ArmA II focusing too much on realism?

[Mac_Spliff=ISK= 10]

Not sure how to?

But, aren't the Mod & Mission's makers that makes the game more realistic...?

They fill up the game with more nifty goodies to use :), so if you dont want it so realistic

Just play vanilla ArmA 2 :), i like it more sophisticated.......so i use the most realistic

Mods and goodies to have the game i want :)

make it as real possible, those that want it more PEW PEW BANG WHOOOSSSSSHHHHH!

look moma, no hair mwhuhahahahaa, just keep playing vanilla style :)

I'm for realism, as close possible, and still, we are far away from it...

Lot's of people are pulling hairs in the middle of the nite while making mods pack and map's...that for our Gaming fun......Respect :)

So for me...? the closer to it the better.....>!!!<

Greet's

[ziiip 1]

ArmA2 not having soul is kind of a vague statement.

[nodunit 397]

OFP- best campaign of the series hands down, plenty of emotion, character bonding and pacing as you worked your way from being under the command of another, then up to commanding a small group to larger groups, up the chain of vehicles through several missions and eventually to armor and aviation. There was also down time which imo helped to strengthen the bond, here you see the characters have a bit of fun..as humans would.

CWC also had a feeling of great tension, you were actually the underdog for most of the time so you never knew where the reds could be lurking.

Arma2- the most emotion we saw was..that one scene..after the UAV mission there is nothing of it and the humor is a bit childish, when you hear "thats not what your sister said" versus "nice and warm just how you like her (in response to a readying a helicopter) red lights tend to go off. The campaign felt different since you were fighting an inferior force and it was all mainly infantry. The use of warfare wouldn't have been so bad if they didn't toss them at you for the last 3 missions so suddenly.

Arrowhead. The campaign was nice but our characters still felt some things missing, the special forces guy who I guess at times wanted to convey emotion but he came off sounding cold and rather emotionless. The tank driver needing assistance to understand the Taki civilian speaking just fine english was enough to make me facepalm and while the diversity of vehicle missions was great and reminded me of OFP, the pacing was so sudden. Here you are a soldier, next mission you're in a tank, suddenly a helicopter, you don't really get time to learn more about what you are using and 'bond' with that vehicle.

summary..

OFP's campaign is amazing, has all qualities necessary to make a great story and game

-emotions from all sides of the human spectrum from happyness, to fear and anger portrayed pending on situation, often reacting how an actual person would react.

-You lose but you continue, missions where you thought you won but receive a call that the enemy is bringing in a force, thus ordering your evacuation is particularly adrenaline enducing if used 'just' enough..you don't want it too often but it is a very drawing feeling to know you cannot win every battle and the war will simply continue.

-you got a great feel for the vehicles by being with them for several missions at a time, along with SF jobs.

-You were the underdog for the longest and even in the end were fighting an enemy just as able as advanced as you, anything could happen.

Arma2- characters are rather flat, emotions are rarely expressed and the humor with it's one rare time is a let down compared to OFP's.

-The campaign though fun wasn't tense as you were neither the underdog nor fighting an equal force.

-Vehicle diversity was low in range

Arrowhead

-Characters have a bit more dimension but are still pretty flat, emotions are conveyed in text but not voice and we do not see a spectrum

- Vehicle diversity is great but the pacing is too rapid to really get into it, it's like going through emotions, one moment you are feeling sadness then anger, you never attune to either and it leaves a strange feeling.

- Still not the underdog and I'm not sure I would call the Takistani military as able as you, being that you have FLIR and they have at best NVG.

[[aps]gnat 28]

OK, but BIS supplied missions never got me into any of the series.

It was the shear attention to detail, grand scale of the landscape and the HUGE sandbox type abilities.

If its about missions, then its about the User made mission .... they have "soul".

User missions range from fun but stupid PvP's (with no realism! ) through to grand and dynamic campaigns with real grit.

[ProfTournesol 956]

Gnat;1784775']OK' date=' but BIS supplied missions never got me into any of the series.

It was the shear attention to detail, grand scale of the landscape and the HUGE sandbox type abilities.

If its about missions, then its about the User made mission .... they have "soul".

User missions range from fun but stupid PvP's (with no realism! ) through to grand and dynamic campaigns with real grit.[/quote']

Even "After Montignac" IIRC ? This mission drags me alone into those games, before the mission editor or the historical mods like I44 or ACW or the modding thingy. Alone in the woods, frightened, only one save game available (or almost)....escaped with a tractor...

That's why the almighty Razor team really pissed me off.

[vilas 477]

i read first post and all what i can say:

- it is not matter of realism or sim-like or simulation

it is a matter of scenario, actors, voices, music, islands, era etc.

if you would took all OFP without missions released with game, intros and made fictional armies of Bantutustan and Anotherlands you would have not fell in love with OFP

OFP is and always will be great since first mission , it has atmosphere

but it is all due to fantastic missions, scenario and actors voices

also in OFP little more narrow minded AI was better in large battles (going prone attacking and keeping formation, while Arma2 AI really try to be alive , not to die for glory, which stops "great cinematic attacks")

of course i don't like fictional nations/armies, cause than i can't identify with scenario, but i think that most important is mission-making, voice acting, intros etc.

but if you don't like "realism", than why the hell you want spoil our fan and not take another CoD, another SoF, another ... (i can't call all names, cause i don't even play them, i am not interested in CoDs etc.)

i don't like people who moan on realism and "Arma is not another CoD"

they act like disco/dance music fan who came on rock show and say

- why they use guitar and drums and shout, leave guitars, turn bit, take keybord and put umc umc umc sound to jump...

- than what you are doing here ?

- there are 100 disco/dance show around, why don't you go there

- cause i want this show to be 101-st disco show

or like we had some years ago in Poland

there was long time ago rock/reagge/metal music radio station

all other stations were disco

someone bought one station and it began play disco

hell, i was turning scale on radio receiver, no matter what station was on, on the all there was the same music

you want all to be CoD ? f*** never !!!

and who started topic ? registered October 2010 ???

it is good that you at least tested OFP1 , but you should know that "if all is the same" it f** boring (unless someone is not mainstream blind follower and pro-globalist that you go anywhere and have McDonald and etc. )

if i go to another country i wanna see other tradition, another food , another music.. not the same on and on and on and on...

what for "another CoD" ??

there is CoD, SoF, whatever, noone makes you play Arma2 , which rest of people here love to have it mil-sim, cause we feel lack of realism still (damage structure etc.)

i believe that OFP in Arma2 (for example CWR) will as well awsome and better than OFP (in look of models and world)

OFP 1 had also this "dirty" atmosphere, buildings look old, in bad condition, dirty... it was super

Arma 1 world for me was too clean and too nice

Edited November 9, 2010 by vilas

[Windexglow 10]

Arma / OFP campaigns had the sickening feeling of "Oh crap" to them. OFP was the fact that neither side wanted to declare war so you were on your own, had no idea what was going on, and it could go full scale war at any moment. It was both personnel yet connected to bigger things. Arma1 was a small military without any chance of support when they needed it. If they got rolled there was no safety to retreat to, they were backed against the sea with no escape.

Arma 2..I never got far into it. The voice actors ruined it for me, and have never been fond of special-forces missions.

EDIT: Vilas, he isn't asking to make the game into CoD. BI could make the game even more realistic by having players wait days before they can go out on a mission but it wouldn't be fun. We could also perform surgery in the field but that isn't fun. Perhaps we could load rounds into a magazine.

Realism is fun to a point, that's what he meant. Some things in Arma2 could be simplified - other made more complex ('realism').

Edited November 9, 2010 by Windexglow

[Honeycutt 10]

Immersion is the best aspect of ARMA2 followed by realism.

Disappointed with the BIS campaign in ARMA2 as it did not show the player all aspects of the content. High commander should have been an option (if you love C&C games great)

OFP campaign was far better.

[johncage 30]

bottomline: arma 2 is more difficult that its predecessors, therefore people who are used to arcade games simply won't enjoy it. ofp was more of a bridge between arcade nonsense and strategic shooter. it's not a sim in the sense of arma 2 at all as it still had plenty of nonsensical gamey situations.

to people used to the sensory overload provided by constant gun battles and explosions of cod and bf series, of course arma 2 will seem soulness...it's missing explosions and john woo style gun battles. sorry.

[celery 8]

bottomline: arma 2 is more difficult that its predecessors, therefore people who are used to arcade games simply won't enjoy it. ofp was more of a bridge between arcade nonsense and strategic shooter. it's not a sim in the sense of arma 2 at all as it still had plenty of nonsensical gamey situations.

to people used to the sensory overload provided by constant gun battles and explosions of cod and bf series, of course arma 2 will seem soulness...it's missing explosions and john woo style gun battles. sorry.

With terms like "arcade nonsense" and "nonsensical gamey situations", one might almost think that you hate games.

[Albert Schweitzer 10]

Since OFP Resistance we had definetly been missing an "underdog" story.

Back in 2001 we were thrown into battle as a a total unexperienced grunt. It was fantastic to feel, that the M16 in our hands was a yoke and often totally irrelevant to the outcome of a mission. It was about staying behind, keeping the head low and spraying & praying. It felt good not being in charge and just following the experienced team leader

Those missions picked you up as a beginner and pushed step by step ahead into taking more curageous actions. But often I asked myself "for what are we fighting for"?

This is when Resistance came along with Victor Troska. He had something to fight for and a real life-story. The concept of OFP just harmonised brilliantly with this campaign. Victor had gained some experience, just like us, but he had no military means and so had to learn dealing with what was available. Each mission felt like an achievement. You were happy for Victor and those in his team who survived.

But ArmA1+expansion? Even after years of playing I still feel kind of silly to act as leader, it just feels unreal (especially with the complex team-commands, stealing time and athomsphere). It was more about bug-managment than about swimming along with the plot.

Operation Arrowhead? I cant identify with a bunch of Söldners, especially not when they are cliché americans. Overarmed, overpowered, killing squads like flies. Rushing from the left of the map to the right of the map, "all, get back", "7, gunner, board jeep... 7 get out... 7 board jeep".

I hope BIS soon gives us a simple protagonist again, with simple means and simple people to follow him, but fighting for a noble cause.

I want the old resistance-camp-fire feeling back.

[Heatseeker 0]

With terms like "arcade nonsense" and "nonsensical gamey situations", one might almost think that you hate games.

I doubt he actually played OFP...

[vilas 477]

I doubt he actually played OFP...

why ?

i think that for many of us here one-man army is nonsense

one man with 10 different rifles vs. 100 enemies , and explosions that should kill you but not even hurt you etc.

you run along street , many enemies fire and noone shots you etc. or by one serie of AK/M4 whole vehicle blows up and go 10 meters up etc.

[MulleDK19 21]

That's what ARMA 2 is. A SIMULATOR.

It's like a lite version of the VBS products.

[celery 8]

That's what ARMA 2 is. A SIMULATOR.

It's like a lite version of the VBS products.

Arma 2 is a game. The VBS range are simulators made by BIA based on the games made by BIS.

[TechnoTerrorist303 10]

Isn't complaining the Arma series focuses too much on realism a bit like complaining that Burn Notice focuses too much on the adventures of Michael Westen?

[Janat 10]

I think arma 2 has quite a good balance between realism and arcade gameplay, but moving around is too clumsy. Especially indoors. Also, I don't really like to be the leader of the squad and would prefer the A.I. doing all the awkward commanding stuff.

[wipman 1]

Hi, i don't think that the ArmA2 focuses too much on the realism, when is too much?, there's alot of room to improve main and many things to make it more realistic and user friendly; for example... the weapons handling... the terrible weapons sway that's entirely unrealistic and bad. It forces you to always shoot stopped as if you had to be a static defense weapon in order to hit something at 10m from you, with the handguns is even worst, while they'd added the reload possibility while walking and even jogging... they haven't added the possibility of swap to the handgun on the move. Is this realism!? i don't think so... and that's why i don't think that the ArmA series be too focused on realism, aside of be computer games and not training software... it have many bad things as those so important that i've said that remove realism from the tittle and make me think and say that the ArmA series are not too focused on realism beeing the best (and only) of their kind; BIS should make it better instead be so lazyes. Let's C ya

[janh 0]

I don't think there is a too much of realism, in fact I value realism far higher than graphics quality or alike (unless it again interferes with realism).

Realism can, however, outgrow into micromanagement. Though also have control over minor details is desirable for realism fans, a "game" would best include this more as optional choice to be enabled by the realism settings. This is done in ARMA2 already with a number of things. Players that go for example through the pains of performing proper aiming procedures with their reticle get the benefit of more realistic experience, and higher hit rate -- others just enjoy the fun of spraying.

My opinion is that the infantry part of this simulation has reached excellent levels (aside from CQB), but now one starts to feel that the vehicle simulation (air, naval, land) lacks, as well as other things like the damage model and hit effect approximations (specific roles of heat, solid shot, etc as tried to implement later with ACE2, for example). I think there is still a lot of potential in approaching a level of detail as found in Steel Beasts 2, Jane's Apache Longbow or Falcon 4. Also this could be done at customizable levels, including one for hard-core sim fans, and a simplified one for casual gamers.

[mosh 0]

I hope ARMA2 never stop focusing on realism that`s the only reason I like this game because its not scared to actually make use of the pc for what its good at

Simulations.

That`s why we all here like no sorry LOVE this game because its a simulation (realism).

The day BIS (though I am sure they wont) turn ARMA etc into another COD,MOH clone is the day every one here I am sure will leave.

BIS are the best game company full stop and this is what they do best ARMA is the only game in the last 10 years or so (since OFP) to have me hooked thi is the best thing to happen to PC gaming ever (to me any ways).

Arma 2 is not, and god willing will never be, anything like SWAT 4. ArmA II is a military simulator. It doesn't focus on a specific aspect of combat/a specific vehicle/branch of military.

Its meant to be a MilSim, it is a MilSim, and I hope like hell it never becomes a "tactical shooter" like SWAT or Ghost Recon.

but if you don't like "realism", than why the hell you want spoil our fan and not take another CoD, another SoF, another ... (i can't call all names, cause i don't even play them, i am not interested in CoDs etc.)

i don't like people who moan on realism and "Arma is not another CoD"

they act like disco/dance music fan who came on rock show and say

- why they use guitar and drums and shout, leave guitars, turn bit, take keybord and put umc umc umc sound to jump...

- than what you are doing here ?

- there are 100 disco/dance show around, why don't you go there

- cause i want this show to be 101-st disco show

Those three posts pretty much sum up the way I feel also. I do believe my box says Ultimate Military Simulator last time I checked.

[zad fnark 10]

I always liked the Red Hammer campaign.

"Simple Lukin. We kill anyone who gets in the way."

"That's it? That's the plan?"

It must be something about the 80s and the Cold War that brings more "character" to the campaigns.

To this day, I enjoy converting our old favortie OFP missions to ArmA2. Once we have Malden and Nogova, I'll be busy.

That said, I wouldn't trade the ArmA2 game engine for anything. Simply moving while reloading is a godsend. Fortunately, the game engine is independent of the character of the campaigns and missions.

ZF-

[BadgerDK 10]

I want more realism, if I can't smell cordite or shit my pants out of fear, it's not real enough :)

Seriously, I do want more realism. The planes and the tanks in Arma are a an outright joke but the infantry bits are stellar (outdoors). I hope to see some more work done on tanks + planes.

[Rail82 10]

I'm 28 years old. This is the military sim I have been wishing for since my childhood... since I played commando on NES. I have always envisioned a global sandbox environment (although I didn't always know what to call it.) and this game is the first step to ultimately developing that.

[76 0]

I keep hoping for BI to stop trying too hard on the realism side of things... it brakes the game, where it could be really amazing. Just look at Eagle Wing.

Realism isn´t everything. Eagle Wing didn´t try to be realistic at all, and so far, it´s the very best Arma 2 experience I´ve had so far in SP. I hope BI go for strong narratives and less realism in the future.

I´ll say it. I´m a Gamer first, and a Sim fan second. OFP was great because it wasn´t trying to be realistic, but because it tried to tell a story in its own kind of way, and succeeded very well at it.

+1

Balance.

[tswords 10]

i will admit that BIS storytelling has gotten a bit dry and soulless in their campaigns. However, the beauty of ArmA II is that it can be both as realistic as you want, and can be as gamy(?) as you want as well. its really all up to the broad views and brilliant ideas of the community who make those after market missions that makes ArmA II what it is.

As far as immersive storylines in BIS campaigns, i think Harvest Red and Operation Arrowhead did miss the bus for that a little bit. Hell, i was more immersed playing that pvt joe blow in ArmA 1 when Sahrani took the turn that koreas fixing to make (political joke?).

But in the end, i personally feel that the game lost focus on the big picture. On the "why we're here" aspect of battle. Really, that doesnt bug me much cuz it doesnt matter why youre here after the shooting starts. what matters is staying alive to say "i was there" lol.

offtopic? maybe. but on this issue im kinda neutral. so im just throwing my 2 cents in.

cha-ching.