European Politics Thread.

[vilas 473]

c'mon, stop using words like socialists, communitsts

in communism:

- you get all from state, you not pay for anything , all founded by state, no private property !!! < this is communism, in communism money do not matter cause you get all and no need to pay

in socialism:

- state spends taxes to support weak, poor, state makes hospitals and full care, state provides many services etc. also state build you a flat in block to live,

so where do you see socialims ?

in Canada, Sweden, New Zealand, in 80s in Germany, France yes

but nowadays ?

anyone give you flat ? you go like that to dentist ? your taxes are spent on "good things" or on BMW 7 for politicians, on salaries of politicians and bilions for fat rich greed banksters to allow them change Ferrari every month ???

this is not socialism, this is not socialism , in socialism noone supports rich !

in our system tax money from poor people go to rich people, banks, this is quasi feudalism-wannabe, this is thief/thiev-ism

noone in socialism gives money to the rich like bank owners, noone in socialism evicts people from houses cause bank credit was not payed

if it was socialism, bank owners who made crisis would get bullet in the head and you would not have 2 saloons of Ferrari in my city

in socialism all people should be equal,

than why member of parliament ears 10 times more than me and gets bonus money 20 times more than me (premie , extra wage)

in socialism noone would allow that bank president earns in 1 month more than me in 10 years !!!

stop using word socialism and communism,

we had socialism before 1989 when we were getting flats from the state and i was going on state payed holidays in mountains (while now if i wanna visit dentist i must pay) , now we have homeless, mafia, and rich greed thieves in Ferrari, Lexus, Bentley, BMW7 etc.

really, this is not a socialism, compare it to pre 1989 state of economy, number of homeless, number of unemployed, stress in work, strokes due to stress , banks structure etc.

Edited May 10, 2013 by vilas

[mrcash2009 0]

I only see the EU as a very clever way to invade and take over countries and centralise in the model of the Nazis (as an example), the only difference its been packages under puppy dog and rainbow politics and trade to make it more 'palatable' for the masses. End result is the same but without brute force & in the political realm in suits with a smile.

[sudayev 27]

Speaking of euroscepticism. I really like what a devastating counter-speech Nigel Farage gave to Polish sworn-servant-to-the-EU prime minister Donald Tusk who said in his well honeyed words why the EU is the best thing that could happen to Europe and it's people.

[vilas 473]

again Sudayev (as addition to previous post) if you call it socialism , tell me one thing: why rich pay lowest taxes ? why all our top-rich businesmen pay in Cyprus ? why rich guys have "tax free" regulations that allow them to put all in "costs of company" and in result rich guy pays less taxes than poor worker, i know what i say cause friend of my is working in tax police, tax inspection and another friend of mine also works in tax office (majority of my friends work in public administration and gov.)

tell me, why guy who has 2 Mercedes (L, SLK) payes 1000 PLN tax for year "cause all is cost of company, it is minused from the tax sume, he get VAT money refunded" while woman who works in his office payed 9000 PLN in the same year ???

Sudayev, really, this is nor socialim, neither communism , this is try of rebuild feudalism, when poor masses work for rich minority

how do we call "odpis, ulga" from taxes in English ? does it socialistic, that rich owner of company do not pay taxes while his cleanining office personell do it ? does it socialistic if i pay for something 123 PLN and rich pays 100 cause VAT tax 23 is refunded to him "cause he is company" ??? i cannot refund VAT just like 95% of our countrymen,

rich guys have refunded VAT tax , they pay 23% less for things we buy, cause they set all into "company costs" in accountancy

or like Carrefour/Fiat whatever they get "5 years tax free" decision from gov.

Americans do not have VAT tax, they may not understand what i said, in EU we have tax called "vat" (value added tax) it is payed in price of products, but those who have company may get this tax refunded, in result usual men pays 123 PLN for something and businesmen pays 123 and 23 has refunded after accountant and tax office do its job

also in Poland we have many "tax free" decisions given by state to some companies who in result do not pay taxes having big profits

in socialism rich guy would pay the same taxes as me, not "vat refund, tax free zone" or tax in Cyprus

Edited May 10, 2013 by vilas

[NoRailgunner 0]

Socialism and Communism didn't work so well + nice for many - guess why all those people took the risk to demonstrate and demand a change in politics? Of course one can dream and romanticise about socialism.... and utopianism. A weak or failed EU is beneficial for US and China/Asia interests.

[vilas 473]

Socialism and Communism didn't work so well + nice for many - guess why all those people took the risk to demonstrate and demand a change in politics? Of course one can dream and romanticise about socialism.... and utopianism. A weak or failed EU is beneficial for US and China/Asia interests.

afair you live on west (i am telling such way, so you were not here before 89 and your informations might be biased cause from journalists, not from first hand), so please allow that i will introduce why my parents fought in Solidarity against "communism" (my mom, my uncle, my neigbors, my older friend were in Solidarity in 80s):

- they wanted more church and more bigotry, sounds politically incorrect ? look at islam revolution now in some countries, do you believe that many people here wanted "kingdom of Christ" and fought cause socialist country was atheist country, they fought for mandatory religion in schools for example, now people on other Lybia topic moan on islamists who take away countries, hey, wait a moment, they fought for it with "regimes", you may not like true words, but this is how it was, my gramma was in solidarity in church and she wanted to make girls to wear longer skirts, cause pre-1989 atheistic state was far away from catholic orders how to behave in bed,

- they wanted "21 demands" among them many were "work less" cause in 80s, 70s, 60s people worked here in saturdays too, my mom fought for work only 5 days instead of 6, my uncle was in Soldiarity in the same ship build plant as Lech Walesa in 1980, he also wanted to work 5 days instead of 6,

in 21 demands you had demand about salary increase,

- people were blinded and brainwashed by CIA propaganda telling Solidarity members "finish communism and you all will be rich, look on Dynasty movie, on the west people have Mercedes and palace, when you finish communism you will get Mercedes"

you think that anyone fought for capitalism ? hahahahaha no way my friend

they wanted more socialism but with national and church values and they wanted to be rich and have Mercedes

you know what was annoying people from my family than ? that "colonel of Militia get car and 60 meters flat, why we get only 40 meters flat, we want equality and we want also car and 60 metters flat"

noone , except small group, ever wanted any free market, any capitalism,

in 1980s we didnt fought socialism, we wanted national-christian-socialism instead of "praise USSR and Russians" version, they wanted replace Lenin with Christ, cause USSR replaced Christ with Lenin, reason was also hate to Russians for 17 09 1939 and Katyn , nationalism was reason that noone wanted "communism" which was "leadership of USSR and Kremlin" because USSR attacked us in 1939 together with Hitler (Stalin was Georgian not Russian by the way)

my family had some problems due to this fight in 80s, lost jobs, lost flat , beaten etc.

they fought for "less work, earn more, religion" not for free market, liberalism, gay ideology , EU symbols instead of White Eagle whatever EU brings,

so if you think people fought with socialism cause they wanted free market - you are wrong my friend, maybe western media told you so, but i know several Solidarity members from 1980 and i know what they fought for , it was pro-christian trade union, not pro-capitalistic party, it was trade union now all of them regret this fight and say that before 1989 it was way better,

i am surprised always, when people from the wast connect "revolt against commies" with "pro-capitalism" movement, western press made it so ? they wanted 21 demands :

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/21_demands_of_MKS < please look at this

1. Acceptance of free trade unions independent of the Communist Party and of enterprises, in accordance with convention No. 87 of the International Labor Organization concerning the right to form free trade unions.

2. A guarantee of the right to strike and of the security of strikers.

3. Compliance with the constitutional guarantee of freedom of speech, the press and publication, including freedom for independent publishers, and the availability of the mass media to representatives of all faiths.

4. A return of former rights to: 1) People dismissed from work after the 1970 and 1976 strikes. 2) Students expelled because of their views. The release of all political prisoners, among them Edward Zadrozynski, Jan Kozlowski, and Marek Kozlowski. A halt in repression of the individual because of personal conviction.

5. Availability to the mass media of information about the formation of the Inter-factory Strike Committee and publication of its demands.

6. Bringing the country out of its crisis situation by the following means: a) making public complete information about the social-economic situation. b) enabling all social classes to take part in discussion of the reform programme.

7. Compensation of all workers taking part in the strike for the period of the strike.

8. An increase in the pay of each worker by 2,000 złoty a month.

9. Guaranteed automatic increases in pay on the basis of increases in prices and the decline in real income.

10. A full supply of food products for the domestic market, with exports limited to surpluses.

11. The abolition of ‘commercial’ prices and of other sales for hard currency in special shops.

12. The selection of management personnel on the basis of qualifications, not party membership. Privileges of the secret police, regular police and party apparatus to be eliminated.

13. The introduction of food coupons for meat and meat products.

14. Reduction in the age for retirement for women to 50 and for men to 55. (it was 60 and 65)

15. Conformity of old-age pensions and annuities with what has actually been paid in.

16. Improvements in the working conditions of the health service.

17. Assurances of a reasonable number of places in day-care centers and kindergartens for the children of working mothers.

18. Paid maternity leave for three years.

19. A decrease in the waiting period for apartments. (in socialism given for free !!!)

20. An increase in the commuter’s allowance to 100 złoty.

21. A day of rest on Saturday. Workers in the brigade system or round-the-clock jobs are to be compensated for the loss of free Saturdays with increased leave or other paid time off.

this is pure socialism, only things missing there is mandatory religion in school, please read them

Reduction in the age for retirement for women to 50 and for men to 55. , now we work till 67

Privileges of the secret police, regular police and party apparatus to be eliminated. now army officer earns 3-4 times more than average worker and gets flat :/ etc. etc.

really rethink my friend what you think about "people fighting with communism", half of my family was in Solidarity, i know what i am saying about "fight with communism"

Edited May 10, 2013 by vilas

[Tonci87 163]

Croatia is, unfortunately, entering EU on 01.07.2013. I do not aprove, to put it mildly.

When there was a referendum on entering EU, the results were that every city or town in Croatia voted ~60:40% in favor of EU.

I think that's statistically impossible. It was a fucking scam.

In Croatian constitution it says that we will never again form a union of any sort with Balkan nations. But what do you know, our idiotic politicians are instead pushing us into a union which has 50 times more bureaucracy than Yugoslavia ever had, and where we will be just a colony.

In 1990. Croatia was economic giant compared to now. In 20 years we sold our banks (how stupid/greedy can you be to do that?), our best firms were being sold to "bussinesmen" of questionable morality for 1 (one) dollar, which they of course later sold for millions. It was called privatization. Privatization my ass, it was a daylight robbery.

I didn't fight in a war to be a slave, I did it for our freedom. Words can't describe how bitter I am.

I know what you say. I talked to many people in Croatia (I´m from Dalmatia, Split to be more precise) and almost noone said that Croatia should go into the EU. Almost everyone opposed the idea. They said that they didn´t fight to get out of one Union just to enter the next one.

People in croatia want a free and independent country and they are very passionate about it. I don´t know if people from other countrys are able to understand that.

Croatians call it the 1000 year long dream since Croatia hasn´t been a independant country for almost a century.

They were always under foreign rule, be it from Hungary, Austria, France, Italy, the Ottoman Empire, Germany or the Serbs.

And now that they finally had their own free state the politicians did their very best to sell out everything to fill their own and their friends pockets.

For a while I had Croatian TV here in Germany (of course it is state owned) and I was furious to see all kinds of PRO EU advertisement. They promised the people everything if Croatia enters the EU. And since I live in the EU since it was founded and also always keep a look on politics I can safely say that most of this advertisement was simply made up. They told the people lies.

@NoRailgunner

There is a big difference between socialism and communism.

Most people in the Ex soviet block, or former Yoguslawia embrace the Idea of socialism because it is generally a good thing if executed properly (that means without politicians filling their pockets with tax money). Communism on the other hand is bad, really bad and most people detest it.

The Ex Soviet block countrys didn´t have socialism but communism. That is why people protested.

[vilas 473]

That is why people protested.

read post above and 21 demands of Solidarity ;)

we wanted more equality and work less

dear people from west - maybe your press and history books told you that people fought in eastern block against communism to have free market and capitalism, but please read 21 demands, main Solidarity movement act which began fight in 1980, 30% of society (mostly aged) regret and wants PRL back , young people know rats race, young men know bank credits, they do not know what is "imieniny" in job when all people sit together , eat cakes for half of day

Edited May 10, 2013 by vilas

[sudayev 27]

we wanted national-christian-socialism

I couldn't resist to comment this... You mean that our countrymen wanted Christ centric-nazism? Good God... I think we wanted a democratic country with all degrees of freedom that come within. People simply lacked of freedom and they wanted to change it just like our neighbours from Czech and Hungary.

Religion wasn't prohibited in Poland, people could go to church even party leaders (which is a paradox) attended to church as well. Pope John Paul II was a frequest guest to his country and people lacked of his wise words about freedom and faith. None could prohibit you to go to church.

People were pro-church because, the church gave harbor to free word and those hunted by the regime, and that is I why the commies where giving the church a hard time in some cases. Nevertheless our church wasn't clear at all, many of regular priests and even higher ranking clergy were collaborators. They were close to pope and in Holy See as well, spying on John Paul II.

in socialism all people should be equal + you entire post

Only on paper my friend, only on paper. You speak the language of an idealist, get a reality check.

Back there there were mobsters, untouchables, crooks, above the laws and all sort of privileged party collaborators. Yeah my family had a flat too but 10 kilometers away rich-commie crooks were building fucking and walled dachas with security gorillas and mercedes benz. Why they could smash bottles on peoples heads and wipe their asses with national flags and not to attend to 1st of May parades and get away with anything? Was this your lovely socialism, hell yes it was with equal and more equal. When a normal person that criticized the party could only became a free boxing bag for the gorillas from the secret police. Even today those rich crooks still exist and made even more money by using connections dating back to the commie years. That's a fact.

Let's stop this pointless discussion about giving away flats, food stamps and how lovely and ideal the communism was.

I'll stop using socialism, instead I'll be using word - pink's. For your comfort, hope it's ok with you.

Fair enough, because everytime we walk whether it was ACta, Sopa, Us politics a thread derails to subjects like polish affairs, free flats, communism, gangster youth :D Let's discuss about the EU only.

[vilas 473]

Sudayev my friend, read 21 demands, how many of your family members were in solidarity ? how many had problems ? do not be angry, but there is afair 15 years difference betwen us ? was your uncle in ship building plant along with Lech Walesa ? was your mum member of Solidarity beaten in 1982 ? my were, have you got Solidarity-member card/book in your house ? i have several from family

noone forbid going to church ? have you ever heard about army officers or militia officers loosing job after baptizing kid ? read 21 demands before believing in things from Fronda

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/21_demands_of_MKS

do you see them pro-capitalistic ?

Edited May 10, 2013 by vilas

[sudayev 27]

My family had problems too and maybe my uncle wasn't with Walesa but he was in doing risky job in conspiracy and had troubles too. Some members of my family had problems with getting a job (after the fall of communism) because the director was in the commie party and heard our family name. After starting own businesses one post-commie (former big commie) from the city hall was harassing the family business constantly, only because of the name and the past. Commies won by crippling the family business in late 90s but later on police went on their asses and locked them for money fraud and corruption.

Wow didn't know you're forty something. I don't read Fronda. Sure I read the postulate and discussed them.

Compliance with the constitutional guarantee of freedom of speech, the press and publication, including freedom for independent publishers, and the availability of the mass media to representatives of all faiths.

Workers wanted freedom and humane treatment. Just like people in any democratic country have.

Solidarity is everywhere where freedoms are limited or in danger. Nowadays Solidarity starts to oppose some views on labor and trade that come from Brussels.

[NoRailgunner 0]

People did see and feel that those in power failed to run their country any longer just by pure propaganda and poor socialist economy + their system of "apparatschiks". Isn't it simply some sort of nostalgia for life under socialist system by a few people who have missed the caravan or are just stuck in time?

[vilas 473]

please, please do not say "socialism" about such people,

better call them pimps ;) cause they use hard work of others and beat when your money are not given on their luxury limousine

socialism in in Canada, New Zealand, Germany (still?), France (still?), Sweden - everywhere where you get free medical care, flat or flat support money, benefits, cheap drugs/medicaments, state very care about safety, labor rights etc. , even in UK you have 5 times more socialism than in post-East block countries with child-benefits for example and medical prices for retired and flat-benefit for least earning,

rest is not socialism, rest is thievism, lie-ism, lawyer-ism, bankster-ism and feudalism-wannabe

@Sudayev - i was wrong thinking you are 20 from previous discussion i misunderstood something

Isn't it simply some sort of nostalgia for life under socialist system by a few people who have missed the caravan or are just stuck in time?

nope, it is other feel, we fought for one thing, we received other thing, opposite thing

[GRS 10]

Annnnnd off we go again.

Edited May 11, 2013 by GRS

[jptiger 1]

don't be too afraid of Slovenia, the government is already putting plans into action that will help to get the budget safe, besides the problem is different then in Cyprus, Greece Spain etc.

and Slovenia has a small economy (60billion), and the banks are much smaller than in Cyprus (in comparison to the state itself).

western stock exchanges have not suffered a lot from Cyprus because of the budget the EU has put aside, so i don't expect Cyprus be be a big problem to the (western) European economies

[kernriver 4]

I know what you say. I talked to many people in Croatia (I´m from Dalmatia, Split to be more precise) and almost noone said that Croatia should go into the EU. Almost everyone opposed the idea. They said that they didn´t fight to get out of one Union just to enter the next one.

That's why I'm even more bitter about it. 99,9% of the people I know voted against EU.

People in croatia want a free and independent country and they are very passionate about it. I don´t know if people from other countrys are able to understand that.

It's good old nationalism.

Real nationalism (love for your country) is being branded as something bad. Why would it be bad? I love my country to death, but I respect others. Nationalism is love for your country, people, culture, traditions. I don't want to give that up just because of some deluded notion of artificial european superstate. We earned our country in blood, one doesn't forget that.

We had a Flag Day on 2nd may in Poland, a day when the national flag is observed, I saw next to our flag there were many these blue pseudo-country flags of the EU. Such a shame, to see this.

If you think that's bad, listen to this: ever since international recognition of Croatia in 1992., EU flag was beside croatian flag on every major state building. And we're not even in EU yet. If that were any other flag (excluding embassys etc.), police would tear it down.

OFFTOPIC:

Vilas & Sudajev: since you've mentioned our beloved Karol Wojtyla, Pope John Paul II. I've read some time ago (croatian source) that he (supposedly) said that his mother was Bielo Chorvat (White Croat). I'm aware that could be a myth, but what od you know about that, if anything at all?

Myth or not, ask any Croat who is their favourite Pope. Without exeption, it's Pope John Paul II.

Edited May 10, 2013 by Kernriver

[Tonci87 163]

To bring some context to that "White croat" thing. During the Migration Period Croats moved to the Balkan coming from Galicia (South Poland and West Ukraine). However not all Croatians left Galicia and so for a short time there were two croatian kingdoms. White Croatia in Galicia and Red Croatia, the Croatia we know today (but then it was much bigger). The Croatian and Polish languages are very similiar to each other. I generally have little problems to understand someone from Poland while it can get very difficult if he is from some other slavic country.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/White_Croats

http://hr.wikipedia.org/wiki/Datoteka:Velika_Bijela_Hrvatska_9_st.jpg

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Red_Croats

Edited May 10, 2013 by Tonci87

[sudayev 27]

If you think that's bad, listen to this: ever since international recognition of Croatia in 1992., EU flag was beside croatian flag on every major state building. And we're not even in EU yet. If that were any other flag (excluding embassys etc.), police would tear it down.

OFFTOPIC:

Vilas & Sudajev: since you've mentioned our beloved Karol Wojtyla, Pope John Paul II. I've read some time ago (croatian source) that he (supposedly) said that his mother was Bielo Chorvat (White Croat). I'm aware that could be a myth, but what od you know about that, if anything at all?

Myth or not, ask any Croat who is their favourite Pope. Without exeption, it's Pope John Paul II.

Got any ideas what sort of law regulated the presence of EU flag in front of official buildings in Croatia before joining the EU? Really strange and sounds almost like Brussels put their hands on you already ;)

Next time I see the EU flag in my vicinity I have a plan to 'confiscate' it. I checked with the law and currently there is no law prohibiting the destruction of EU flag, which means EU flag is simply non protected flag in Poland.

Regarding Pope John Paul II. Interesting theory, I never heard of White Croats before until now. I checked local internet sources in Polish but I didn't find any information regarding Croat descent, while on the other hand I've read that White Croats were Polish too just like a tribe inside of another tribe thus it will require more digging & historian consultation to confirm. Pope's mother Emilia Wojtyla (Kaczorowska - maiden name) was born in 1884 in Bielsko-Biala click (Southern Poland), nevertheless there are people living in this country with mixed Slavic heritage, for example my second name has an obvious meaning in Czech language, but as far as our memory reaches we can't track the family name beyond XVIII century to spot any Czechs, so I think it probably goes deeper.

It is interesting to add that according to some American documents from the beginning of 20th century there were about 100,000 immigrants to the US born around Krakow who declared themselves to be Bielo-Chorvats, i.e. White Croats by nationality (wiki)

It's good old nationalism.

Real nationalism (love for your country) is being branded as something bad. Why would it be bad? I love my country to death, but I respect others. Nationalism is love for your country, people, culture, traditions. I don't want to give that up just because of some deluded notion of artificial european superstate. We earned our country in blood, one doesn't forget that.

+1, but remember that the EU will push you to abandon such thinking telling you - you're European first. It starts from educating kids, increased appearance of so called- LGBT movements (funded by Brussels), leftist propaganda generally bashing the traditional beliefs and way of life... Just like under the Soviet days - we're all comrades, then we're Russians, Germans, Poles, etc...

---------- Post added at 22:05 ---------- Previous post was at 21:53 ----------

To bring some context to that "White croat" thing. During the Migration Period Croats moved to the Balkan coming from Galicia (South Poland and West Ukraine). However not all Croatians left Galicia and so for a short time there were two croatian kingdoms. White Croatia in Galicia and Red Croatia, the Croatia we know today (but then it was much bigger). The Croatian and Polish languages are very similiar to each other. I generally have little problems to understand someone from Poland while it can get very difficult if he is from some other slavic country.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/White_Croats

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Red_Croats

Thanks for the links' I'll study some. Regarding the language, yes I experienced that both languages sound very similar and during my vacation in your nice country, normal non complicated communication was possible without escaping to German or English. A few glasses of Rakija brought down any remaining language barriers :D

[kernriver 4]

Got any ideas what sort of law regulated the presence of EU flag in front of official buildings in Croatia before joining the EU? Really strange and sounds almost like Brussels put their hands on you already ;)

I really don't know of any law or regulation which allows putting EU flag on official buildings in Croatia, and yes it seems Brussels put their hands on us already. That pisses me off. Who are they to tell us how to live? :mad:

Regarding White Croats, it's no biggie, I was just curious. In addition to Tonci's links, here is another one, pretty informative:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/White_Croatia

+1, but remember that the EU will push you to abandon such thinking telling you - you're European first.

Well, I'm proud to be European, especially Slav, but I'm a Croat first.

A few glasses of Rakija brought down any remaining language barriers :D

Haha, rakija has been known to do that, I remember when my father spoke to some Czech tourists that stayed in my relative's house near Split (Duce Luka, Tonci you surely know where that is), they were on summer holidays. Few shots of rakija and the language barrier vanished. ;)

[Tonci87 163]

I had the very same experience with a few Czech tourists last summer. A little bit of rakija and the language barrier was gone. True European spirit. Maybe someone should get all the EU Politicians drunk :p

[mrcash2009 0]

I had the very same experience with a few Czech tourists last summer. A little bit of rakija and the language barrier was gone. True European spirit. Maybe someone should get all the EU Politicians drunk :p

Thats a good point actually, if you get on the ground to the people you will definitely see a difference then what impression you may get through 3rd party sources when people get together. The whole EU thing isn't really about or for the masses much at all, who benefits is the main thing at the dealings side. Everyone is in for the ride and a passenger in many ways.

[vilas 473]

i have read in today's press in my country, that in Greece those teachers who wanna strike will be imprisoned, i do not know if it is true so i would like to verify it (i cannot imagine that slavery is entering Europe again , but now instead nobles we have bank-nobles)

but all press writes the same "order of Greek prime ministers threatens highshool teachers by prison if they go strike" < this is pure slavery

Edited May 14, 2013 by vilas

[nettrucker 142]

i have read in today's press in my country, that in Greece those teachers who wanna strike will be imprisoned, i do not know if it is true so i would like to verify it (i cannot imagine that slavery is entering Europe again , but now instead nobles we have bank-nobles)

but all press writes the same "order of Greek prime ministers threatens highshool teachers by prison if they go strike" < this is pure slavery

It's not only here in Europe. In the US a lot of whistleblowers are being imprisoned nowadays because of telling the truth. You'll see that the situation is going to get worse all over the world and not only in Europe. You remember the greek journalist who published the list with all major suspects of corruption of the greeks elite. The journalist has been immediately arrested meanwhile the people who engaged in colossal frauds are still free. So it doesn't surprise me at all if it would be true. As long as this world continues to be run by psychopaths we are doomed.

[Tonci87 163]

Seriously? Imprisoned for strike? Well, seems as if we are heading for the 19th century again.

[nettrucker 142]

Seriously? Imprisoned for strike? Well, seems as if we are heading for the 19th century again.

Maybe fascism would be the right expression to use.