Fatigue Feedback (dev branch)

[Ilias38rus 5]

Really hope to find, soon, adrenalin effects in game, because if you are tired it will not stop you from spurted running into cover under fire.

[machineabuse 11]

• Added: Experimenting with animation slowdown for steep terrain and exhaustion

Anyone managed to get the exhaustion part of this to work(or figure out what this means)? As far as I can tell I can still jog infinitely on depleted stamina.

[five_seven5-7 56]

Anyone managed to get the exhaustion part of this to work(or figure out what this means)? As far as I can tell I can still jog infinitely on depleted stamina.

 

True. In 1st person view font "feel" any difference when stamina is depleted, any slowdown experience.

[St. Jimmy 272]

Anyone managed to get the exhaustion part of this to work(or figure out what this means)? As far as I can tell I can still jog infinitely on depleted stamina.

Slowdown happens as soon as you run out of stamina completely and only way to recover it is to get the stamina bar from red to white again. It's not gradual it's just on/off. Running speed drops ~1,5km/h. It's the same effect when the terrain gets steeper so there's slight slowdown. It happens when the indicator shows orange. Then when you're out of stamina and going uphill the reduction is naturally doubled so it's -3km/h from the original speed.

 

It's not easy to notice with bare eyes. You can just see and hear it if you concentrate and really watch and listen the step rate and the animation.

 

A quick code that you can place in the init.SQF if you want to check fatigue and speed in the editor:

enableSaving [false, false];

_newfat = 0;
_oldfat = 0;
_diffat = 0;
_speed = 0;

while {true} do
{     
    _speed = round ((speed player) * 100) / 100;
    _newfat = round ((getfatigue player) * 1000);
    _diffat = (_newfat - _oldfat);
    hintsilent format["%1 fatigue\nChange %2\nSpeed %3",_newfat,_diffat,_speed];
    sleep 1;
    _oldfat = _newfat;
};

[danil-ch 165]

Tweaked: Decreased stamina regeneration and exhaustion cooldown times. It now takes 30 seconds for the available stamina to fully regenerate from total exhaustion instead of 45 and the exhaustion cooldown (period of regeneration when you still cannot sprint) now takes 10 seconds instead of 15.

 

Tweaked: Removed animation slowdown upon exhaustion

 

One word... degradation.

[CaptainObvious 95]

Whaaat is going on?  :huh:

[danil-ch 165]

Nothing good. Bohemia just keeps encouraging unstoppable marathon through the map.

[andersson 285]

They wished for more people to enable stamina on servers and now more will turn it off.

I truly believe that most servers with stamina turned off do that as they are not interesting in simulating that aspect and want a more fluent nice gameplay, NOT because they think the stamina system was bad. So in trying to fix something that wasn't broken to a group that do not want it they are ruining it for the groups that do want stamina.

 

An analogy?

Isn't this a bit like trying to nerf the Advanced Helicopter FDM so more people would use it? It wouldn't work. The sim pilots would cry and the "transport A to B" wouldn't use it anyway.

Luckily the FDM is local so it's not up to the servers to choose. If not BI would maybe try to "fix that one too" based on official missions/servers statistics...

[DancZer 65]

I wonder how the new system will affect the fatigue usage on the servers. My bet is: It will be minimal and those whose disabled the current they will disable the new too.

[Kryptongame 14]

33% faster is a +1 from me and my casual standpoint.

[gippo 38]

Seriously? Quicker stamina regeneration AND no animation slowdown? What is going on guys?
 

I wonder how the new system will affect the fatigue usage on the servers. My bet is: It will be minimal and those whose disabled the current they will disable the new too.

 

Can we even use the fatigue (previous) system after the update? I don't think so.


About Advanced Flight Model: You still cannot force the subsettings on the server, so that is also a half ready stuff. Not like a lot of public servers would use it... but if they want to use it, they cannot use it "correctly".

[Kryptongame 14]

Seriously? Quicker stamina regeneration AND no animation slowdown? What is going on guys?

 

 

Can we even use the fatigue (previous) system after the update? I don't think so.About Advanced Flight Model: You still cannot force the subsettings on the server, so that is also a half ready stuff. Not like a lot of public servers would use it... but if they want to use it, they cannot use it "correctly".

I,think he meant will servers even enable stamina now, or will they keep it disabled/unlimited like current.

[gippo 38]

I,think he meant will servers even enable stamina now, or will they keep it disabled/unlimited like current.

Well, obviously not all the servers. We have it limited at 60% (If a player is managing his fatigue correctly, rarely hits 60% anyways), but yeah, let's talk about like all the servers have it disabled. I wouldn't care about the new stamina system, if we could still use the fatigue system, but well... Let's jog into total causality. A lot of other games use hitmarkers too, I think that's a great idea to implement, because the players are already familiar with that system.

[Kryptongame 14]

Well, obviously not all the servers. We have it limited at 60% (If a player is managing his fatigue correctly, rarely hits 60% anyways), but yeah, let's talk about like all the servers have it disabled. I wouldn't care about the new stamina system, if we could still use the fatigue system, but well... Let's jog into total causality. A lot of other games use hitmarkers too, I think that's a great idea to implement, because the players are already familiar with that system.

To be honest, the Blood hits are a good blend between casual and simulator to me. You obviously see the blood, but it's kinda where you hit in a most pattern...not totally realistc, but better than a white cross on your screen.

[haleks 8212]

So, to answer to the fact that some people disable fatigue, they make it non-existent?

How's that a progress?

 

It was perfectly fine before, you could have fatigue simulation if you wanted it, or disable it for fast-paced modes.

Now you have... nothing, really.

[gippo 38]

It was perfectly fine before, you could have fatigue simulation if you wanted it, or disable it for fast-paced modes.

Now you have... nothing, really.

Exactly. Wouldn't care if we could keep the old system too... (I would kind of, because there are other issues completely untouched in player movement, eg.: Ultimate turn speed in prone position)

[Alwarren 2767]

One word... degradation.

Yeah. Once again only the offensive is affected at all. If you need to run away, you can run like a Duracell-Rabbit without ever having to rest. Why? Seriously, why?

When are BIS going to admit that there is no "one system fits all" and stop trying to make a mashed up good-for-nothing hybrid system, and make it a user/server side setting?

This current system will satisfy no one and alienate everyone. Hardcore gamers will miss the slowdown, casuals will hate the sway. I realize you can't please everyone but that doesn't mean you should aim to please no one.

So let me reiterate the plea: Give casuals their sprint-bar and hardcores the old fatigue system, and make it a difficulty setting. Bam, everybody is happy.

Send from my tablet, so pardon any autocorrect bollocks

[arkhir 135]

It'll probably never happen.

 

Source: http://feedback.arma3.com/view.php?id=23872

[machineabuse 11]

A stated goal of ArmA's gameplay was authenticity.

Is an infantry simulation authentic without the consequences of physical exhaustion?

To excerpt Sun Tzu's Art of War;
 

If you are situated at a great distance from the enemy, and the strength of the two armies is equal, it is not easy to provoke a battle,

[The point is that we must not think of undertaking a long and wearisome march, at the end of which, as Tu Yu says, "we should be exhausted and our adversary fresh and keen."]

and fighting will be to your disadvantage.

How could exhaustion's dismissal be anything remotely authentic to infantry simulation? It's like calling dogfighting without energy management a flight simulator, when energy management is the entire point of Air Combat Maneuvering.

 

[Alwarren 2767]

It'll probably never happen.

Source: http://feedback.arma3.com/view.php?id=23872

Yeah i know, I've heard it before. It doesn't make it any less true though.

Also notice that it says "improvement"... Facepalm

Send from my tablet, so pardon any autocorrect bollocks

[arkhir 135]

After some testing I have to revisit my opinion on the current system.

 

I still don't think it's better than old fatigue. Nor do I think it's worse; it just is. And it is different.

 

 

It still restricts your movement and requires you to plan your path. Running or jogging uphill is as tiring as sprinting on flat surface. Dslyexci's video mocking the new system isn't really relevant now (running up the first hill would drain your stamina fully) and it seems like most people base their opinions on how it was, rather than how it actually is.

For me it'd be perfect as a complementation to the old system and some changes to running&jogging mechanics, obviously customizable via settings to keep everyone happy - as I suggested in the tracker.

But still - after some actual testing is not as bad as I thought it was. I hope they'll tweak it even more, not making it ridiculous in any way, just feeling natural.

 

Another thing I'm glad they've fixed is sprinting w/o weapon which properly drains stamina. Visual GUI elements are splendid, too.

 

 

Am I happy with the overall changes? Yes and no; hard to tell based on current iteration of stamina system. It certainly is better than what it initially was (unlimited 14 kph running in montainous terrain)

Am I disappointed to see the old system gone? Sure I am. I'm still missing impact on prolonged running; for me it seems like only sprinting and running uphill seriously affects your avatar.

[fareast 20]

just give us option to enable the old fatigue back...if they keep dumbing stuff down tanoa and arma 4 are off my wishlist

[teabagginpeople 398]

I have not been on dev branch in a bit so cannot say if I like or dislike anything In particular.

But maybe people jumping the gun with removal of slowdown it was perhaps not working properly for any number of reasons ai included. Doesn't mean they are totally watering it down, probably back to drawing board.

Well I say that with hope. As there is a serious lack of information and actions have gone against words.

[R3vo 2654]

It was perfectly fine before, you could have fatigue simulation if you wanted it, or disable it for fast-paced modes.

Now you have... nothing, really.

 

 

Was it? Why did the ACE3 dump down the fatigue effect then, if every hardcore player liked it as it was?

[Alwarren 2767]

But maybe people jumping the gun with removal of slowdown it was perhaps not working properly for any number of reasons ai included. Doesn't mean they are totally watering it down, probably back to drawing board.

AI included, yes. The good solution would have been to fix the AI. There is a lot of fixing required on the AI, energy would have been better put into that instead of a system that was already implemented...

Send from my tablet, so pardon any autocorrect bollocks