Is arma ... fun?

[dissaifer 10]

To begin, I have to say I am new compared to some of the people in the community who have been here since OFP.

So, I was looking for a new game about a year ago and stumble across Arma 2. I read about it and it sounds fun and exciting, go out and buy it.

I start to play the tutorial... and realize this is a little difficult. I have to play the tutorial mission in the town so many times to kill all the guys in the town that it is a little ridiculous. I rack that up to it's a sim and I need to just get better.

I play through the campaign with some difficulty and the story is very good, but the game play is lacking in some way. Mostly I am frustrated with it, but I trudge through it.

Then I get to downloading the mods and playing with all the great stuff that the community makes. :D

So, I stop playing for a bit and really just came back, downloaded the patch and started playing EW. And this general feeling came back to me of frustration.

I openly admit that I am not the best pilot, which I am sure isn't helping the matter, but then how am I expected to shoot planes out of the air without lock?

Beyond that, I stopped and thought to myself, am I having fun? The answer is sadly... no. I really want to like this game, there is a bunch of great stuff in it, but every time I go to play it, all the fun is sucked out of it by playing it.

Don't get me wrong I am not complaining about the game, I really trying to help as much as I can when I can (I realize that isn't much). I really want this game to do well but I just can't bring myself to play it because it's just so frustrating. :(

Some of the problems I have... there are too many commands, I've been killed quite a few times trying to issue orders to AI. Enemy AI... are psychic, you drop in the grass before they see you and try to sneak up and are shot to death. Vehicles are hard to control, full speed or none, turning is basically painful. Helicopters fight the direction you want to go in, again I am not a great pilot, but it shouldn't try to counter correct putting the nose down (no I wasn't in auto hover).

I just don't understand why everything in this game has to be a chore. Sorry, I'm just frustrated. :(

[Zipper5 74]

Sounds like you're suffering from a severe case of mainstreamFPSitus. Don't worry, the symptoms wear off after a prolonged exposure to Arma 2's gameplay. ;)

Or if you're not looking for simulation gameplay, and you're not enjoying Arma 2, then I'd recommend moving on and sticking to what you enjoy.

[Arma-2-Guru 55]

Don't judge the game on the campaign or single missions, the main element of the game is the community side of things. Get yourself in a squad/clan and have a game online, that's where the real fun is at. I don't know many people who enjoyed the campaign.

[Cyteless 10]

I think Guru pretty much summed it up.

[eggbeast 3673]

yeah leave the AI alone- therein lies madness

[instagoat 133]

Hi!

Arma 2 is pretty difficult, but not as difficult as OFP back in the day. The AI doesn´t shoot you trough walls anymore, they´re not able to aim as well and tanks don´t have X-ray vision anymore.

The command system is one of the remnants of the old OFP, and its essentially the same, that is, pretty complex and unintuitive.

The only way to figure it out is to take it step by step, and try things out in the editor before applying them in the campaigns.

http://forums.bistudio.com/showthread.php?t=81123

This should be helpful.

As for EW...

Select the Sidewinder missles, and hit tab to target the planes as they take off. Each takes two missles to destroy. Second objective is more complicated because you need to destroy pretty much every enemy around it to succeed.

One thing that is important to Arma 2 is a mindset that takes a while to take on, essentially the motto of Dwarf Fortress (which is a gruesomely hard indie game about building a mountain fortress in a fantasy setting.) "Loosing is fun."

Use the Editor to experiment with tactics, and hone your AI squad command skills. Put down an enemy squad on patrol, and try to ambush them. Set up a convoy, and try to attack it with a helicopter. Challenge yourself: the advantage with self made training scenarios is that you always know what to expect, a luxury you usually don´t have in user made missions and the campaigns, especially Missions such as Cipher where everything is randomized.

It´s all a matter of mindset. For example, I play MW2 like I play Arma, and it becomes very boring because even on the highest difficulty, it gets reduced to a shooting gallery. I don´t enjoy the game, because its neither offering me the freedom that arma does, nor is getting an enemy actually rewarding. That, and its twitchy. I like to be able to plan and think ahead, before tackling an objective.

Hope this is at least a little bit helpful.

Cheers

Insta

[Fishercat 10]

You can work your way through the Armory as well. This gives you simple, quick missions that can help improve your skill in every area.

[jw custom 56]

The learning curve in ArmA is steep and if your not willing to keep trying eventhough it sometimes feels impossible then you'll never get the hang of it and your better of with games like COD.

The very first time i tried to fly i NEVER thought i would learn it, i was wrong now i think it's very easy. When i learned to fly jets i NEVER thought i would be able land them manually, i was wrong now i think it's very easy.

[oldbear 390]

Is arma ... fun?

Whaoo ! The problem with ArmA is that the answer is not an easy one, not the "black or white" kind of answer.

After a rather "long exposition" to OFP/ArmA/ArmA2 gameplay I can tell you that sometimes I have found it boring and sometimes thrilling but it's the only game I am still sticking to .... let me say I have play a lot since Pong.

What I enjoyed the more is playing in a group with my Game Team on PvP as on Coop and remember that basically the game is a "grunt sim" not "ArmA : FlySym".

[dissaifer 10]

Thanks for the words of encouragement. :)

MW, MW2... those are nap time, I destroyed the game on Veteran. So, that is too easy and this is too hard. It would just be nice, if the game eased you into it, because the learning curve is so high. I'm just saying, there is something to be said for simplicity... that is why COD does so well, both games could learn from each other.

AI does equal madness... I did just load up a game, against 3 AI. I snipe one then hide and turn on Troopmon... One guy knows exactly where I am (even after i crawl away... the other guy is clueless). The one who knows where I am, scouts the area thoroughly (and has the red mark to 'engage' me) even though he doesn't "know" where I am. It's just a little irritating, especially when you try to use the mission maker search and destroy and they don't even really look.

Maybe a clan is where it's at... at least the players will have the same problems as me.

[walker 0]

Hi Dissaifer

The road to competence in ArmA is paved with the piled up bodies of new players.

ArmA unlike other games makes no apologies and does not stroke your ego.

http://community.bistudio.com/wiki/ArmA_II_Hints_and_Tips

Getting good in ArmA takes time and effort.

I have died many times in ArmA as has every one who plays it you are not alone in this.

But one day it starts to gel and suddenly you think; why the heck was I having problems with this? Its simple.

After that point; all other games pale in comparison, you buy them but they sit on the shelf gathering dust.

You learn what to fear: For everyone on the ground it is: bare open ground and being on your own. In the sky it is: what is over that hill. As infantry it is: AFV's and especially BTRs; in an AFV its: that Forrest line and standing still or that helicopter, as a helicopter crew its planes and Shilka's etc.

You learn to read the ground, to look for routes in defilade. You start to look for the flash and smoke. You listen for the sonic snap or whiz of a ricochet and ignore the rounds that are not aimed at you. You learn to lean around corners and move your firing position. To reload in cover and count your rounds. You learn how to hunt MBTs as a team, a smoker and 3 AT like stone age men hunting mammoths, distracting and concealing and multiple backups.

But most of all ArmA is unlike other games; it lasts.

Kind Regards walker

Edited May 8, 2010 by walker

[ScareCroweb 10]

Well let me say a few things before you dismiss me totally...

Arma 2 is a Military Game/Sim I'd like to emphasise the Simulation aspect of it, because as you said yourself you are a killer in games like MW2 and such but not in Arma2 for example the fact that you flunkt out in the tutorial tell me that you are a typical COD/Shootem up gamer, no pun intended :) thats all good but if you think those games are fun for you then you should be happy with that, BUT if you plan on having fun with Arma2 then you must also learn to enjoy real warfare and real use of real life tactics, if you dont know any tactics then you MUST learn some basic ones, start with getting along with some people who actually use tactics in multiplayer games. its either that or start reading about warfare and tactics. I guess reading books isnt much fun either, but unless you have a real life drillinstructor to teach you you will have to learn it somewhere.

These words have helped me so many times to overcome my many losses during my gaming in Arma and other games:

Experience is a hard teacher, she gives you the test first and the lessen after. vernon sanders law.

This means that experience is hard to acquire and this is the way it should be, and thats why experienced troops are much tougher because they simply have learned to survive the hard way and there is no book that can replace experience.

My point is if you want to be good and make it work for you you should stick to it untill you gain that experience. Good luck FNG :)

[*LK1* 10]

if you resist for the first month you will fall in love with arma 2.

is it funny?of course like all the things that start to give you satisfaction...

but before you must familiarize with the game since is not to much user friendly.

you think mw2 or cod 6 are more funny?dunno...but im sure with these games you get bored faster because is the same thing to do again and again.

in arma the things you can do are more various.

[Lal 10]

OP, I felt like you do for a long time. To me the reason was, as you also state, an abundance of controls and the lack of a good and descriptive manual.

However, now the game is awesome! In other words you might want to keep playing for a while and see if it gets better. Spotting enemies was insanely hard to me at first. So was remaining unseen and even hitting reliably with the weapons, not to mention the fact that I had no idea how the map worked with enemy spottings and so on. This will change after a while however.

[maturin 12]

You can work your way through the Armory as well. This gives you simple, quick missions that can help improve your skill in every area.

That said, I die more in the Armory than anywhere else.

[instagoat 133]

The tutorials in Arma 2 are pretty inadequate, unfortunately. Not only a bit buggy, but also not really telling you how to do things beyond the very most basic things.

There´s been a few teasers of the Operation Arrowhead tutorial section, which is looking fantastic compared to the one in the vanilla game. Better late than never.

Playing together with people is more fun, yes, especially because you can properly communicate. I always try to drag new people into the game to play with, but they usually don´t make the first hurdle of getting past the initial difficulties the game poses for them.

Once you´re past those, though, it really only gets better.

[SgtMjr 10]

I hardly scratched the campaign or the scenarios, let alone the editor, when I found the Squad/Clan/Realism unit community and have never looked back. To me this is where the 'heart' of ArmA2 lives. Multi-Player action in a realism unit has pretty much taken over my game play completely.

Check them out, they'll be glad to see you. You'll have a blast being part of a team and playing Arma2 the way it was meant to be played, IMHO. The best ones use proper squad tactics and combined arms with a chain of command and structure that simulates a real military organization. Using all the mods that enhance the game like ACE2 and ZeusAI and missions that challenge you to tackle them just as a real Platoon and Company would have to, you will be left most satisfied having scratched that mil-sim itch.

[dissaifer 10]

Wow ScareCroweb... you're a dick.

I'm having a problem with how the game functions, not the concepts in the game. I already understood L ambush, flanking, suppressive fire, center peel, hit and run... and so on before I've ever seen this game. So, don't insult my intelligence.

The game feels like I am jerkin' around a delayed robot on the screen and in a tight situation that gets me killed.

I'm actually glad it takes time to learn how to shoot long range for snipers and that I can't instantly fly the helicopter with the grace of a seasoned vet... but I also don't think it should handle like an 18 wheeler.

And another thing... what is wrong with liking MW and Arma? This is the dumbest crap I've ever seen... they are totally different games each with their own goals. It's like people being mad at someone who likes American football and Rugby.

[Erratic 10]

I've just recentely purchased this game. I think I bought it about a week ago. I've already put 30 hours into it! lol. Now, this number will soon go up. But I mean the second I was dropped into ARMA 2, I accepted that this is going to be hard. I don't even get frustrated when I die, because this game really is alot harder than your run of the mill FPS. ALOT harder.

But don't you find it good that there's so much to learn? And already after playing for a short time, I've got loads better. I've begun to control my AI squad nicely, yes there's still things I need to touch up on and the AI control is probably the only real frustration for me, but I'm getting there.

As far as the vehicles go, I found if I use the mouse to drive the vehicles, you can drive them real nice once you get used to it. I was using the keyboard before and I was driving like a drunk! At first for me, it felt like the mouse wasn't sensitive enough to drive the vehicle as it is to aim your weapon, but it seems to be very good once you give it a go. Give it five minutes and go nice and steady with it and you can already begin to do some nice driving.

As far the graphics and immersion go, amazing. There's times where I laugh and think, man this is the real deal as far as immersion goes. I think the graphics are top notch also.

All the missions, mods and everything make the whole community really great too. I've sat here for god knows how many hours reading about the stuff and choosing which ones I want and what not. My collection is building and building!

What triggered it for me about how good this game was, was when I downloaded a user made mission to test one out, and I was controlling my squad to take an airfield, and we got into a massive firefight. It took me 40 minutes to finally get onto that airfield because of the resistance, but I remember after thinking. That was crazy! I get bored out of my head playing MW2 for 40 minutes now, I mean, imagine slowly moving towards a point in MW2 for 40 minutes! You'd fall asleep at your desk. But this game is completely different.

I'm telling you I could go on and on. I'm going to use the Armoury later and play around with that! I've got some new mods to test out (sound mods and stuff) and missions to practice and try to complete. I've also got the editor to mess around in, I had a brief look, it looks endless. Where do I start? There's just so much to do :)

If you ever want some co-op with a fellow beginner, hit me a PM. You or I can host a server and we can select some nice and simple missions that we can try and complete.

[Whoatherefatty 10]

I agree with the TC. Doing random secops in the editor is infinitely more fun than the campaign levels. Tbh the campaign is not what I expected being a newbie to milsims. I thought it would be mostly chillin at the base and going on patrols when told... Pretty much like a job. Instead the game does a lot of that screen fades now your here stuff.

[Arma-2-Guru 55]

You should apply for GOL -Guerrillas of Liberation clan/squad. While I was with them I learned a shed load of tactics including ROE, formations and assault & retreat tactics, they will show you the ropes really well.

[ScareCroweb 10]

You should apply for GOL -Guerrillas of Liberation clan/squad. While I was with them I learned a shed load of tactics including ROE, formations and assault & retreat tactics, they will show you the ropes really well.

Hey Guru, I dont think he needs anyone teaching him tactics, he has obviously tons of experience with Arma2 or so it seems from his post, he maybe able to teach us some tricks, who knows :bounce3:

[Inkompetent 0]

ArmA is about the patient hunter. About the coordinated, well practiced team of hunters. About surviving the beast, like hunting wild boars with spears.

About the game feeling sluggish. Well.. yes. It is. It is a bit rigid, because what you see in first person, or in third person, or how others see you in third person, that's the exact same model. There's no cheating like first person being a pair of hands and a gun like in Counter-Strike, Battlefield or Call of Duty. It puts limits on the mechanics.

But even more importantly: How agile is a soldier in his Interceptor vest, magazine pouches, kevlar, camelback, half a dozen of additional pouches, and rifle? The sluggish movement in ArmA is unusual as far as games goes, but you simply have to plan with that things take a long time to do. It's not easy to move in 50-60 lbs of gear, and especially not when you are starting to get tired.

To me the reward in ArmA is the feeling of successfully spent time. Instead of the caffeine-speeded rounds of CoD:MW or BFBC2 the good missions aren't a constant fragfest with constant respawning. They are battles where I have to earn my kills and earn my survival. Where being the quickest shot or stepping around the corner at the right second isn't enough, but I have to plan more thoroughly, observe more in detail, and where every extra effort is extra rewarded.

I'm not spoon-fed a feeling of success in ArmA. I have to work for it. And that makes it sooooo much more real than in pretty much every non-sim game out there.

Edited May 8, 2010 by Inkompetent

[dissaifer 10]

Thanks ScareCroweb. :) I would gratefully take the place of a low level grunt if asked. Everybody plays different and just because I know tactics doesn't mean people like to do them.

[Binkowski 26]

sometimes.