New Weaponsway is way to much. And holding breath bug?

[VoRtReX-uk 10]

Wait what? Haha I'm confused.

That video is a great demonstration of how weapons can still be used effectively right now. vegeta and others have said it already before so there isn't much use in me trying to explain it to people like Rath or j4you again. In real life you actively have to control your weapon - So it only makes sense that in game you have to actively control your weapon. Pointing and clicking isn't up to par. The amount of concentration required to shoot in real life is far more than that in game. Thus the need for more sway. If you accept it and actually try to get used to it, you will find you will be able to perform any shot you can perform in reality, and even some that you can't make in reality.

I wish Dsylecxi would do a similar video that informs people of the weapon sway, why its there and how to handle it. (A polite way of saying suck it up and learn to play the fucken game)

The changes to the sway today basically make it the same as it was before the update (aside from fatigue effect on sway). Too my mind it is a step backward. Prone shooting allows me to easily plink away at far away units without much need to get close and I can engage people 500 metres away from a crouch. Not realistic or very engaging.

In the end I am sure a balance will come, but it makes me cringe to think of BI changing things:

a) for people who refuse to even

try

to adapt or consider the possibilities

and

b) before the community has even really gotten enough time to try it out.

I mean com'n the patch has been out a couple days and they have already pretty much reverted the weapon sway. Majority of players have yet to fully try it out, let alone get used to it. If it is BI intention to dial back the sway until bipods/resting is available, and then dial it back up that is fine, but I hate to see them change it just because "little jimmy can't handle it".

Anyhow sorry for ranting.

Your so stuck in your own ways you don't even listen to the other side.

Every post I have said make it an option, but you just want EVERYONE to have it the way you like.

I played all last night and the ammount of firefights over 10-20 meters that ended up with VERY VERY good PVP players facing each other changing mags was absurd.

"Suck it up" just doesn't cut it. I bet you play against AI, and not against real players.

The clan I am part of played a match against a coop only clan the other week and we totally DESTROYED them. Because it is a different way of playing, just one you don't like. Options Options Options people.

[Greenfist 1863]

Have you guys tried the tweaked sway on the dev branch? It's nearly perfect there.

Too bad we probably have to wait 3-5 weeks before it goes to stable. :( Unless BIS thinks this is worthy of a hotfix.

[((K)).Siberiano 10]

pleaseeee. come back old sistem scopes!!!!!

[-Coulum- 35]

Your so stuck in your own ways you don't even listen to the other side.

Every post I have said make it an option, but you just want EVERYONE to have it the way you like.

I played all last night and the ammount of firefights over 10-20 meters that ended up with VERY VERY good PVP players facing each other changing mags was absurd.

"Suck it up" just doesn't cut it. I bet you play against AI, and not against real players.

The clan I am part of played a match against a coop only clan the other week and we totally DESTROYED them. Because it is a different way of playing, just one you don't like. Options Options Options people.

We are all stuck in our ways of course - its the internet. But what is your side? The last few posts I have read have all been "My gun doesn't sway irl, my gun doesn't sway like that irl, my gun doesn't sway like that irl" without acknowledging the explanation people are giving them for that ingame sway. Its why I responded the way I did.

I've never said anything about not wanting options. I actually do want easier difficulties to have less fatigue and weapon sway effects, just so people can get accustomed to it and will stop complaining about it here. BI said that might be an option but for now they want to nail down a standard first (at least that's the interpretation I got).

I am not sure what you are getting at with PvP vs. Coop. I have played coop and PvP with the sway. Actually been enjoying the PvP more. It is hard to compete with the ai's precision. Yes firefights are much more up close and personal now. I don't know what environment you were playing in to get people 10-20 metres away from each other (I assume urban) but even in the hills of altis firefights can get as close as 50m if the cover permits and teams are able to manoeuvre well. If I guy simply hides you got get clsoe to kill him. It is not uncommon for close encounters like this in reality either when neither side retreats. I am not sure what the problem is?

Have you guys tried the tweaked sway on the dev branch? It's nearly perfect there.

Too bad we probably have to wait 3-5 weeks before it goes to stable. Unless BIS thinks this is worthy of a hotfix.

Yes I tried it. Its pretty much what we had before the patch. So much for the "revamped weapon sway". Community gave it a try for a whole three days?

But thankfully I think this is far from the end of the tweaking.

[DancZer 65]

I think the weapon sway is OK as is! The problem is with the AI accuracy.

[nikiforos 450]

I think they fixed the sway now with the latest dev branch update.

[andreher 10]

This fatigue / weapon sway is unplayable horrible now. I just had a game night yesterday with my friends and we aborted the mission and closed the game after waiting 4+ minutes (prone position) the drunk soldier get his aim straight. Please, guys, you got the Gameplay X Realism right this time with A3 (compared to A2), why screw it?

I'm starting to regret have buying the dlc bundle since I'm mostly like not going to keep playing if the game stays like that.

Edited July 16, 2014 by andreher

[Bouben 3]

This fatigue / weapon sway is unplayable horrible now. I just had a game night yesterday with my friends and we aborted the mission and closed the game after waiting 4+ minutes (prone position) the drunk soldier get his aim straight. Please, guys, you got the Gameplay X Realism right this time with A3 (compared to A2), why screw it?

I'm starting to regret have buying the dlc bundle since I'm mostly like not going to keep playing if the game stays like that.

It is always a bit complicated when a casual meets a challenge-seeking.

[andreher 10]

It is always a bit complicated when a casual meets a challenge-seeking.

Well, I have 409 hours of ArmA III. That's quite a casual. BTW I like realism and simulation, but I also like gameplay.

[whisper 0]

This fatigue / weapon sway is unplayable horrible now. I just had a game night yesterday with my friends and we aborted the mission and closed the game after waiting 4+ minutes (prone position) the drunk soldier get his aim straight. Please, guys, you got the Gameplay X Realism right this time with A3 (compared to A2), why screw it?

I'm starting to regret have buying the dlc bundle since I'm mostly like not going to keep playing if the game stays like that.

What was the gear of the player when you did this? To me the whole point of this change, and why I find it awesome, is how it forces people to deal with logistics, and make travel-planning matter.

There are several problems currently, few days after patch, that will be soon corrected :

* Less realism-oriented missions have not been modified to include things like disabled fatigue

* Most mission do NOT take at all into account this new limitation on transportation limits, and acts as if running for kilometers with more-than-full gear is NORMAL. Mission maker will have to adapt to : share gear amongst player and emphasize the role of Ammo Bearer, add more transport vehicle, probably lower the amount of vehicles to get in line with the lack of rockets in backpacks.

* sway is a bit too heavy atm, even when full rested. Dev branch seems to have it nailed quite nicely. This will get pushed to main, hopefully soon.

On my side, atm, I corrected the issues by using AGM mod, with Fatigue module disabled. It works wonders, tbh.

[Bouben 3]

Well, I have 409 hours of ArmA III. That's quite a casual. BTW I like realism and simulation, but I also like gameplay.

409 hours of what? :-) I mean, there are some players that play as pilots or crew most of the time. I would not expect them to be good marksmen even after 1000 hours of tank driving and piloting helicopters :-)

---------- Post added at 16:50 ---------- Previous post was at 16:48 ----------

* sway is a bit too heavy atm, even when full rested. Dev branch seems to have it nailed quite nicely. This will get pushed to main, hopefully soon.

I disagree, the current devbranch is a regression basically. I dislike it. The effect of fatigue is barely noticeable in a normal gameplay now.

[lao fei mao 21]

I have got the sway problem fixed, pls find the download link

http://forums.bistudio.com/showthread.php?180535-1-24-weapon-exaggerated-sway-got-fixed

[wolfflight 0]

Hehehe. Yep. I'm lovin it. gotta adapt guys. You can't play arma like you play counterstrike. You can get in accurate shots, just you gotta actually take some time and concentration. In that vid the player only got the kills he did because the other players he was against were trying the run and gun game as much as he. The end is a great example of how not to deal with weapon sway. Instead of taking the time to ensure a hit he just sprayed away, alerting the other player.

What is exactly playable. Because the game is more than playable to me. If you take the time to figure out how to play it. Just because you can no longer snap shoot people at hundreds of metres away does not make the game unplayable. It does mean you may have to adapt your tactics, playstyle and expectations though.

This is my point of view as well. It now takes SKILL.

Those who claim that there is no horizontal component to sway are a little 'off-putting.' In actuality the sway does describe a figure eight. I will say that yes, A3 has the figure 8 a little too horizontal... for a right handed shooter the rifle should go roughly in a figure eight that is tilted 45 degrees offset right... in other words up and right, down and left... a left handed shooter would be the opposite, up and left, down and right.

but there is definitely a horizontal component. Add to that, jerking the trigger, anticipating the shot, etc. and actually A3 does not even model ALL the things that can make a shot go wrong.

and thank whoever the gods are that they do not just use a a random circle where the bullet hits somewhere inside it like pretty much EVERY other game does.

And all these people holding their breath. I have been shooting for over 30 years. And as a United States Marine Infantryman who shoots Expert, I can say that in all those years of shooting, I NEVER, that is I say NEVER hold my breath to shoot. That induces muscle fatigue and oxygen deprivation which causes microtrembles. Holy crap. You shoot with the breath... Some shoot on the inhale, some shoot on the exhale. I personally shoot on the inhale. I aim through the sights and make it so that on the inhale, right before I exhale, the crosshairs are on the target.

Inhale, pull trigger, exhale...

What the game needs is better breathe control and obvious indicators of breathing, but you need to learn to AIM better, not complain about sway. Sway ALWAYS exists, because you are breathing.

I personally like the new system. And yes, quit running around the battlefield, and use TACTICS and teamwork...

Edited July 16, 2014 by WolfFlight

[Rath 10]

We are all stuck in our ways of course - its the internet. But what is your side? The last few posts I have read have all been "My gun doesn't sway irl, my gun doesn't sway like that irl, my gun doesn't sway like that irl" without acknowledging the explanation people are giving them for that ingame sway. Its why I responded the way I did.

I've never said anything about not wanting options. I actually do want easier difficulties to have less fatigue and weapon sway effects, just so people can get accustomed to it and will stop complaining about it here. BI said that might be an option but for now they want to nail down a standard first (at least that's the interpretation I got).

I am not sure what you are getting at with PvP vs. Coop. I have played coop and PvP with the sway. Actually been enjoying the PvP more. It is hard to compete with the ai's precision. Yes firefights are much more up close and personal now. I don't know what environment you were playing in to get people 10-20 metres away from each other (I assume urban) but even in the hills of altis firefights can get as close as 50m if the cover permits and teams are able to manoeuvre well. If I guy simply hides you got get clsoe to kill him. It is not uncommon for close encounters like this in reality either when neither side retreats. I am not sure what the problem is?

Yes I tried it. Its pretty much what we had before the patch. So much for the "revamped weapon sway". Community gave it a try for a whole three days?

But thankfully I think this is far from the end of the tweaking.

Sigh... I have absolutely no problem wrecking shop with any gun in ArmA 3 with the new weapon sway even on elite difficulty. I understand why they did it I was just trying to get it across that it should be optional for people who are more interested in realism over a scope minigame.

[CaptainAzimuth 714]

Alright, a Pro Tip from the ANVIL Special Operations Command.

Learn to counter the sway as is meant to be handled. When you aim, watch the sway. Now, move your mouse against it, and notice it's easier to handle. Most importantly, holding your breath MATTERS. When you hold your breath, it counters the Up and Down sway which counts for Breathing. Ounce you get a hang of it, it'll be easier to handle most if not any guns you use. Don't forget to position your stance depending on the situation. If you feel you can't take a shot, and the conditions permit, don't. Wait it out until you feel you wont be putting yourself or your team mates at risk by possibly giving away your position with in accurate gunfire. Carry on.

DarkSideSix Out!

[Bouben 3]

I have got the sway feature changed to my liking, pls find the download link

http://forums.bistudio.com/showthread.php?180535-1-24-weapon-exaggerated-sway-got-fixed

Fixed that for you.

[lao fei mao 21]

Fixed that for you.

---- I'm not forcing you to use my addons, just share it to those who might have the same mind with me.

[Bouben 3]

---- I'm not forcing you to use my addons, just share it to those who might have the same mind with me.

Cool.

[kilroy the nerd 14]

If it makes you guys feel better, devbranch has tweaked it to be more comfortable apparently.

[Sillywabbit 10]

Before and after video

[andreher 10]

Arma 3 is unrealistic in so many ways I don't see why we have to have such "realism feature" that affects gameplay so much.

Example of unrealistic stuff on your perfect simulator realistic virtual reality i'm a marine game:

• 3rd person view
  
• You can kill a guy instantly with 2 shots on the feet but not with a 6.5mm war rifle shot on the chest.
  
• You can take up to 4 rifle shots and heal your self fine with a small bandage kit.
  
• Vehicles have hitpoints and no realistic penetration sistem. You can blow up cars by shooting on the wheels.
  
• You can fix broken jets in 5 seconds using "Tools". Same for other vehicles.
  
• Grass only renders nearby your screen, so If you prone under the grass you can't see shit, but the enemy player 200m from you can see you perfectly because he sees no grass.
  
• You can roll over with a quad and keep going like nothing happened.
  
• You can easly fly choppers and jets with keyboard.
  
• You can drive tanks, apcs and other vehicles with AWSD just like need for speed. Not even gear control.
  
• I could go forever...
  

Edited July 16, 2014 by andreher

[VoRtReX-uk 10]

Dev branch is a god send. Its still got a little bit more sway than before but I am more than willing to learn how to control that.

[CaptainAzimuth 714]

Before and after video

In the after video, the way your countering the sway, as someone would do IRL, makes it look so much more polish than before. To call it drunk aiming, is... a bit like lumping over a fence but landing on the moon instead. However, i can see the under slung nade launcher being maybe an issue.

[roshnak 41]

Before and after video

You sure like to use DMRs and sniper rifles in PVP, huh?

[barakokula31 10]

• Grass only renders nearby your screen, so If you prone under the grass you can't see shit, but the enemy player 200m from you can see you perfectly because he sees no grass.
  
• You can easly fly choppers and jets with keyboard.
  
• You can drive tanks, apcs and other vehicles with AWSD just like need for speed. Not even gear control.
  

Please tell me you aren't serious.