Fatigue effects

[Anachoretes 10]

If not now, when ?

New fatigue already requested. And Our demagoguery will not speed up the process. Im sure.

Have you gone up a ladder lately?

I'm not saying "no more wood climbers" or "completly". But the flexibility of the soldiers greatly improved, right?

- Attacking against the sun has no discernible effect.

I don't want to compete in the search for the pros and cons.

I expect more in-egine stuff like animation and physics. Because the ACE will do the rest.

After all, release of ArmA does not mean the end of the development. It's a long way to go. But now we have tracker.

Attacking against the sun has no discernible effect.

New HDR works just fine. You want to see white veil direct to sun? My eyes never note this. Just adaptation and huge contrast.

---------- Post added at 14:09 ---------- Previous post was at 14:06 ----------

And that is very worrying and justifies our "panic".

It's more like a cautious statement. But not total negation.

[Variable 322]

It's more like a cautious statement. But not total negation.

And that's bad enough considering this feature has the potential to completely ruin the game and is game breaking for many of us.

[Masharra 10]

Also Shouldn't crouched stance have a higher increase fatigue whilst moving?

[Alwarren 2767]

Alright, true the system hasn't been modified since alpha but that may be because not all systems have been put in place to compliment it fully nor has all the content been implemented.

May be. It would be better if we had feedback on our feedback, i.e. if only the devs would talk about this. But we don't know, and as a matter of fact, the only feedback on the topic I have seen is "we'll see what we can do" which to me reads as "whatever".

The instant grenade throw was something literally implemented before public Alpha, and has been said time and time again to be a quick and dirty implementation that isn't finished yet. Will it be fixed before release? Hopefully, but I prefer it over the old glorified suicide solution from the previous games.

It's a matter of preference. I would prefer a system that lets you decide how far you throw, how hard you throw, and whether you throw at a high or low angle.

Iertia-less movement is a casualty for smooth mouse and fluid controls. I don't expect this to ever come back, nor do I want it to (at least not in the way it was in previous titles).

There are multiple example of games that do a better job at this. Look at Ghost Recon Future Soldier, when you sprint, you practically have hardly any control moving left or right; you can't do the 180 degrees matrix turns you can do in Arma 3. Bf3 has better movement as well. As it is now, it feels robotic and overcompensated.

I'm not sure what you mean by weapon size being irrelevant? Are we talking muzzle velocity (as it was with Arma 2) or getting your gun stuck in doorways, because the latter still happens with long weapons.

What I mean is, why would you even use a compact MX or an SMG? There is no advantage in them, only disadvantages. They usually have worse range, worse dispersion, etc. Their reason for existence is that they are better in CQB in reality. In Arma 3, they're a punishment, nothing else. Weapon size has no effect on CQB, so it doesn't matter if you have an SMG or a machine gun. It makes me question why SMG's are even in the game.

Yes, the first aid system is crap it's something I myself have been looking into improving, but if you actually look at the first aid system files everything is half finished and a work in progress. Things such as bleeding are in the files but deactivated, So i'm taking a wait and see approach to that.

Experience shows that most of the time, vanilla methods and content are used in mission. The prospect of being stuck with this first aid system is, to put it mildly, disquieting. I strongly dislike the First Aid System, in fact, it is my major gripe with the game apart from the inventory overload. These two absolutely need to be fixed, and one of them we already have confirmation that it won't be fixed.

The lack of inventory in briefings is frustrating, even worse still you can't access vehicles inventories while inside them using the briefing trick either. No idea why this was removed and this is the first post I've seen making a stink about it, which I'm glad to see finally.

Tell you what, so far I was hoping they would fix it, but neither was it fixed, nor is there any indication whether it will be fixed or not. Again, this is an issue with communication, which could be VERY much improved. There is also no mention of this and other major issues on the web page's "Known issues" page.

If this won't get fixed, you can forget about things like a Resistance campaign that very much relies on a mission loadout in the briefing.

Add to this the major annoyance of the red circle, which will make missions that require orientation pretty much impossible.

The Realism vs authentic stuff is to stop people from demanding ridiculous levels of realism from the game,

Maybe, but it can be used the other way around, to justify changes that are breaking realism. The sun is an example of that. I know that BF3 players complained about the sun, but DICE didn't change it because it is an element of gameplay, and element that was lost between Arma 2 and Arma 3 which can be explained away with being authentic instead of realistic.

if people want the former so much go buy VBS2 as that's designed to be a full on simulator. I mean Arma 2 had a pinpoint accurate artillery computer, lock on guided RPGs, RPGs with zero deviation or drop, a hitpoint based armour system for tanks, and many other blatantly gamey features.

I disagree about VBS. While being too expensive in the first place, it isn't a replacement for a game like Arma 2. It's not like I am not willing to make compromises. The RPG's for example, most of them felt more like missiles even the MAAWS which is a rifle, but I am willing to live with that. Plus, as you say yourself, ACE fixed most of these issues.

EDIT: Not saying these are fine, I used ACE to get rid of most of that crap(but similarly, removed parts of ace that I found to be idiotic and add nothing to the game) but sets a precedence of what to expect.

As I said, I am willing to compromise. I don't need any sort of digestive simulation that would force you to go behind a bush after a while to relief yourself, nor do I need to have ultra-realistic movement where you can hurt an ankle because you were running too fast on uneven forest floor. I still feel that a lot of the things changed in Arma 3 have sacrificed the realism I did like for simplified gameplay ("Accessibility") that I do NOT like. I am willing to overlook the movement issues I mentioned, but the first aid, inventory overload and lack of blinding sun are gamebreakers to me, and not having the mission briefing loadout is a major disappointment that I seriously hope will get fixed. And yes, while it was said that the current inventory system is a prototype, it hasn't changed in the, what, four month since the release of the alpha.

Also I've never played wasteland, and apart from the realism vs. games argument I agree with most of what you posted.

I never played Wasteland myself, either, but if people like it I am fine with that. I just don't want to see major game changes being done to accommodate Wasteland and Warfare players (for example, vehicle crew numbers) at the cost of coop/clan play.

[Anachoretes 10]

Masharra

I think it's working now, just hard to notice.

[Alwarren 2767]

I don't want to compete in the search for the pros and cons.

Then you'd better not start it, but you did. It was you that claimed nothing was lost, and you chose the easy way out when someone shows you that you are wrong.

I expect more in-egine stuff like animation and physics. Because the ACE will do the rest.

That essentially says that you will have to rely on a MOD? I am sorry, I prefer the base game to be playable and the mods adding value, not fix gaping issues.

After all, release of ArmA does not mean the end of the development. It's a long way to go. But now we have tracker.

We always had a tracker (CIT). But getting a new version takes time. You cannot rely on that. We had seen a lot of trouble when Arma 2 was released, I would rather avoid such a situation.

New HDR works just fine. You want to see white veil direct to sun? My eyes never note this. Just adaptation and huge contrast.

It isn't about HDR, although I think that coming from a dark building into bright sunlight should have MUCH more effect than it does right now. I know it does in reality.

But attacking against the sun should have disadvantages for visibility, which right now it doesn't

It's more like a cautious statement. But not total negation.

It sounds more like wishful thinking to me. Yes, I want this game to be great too. It surely has the potential for greatness, but it has flaws, flaws that I feel must be addressed

[Anachoretes 10]

It was you that claimed nothing was lost

I know that some people just like to argue on the internet.

When i say "nothing was lost" i meant "nothing, that make this path wrong".

flaws that I feel must be addressed

But it's already done. And there's so many issues on the agenda ...except endurance.

But it shouldn't be just a matter of endurance. But proper capacity and weight system. "Your soldiers can lift 50 kg of feathers but they will not fit in a backpack."

Edited July 7, 2013 by Anachoretes

[Alwarren 2767]

I know that some people just like to argue on the internet.

Can you actually reason, or is generic statements all you can do? You claimed there was nothing lost, even if...

When i say "nothing was lost" i meant "nothing, that make this path wrong".

... even if I extend your original statement by this. I told you what was lost, and still, you just argue with generic "don't worry be happy". Please indicate how you get your conclusion. I said what I dislike, now it's your turn to prove me wrong.

[Anachoretes 10]

Alwarren

All pros and cons of the new game on the surface. I don't see the sense of listing them. About new fog, hdr, direct lights, animations, models, physics, scuba, etc. But it still ArmA - you have the editor, army, and all your time. But "Blinding sun" is not are core feature that make this game ArmA.

I understand that we want the same thing. I do not understand why you want it all the time. Again and again. You would think that this puts pressure on the developer? In my opinion, the suppression fire has already done its job. It is necessary to cool down the barrels and watching for "hostile" movements. :)

Edited July 7, 2013 by Anachoretes

[Varanon 892]

Edit: Never mind, wasted breath (or letters)

[Alwarren 2767]

Alwarren

All pros and cons of the new game on the surface. I don't see the sense of listing them. About new fog, hdr, direct lights, animations, models, physics, scuba, etc. But it still ArmA - you have the editor, army, and all your time. But "Blinding sun" is not are core feature that make this game ArmA.

ROFL. Alright. I see, just as I suspected.

[Anachoretes 10]

I see, just as I suspected.

You see what you want to see. This doesn"t apply to me.

[Troxell 10]

i may be lost but i want to post about the Fatigue issue now i'm not in the army or anything but i know for a fact they train full gear running and shit but in game these guys are a bunch of pussies i mean they cant fire there weapon right for 1 (to much recoil) and 2 they start to cry after running 10m now that is just sad i think they should lose the blur or make it the way it was where you can turn it off if people want it or not i think that's fair for the players who want it or not but that's my views on it how ever they take it fine.

[dmarkwick 261]

i may be lost but i want to post about the Fatigue issue now i'm not in the army or anything but i know for a fact they train full gear running and shit but in game these guys are a bunch of pussies i mean they cant fire there weapon right for 1 (to much recoil) and 2 they start to cry after running 10m now that is just sad i think they should lose the blur or make it the way it was where you can turn it off if people want it or not i think that's fair for the players who want it or not but that's my views on it how ever they take it fine.

*breeeeath*

[dale0404 5]

*breeeeath*

I nearly passed out! Good job you told me to breathe!!! :cool:

@Troxell

The blur effect can now be disabled.

[Wolfstriked 11]

Yeah man BREATH....its gonna be alright.We have all been there and then mini ranted on the forum.Its a fact that when something bothers you you need to release the energy and the forums are perfect for that.;) Trust me the wifey dooesn't give a crap about the blur or the zoomed in FOV of commander positions in APC's.:D

Just breath,tell us your name and a little bit about yourself.

[Anachoretes 10]

Smart people have come up with sublimation. So you can draw a landscape or write great music. Or mod for ArmA. ;)

[bigshot 64]

Absolutely do NOT like the fatigue system in the latest official beta as of 8/15/2013. There's TOO much fatigue too often and feels as though you might as well not even bother sprinting (unless you only need to run 5-10m). Does anyone happen to know if it is staying this way, or are there plans to decrease it by alot?

It's just another nail in the coffin for me it seems.

[HKFlash 9]

Absolutely do NOT like the fatigue system in the latest official beta as of 8/15/2013. There's TOO much fatigue too often and feels as though you might as well not even bother sprinting (unless you only need to run 5-10m). Does anyone happen to know if it is staying this way, or are there plans to decrease it by alot?

It's just another nail in the coffin for me it seems.

People are satisfied with it, so no I dont think it will change. You just need to use less heavy loadouts.

[Smurf 12]

People are satisfied with it, so no I dont think it will change. You just need to use less heavy loadouts.

Heavy loads or not, you get tired WAY too fast and isn't something new. Recovery is as fast too.

[Snorre44 10]

Well, to me it also feels too much. But on the other hand look at the conditions. It is mediterrainian, often there is no shade but direct sun. The equipment is not made for this climate conditions. Also it is not that easy to sprint in full gear. It is not only that you have more to carry, it is also that you move in a different way because of the equipment.

I am sure many people underestimate those factors.

But yes, it is too much. It should be reduced so that you dont have to worry about sprinting for a few metres.

[bigshot 64]

wow ok, didn't realize this is what the new crowd likes. I mean OFP/Arma player remarks from the past have always included complaints about the slow/clunky movement, but this way it seems even slower now. I actually preferred the feel of movement in the original Alpha when it first came out. That was quicker, smoother, less frustrating getting around over larger distances, etc.

The new slower movement coupled with the new A3 shooting mechanics (which I find arduous) are really turning me off. I suppose with this new Bohemia team in charge of things it's "out with the old, in with the new". I'm finding that they're taking the game in a direction that just doesn't seem to suit me. Don't get me wrong, I love sims...but this is getting too over-the-top for me personally speaking...to the point where I'm just not enjoying the game now.

Crazy as it sounds I might actually end up going back to A1 for awhile, hehe.

[KeyCat 131]

What equipment did you carry BigShot? I haven't spent much time testing fatigue but I like that there is a price to pay when you fill your combatvest and backpack. It also makes vehicles needed.

/KC

[big_t 1]

....past have always included complaints about the slow/clunky movement, but this way it seems even slower now. I actually preferred the feel of movement in the original Alpha when it first came out. That was quicker, smoother, less frustrating getting around over larger distances, etc.

THis exactly. When coming from Arma 2 to Arma 3 alpha it felt great, so fluid and proper, now it's so so very slow and boring. Not even sure if it's more realistic now or even slower than in real life,,,it feels really really slow (unless sprinting which lasts what 45m?). The Game feels slow and thats not a good feeling to have about a game.

[nodunit 397]

People say they want freedom of movement, then another say they want weight system, BI experiments with weight systems effecting movement and reaction time and speed, people don't like it. BI can't win.