minutes are over i guess...