Jets DLC Official Feedback

[FRENZYMAX 3]

10 hours ago, teabagginpeople said:

First one about flaps. Know it's not ideal. I have a cheap 5 button mouse hp one was about 10 euro.  I use the 5th button along with the same one key  for flaps down to vary between flaps  down and up. 

I have a mouse with 2 additional buttons too, but i've mapped them for zoom controls, so there isnt any free button to bind. But remember - we've got new actions to control radar, flare modes and tailhook, so we need to place them somewhere on keyboard within comfort and easy reach, just so you concentrate on piloting instead of searching "where-the-heck-i've-mapped-this-thing" button while trying to evade missile.

 

9 hours ago, AV8R_Six said:

#1 - This would work if there were only one Flaps Up and one Flaps Down position, but there are two flaps positions for good reason.  Partial flaps is available for takeoff and approach...where as full flaps down is great for carrier takeoff or short field operations.  Taking off with full flaps, you climb to altitude and speed then raise them incrementally to smoothly transition to full flight.  The way it is now is fine, you just have to cross-check your flaps indicator and be disciplined with your T/O and Lndg Checklist.

SIgh... Please, read my post again, carefully. I know how flaps are works. I know how to use them. And "T\O + landing checklist discipline" with a current ARMA plane FM is ridiculous. All i want is just to have an ability to control flaps with one button instead of two just to save some precious space on keyboard for new features. Also, making simple controls overcomplicated isnt the only way to increase realism.

 

10 hours ago, AV8R_Six said:

#2 - You can fix this by binding both functions to the same key or button on your joystick.  I did!

I didnt use joystick, but i'm generally intrested to see where did you find wheels brake action for planes. Can you show it to me on a screenshot, please ?

[teabagginpeople 398]

2 hours ago, FRENZYMAX said:

I have a mouse with 2 additional buttons too, but i've mapped them for zoom controls, so there isnt any free button. 

 

Just as a suggestion from my experience  mapping the two free keys on the mouse for zooming is a mistake. I did this at first. But it wasted alot of possibilities for greater control. 

 

I use one for freelook when not using trac ir.  And the other for combos. I use it over multiple keys. Example my lock target key doubles as next vehicle target using the combo key. 

 

Example the combo mouse button used with your flare key can be used to change from burst to single keeping it all around the one key.

 

Example the combo mouse button used with mouse wheel can act as in  zoom zoom out, then mouse wheel pressed for another combo lock area in the targeting camera . Now the mouse wheel serves as four functions. Stuf like that. 

 

Personally things like the tailhook are not essential.  in the whole landing process as this can be thought out long before approach and isn't needed for reflex action. So can use action menu for this. 

 

 

Apologies for all the off topic.

 

[flight1700 22]

On 4/20/2017 at 8:47 AM, bl4dekk said:

Dlc jets are anti-aircraft jets, so they should be better at CAS jets.

 

But this does not occur if we compare their cannons, their cadence and their damage are relatively low, especially shikra.

 

The wipeout uses a 30mm cannon with a rate of 24 shots per second, the F/A-181 Black Wasp II uses a 20mm vulcan cannon with a rate of 29 shots per second.

 

The Gau 8 avenger (A10 Thunderbolt) has a cadence of approximately 3900rpm or 65 rounds per second.

 

Already a Vulcan M61A1 has a cadence of 6000rpm or 100 rounds per second. 35 rounds per second is not an absurd difference ok.

But in the game, the cadences are very similar approximately only 4 bullets per second for the two jets mentioned above, but the damage caused by the 30mm is much higher (logically) but causes an imbalance.

And there is another factor the new dlc jets are more fragile than the CAS jets.

 

Comparing cannons rpm :

A-164 Wipeout = 1440rpm
To-199 Neophron = 1140rpm
A-143 Buzzard = 1,140rpm (yes the same at Neo Lol)

 

F/A-181 Black Wasp II = 1740rpm
To-201 Shikra = 540rpm (What?) It is 30mm APF or APDS but even if it hits, it causes less damage per bullet than the wipeout 30mm HE.
A-149 Gryphon = 1.560rpm

 

*The above values may vary, but I tried to be very careful. :P

 

One more thing the new jets use APF or APDS ammunition and the CAS uses HE, but in the practice of the game they do not differentiate much.

 

The video below shows this :

 

https://youtu.be/3Fs2uO0oxg4

 

*Different helicopters and different angles can vary the amount of ammunition used.

20mm vs. 30mm

  Reveal hidden contents

 

A 20mm cannon is faster than a 30mm cannon. But it does less bullet damage, but it pays off with its high cadence and the possibility of hitting its target more likely. Already a 30mm cannon does the opposite obviously. More damage less cadence.

 

 

 

 

Feedback report page :
https://feedback.bistudio.com/T124390 (To-201 Shikra 30mm GSh cannon Very low cadence.)
https://feedback.bistudio.com/T124426 (Ejector seat killing player)

 

This is a major problem. These jets don't FEEL like they should when firing guns. They feel like CAS jets.

 

What needs to happen is really a simple change; the Wasp's fire rate should be 6,600 r/min (assuming the vulcan cannon), and the Shikra's fire rate should be 1,800 r/min (assuming the GSh-301 cannon).

 

This absurdly fast fire rate should be coupled with a select fire option; pilots should be able to fire 5,10, or 20(ish) rounds per trigger pull. Display this setting perhaps somewhere near the current countermeasures setting, and have the burst setting be able to be cycled through with a binding (like ctrl-f or something).

 

I feel this change is essential to Jet gameplay, 20mm was meant to be thrown in bursts of 10 or 20, all hitting within a fourth of a second. A lack of THIS kind of firepower is a serious handicap on the Wasp in particular, and certainly makes it subpar compared to the Shikra.

 

PLEASE change it <3.

[Grumpy Old Man 3545]

1 hour ago, flight1700 said:

This is a major problem. These jets don't FEEL like they should when firing guns. They feel like CAS jets.

 

Same for the "B_AAA_System_01_F" -> Praetorian, this asset deserves a sound of the same quality as the wipeout's main cannon.

Doesn't sound like a 20mm gatling at all and pales in comparison to the 30mm gatling of the wipeout.

 

Cheers

[froggyluv 2136]

 

 K im a pilot n00b but cant for the life of me get the option to Attach to Catapult but i do get the option to Launch. Ive been inching all around that damn boat lol. Funny the mission fails even tho i got airborne without that darn contraption. Dam you purists!

[ski2060 167]

Funnily enough they just changed that option in the Dev build.  I guess the PR guys didn't get the news before they decided to post up that OpRep.  That will need to be changed if they keep the option as just "launch" .

[_Hawkeye_ 43]

Would love to test this but it is locked ingame so guess no....yes I own the DLC like I own all the others.

 

[AV8R_Six 110]

56 minutes ago, froggyluv said:

 

 K im a pilot n00b but cant for the life of me get the option to Attach to Catapult but i do get the option to Launch. Ive been inching all around that damn boat lol. Funny the mission fails even tho i got airborne without that darn contraption. Dam you purists!

If you are speaking of the Showcase mission, I'll post a YouTube video link for you to check out soon....but it's a little tricky.

Taxi up slowly to the CAT Shooter (Yellow Shirt) with mouse-wheel menu active till you see the Takeoff Arrow in the middle of your screen.  On the interactive menu, you should see Spacebar to Launch or words to that effect.  Make sure you don't hit your throttle until you see the Shooter go through his motions and your Flight lead is airborne.  While holding SPACEBAR, throttle up full and get ready to rotate for takeoff.

 

The Wire/Hook script was broken when I shot the video...anyone know if it's fixed yet?

Video to come.

 

[froggyluv 2136]

 

 Weird cause I sit there waiting and the yellow shirt guy just keeps his hands up and the Lead never launches.

[AV8R_Six 110]

The option usually comes up when you are about 15-20 feet from the hookup point...my video is uploading to YouTube now.

 

[ampersand38 344]

10 minutes ago, froggyluv said:

 

 Weird cause I sit there waiting and the yellow shirt guy just keeps his hands up and the Lead never launches.

You gotta hold down Space until the Launch circle goes all the way around.

[froggyluv 2136]

 

Ahh thanks -will check out when get back home

[AV8R_Six 110]

1 hour ago, froggyluv said:

 

Ahh thanks -will check out when get back home

 

 

[SuicideKing 233]

Throttle is too sensitive in most of the planes. It should be fairly non linear. In general, the points are:

 

1. Plane shouldn't start moving until engine has spooled up completely. Jets DLC planes do this mostly correctly, old ones don't. Related to https://feedback.bistudio.com/T123854

1b. Non-dynamic loadout CAS planes don't function correctly the first two or three times with the new throttle, they still control like the old one. After cycling 3 times they're fine.

2. Even if the planes wait before moving, they tend to start moving a bit too fast. Maybe set 25% or so as the threshold to move again from a standstill, and let the increase in speed be slow. Movement should feel more inertial, so naturally there's going to be some degree of hysteresis.

3. VTOLs don't behave correctly at all at the moment. They go forward despite vectoring being on.

4. When in turns (on the ground) the plane slows down a bit too much, then shoots forward.

Edited May 2, 2017 by SuicideKing
Clarified point 4

[SuicideKing 233]

Issues with turrets:

 

1. They don't like to use radar. https://feedback.bistudio.com/T124657 https://feedback.bistudio.com/T124492

2. Radar sensor doesn't rotate correctly for some https://feedback.bistudio.com/T124658

3. Centurion can see targets beyond 8km https://feedback.bistudio.com/T124659

4. Praetorian 1C targets infantry, which it shouldn't. https://feedback.bistudio.com/T124660 

 

Lack of SEAD: Macers can't target lased targets at the moment (https://feedback.bistudio.com/T124664), and there exist no Anit-radiation missiles. https://feedback.bistudio.com/T124661

[rebel12340 46]

27 minutes ago, SuicideKing said:

3. VTOLs don't behave correctly at all at the moment. They go forward despite vectoring being on.

I believe they changed the way vectoring with the VTOLs works. You now control the vectoring manually or you can set "automatic vectoring" to on through the action menu.

 

That being said, I'm not really sure how the automatic vectoring is supposed to work, as it didn't seem to be possible to do a vertical take off with it on last I checked.

[odie0351 67]

1 hour ago, SuicideKing said:

Issues with turrets:

 

1. They don't like to use radar. https://feedback.bistudio.com/T124657 https://feedback.bistudio.com/T124492

2. Radar sensor doesn't rotate correctly for some https://feedback.bistudio.com/T124658

3. Centurion can see targets beyond 8km https://feedback.bistudio.com/T124659

4. Praetorian 1C targets infantry, which it shouldn't. https://feedback.bistudio.com/T124660 

 

Lack of SEAD: Macers can't target lased targets at the moment (https://feedback.bistudio.com/T124664), and there exist no Anit-radiation missiles. https://feedback.bistudio.com/T124661

1. Manually turn on radar for the defensive turrets in the attributes. If that isn't working then this is a concern, although from my experiments all the turret systems seem to do their jobs.

2. Unless it's effecting the ability of the turret to engage threats than it's not a big deal, still it would be nice to have fixed.

3. Don't know what it's range is supposed to be but honestly it should be able to reach out further than 8k anyways.

4. The ship should never be close enough to shore for it to detect infantry, but regardless, the system the Praetorian is based on is (or will be able to soon) capable of engaging surface threats including ships, boats, canoes, kayaks, rubber duckies etc etc. It is no stretch to think that the same system would be capable of engaging infantry if said infantry are in range, be it via an operator remote controlling the system or maybe even automation by 2035, and given as we have UGV's in game that can automatically engage targets it is reasonable to think that such a system would have similar capabilities.

 

Definitely agree with you that there needs to be some Anti-Radiation missles...and cluster bombs..ya know..for reasons.

[CNutter 24]

I really don't know if it's been mentioned before, probably has, but my forum search skills are too weak to find it...

Please, please for the love of all that is holy add a ladder or something to get from the water back up to the deck!

There's literally no way I can find to get back on the deck other than placing something with zeus to climb on. I've even tried using the teleport function in MCC, but it places me in the water under the carrier instead of on the deck.

 

Edit:I've come across another problem or two, but I'm not sure if these can even be fixed...

 

While trying to take a bobcat over to push my FA-181 back onto the flight deck I magically sunk into the deck. When I got out I fell through the carrier and back into the water below :(
All this could've been avoided if there were a way to use reverse thrust in jets (or if we had a proper tow vehicle)...
 

[AV8R_Six 110]

1 minute ago, CNutter said:

I really don't know if it's been mentioned before, probably has, but my forum search skills are too weak to find it...

Please, please for the love of all that is holy add a ladder or something to get from the water back up to the deck!

There's literally no way I can find to get back on the deck other than placing something with zeus to climb on. I've even tried using the teleport function in MCC, but it places me in the water under the carrier instead of on the deck.

 

 

LOL...yes!

[ivan keska 45]

The showcase i feel is lacking a bit, because it's just fly in and kill two planes and 2 tanks. I wish there was a bit more to it, thus something that would show off the custom weapon loadout. Like you land at the carrier and then get called out to assist friendlies, but you now need to rearm with a more ground based load out. So we get a sense of the new jets a bit more and also see a method of employing the loadout system in game.

Also the weapons on the carrier, don't detect the carrier. Thus they will track a target and fire into the carrier blowing themselves up or any friendly on deck.

Also as Cnutter said above, we do need a way to get up to the carrier from the water. Because that just gives it more possibilities for both offensive and defensive situations. Since infantry can be sent into boats or apcs from the carrier, and so infantry can also assault the carrier.

And is the centurion launcher only suppose to have a detection range of 4km? because i feel like it should be the more medium to long range system, with a range of atleast 6km. There for it's first line defense, the spartan is second line, and the praets are the 3rd line defense. Also if possible would be great if the Praets could function as counter missile, so if for example a cas jet fires from beyond the range of the centurion launchers. The praets can have a chance to kill the missile.

[Imperator[TFD] 444]

2 hours ago, odie0351 said:

1. Manually turn on radar for the defensive turrets in the attributes. If that isn't working then this is a concern, although from my experiments all the turret systems seem to do their jobs.

2. Unless it's effecting the ability of the turret to engage threats than it's not a big deal, still it would be nice to have fixed.

3. Don't know what it's range is supposed to be but honestly it should be able to reach out further than 8k anyways.

4. The ship should never be close enough to shore for it to detect infantry, but regardless, the system the Praetorian is based on is (or will be able to soon) capable of engaging surface threats including ships, boats, canoes, kayaks, rubber duckies etc etc. It is no stretch to think that the same system would be capable of engaging infantry if said infantry are in range, be it via an operator remote controlling the system or maybe even automation by 2035, and given as we have UGV's in game that can automatically engage targets it is reasonable to think that such a system would have similar capabilities.

 

Definitely agree with you that there needs to be some Anti-Radiation missles...and cluster bombs..ya know..for reasons.

 

 

The ship defences can be placed as standalone turrets so ship-to-shore distance is irrelevant.

 

Having said that I agree that letting it target ground targets is fine.

[froggyluv 2136]

5 hours ago, AV8R_Six said:

 

 

 

Man still cant get it wtf?? No mods, I pull up pressing and holding Space while setting throttle top full and they never react or move

 

 

[Hvymtal 1251]

55 minutes ago, Imperator[TFD] said:

 

 

The ship defences can be placed as standalone turrets so ship-to-shore distance is irrelevant.

 

Having said that I agree that letting it target ground targets is fine.

I'd be cool with the praetorian (and only the praetorian) targeting ground/naval units within reasonable distance, but not land units. That might be a little ridiculous with 3000 rounds of ammo on tap and it already shreds light vehicles under imperfect player control as it is, and I don't think the IRL C-RAM can independently target land vehicles (correct me if I'm wrong), though I know for certain that the Phalanx can.

 

As for the deck crew moving thing, it worked for me the first time so I can't help other than ponder at what I did "right' and what you all did "wrong" :P

[flight1700 22]

On 4/26/2017 at 3:44 AM, bl4dekk said:

The jets of superiority have no superiority at all if we use their cannons, if they run out of missile and depend on the cannon, 1 mistake against a CAS and you die.

And the last update generated a bug in the cannon sights of shikra, buzzard and gryphon

 

 

 

 

errrrr,Could not make a f18 gif so it goes in the video :/

 

 

 

I can't be bothered to dig through comments, but did you figure out that the pip you were lining up with the lead marker in the F-181 was NOT actually what is "supposed" to line up with it? What you want to line up is the lead marker and the -w- in the middle, who's name has momentarily escaped me. This worked for me, and I believe this is a bug.

[SteemSucker 19]

Incorrect TWR and engine performance for Black Wasp: https://feedback.bistudio.com/T124666

 

Missing keybinds for new jets: https://feedback.bistudio.com/T124667