ai command dlc C2 -Command And Control

[bad benson 1733]

1 hour ago, alezil said:

I used "this disableAI" MOVE ";" In enemies or  "this disableAI" PATH”, and to make things more difficult, I placed the enemies guarding the doors and Bottleneck areas.

 

The enemy with "this disableAI" MOVE "; It's extremely deadly.  Still, my soldiers were able to be successful a very few times, which is a lot.

 

The enemy with "this disableAI" PATH ";" Is a little bit easier, but still lethal enough to decimate my soldiers most of the time.

 

The enemy with nothing of his capabilities turned off, is the easiest, with a high degree of success for my soldiers.  Looks like when the enemy AI is free, it tends to make more mistakes.

 

that's some great info for mission makers too. thanks for that!

[mad_cheese 593]

That's some great intel indeed!

 

The stationary units have a big advantage, especially if looking at any door or window. I'm very curious now what disabling "PATH" does exactly when the unit is in a building. I'm still undecided what to do to "tamper" with units in buildings. At the moment, I lean towards disabling their "TARGET" and "AUTOTARGET" (unless AI is controlled by a player), then when the unit has a line of sight, toggle it on with a delay of say 1 sec or slightly less. This gives the clearing AI a slight advantage and tackles the issue with them not reacting fast enough. Let's see where it goes! Clearing is still a bit iffy :)

 

[alezil 12]

I don’t know much about the Ai, only thing I can do is look they behavior when I disable or change something.

In Disable “MOVE”, the AI is fixed and forced to stare at the chosen door or bottleneck. Then it is 100% guaranteed that he will have the firing line on the BLUEFOR as they walks through the door, and that’s is why they are sol lethal. Then, it only depends of their reaction time (subskill spotTime I think).

 

The Disable "MOVE" have a narrow fire angle: 30º or something like that, creating a blind spot. Because of that, Ai sometimes fails to hit a enemy. 

In the Disable “PATH” option, the AI does not move either, but the enemy can still move 360º in his axis to cover other points of interest. What happens is that on Disable“PATH”, the enemy gets confused with the footsteps of my soldiers and starts to watch another door and loses the advantage when my team enters the room, sometimes they even react turning the back on my team.
 

And that's why they are less effective, they make more mistakes.
 

Mad Cheese, I was watching again your video tutorial in the YouTube and realized that I forgot to turn off the Autodanger to my team at the time of doing these simulations.
 

Another thing, if you increase the subskill “spotTime”, they improve performance and react fast in CQB. My soldiers with this maxed values seens to performer much better.

Is this skill is boosted by the C2? Or only the global Skill value?
 

In Ace3 it apparently theres a AI change regarding "No dead zones in CQB". The reason behind this is that apparently some weapons have a minimum distance to be used and AI stops firing or stutters for a short period at smaller distances.
I do not know if this problem persists in the Vannila AI or even in the Vcomai. But it may be that if it still exists, if so, it may cause a delay in AI reaction time as well.
 

The only problem I saw with the "clear building" function is that sometimes they fail to enter the last room in the building. I think that happens when some of the soldiers die in the raid.
 

Do you think it's possible to include a more complex "storm that room" option in the future? making then peek against the door as they do when they storm the building.
 

 

 

[mad_cheese 593]

Hey thank you for sharing your experiments! That's a very smart insight - I never looked at it that way, leaving certain abilities in order to create calculations :) The idea that disabling path creates confusion with footsteps is interesting, I will investigate!

 

Right now I'm not disabling the occopying enemy AI, I'm just trying to get the clearing units to act correctly. I do at this point think that disabling enemy AI's targeting ability (for 1 sec) is tolerable even in multiplayer, if the enemy AI is not commanded by a player. This will give you an edge, but will not be unfair towards other players in CTI etc.

 

I hope I can get to that stuff soon, there's still so many things on the to do list.

[sammael 366]

mad_cheese, I have a question-idea.

Is it possible to make script comand to eject all paratroopers at same moment?.

 AI can`t use guided parachutes.

Even with RHS 0 4 2 statuc d6 parachute all unit have big landing dispersion.

I think paradrop all unit at same moment will dercrease landing despersion.

 

[teddymosart1 40]

+1 for the idea of the parachutes...If we could get 2 buttons for this,one ;Contrl+Alt+Altgr =placing men in´parachutes,hanging there for Zeus to use as reinforcements ,ready hanging in the air as shock-troops.Just pre-place them in the air first.

Just let them fall on command when needed.

2 .Maybe a button that place a set number of reinforcements troops in the vicinity of the player,number set by player.

 

Buttons to disable the highlighted enemy troops "Ai-Move","Ai-Path",for simplicity.  Would be very neat to have .

 

Some way to evacuate hurt troops,by making a helo fly zig-zag-pattern ,with spot-light on,searching for these troops,left behind.Auto-load them inside.

A button to make the whole unit RTB,with helo-lift would be useful sometime .

A Stop-watch and a Count-down timer to be able to sync when to start in MP,will come in handy.

A button to add a bunch of IR-lights for placing a LZ would be useful.

Some way to decide what road the Ai will drive on/prefer to take ,when they use those in the map. 

A Retreat button too.

 

Some way to make vehicles scatter,if they get shot at.And a command button for that.

Some way to add a flight for CAS,if needed,that is left out by mission maker,not to get stuck with no At agains a tank.

Some way to order helo to provide air-cover,if needed.

Just my 2 cent for now.  Thanks for a great mod.

 

[mad_cheese 593]

Hey sorry for the late reply. Parachute Waypoint is on the to do list!

 

As far as the other suggestions go, I may actually tweak my Simple_Heli_Request addon to do stuff like that in the future :)

[CortrexComp 0]

Sorry to bother. I can't find any help so I think I have completely missed something. I subscribed to C2 and the CBA thing through Steam. I put in the "custom control" keys, I loaded my campaign (Scouting mission vanilla) but I don't see any HUD mode. When I press any of the "custom control" keys nothing happens. I Assigned the keys you talked about in the 1st tut video (L-shift to 13 etc.) but I don't see where I can apply an action to those keys. So it just has Custom 13 L Shift but no action. When I go to the addon drop box from the configure addon there is nothing listed there. It is just an empty box. When I click the down arrow the box turns grey and that is it. What am I missing?

Edited February 4, 2017 by CortrexComp
Disregard, found answer

[kremator 1065]

Hey MC.  Still having problems with AI in my team suddenly changing their minds about WP I give them and going into WAIT state.  Happens at random intervals, but mostly when I give >3 WPs to a subteam (coloured or uncoloured makes no difference).

[xon2 102]

Hey mad_cheese,

 

been playing with C2 for a bit now and in combination with VA its really a blast. That you finally can let your ai ambush and nade a position via the waypoint menu, just great. And the vehicle transport functionality you implemented with duda's help really brings something to ai gameplay that was painfully missing from the game. So thx for all that. 

 

Do you plan on bringing in the convoy function for multiple vehicles?

 

I think its a really good decision to drop the tablet approach and go with the full map. If you and duda123 can bring that enhanced grouping functionality and vehilce transport system into one cohesive framework....that'll be incredibly useful. Its immensly useful to get total control over any ai of whatever faction and be able to order them around, board vehicles and let them be transported (in convoy ) to whatever location.

 

Yes, you can achieve a lot of that by simply going into zeus mode and adding all mission assets to zeus control. But, its still a workaround and a mod that does all that by design is just the real deal.

[kremator 1065]

One thing I have noticed (which is probably a bug) is that the map picks up civilians (and displays a pink box with a cross in it).  Or am I doing something wrong?  I wonder if it is the HC from duda picking them up?

[mad_cheese 593]

 

 

On 6.2.2017 at 0:27 AM, kremator said:

Hey MC.  Still having problems with AI in my team suddenly changing their minds about WP I give them and going into WAIT state.  Happens at random intervals, but mostly when I give >3 WPs to a subteam (coloured or uncoloured makes no difference).

Is that with the release or BETA version? This issue is new to me, I need to sort you out with a new version as soon as I'm back home.

 

On 10.2.2017 at 2:05 PM, kremator said:

One thing I have noticed (which is probably a bug) is that the map picks up civilians (and displays a pink box with a cross in it).  Or am I doing something wrong?  I wonder if it is the HC from duda picking them up?

That's just my personal taste - KNOWN civilians should be marked on the map but it's possible that I messed up the checks and they just have to be friendly.

 

 

On 4.2.2017 at 8:55 PM, CortrexComp said:

Sorry to bother. I can't find any help so I think I have completely missed something. I subscribed to C2 and the CBA thing through Steam. I put in the "custom control" keys, I loaded my campaign (Scouting mission vanilla) but I don't see any HUD mode. When I press any of the "custom control" keys nothing happens. I Assigned the keys you talked about in the 1st tut video (L-shift to 13 etc.) but I don't see where I can apply an action to those keys. So it just has Custom 13 L Shift but no action. When I go to the addon drop box from the configure addon there is nothing listed there. It is just an empty box. When I click the down arrow the box turns grey and that is it. What am I missing?

No problem. You have been watching an old video, I tried to point out the outdatedness in many ways. Best way to be sure is to check your addon control configurations (Controls >> Customize addons >> C2), those keybinds are gonna be correct for sure.

 

On 10.2.2017 at 1:37 PM, xon2 said:

Hey mad_cheese,

 

been playing with C2 for a bit now and in combination with VA its really a blast. That you finally can let your ai ambush and nade a position via the waypoint menu, just great. And the vehicle transport functionality you implemented with duda's help really brings something to ai gameplay that was painfully missing from the game. So thx for all that. 

 

Do you plan on bringing in the convoy function for multiple vehicles?

 

I think its a really good decision to drop the tablet approach and go with the full map. If you and duda123 can bring that enhanced grouping functionality and vehilce transport system into one cohesive framework....that'll be incredibly useful. Its immensly useful to get total control over any ai of whatever faction and be able to order them around, board vehicles and let them be transported (in convoy ) to whatever location.

 

Yes, you can achieve a lot of that by simply going into zeus mode and adding all mission assets to zeus control. But, its still a workaround and a mod that does all that by design is just the real deal.

 

Thank you! It's not really a collab, since we both had our addons pretty far developed merging would be very difficult.  But we do have an eye on compatibility! There's a lot more things to come in the next version especially for ambushes etc.

 

I did try to map out things for convoys but weirdly enough I have not been able to confirm any of the DEV threads stuff to be in the game. I may have overlooked but there was word of many setConvoyX commands that I never found in any commandRef. I will try to find out a bit more but I fear that this is all just groupLevel stuff. I do have some sneaky ideas tho.

 

I'm hoping that the combination of C2 and AIC will give you the framework you need!

 

Regarding the update: I wanted to give the new version a proper sendoff but I think I'll just drop it next week and be over with it.

 

[kremator 1065]

Would it be possible to code that C2 ONLY shows your team and nothing else ?  It picking up civs can be mission breaking (if you are hunting them/ using them)

 

Looking forward to new version !

[john111 76]

Great news!  Sorry to bother you ,could we get a way to make air supplies be dropped exactly where we point?  I don`t really want to walk all over the place..thnx.

 

Some way to make the cars cross any bridges they come across,as of now ,they flat out refuse to drive there.

To make all cars go lights out , is another little request I`ve got.

I really love this mod,anything put in this is useful,if you decide to do it ,thank you.

 

Some way to just place down a patrol marker would be nifty,tho.  Be able to turn on lightbar of patrol cars and make them do patrols ,will add to emersion.

To be able to randomize stuff,like time or weather,or make enemies move when we get within sight of them,would force a change of plan (and the the use of C2) to make fast change about how to play it.

 

  

[kremator 1065]

We have to be careful with requests guys as there are a lot of things that are hard coded into the engine, that MC can't easily change (if AI cannot cross a bridge then C2 won't be able to influence it).  C2 is a way to give you MORE control over AI (primarily for positioning in combat).  If you want them to patrol, then give them multiple waypoints .. you can already do that!

 

C2 is not for changing weather.  I think you have the wrong addon!

 

[reggaeman007jah 31]

2 hours ago, john1 said:

... could we get a way to make air supplies be dropped exactly where we point?

 

Some way to just place down a patrol marker would be nifty,tho.  Be able to turn on lightbar of patrol cars and make them do patrols ,will add to emersion.

To be able to randomize stuff,like time or weather,or make enemies move when we get within sight of them,would force a change of plan (and the the use of C2) to make fast change about how to play it.

 

  

 

Have you considered using MCC alongside C2? It is a very cool and powerful combo!!

[kremator 1065]

^^ this.  There are a lot of mission tools out there.  C2 is much more niche in what it does (thankfully!)

[john111 76]

I do use it.But I need some way to make helos sling load by command and a small bug report,the choose whole team,and make them board a car seems to bee busted up pretty good.

I have a lot of mods enabled,so no wonder .

[xon2 102]

On 6.2.2017 at 0:27 AM, kremator said:

Hey MC.  Still having problems with AI in my team suddenly changing their minds about WP I give them and going into WAIT state.  Happens at random intervals, but mostly when I give >3 WPs to a subteam (coloured or uncoloured makes no difference).

Is that with the release or BETA version? This issue is new to me, I need to sort you out with a new version as soon as I'm back home.

 

I hav this problem in the last three missions aswell. Kinda had to swap roles from gunner in the Kayman to pilot after that basterd of an ai would not go to the next waypoint no matter how often i deleted the route and replanned it. Might be another mod that inteferes, although i've a very limited set running atm.  Maybe the mission is a bit off. I gonna retest this sometime this week with cba and c2 only. Better forget about this until its confirmed i guess. Good luck with your next build, no need to rush anything.

[mad_cheese 593]

On 12.2.2017 at 6:29 PM, kremator said:

Would it be possible to code that C2 ONLY shows your team and nothing else ?  It picking up civs can be mission breaking (if you are hunting them/ using them)

 

Looking forward to new version !

 

Oh that makes a lot of sense. I thought they would only pick up 'known' civs but I looked at the code again and I think I did not consider civs in particular the last time I made adjustments. As a temp fix, my best solution woiuld be to turn off the tracker but I'll fix this for sure. 

 

22 hours ago, xon2 said:

Still having problems with AI in my team suddenly changing their minds about WP I give them and going into WAIT state. 

 

I hav this problem in the last three missions aswell. Kinda had to swap roles from gunner in the Kayman to pilot after that basterd of an ai would not go to the next waypoint no matter how often i deleted the route and replanned it. Might be another mod that inteferes, although i've a very limited set running atm.  Maybe the mission is a bit off. I gonna retest this sometime this week with cba and c2 only. Better forget about this until its confirmed i guess. Good luck with your next build, no need to rush anything.

 

Very strange indeed... @xon2  @kremator this happens with AI drivers/pilots and footsoldiers yes? I'm on the road right now but will look into it. When it happens, does the route get cancelled or do they just hover in limbo between two wp's? 

 

@john1 I'll have to concur with the guys, those are cool ideas but out of my scope unfortunately. Sling Loading would be awesome but a little to big of a task for me at the moment. But there's gonna be a lot of other new stuff that u may enjoy!

[xon2 102]

'' Very strange indeed... @xon2  @kremator this happens with AI drivers/pilots and footsoldiers yes? I'm on the road right now but will look into it. When it happens, does the route get cancelled or do they just hover in limbo between two wp's?  ''

 

So i guess when i had these problems it must have been something with these missions (nice but old ones from a 5 mission mini campaign from the steam workshop). I did a bit of ordering a Kajman around in the editor today, and for the most part it worked alright. The pilot ai did not get stuck in this unresponsive state like i reported last time. 

 

I might be doing it wrong, but how does the pick-up feature is supposed to work? When i place the pick-up waypoint on the map close to some units, the helo lands there for a very short time but gets off the ground within 3 seconds or so, unless i tell the waiting infantry units to board said helo shortly before it touches down. Hows the right way to do it? Additionally, the helo forgets all planned waypoints after a successful pickup, but thats probably because i am too supid to give only those units the get in command that are actually outside the helo. I need to retest that.

 

The fly at very low altitude setting looks cool as hell, but it almost always crashes (might work over water though), but i think u mentioned at some point that it is pretty much useless and should not be used for that very reason.

 

One more thing: i guess this has little to do with C2 but is more of a general A3 ai/pathfinging issue. When you place a final landpoint or drop off point, the helo sometimes does it a good deal off, even when the waypoint is placed on open, clear ground like an airfield.

 

Overall the transport feature is in a usable state. I hope we didn't cause you any sleepless nights because of our limited observations. Looking forward to what awesome features the next C2 version brings. Thx a lot mad_cheese.

 

Oh, one last thing: this entire Vehicle 'transport' framework, is that pretty much all duda's work and you made it accessible via the C2 tablet? If so, then all the little issues i had would be more about Advanced AI command and less with C2 itself right?

 

 

[mad_cheese 593]

On 17/02/2017 at 4:01 PM, xon2 said:

So i guess when i had these problems it must have been something with these missions (nice but old ones from a 5 mission mini campaign from the steam workshop). I did a bit of ordering a Kajman around in the editor today, and for the most part it worked alright. The pilot ai did not get stuck in this unresponsive state like i reported last time.

That's good to hear :)

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I might be doing it wrong, but how does the pick-up feature is supposed to work? When i place the pick-up waypoint on the map close to some units, the helo lands there for a very short time but gets off the ground within 3 seconds or so, unless i tell the waiting infantry units to board said helo shortly before it touches down.

The pickup requires you to assign units as cargo. That's what the landing radio-message is really for - it tells you the moment when your pilot is going into the actual landing. This is your cue to assign units as cargo (just have them board the chopper). If you wanna add yourself to the cargo: once the landing has begun, the landing chopper will have an action-menu for you to assign or unassign yourself to/from the vehicle.

 

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The fly at very low altitude setting looks cool as hell, but it almost always crashes (might work over water though), but i think u mentioned at some point that it is pretty much useless and should not be used for that very reason.

 

This feature is kinda for me only. I don't wanna take it out but I know most people will have choppers flying into obstacles. I only do it with littlebirds in wildly open areas.

 

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One more thing: i guess this has little to do with C2 but is more of a general A3 ai/pathfinging issue. When you place a final landpoint or drop off point, the helo sometimes does it a good deal off, even when the waypoint is placed on open, clear ground like an airfield.

I don't think the landing type makes a difference here - each time the chopper gets the order to land, a complex script looks for a safe landing position. If you know how to read the map well, you may not notice this script but C2 checks for empty and suitable positions within a growing radius. The more those checks fail, the more radius grows, so the heli may land very far off. The gradient is important for this as well.

 

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Overall the transport feature is in a usable state. I hope we didn't cause you any sleepless nights because of our limited observations. Looking forward to what awesome features the next C2 version brings. Thx a lot mad_cheese.

I have a feeling the new functions may be useful for you!

 

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Oh, one last thing: this entire Vehicle 'transport' framework, is that pretty much all duda's work and you made it accessible via the C2 tablet? If so, then all the little issues i had would be more about Advanced AI command and less with C2 itself right?

No one else is involved in scripting for C2 (unfortunately). So I guess I'll have to take the blame here lol :)

[kremator 1065]

Still getting some errors when opening, then closing the map.  I get the dialog remaining PLUS another dialog in the top right (something about formation).  This happens when I'm stationary.  I can clear it using escape, but it is annoying.  Any ideas ?

 

PS looking forward to the new release!

 

PPS Regarding the landing of helos, could we FORCE them to land exactly where we call (and take the explosive consequences if we screw up!)

[Incontinentia 339]

Mad cheese, just thought I'd drop a comment to say how awesome the latest version is. Had a bit of a lull from actually playing Arma for a while and came back to a whole host of really cool stuff. It's an essential mod. Thanks buddy! 

[kremator 1065]

Hey MC.  The latest 64bit RC (1.68) breaks the map-based C2.  Not the tablet luckily, but you may need to look at the map.