Knife proposal

[PuFu 4600]

this knife discussion happens everytime a new BI game is released..it's NOT gonna happen

[DaveP 66]

In theory throwing knives/axes are doable, but aside from that the game just isn't set up for it

[ProfTournesol 956]

"Sir, I don't understand. What goods' a knife in a nuke fight? All you have to do is press a button, sir."

*knife throw, blood splatter*

"The enemy can not press a button... if you have disabled his hand."

/thread

No, seriously: this would be good for the modding possibilities, e.g. Napolean Era war, medieval or earlier mods, or why not post apocalyptic mods Fallout style? Or for civilian action - axe murderers, police batons...fencers? Basically, anyone saying this is not something that "suits the game" is stuck in mod-less console world (sorry, had to flamebait a little!) - if OFP hadn't come with civvy stuff from the beginning, I bet this argument would be had right now about whether or not there should be a tractor in game.

That said, the REAL question here is whether or not you want BIS to dedicate time and resources to implementing this in their modern time real-world combat simulator. In that case, all the arguments for "not really common" apply fine, as well as the "instead they could implent A, B or C realistic modern combat tech".

Ultimately, I still think a BIS-approved melee ability would enliven and extend the mod-life and thus shelf-life of their product a LOT more than another AWACS system or whatever.

Regards,

Wolfrug

Absolutely ! I won't mod anything for ArmA2 until a built-in melee system is done, as it was simulated in OFP through strokegun and strokefist.

[Guest]

Damn nay-sayers always hating the knife... Just because it's there doesn't mean you'd have to use it all the time, or that it would have to be over-powered like in Call of Duty.

As for how unrealistic it is, who gives a crap: it's an engine capable of more than just things that strictly follow the US military doctrine. Such as Serial Killer/rambo/roleplay/DM missions, ninja/jedi/predator/ww1/ww2 addons etc.

Put it this way: In real life some very lucky commercial pilots get to have some nice in flight sex with a hot stewardess... Just because it's possible, why on earth would anybody add something like that to a flight sim?

Same rule for the knife. Yeah, it happens. But no, not very often in a combat situation.

I think some guys are forgetting that although the knives are "combat knives", they are normally used to do practical things...

Open cans

Cut Rope

Prepare Hunted Food

General Outdoor survival

And some engineering purposes, like hacking out a very basic lock on a door.

[Alaric -ITA- 10]

Little off-topic:

i noticed in Splinter Cell Chaos Theory (or was it double agent? can't recall) you could break open a lock by putting a knife in it and pushing, is that really possible?

[DaveP 66]

Depends on the lock, and if it was a door I suppose if you were strong enough you could use it like a crowbar to break the frame of the door

but frankly I doubt it

[Alaric -ITA- 10]

Well, i recall it worked for most doors, he just putted the knife inside the lock instead of the key and violently rotated it to break the lock, i don't think he actually broke the entire frame. It was time-saving because you didn't have to pick the lock.

[DaveP 66]

In that case it sounds pretty impossible, my best reckoning is the force would have to be enough to break the deadbolt or force it through the frame of the door, either of which is going to be at a point after which the knife would either break or fall out of the lock

[Alaric -ITA- 10]

I see, thanks for the info :)

[TKTom 10]

Absolutely ! I won't mod anything for ArmA2 until a built-in melee system is done, as it was simulated in OFP through strokegun and strokefist.

There is the Undead Mod which has melee attacks for the AI. Maybe you could look at that.

[ProfTournesol 956]

There is the Undead Mod which has melee attacks for the AI. Maybe you could look at that.

Nope, scripted attacks don't interest me.

[DaveP 66]

I did a script back in the OFP days that let you kung fu people to death, it'd be similar but of what I remember then it wasn't really useful/effective, let alone now

[Pulverizer 1]

Put it this way: In real life some very lucky commercial pilots get to have some nice in flight sex with a hot stewardess... Just because it's possible, why on earth would anybody add something like that to a flight sim?

Same rule for the knife. Yeah, it happens. But no, not very often in a combat situation.

I think some guys are forgetting that although the knives are "combat knives", they are normally used to do practical things...

Open cans

Cut Rope

Prepare Hunted Food

General Outdoor survival

And some engineering purposes, like hacking out a very basic lock on a door.

Don't be so close-minded. Forget about all the "ultimate combat simulation" stuff and "real life" for a moment. It's very much a game, not a simulation of real life, especially if you look at any PvP mission played in the public.

It would happen all the time in a pistol/knife fighting DM mission for instance. Probably a handful of times in a single round of CTF (surprise a camper from behind, run out of ammo, stab in the face at a corner etc).

A knife or riffle-butt is infinitely better than not being able to do anything to defend yourself without ammo.

Not to mention all the modding possibilities once again...

Edited July 10, 2010 by Pulverizer

[SnR 1]

1. AI wont even let you near them to use it, ie they go prone when threatened and are always face on.

2. PvP maybe the best opportunity for its use, altough lame.;)

[Luomu 10]

Hey, even Swat 4 got a quick punch button in the end... although I think BIS might have to revamp their antiquated weapon system somewhat to properly make it instead of yet another item which we cycle through with the fire mode key :)

[FelixK44 10]

Uhm, Didn't read through all the posts but I find this pretty interesting but it might not work......

Wouldnt it be possible to add an action on the enemy side through a trigger that adds an action like "Slice throat", or "Break Neck", Then the player side could sneak up behind AI and all it would need is a script and lock the target character with player character and play some custom animations and a cool camera effect... :eek:

Maybe include random selection of kill animation multiple stabs,slicing throat,breaking their neck... etc :)

P.S.

The reason why I suggest adding it like an action w/script and animations is because one of the VBS2 feature videos shows a guy sneaking up behind an enemy soldier in a house and slicing their throat while rest of his team goes by the window :D

[DieAngel 0]

Rather than a knife i would want wire/bolt cutters to make holes in these DARNED CHAINLINK FENCES.

[Flash Thunder 10]

would be kool to see it in a cutscene or a quicktime but not for general use.

[froggyluv 2136]

Well if Mount&Blade, arguably the best melee game can incorporate guns, then Arma2 the best shoot em up....

...well in theory anyways :D

I think the Arma series first needs an enhanced (rebuilt) CQB system build in terms of close range pathfinding and maneuvering as well as primary threat response times before we can really talk about a rewarding knife fight experience.

[ben_s 11]

I think if you are close enough for a knife kill. Then KUDOS TO YOU!!!

But in realistic terms, If you do get close enough, i think an action should popup saying "silent kill", where an animation happens where you cover his mouth, drop his gun and silenetly kill him. Wouldn't just be the ultimate reward for gettign that close, it would be awsome for cutscenes too... :)

[froggyluv 2136]

No offense mate but I don't think a pre-rendered insta-death move has any place in arma.

[Jelliz 10]

"MY ROFLKNIFE GOES SLIECSLIECSLIECSLIECSLIECSLIEC!!!1!1!11":shine:

But seriously, in CQC it would be useful with a knife, or hitting someone with the rifle(which there is animations for ingame).

[dragon01 903]

I think a knife (and/or bayonet, they can be attached to modern rifles) could find a place in ArmA II, even if not for combat (though ability for silent kills without a silenced pistol might be usefull sometimes), it might be used for things like slashing tires on vechicles you have to leave, but not want taken (mostly in MP I guess, AI seems to be unable to comandeer vehicles left lying on the field) or for guerillas as an emergency weapon. It would also enhance feeling of realism, because soldiers are issued knifes in real life. And of course, introdicing system allowing it's usage could help WWII, WWI and other historical mods. US army recently announced discontinuation of bayonet training, but I read that before that, recruits were taught to use bayonets before being thaught to fire their rifles.

[Pundaria 10]

And for christ sake..... knife is still the most common killing weapon worldwide

[Alwarren 2767]

It would happen all the time in a pistol/knife fighting DM mission for instance.

ARGH.

Ever so often when playing Modern Warfare (the first one, not the overpriced piece of... but I digress) someone would come up with "let's play a knife only round". Which usually was the point where I logged out, stating that this is a first person shooter and not a first person stabber. I found the idea of twenty people, half of them walking underbrush, trying to stab each other painfully silly.

Probably a handful of times in a single round of CTF (surprise a camper from behind, run out of ammo, stab in the face at a corner etc).

None of these have anything to do with realism. Most games already allow you to carry too much stuff with you, I wonder how you stab with your hands full. But then, in MW you see people firing an M107 while in mid-air, or bunny hopping with two bazookas on their back.

*sighs*

~~ Alwarren