Cover system for Arma3?

[roberthammer 582]

MOH: Airborne had it good too - it was very usefull with that shotgun :D

[Make Love Not War 10]

Wanted to touch upon the AI side of this discussion again:

I hope that BI will really do a top down reformation of the AI so that they act in a more sophisticated way but my experience with what is possible and what seems to be implemented by BI points towards this being unlikely.

Unfortunately, I'm inclined to agree. :(

So to be the ruthless pragmatist, I'd like to think that the cover system would at least mean that the AI would be being stupid in cover rather than being stupid out in the open.

Good point. Yeah, upon some reflection I realize I wasn't being fair - you're right that improving the AI's ability to find and use cover would be a meaningful step forward.

<snip> it does emulate that first response in a firefight which is to go to ground.

Yes, and of equal importance is to return fire ASAP. ATM, the AI somehow manages to do neither of these two things; instead, it seems to be enamored with the idea of running from cover to cover willy-nilly. In effect this means that (A) it is actually not behind cover very often, and (B) it isn't firing back to any appreciable extent.

BTW, I was looking at solving some of these issues via scripting and the proof of concepts I've written so far seem promising. I also know SNKMAN was doing some work in that area:

http://forums.bistudio.com/showpost.php?p=1760433&postcount=1943

Those vids are definitely worth checking out.

[-=seany=- 5]

For Players - no

For AI - maybe.

TBH the AI now, in OA, do use a cover system and will run to an object (like a building) and lean around the corner of it. It's pretty impressive. If they can improve this a bit more then that would be great. The trouble with adding things like this for the AI is getting them to do it at the right time.

There is no point in adding things like this for the AI if they do it at the wrong time, which is some thing that is already a problem in Arma, to a certain extent. When this happens it makes the game feel less realistic then if the feature wasn't there.

I think during the course of Arma3 development they will improve the Ai and things like taking cover and shooting around corners. So I doubt there is a need for some "special ability" to be added.

[froggyluv 2136]

AI's use walls laterally quite well. What would it take for them to use objects ala cars, tanks etc....?

[St. Jimmy 272]

It's already unrealistic. How can they make it "even more" realistic?

No soldier is trained to waste ammo like that nor is it effective in any way.

It just looks "cool"

Ok let's replace the "even more realistic" with realistic :) And if you or your squad leader thinks that's uneffective and you are wasting too much ammo then don't use it.

[swesog 10]

There is a cover system in the upcoming Red Orchestra: Heroes Of Stalingrad. I think that would work for Arma 3 aswell.

[Lou Montana 101]

well TBH I loved the Army of Two : 40th day cover system, fluid, very effective when you know it !

But honestly not in Arma ; one thing from other games I'd like to see would be the soldier putting his weapon down (or up, but... anyway) when he's too close to a wall ; first trying to put the gun over the wall (if it is just a bit too high) and if not, keeping it against his body so you are not blocked in your movements in a small place. I wouldn't be angry if they kept the actual system tho, because it's also simple and effective - maybe just needs a bit of polish, that's all !

[gho-t 10]

If they devolped a well done FPS cover system, i could see that being in the game.

[.Taffy 10]

As others have said before me, I think there is no need for a cover system for the player, but I would really like to see the AI respond more interactively with the environment to take cover.

[kylania 568]

As others have said before me, I think there is no need for a cover system for the player, but I would really like to see the AI respond more interactively with the environment to take cover.

They've gotten a lot better in A2. Last night I was playing and several times I saw AI run to a tree or a wall and hide behind it poking out to shoot.

[ProfTournesol 956]

They've gotten a lot better in A2. Last night I was playing and several times I saw AI run to a tree or a wall and hide behind it poking out to shoot.

Yes, latest patch made it much better. Need some improvements on shooting through windows / doors etc.

[.Taffy 10]

They've gotten a lot better in A2. Last night I was playing and several times I saw AI run to a tree or a wall and hide behind it poking out to shoot.

True, there has been a big improvement, so I am hopeful for the future of the AI. Their behaviour in urban environments does need improvement though, and I would quite like to see a system where you could point at the corner of a building and have the selected units stack up againts it etc.

I appreciate that doing it would likely be very complicated though...

[Splintert 10]

They've gotten a lot better in A2. Last night I was playing and several times I saw AI run to a tree or a wall and hide behind it poking out to shoot.

When a milita hides behind a 3/4 foot pole as cover, with both shoulders and legs sticking out, something is wrong.

[SPC.Spets 21]

I think also Medal of Honor Airborne have a cover system...

If BIS put all the thinks ppl are asking for, I hope the game do not change too much. I dont want ArmA3 the same destiny as Americas Army 3, they change everything and the game FAIL so bad, that now, nobody is playing even AA2.0

EDIT: oh! btw! all those things that ruined AA3 was suggested by newcomers and casuals, even they are not playing that game now

Edited May 24, 2011 by SpetS15

[4 IN 1 0]

Aside from looking cool and make gameplay unrealisticly easier in most case, I see no difference by switching into 3rd person view, not that I am totally against any sort of cover system, for example RO2 have a good system, but thats a game that have a lots of predefined object placement. So instead of spending time on cover system, i think they should just try to make the avatar switching weapon hand when lean left.

Edited May 25, 2011 by 4 IN 1

[neokika 62]

In my honest opinion Arma 2 already has the best cover system ever, the traditional one, where you go prone, crouch and lean, its really amazing and works better then any other type of cover system that make you glued to a wall/cover...Also the most "realistic"!

_neo_

[Iroquois Pliskin 0]

Really depends on the implementation, it has to be fine-tuned to twitch FPS, preferably with no additional keys to initiate cover - I don't think there are any free keys we could assign to this function. ;)

I've seen a video in this section of the forums, showing a cover system in ArmA 2 similar to smookie's PVP animations, it could be his creation, in fact. :D

[zooloo75 834]

Don't know if this was mentioned yet, but I would like to see the character "adjust" to the height of a nearby object when crouched to allow more cover.

[JojoTheSlayer 35]

That would also give TrackIRs vertical axis a point in Arma2. :)

(Though it should also be assignable to a key+mouse movement combo.)

Ditto, but thats about it.

Cover mechanics in games work far better than what you are able to do in real life anyway and that would affect game play negatively if it could be used on hardcore settings.

I wouldnt mind that the weapon auto lowered itself if it hit objects though. Like doorways, you are to close to the wall, etc

Edit:

Blind fire with extreme recoil etc could only be discussed I think if you, like Red Orchestra, can shoot the weapons out of peoples hands besides just damaging them or it will only be misused.

Edited May 25, 2011 by JojoTheSlayer

[4 IN 1 0]

Really depends on the implementation, it has to be fine-tuned to twitch FPS, preferably with no additional keys to initiate cover - I don't think there are any free keys we could assign to this function. ;)

I've seen a video in this section of the forums, showing a cover system in ArmA 2 similar to smookie's PVP animations, it could be his creation, in fact. :D

That is his work, however there is drawback with his mod, and it does not always works with everyone, I for one are only able to run that mod half of the time.

[SPC.Spets 21]

Don't know if this was mentioned yet, but I would like to see the character "adjust" to the height of a nearby object when crouched to allow more cover.

you can do that, watch min 3:00

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there is also a mod for pvp animations

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[-Puma- 2]

Cover system would (If Ai uses it correctly) bring longer firefights. If ai would just go behind cover and stay there for awhile it would bring more possibilities like flanking the dude. Now what I´ve seen run around quite alot and stops to kneel and takes a few shots, wich is very easy to predict.

I just woke so im allmost certain all of this dosent make any sense:pet5:

[sxp2high 23]

In my honest opinion Arma 2 already has the best cover system ever, the traditional one, where you go prone, crouch and lean, its really amazing and works better then any other type of cover system that make you glued to a wall/cover...Also the most "realistic"!

_neo_

Exactly, we can already do, what a cover system would do. And after some practice, as fast as a cover system. So, no use for such a thing.

[Tom1 10]

Don't know if this was mentioned yet, but I would like to see the character "adjust" to the height of a nearby object when crouched to allow more cover.

In my oppinion this is all it needs.

[norsu 180]

I wouldn't mind a cover system like in RO2. Simple 3rd person cover systems where you are glued to a wall would be too easy and make battles repetitive like they usually are in cover system games. Current way of taking cover suffers from couple of annoying things:

-Movement near objects and walls can be clumsy

-You can get stuck into rocks and other small obstacles

-You need to position yourself carefully to take the advantage of leaning and freelook. This wouldn't be an issue if movement was precise. With TrackIR this is easier but TrackIR shouldn't be mandatory in any way.

-We need multiple keys to do to simple things like quick freelook leaning. Maybe universal leaning function that you can adjust with mouse movement would be better? Something like in Thief 1 & 2 where you can adjust how far you lean using the mouse movement and leaning keys.

Edited May 25, 2011 by Norsu