ACE for OA 1.12

[sickboy 13]

lol you continue arguing with me :)

Sorry you not understand me or you out of reality :)

Yes, of course I continue argueing with you.

We put a lot of time, work, sweat, tears, into ACE, distribution, support etc.

You are openly sharing your opinion, and stating things that are simply untrue.

On the other hand, I am providing (verifyable) facts, to proove you wrong.

Yet you do not wish to continue discussion (perhaps because you know you are out of reality) :)

I'm not battle organizer not map maker and not coder

I'm standard player and due to my experience and work able to look on problem by eyes of other standard player.

I don't need to know about solutions and methods or other issues

Personally I can fix any issues with any mod due to my knowledge and can help other people to fix but only on user level

Well shame on you with all that knowledge, and not reporting issues / crashes :) (Digging own grave comes to mind..)

And it's besides the point anyway - if you're not the map maker / coder / server admin, then someone else is, and you should take it up with them - it's easy to put all the responsibility onto others (us), but I think we do enough, you aughta expect a little more of yourselves instead (and if you don't, then the blame is your own).

I suppose we will never agree on expecting players to report issues, difference of opinion, I can live with that.

But the rest of your statements seem baseless and i've provided counter arguments, incl verifyable facts.

I guess you've made up your mind.

Edited October 12, 2011 by Sickboy

[hellfire257 3]

I've not experienced any problems that Kotov has mentioned. I suspect it's problems caused by the end user. You can lead a horse to water but you cannot make it drink, so to speak.

Players who actually play online will never write you anything on forums and not gonna report anything.

LMAO, do you actually pay attention to anything that goes on here?

[Tonci87 163]

I've not experienced any problems that Kotov has mentioned. I suspect it's problems caused by the end user. You can lead a horse to water but you cannot make it drink, so to speak.

LMAO, do you actually pay attention to anything that goes on here?

^this

@Sickboy You and the other ACE Devs do an outstanding job. I´m more than happy that I have been a little part of the project right from the beginning (closed Beta was Fun :D ) and I´m already looking forward to see what you guys can do with the improved Engine in Arma 3

[jedra 11]

I have worked in IT support for over 20 years, from huge worldwide corporate systems to small web apps and the same thing applies - bugs can only be fixed if they are reported. While there will be some people who log in, spot a bug, log out, an never use ACE again, frankly it is their loss - no developer be it a hobbyist or a commercial operation can do anyhting about that. Both the ACE team, the Arma Community in general , and BIS themselves respond extremely well to bug reports and most things get fixed.

Also, if you were involved a game that was 3 months in the planning, and it did not go to plan, then really you have to ask the people who did the planning whether they planned it properly. That is after all what a plan is!

Also, if you did experience some bugs during the event, then would it not be a good idea to be more specific and perhaps raise some tickets. At least then the ACE team can have look at them and potentially resolve them.

I would shake my fists at you, if I hadn't managed to bust both of my shoulders ;-)

[Gunter Severloh 4072]

Both the ACE team, the Arma Community in general , and BIS themselves respond extremely well to bug reports and most things get fixed.

This alone says alot about our community, game and Bis's ethics about their game, one of the finer reasons

why we have an ausome game as we do, unlike other games we know of cough.... O F P 2 :j:

[stevedrumsdw 10]

Gdt binocluar zoom mod is not working with this version of ACE, does anyone know what change that could be related to? I have used this for years and now it does not work. Is there a file in the ACE addons I could remove that affects this?

Edited October 13, 2011 by stevedrumsdw

[galzohar 31]

If you play a mission that does not require ACE, then people joining in without ACE running will crash the server. With 70 players online I would bet 99% that this is why the server crashed. In Zeus they had to password the server even though they don't mind anyone coming to play with them, simply because it would suck to load up a non-ACE mission and have the server crash mid-mission because someone joined in without ACE running.

As for easiness of installation, I really don't know what to say anymore. The fact is that installation is too hard for most people, but also that Sickboy has basically done everything one might imagine possible other than writing a program that would read your mind and install/run everything accordingly. Fact is that people who take a bit of time to read the guide I wrote in Hebrew for how to install our community mods can do everything needed to play by clicking a single shortcut (and take only a couple minutes to set up said shortcut if they follow the instructions), yet I've noticed an incredible amount of players that would show up on the forums or teamspeak, ask what they need to do to play with us, and when given the answer they would just disappear and never show up again, most likely because either something didn't work for them or because it seemed like too much effort for them. I think this will never be solved until BIS do something about it and automate everything from within the game.

To be honest the only thing that can be easier to use than what is currently available, is an ability for server admins to create an exe that will download/install Six Updater if needed, adjust its settings, create the preset if it's not already created, and then do the "install/update and start game". But even then it would probably be too much work for most server admins (though personally I would definitely do my best to make something like this for my community if it was actually an option, though it probably never will be).

As for no PvP ACE servers, I really don't see many PvP servers at all. Even PR which is quite fresh is only left with 1 active server, and that is a server that already had an active community and admins experienced with higher player counts and public players before PR was even released. Now with so few PvP servers, and the (assumed) fact there are more people having trouble with ACE than people who successfully run it, it makes sense that there are no ACE PvP servers. If many people would have liked PvP I'm sure we'd see more PvP servers, including ACE ones. But right now there simply aren't enough people that are capable of installing ACE, like PvP, and would be willing to play it on a public server. Each of those things is rare enough on its own right, and combining all 3 is just asking for an empty server.

Edited October 13, 2011 by galzohar

[Militant1006 11]

I will admit, I do not find ACE to be the perfect mod I have always dreamed of, because I find a few inherent realism issues in the mod, but, I am a bit of a realism nut, and I know that you cannot make everyone completely happy.

Most things I don't like are little issues, such as the wounding systems formula, and not having a state in wounding which involves being conscious but in extreme pain (rolling on the ground), or the Mk262 not being able to kill at over 800m on unarmoured targets like in RL.

But I always remind myself that if I don't like it, someone else may like it that way, and although it isn't perfect, it improves on the vanilla game significantly. One thing that may benefit in stopping most of the massive amounts of whinging abotu bugs is making the standard releases being only stables, on six updater etc. while having closed beta testing, not being incredibly exclusive but basically forcing any private beta testers to report bugs found.

Usually on my part these days I don't complain about a problem if I can't fix it, if I find any horrible bugs that haven't been reported I go ahead, but otherwise sit back and watch the developers develop their mod.

By the way, a question that I don't know if it has been asked, although it probably has, is there any plans for an ACE 3 in arma 3, or is ACE planning on finishing up on arma 2?

I suppose even if it took a while to get a first release out on arma 3, the features shown so far would last the community a long time.

[kireta21 13]

One thing that may benefit in stopping most of the massive amounts of whinging abotu bugs is making the standard releases being only stables, on six updater etc. while having closed beta testing, not being incredibly exclusive but basically forcing any private beta testers to report bugs found.

Disagree. I want stable version, I download Stable, if I want the newest possible I download ongoing version. People too reta..., erm, unable to check which version they are downloading, or not unable to understand "ongoing developement" thing, shouldn't concern me. I prefer having a choise than not having a choise.

By the way, a question that I don't know if it has been asked, although it probably has, is there any plans for an ACE 3 in arma 3, or is ACE planning on finishing up on arma 2?.

Some issues/sugestions in ACE issue tracker have their "target version" set to ArmA3 so I take it for "Yes".

Edited October 13, 2011 by boota

[Robalo 465]

You can bet that as soon as Arma3 will become available to the ACE team, 99% of development efforts will go towards ACE3 :)

[hellfire257 3]

as soon as Arma3 will become available to the ACE team

:cool:

[kotov12345 10]

ok do you want solutions?Just copy what PR did.

1.Make one click to install installer.

2.Forget about updates very week or even every month

You can do updates same periods as vanilla game

3.Make nice maps.You can use popular maps like warfare/valhala or a&s

4.Run good server.1 is enough.

Also I'd remove or make them switchable such annoying options like high freq sounds when firing AT and you cant run when carry too much gear.But it is only my imho.

[Guest]

ok do you want solutions?Just copy what PR did.

1.Make one click to install installer.

2.Forget about updates very week or even every month

You can do updates same periods as vanilla game

3.Make nice maps.You can use popular maps like warfare/valhala or a&s

4.Run good server.1 is enough.

Also I'd remove or make them switchable such annoying options like high freq sounds when firing AT and you cant run when carry too much gear.But it is only my imho.

Out of Scope

[Militant1006 11]

yeah what I suggested is only something that would stop some whinging, doubt it is important.

Good to hear Robalo, great to see some enthusiasm in the mod team, it is rare to see total conversion mod teams keep going after 3 titles these days.

Lately I have been playing ACE missions with my fellow AAF members, we normally play infantry operations, we have been testing stuff like running convoys and armoured warfare, and we find it really fun, lots of depth, didn't notice it too much untik playing in multiplayer, like doing missions being an armoured platoon (with abrams) taking on Taki Army armour, great fun with the teamwork, and armour damage system, and doing missions where we simply get a few trucks from point A to point B, under protection. love things like replacing tires, towing vehicles, evasive driving, all great fun.

[hellfire257 3]

ok do you want solutions?Just copy what PR did.

1.Make one click to install installer.

2.Forget about updates very week or even every month

You can do updates same periods as vanilla game

3.Make nice maps.You can use popular maps like warfare/valhala or a&s

4.Run good server.1 is enough.

Also I'd remove or make them switchable such annoying options like high freq sounds when firing AT and you cant run when carry too much gear.But it is only my imho.

FPDR

N.B.

All statements are generalised.

1. If you cannot work out SIX updater then you must be mentally challenged.

2. If you cannot remember to update once every two weeks, you must be mentally challenged. If you cannot grasp that you can use the stable builds, you must be mentally challenged.

3. This is a mod, not a game mode. If you cannot grasp this, you must be mentally challenged.

4. This is a mod, not a separate game. It is up to server admins to run what they want. If you cannot grasp this, you must be mentally challenged.

Conclusion? I'll leave that up to you.

[PuFu 4600]

ok do you want solutions?Just copy what PR did.

1.Make one click to install installer.

2.Forget about updates very week or even every month

You can do updates same periods as vanilla game

3.Make nice maps.You can use popular maps like warfare/valhala or a&s

4.Run good server.1 is enough.

Also I'd remove or make them switchable such annoying options like high freq sounds when firing AT and you cant run when carry too much gear.But it is only my imho.

you got the OPTION to play with whatever mods you like. You don't like it and you feel posting bugs and suggestions in an orderly fashion is too much to ask for, then don't do it and move on. I don't see why you take this so personal. It is not like you put any time in ACE yourself.

1. this was the way ACE1 was beeing released. But the downside (besides ppl like yourself bitching about it) was the size you had to download each update.

2. why is that a problem? I really don't get it? Updating your mod is a two click button these days, so i really see no problem there. Besides, good testers are hard to come by around these parts. I remember during ACE1 development, that even having dedicated testers, the trial and error and dicking about finding bugs was done by us the devs...the current mode is ace releases updates and the community is the one to test and get involved in the testing process (although nowadays most bugs have been long squased)

3. maps != missions. Arma and ACE are SDKs. They give the users the tools to do whatever they want to with them. Besides, there are already warfare versions for ace.

4. Are YOU willing to pay for that server? I am sure that if you put forward a server for ACE, they would be more than happy to use it

[gossamersolid 155]

ok do you want solutions?Just copy what PR did.

PR is a pile of shit though, so... Yeah!

If I wanted to play BAF with AAS, I'd play BAF with PvPScene's AAS versions. Then if I wanted a BF2 hud tacked on top... I'd simply play Battlefield 2.

[sickboy 13]

Kotov, thanks for taking the time to more concretely express your opinion.

ok do you want solutions?Just copy what PR did.

PR is a PvP game mode with few addons attached and designed for public play (afaik), ACE is a mod, not specifically intended for PvP, if anything, more coop, and has never focussed on missions.

Basically you can play any mission with ACE, only some need to be adjusted due to added ACE gameplay elements or restrictions.

Apples and Oranges :)

1.Make one click to install installer.

It exists already; Six Updater.

First time only: Install SU.

Start SU, Click "Install/Update and Startgame". Some minutes later, all ACE modfolders are installed, and the game is started with the required parameters.

As a bonus, you get access to the other 100's of mods hosted on the SU network, with the click of a button, and a whole scala of other optional features that you can deploy for your own usage or even community/clan usage, so that even e.g ACRE/Jaylib TS3 stuff is arranged automatically, and even the TS3 server joined with the correct info, in the correct channel :)

Admitted, not entirely 1 click, rather like 2 clicks, maybe 2.5 ;) But you get a lot more than an old-school 'dead' one click installer, if you want....

We feel this fits and works much better than creating huge (2 GB) 'one click' installer files, saves a lot of bandwidth for hosters and downloaders alike, etc etc.

Lastly; Distributing ACE is free - I mean, you are allowed to distribute ACE mod in any manner you like.

So if a huge, 1 click installer, is preferred by you / community / clan / server admin / anyone, you are free to create it, and host it.

2.Forget about updates very week or even every month.

You can do updates same periods as vanilla game

I can see a point for public play, but otherwise i have to ask; Why?

1. You can use stable releases (1-2 month schedule)

2. You can choose not to update to a new release

So what is the importance of reducing our schedule to say 6-12 months?

I can tell you the negative result of this; it would cripple our development and probably will make us stop developing ACE, like has happened with other teams.

3.Make nice maps.You can use popular maps like warfare/valhala or a&s

See my first comment. But to add to that, there are already several missions included with ACE out of the box, incl Domination and Warfare ACE edition, and many more casual MP missions, generally written by 3rd parties.

And A&S, while not included, is fine playable with ACE, and afaik there are also ACE editions available with ACE assets/features. http://ace.dev-heaven.net/wagn/Missions

4.Run good server.1 is enough.

As a mod, not as a game mode etc, it doesnt seem to make sense to run a server. At the same time nothing is stopping you from running an ACE server, public or private, unlike PR.

Also I'd remove or make them switchable such annoying options like high freq sounds when firing AT and you cant run when carry too much gear.But it is only my imho.

But that's what happens when you fire AT in reallife and dont have ear protection. Simple solution; Insert ear plugs (seriously, they are available in ACE :))

And if you don't want to become tired when you have too much gear, you can place the Disable Stamina Module :)

All in all I feel the issue is not so much ACE itself, but being uninformed about the Mod, perhaps partially caused by less accessible documentation, although in my experience; you can have the most complete, beautiful, accessible documentation in the world, and still only 2% will read it :)

Also you seem to expect many things from us (Like .. everything .. except also playing the game for you ;)), while you (anyone) can arrange it themselves.

Things cost time, work, sometimes money etc, why do you feel it's all up to us??

(We're not Bohemia Interactive, you bought their game, not our Mod / sweat / etc. And I dont even see BI servers ;))

Edited October 13, 2011 by Sickboy

[Tonci87 163]

Sickboy, I think he is just trolling.....

[sickboy 13]

Wanted to add; ACE Features are all located in @ACE folder, while @ACEX, @ACEX_USNavy, @ACEX_RU are optional, extra assets (models etc).

@ACE folder can be used separately, so if size is an issue / not interested in additional assets, using @ACE is enough.

I suppose we could change our stable release packages from simple .7z's to self extracting exe files / basic installer,

and e.g keep it still extractable by archive tools like 7z, but we have had complaints about that approach in the past (ACE1) and IMO it doesn't add much, especially compared to Six Updater.

Sickboy, I think he is just trolling.....

Dunno, he takes the time to respond, so I do too, besides, I like to share our thoughts/vision, so it's clear to everyone :D Edited October 13, 2011 by Sickboy

[Guest]

tl;dr, basic installer and SixUpdater

Nah, SixUpdater is the future and u da man!1

[sickboy 13]

If you play a mission that does not require ACE, then people joining in without ACE running will crash the server. With 70 players online I would bet 99% that this is why the server crashed. In Zeus they had to password the server even though they don't mind anyone coming to play with them, simply because it would suck to load up a non-ACE mission and have the server crash mid-mission because someone joined in without ACE running.

Correct, the interesting part is that these kinds of issues could've been solved months ago (if not years), if only server-admins/clients experiencing these issues would report their dumps to BIS CIT.

It's a bug in the game, we were unable to reproduce it in test environment, and even if we could, we can't fix it (BIS can), and a workaround probably would cut in core elements that define ACE. But in any case as long as we cannot reproduce it, a workaround is out of the question too.

[themaster303 22]

Nah, SixUpdater is the future and u da man!1

hell yeah, its the future and its really easy to use !!

btw. mr. billion, what is the t-company saying :D

[fasterthanlight 10]

Did the copy map feature get removed in a previous version or did it get moved to another key binding?

[dunedain 48]

PR is a pile of shit though, so... Yeah!

If I wanted to play BAF with AAS, I'd play BAF with PvPScene's AAS versions. Then if I wanted a BF2 hud tacked on top... I'd simply play Battlefield 2.

I believe you sir need some rest... Comment reported anyway.