The A-164 WIPEOUT Fixed Wing Aircraft

[carlostex 38]

In the Flight model thread here i started to do some tests on how the 30mm Cannon seemed a step back when compared to the GAU-8, and how the A-164 does not seem a worthy successor.

I created this thread to allow the discussion to continue on a proper thread. Here are the issues i presented:

Ok just made a small test. The 30mm DU rounds should have extra penetrating capability. But in the tests it doesn't really feel anything special compared against other types of 30mm rounds.

Against a building:

Against plywood plaques or some sort:

Against Metal Containers:

Now it seems to me that 30mm DU penetrating capability isn't very realistic. Either 30mm needs to penetrate more or objects in the Arma 3 have way too much armor. Maybe it's a little of both...

I was curious... So it seems that the 12.7mm APDS round penetrates deeper than the A-164 30mm Round.

Just took a look into configfile >> "CfgAmmo" >> "Gatling_30mm_HE_Plane_CAS_01_F"

and values are:

caliber: 1.4

hit: 32

indirecthit: 12

indirecthitrange: 3

This is basically the same as: configfile >> "CfgAmmo" >> "B_30mm_HE".

So BIS might change settings. I would be cool to see two types of ammo available for the A-164.

To attack hard targets a 30mm_DU round:

caliber: 8

hit: 150

indirecthit: 8

indirecthitrange: 1

To attack soft targets (cars, personnel) a somewhat improved 30mm_HE round:

caliber: 1.5

hit: 40

indirecthit: 15

indirecthitrange: 3

If supposedly the A-164 Wipeout is the A-10 Warthog successor, make it a worthy successor. As it seems right now the Wipeout in Arma 3 performs worse than the venerable Warthog in Arma 2.

One cool feature would be that the Wipeout had an internal system that would allow to reload between HE and AP rounds. That would be a cool "advancement" between the Warthog and Wipeout instead of the cosmetic change which has no gameplay impact whatsoever.

[HKFlash 9]

You should use the splendid cam for the screenshots. Allows you to take the shots from any position.

[carlostex 38]

That's true but for the purpose this is just fine.

[Brisse 78]

IRL the A-10 usually carries a mixed load. With the standard mixed combat load it fires five PGU-14/B Armor Piercing Incendiary and then one PGU-13/B High Explosive Incendiary. There is no way to change ammunition in flight.

[carlostex 38]

IRL the A-10 usually carries a mixed load. With the standard mixed combat load it fires five PGU-14/B Armor Piercing Incendiary and then one PGU-13/B High Explosive Incendiary. There is no way to change ammunition in flight.

Yes i know, but how do you simulate that within the game engine? AFAIK it's not possible to include two types of ammo within an entry in CfgMagazines, or define how much bullets of each type are used within a certain interval.

What i'm suggesting is that since Arma 3 features a hypothetical futuristic scenario maybe there was now a way to reload between two types of magazines for the Gatling cannon. This would be a cool futuristic kind of advancement, since the cosmetic changes on the aircraft (stealthy look) have no gameplay influence whatsoever. As of now, the A-164 Wipeout seems to be inferior to the A-10 Warthog in Arma 2.

This is the point of the thread, ideas are needed in order to make the Wipeout stand out from the A-10, to make it feel it was a technological advancement.

[AveryTheKitty 2626]

Replace the A-164's AA missiles with AMRAAMs or ASRAAMs cause the current ones don't hit anything. Why didn't they use the other munitions for it?

[nodunit 397]

You propose that there be two boxes or drums of ammunition for a fire selector to switch between. Unless the various mechanical bits are resized I don't think there would be any room considering how much the drum takes now..alternatively same drum but split ammo count.

[nerdwing 13]

While we're at it, can we rename it to something that isnt awful, and isnt a negative connotation?

A-164 is just random as heck, and a "Wipeout" is a bad thing. Call it the "Marauder II" IMO, to continue the WWII-plane naming tradition.

[2nd ranger 282]

Yeah BIS is pretty bad at naming things. At least this name doesn't end in -er, like Hunter, Slammer, Darter, Stomper, Panther, Scorcher. Although they couldn't resist it with the A10's missiles which are Macer and something else ending in -er.

[carlostex 38]

You propose that there be two boxes or drums of ammunition for a fire selector to switch between. Unless the various mechanical bits are resized I don't think there would be any room considering how much the drum takes now..alternatively same drum but split ammo count.

That's the whole idea. Somehow a mechanical advancement would allow for this type of ammo selection, changing mags during flight. Of course instead of a total of 1000 rounds there would be 2 smaller mags of 500 rounds each.

The rate of fire is also really low ATM, so i'm hoping BIS might change quite a few stuff around.

As of now this new A-164 Wipeout brings nothing new to the table, it's pretty much a stealthy A-10 which for CAS doesn't make a whole lot of sense IMO. Not only that but the cannon is far less efective than the old GAU-8 on Arma 2, so i wouldn't rely a lot on the cannon to destroy light and medium armored targets like APC's, which the GAU-8 can still be quite effective IRL.

So my idea is to give the A-164 an improvement versus the plane it replaces, dual mags would be cool. AP rounds for armored targets like APC's and HE rounds for softer vehicles like trucks and other transport vehicles or even ground troops. It would be a cool feature and would make the A-164 stand out from the A-10 past.

Of course there can be other ideas, not only for the A-164 but for the OPFOR CAS jet as well (don't remember the designation :))

[heavygunner 179]

Well, instead of one gun firing 2 different rounds (Not possible as it seems) you could just set 2 different guns on the same spot, with one firing AP and one HE rounds. These method was used before for this and the engine limited RPM for one gun problem as far as I know.

[barakokula31 10]

AFAIK it's not possible to include two types of ammo within an entry in CfgMagazines, or define how much bullets of each type are used within a certain interval.

And what about the regular magazines having tracers for the five last bullets? How do you explain that?

[Sniperwolf572 758]

And what about the regular magazines having tracers for the five last bullets? How do you explain that?

There are config entries in the magazine which determines which bullets show the tracer.

This is how the 5.56 mag is defined:

class 30Rnd_556x45_Stanag: CA_Magazine {
// Only the important bits
ammo = "B_556x45_Ball"; // Ammo that the mag uses
tracersEvery = 0;  // 0 means no tracers every X rounds, 1 would mean tracer every round, 2 would mean tracer every other round, etc.
lastRoundsTracer = 4; // How many rounds at the end of the magazine show the tracer
// ...
};

Edited March 15, 2014 by Sniperwolf572

[barakokula31 10]

...stuff...

Can't something similar be done for different ammo types?

[Sniperwolf572 758]

Can't something similar be done for different ammo types?

There is no native support for such things in configs as there is for tracers, as far as I'm aware. Scripting on the other hand, sky's the limit. But don't expect BI to do that.

[carlostex 38]

An option if BIS doesn't at least change the HE rounds to more effective AP rounds is to mod the thing. When i have the time i'll do it at least for my enjoyment. It will be pretty much config work.

[kilroy the nerd 14]

EDIT: nvm, didn't properly look through second page

Still, if the Marshall can load different round types in combat surely they've developed some way for aircraft, yes?

[marksinnerdemon 11]

There is no way in a aircraft to change rounds as of yet. Actually that is the last thing most Air Forces are concerned about due to the advanced nature of missile and bomb tech. If the Commanders want to duel purpose they generally mix ammo, however a lot of that ammo size is multi role like the 50 call with the API rounds etc.

[carlostex 38]

There is no way in a aircraft to change rounds as of yet. Actually that is the last thing most Air Forces are concerned about due to the advanced nature of missile and bomb tech. If the Commanders want to duel purpose they generally mix ammo, however a lot of that ammo size is multi role like the 50 call with the API rounds etc.

That's why i called it a hypothetical technological advancement. Remember that Arma 3 is set on the year 2035.

[asdfero 10]

This is a great value for the 30mm, they're the values on Peral's A10-C Mod.

Caliber 4.17

Hit 300

Indirect Hit 40

Indirect Hit Range 3

[xendance 3]

This is a great value for the 30mm, they're the values on Peral's A10-C Mod.

Caliber 4.17

Hit 300

Indirect Hit 40

Indirect Hit Range 3

I don't know, armored targets explode way too easily with that ammo. It's unrealistically good.

[jgbtl292 0]

i hope he will fix the splash size to . actual is not more then a big rifle.

[nerdwing 13]

I personally find the gun to be totally fine versus tanks. I'd use it vs infantry to support buddies on the ground anyways, you've got the 6 ATGM's for any actual tanks you engage.

[spanishsurfer 58]

What's the class name for the two jets? I'm prepping my BECTI mission for Friday's release. Thanks in advance.

[gossamersolid 155]

i hope he will fix the splash size to . actual is not more then a big rifle.

The splash damage is most likely meant to supplement the lower firing speed due to engine limitations.