Stealth Kills?

[Siaxis 10]

If just you boys knew how much a Knife means to Special Forces. Its not just something from a COD game. Its actually used. So dont cry about ''i smell COD''

---------- Post added at 11:59 AM ---------- Previous post was at 11:56 AM ----------

Sorry for that. Was meant to be put up on your thread. Not as a message. And was replying on the other guy ^^ sorry.

[Mr. Charles 22]

4DzcOCyHDqc

/thread

[jake_krieger 10]

What about Bayonets . They were used in REAL LIFE ! ADD THEM !

[rye1 21]

Mr. Charles; what the hell? No one is saying use a knife as the first resort, they are simply saying it is a good weapon to add to the game to go along with stealth.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=myzDLzjQ2Ss

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3pzxb2sxbDU&feature=related ;)

[celery 8]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3pzxb2sxbDU

Is that Monty Python? :lol:

[roberthammer 582]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3pzxb2sxbDU&feature=related ;)

That's like Japan style -

!!! :D

[Rocklobster 10]

I guess it would be handy, but only if the NPC's were realistic enough to be able to sneak up on - admittedly already quite a task regardless of the AI in a very open game like Arma where the sight lines are often >1000m, and with little to hide behind.

They had a usable knife in OFP : DR, but it was pretty much redundant. To use it you had to go completely out of your way. I only used it once because of that, and had the AI been better in that game I wouldn't have used it at all.

If there was a 'stealth kill' function, there wouldn't be any point in including it unless it was integrated well with all the other gameplay elements. (But that doesn't mean making it as easy/arcadey as COD).

Edited June 2, 2011 by Rocklobster
rewording

[onlyrazor 11]

I'd honestly like to be able to script banzai-esque suicide charges. It'd be cool, especially if someone wanted to do a WWI/II/III/X mod.

[maturin 12]

I guess it would be handy, but only if the NPC's were realistic enough to be able to sneak up on - admittedly already quite a task regardless of the AI in a very open game like Arma where the sight lines are often >1000m, and with little to hide behind.

They're blind as bats past 300m, what are you talking about.

Knife kills with current AI would just be a borderline abuse showcasing the worst part of the game. AI are far too happy to go prone and slowly attempt to rotate while you run circles around the,.

If there was a 'stealth kill' function, there wouldn't be any point in including it unless it was integrated well with all the other gameplay elements. (But that doesn't mean making it as easy/arcadey as COD).

It would be arcadey, unless a huge amount of effort was put into the animations and wounding system. It would need more detail to work than the gunplay has ever had. So it's pretty obvious that they should expend their effort on the core gameplay.

[ProfTournesol 956]

It would be arcadey, unless a huge amount of effort was put into the animations and wounding system.

I really don't see why. It could be very simple, without being "arcadey" (which doesn't mean much. Are simplified helicopter handling "arcadey" ATM ?). Just a strike, and a dammage according to distance and the body part which is hit. So it would be hard to use, as in RL.

[maturin 12]

I really don't see why. It could be very simple, without being "arcadey" (which doesn't mean much. Are simplified helicopter handling "arcadey" ATM ?).

Yes.

The difference is that knives would fall under the infantry category. This game simulates infantry and merely includes aerial vehicles and tanks.

[froggyluv 2135]

They're blind as bats past 300m, what are you talking about.

Knife kills with current AI would just be a borderline abuse showcasing the worst part of the game. AI are far too happy to go prone and slowly attempt to rotate while you run circles around the,.

It would be arcadey, unless a huge amount of effort was put into the animations and wounding system. It would need more detail to work than the gunplay has ever had. So it's pretty obvious that they should expend their effort on the core gameplay.

Although I've always been in favor of a melee strike, the above is very true. Current AI just aren't nimble and agile enough combined with CQB smarts to give them a fair chance against a player armed with a knife.

Hopefully will change - although improved AI cqb behaviour would just make me happy on so many levels besides melee.

[ProfTournesol 956]

Although I've always been in favor of a melee strike, the above is very true. Current AI just aren't nimble and agile enough combined with CQB smarts to give them a fair chance against a player armed with a knife.

Hopefully will change - although improved AI cqb behaviour would just make me happy on so many levels besides melee.

Voice of the reason :)

[MissionCreep 12]

Just use a silencer. I doubt in real world situations that a combatant would risk unarmed (in modern warfare, a knife is really a tool) CQB unless it was completely necessary. There is nothing stealthy about wrestling someone into submission.

[ProfTournesol 956]

Just use a silencer. I doubt in real world situations that a combatant would risk unarmed (in modern warfare, a knife is really a tool) CQB unless it was completely necessary. There is nothing stealthy about wrestling someone into submission.

I would never have thought of this.

Edited June 2, 2011 by ProfTournesol

[Mr_Tea 0]

IRL an Knife is still an deadly weapon, and if no other weapon is available it must be used.

The only question is, can it be implemented properly?

I hope so.

To close in on an enemy can be very hard in an quiet night, but in an thunderstorm for example, it`s very much possible to be archived.

[Kristian 47]

[Goos 0]

Oh for the love of...

Why are so many people ASSUMING people are talking about running up to a target tapping a button to see the blade slash across said target as it falls to the ground dead?

Get CoD out of your heads! The best example would be the likes of splinter cell. Yes that game is heavily focused on melee but bare with me it's easier than a lot of people realise.

Now imagine this your behind enemy lines your weapons are dry due to whatever reason you come up on an enemy camp and see a sentry you could pick off slowly creeping up behind him you get close enough to be faced with the silent takedown option uppon engaging on that action you become LOCKED in an animation where you step to the target grab him sinking your blade in him in the deadliest fashion as over the space of a few seconds he slides to the ground motionless. The whoal event could take 5-10 seconds during which time you were completely prone to attack had anyone seen you. There is already an action very similar to this chain of events in ArmA 2 right now. Reviving a fallen comrade. The trick is synching the 2 animations of the 2 men in this action again similar to an already existing action. Picking up a fallen soldier. So yeah it's very possible and very plausable.

If you want to get whiney about it then maybe it could be linked to a module so it is selectable wether or not it can be used or not and maybe limited to certain units. At the end of the day no it would not be the forefront of actions one would engage in for combat but more options available makes games better!

Edited June 2, 2011 by Goos

[Big Dawg KS 6]

Why are so many people ASSUMING people are talking about running up to a target tapping a button to see the blade slash across said target as it falls to the ground dead?

Probably because of the title? It kind of really implies that. I mean we've already had the discussion over whether or not knives are stealthy or used stealthily. Should have just been called "Knife/Melee Combat" or something.

[rye1 21]

Blackfox started this thread and it went straight to knives and he said no; just some kind of stealth animation. But really any stealth system would improve the game; it doesn't need knives or other types of weaponary for hand-to-hand. It just needs improved. Not that I wouldn't like to see BIS do something with hand-to-hand combat but I'd prefer we get the correct things implemented over the period of time.

[Goos 0]

Probably because of the title? It kind of really implies that.

No it really doesn't that's just where peoples assumptions went. Personally I fail to see how the words "stealth kills" translates to "one shotting someone with a knife" I read killing a target by using means of stealth be it suppressed weapons/snapping their necks/slitting their throat/drowning them in a boal of cerial/whatever *shrug*

For the most part with the game as it stands now I've done pretty well at various times sneaking right up to an unsuspecting A.I. and popping him in the back of the head with a supressed pistol round but the key to stealth is it should be hard it's not just a case of keeping to a shadow and taking a guy out even though his friends are around and fail to realise their buddy is not looking too healthy. Real stealth is observing and waiting for the right moment to strike and acting on any opportunity that presents itself. As long as that is nailed well and no super hearing is involved it should work out well.

Also my previous example of knifing someone could also apply to something like a choke hold I just used knifing as an example. should have made that clear.

Edited June 3, 2011 by Goos

[Big Dawg KS 6]

No it really doesn't that's just where peoples assumptions went. Personally I fail to see how the words "stealth kills" translates to "one shotting someone with a knife" I read killing a target by using means of stealth be it suppressed weapons/snapping their necks/slitting their throat/drowning them in a boal of cerial/whatever *shrug*

And one thing people do here is assume... quite a lot. Occasionally you get people who just read the thread title and post, without actually reading the thread. The thread title is very important. :j:

[ProfTournesol 956]

And one thing people do here is assume... quite a lot. Occasionally you get people who just read the thread title and post, without actually reading the thread. The thread title is very important. :j:

Because all topics about knives were closed and directed to this one.

[*LK1* 10]

i smell the knife arguments starting yet again...damn consoles games

:D:D:rolleyes:

[dysta 10]

You need a lot of wielding training and stealth training in case to make knife much more worthy in the stealth killing, not a console thingy that you just run behind them and press a button. Cutting wrongfully is also result a grave consequence.

However, no matter how stealthy or even a ghost, in human system people will immediately reflex from a sudden signal under 0.6 seconds. Which mean there's still a possibility to struggling from getting assassinated. Silent ranged weapon however, when he's hit, he will just feel get hit. That's why some assassins also brings with a crossbow or dagger (if trained really well with it) if range is matters.

Overall, I don't think having knife is a bad idea, but people were too much overrated the functionality of the "ancient weapon" (knife is invented in stone-age), there's still a lot of limitation to stealth kill with a knife, at least with proper training and skills that would be another case.