No Army?

[kocrachon 2]

BIS have just gone the more realistic way... Say there was a conflict over near where the ArmA 2 island is located, who would be first there from the US? The Marines... It's just the more realistic option...

But as people have already said, I'm sure some high quality army units will be made shortly after release for all the army junkies. But for me, the Marines are personally the better option to go with in this type of conflict. The MEU are the way to go with this game. BIS have done their research.  

There has rarely been a military conflict where only 1 branch of the military has performed. And even more so, the military is becoming 1 giant joint unit.

More reason to incorporate all 3. All 3 branches of the military server major different roles. The Navy does a good job of trying to be both airforce and army, but it still lacks in man power, and for the most part, the Army and the Airforce both have the newer and greater technoligy and funding (simply because Navy has to use its budget on Air, AND Ground, AND Ships, stretching it thin).

I think all military games need to stop forcing a 1 branch deal and make all games Joint Task Force games.

THAT is realism.

Also, the first to respond, would be the 82nd Airborne Division, even on a country that was in a Gulf (Iraq), The 82nd Airborne landed on the border of Iraq and Turkey before the Marines touched dirt in Iraq.

An Airplane from Florida can reach anywhere in the world faster than a Ship can.... for the most part

[AntipopAU 3]

BIS have just gone the more realistic way... Say there was a conflict over near where the ArmA 2 island is located, who would be first there from the US? The Marines... It's just the more realistic option...

But as people have already said, I'm sure some high quality army units will be made shortly after release for all the army junkies. But for me, the Marines are personally the better option to go with in this type of conflict. The MEU are the way to go with this game. BIS have done their research.  

There has rarely been a military conflict where only 1 branch of the military has performed. And even more so, the military is becoming 1 giant joint unit.

More reason to incorporate all 3. All 3 branches of the military server major different roles. The Navy does a good job of trying to be both airforce and army, but it still lacks in man power, and for the most part, the Army and the Airforce both have the newer and greater technoligy and funding (simply because Navy has to use its budget on Air, AND Ground, AND Ships, stretching it thin).

I think all military games need to stop forcing a 1 branch deal and make all games Joint Task Force games.

THAT is realism.

Also, the first to respond, would be the 82nd Airborne Division, even on a country that was in a Gulf (Iraq), The 82nd Airborne landed on the border of Iraq and Turkey before the Marines touched dirt in Iraq.

An Airplane from Florida can reach anywhere in the world faster than a Ship can.... for the most part

I'm not an American, nor know the US military very well. I was just doing some training and talking to a US Army Major and US Marine Gunnery Sergeant at a LAV course here in Australia, and they agreed that the Marines were the first on the ground in most theaters of war. With quick support from the Air Force and Navy, then finally the Army. I told them about the way both ArmA 2 and OFP2 were set out, and they believed both games were plausible and semi-realistic.  

Also, if you were fighting a full blown enemy (Not Iraqi insurgents) but a FULL military, would you seriously just dropped some dudes off a plane and leave them in there and wait till everyone else gets there? Or would you send the Marines with their own Aircrafts and Armour? I personally would choose the later....

[Second 0]

Also, if you were fighting a full blown enemy (Not Iraqi insurgents) but a FULL military, would you seriously just dropped some dudes off a plane and leave them in there and wait till everyone else gets there? Or would you send the Marines with their own Aircrafts and Armour? I personally would choose the later....

We don't know does campaign start from full blown war or not. It probably escalates as full blown war at some point, but not necessarily right from start.

Here's few options.

1. Maybe Razor goes there when US gets bloody nose first (as trailer seems to tell).

2. Razor's insertion is infact preparations for heavier forces. (as trailer seems to tell too).

3. 1 and 2 combined.

4. Razor working behind enemy lines while ground battles wages.

5. Something else. What?

[tiger_2650 0]

There may be a commercial reason for the decision to make the primary "allied" force the US Marines in that the US Marines are major customers of BI's VBS series.  The Marines (officially or unofficially) may simply have suggested that they would appreciate some free advertising!! Complete speculation of course but I believe feasible.

As for including other forces with the game ... I'm all for that.  Such addons could be included on a specifically created 2nd disk if space were at a premium.  I agree that this would also make public server missions more accessible.

[Banderas 0]

If I remember well, the first units in Afghanistan were marines in 2002 (not counting the special forces). Over the times they proved their value in many different conflicts. Maybe they have a lot of media attention, but the 82nd and 101st airborne has their own too, as well as Army Rangers, Green Berets. I didn't hear less glorification about these units than the marines, or about fow example the French Foreign Legion.

I think the idea behind that there will be marine units in the game, because each MEU is like a little "joint ops" armed force. They have their own infantry, recon, spec ops, armor, artillery, air force and logistics, all under one command. I think that justifies that a pure Marine force is representing the West.

Altough I admit the 82nd airborne is an excellent fightint force, and I'm sure their value as individual soldiers are on level with the marines, but on their own they are only light infantry.

And also the Marines won't fight on their own, they will help the Army of Chernarus.

[dslyecxi 23]

There may be a commercial reason for the decision to make the primary "allied" force the US Marines in that the US Marines are major customers of BI's VBS series.  The Marines (officially or unofficially) may simply have suggested that they would appreciate some free advertising!! Complete speculation of course but I believe feasible.

I doubt this is the case. BIS has done Army in the past (OFP), a mix (ArmA), and now they're doing Marines. Seems reasonable, without thinking there's something else behind the decision.

[sparks50 0]

Its just the politically correct thing to do for a shooter.

[Heatseeker 0]

Might be because they already have a bunch of artwork and assets. The "Team Razor" seems way corny though .

Why not make them the navy seals instead? More believable..

[Clavicula_nox4817 0]

Well, Arma2 is going to be Warfare sim, not a game about soldiers playing PSP and sending Txt Msgs to their friends on battlefield.

That's why we have Marines, not Army

What's more, In PVP mode ACU is very unfair. In real life ACU is really good camo but in game it's hard to make it work.

And if we have Marpat and some opfor in wdl, then it's ok.

How to recognise? By model. Or try to play as a team so that you know where every member of your team is.

What's more, there are so many games about US Army already, this is Marines time

Really? More games these days focus around Mariens now, the only legendary games out there that focus on Army anymore is Americas Army (made by the army) the Ghost Recon Franchise, and then ArmA 1.

Which is sad, because the Army has the largest Special Operation Forces units, perform more SF missions, has the largest ground force, the most modern ground force (uses newer tanks and IFV/APCs.)

Then again what should I expect, after all my time in the Army I still see how the media makes the Marines seem like they do all the work, and the Marines believe it themselves. First to the fight? Tell that to teh 82nd Airborne that droped in behind enemy lines before the marines touched the shores in Iraq.

ANYWAYS back on topic.

ArmA 1 was a joint ops game. It had Marines AND Airforce AND Army. I don't see why ArmA 2 had to go so heavy into Marines. Even ArmA 1 had moments in it where the Army soldiers were getting help from marines (such as the cobras saving the shores).

I am just kind of tired of games putting Forces in the site, and not making it more of a joint forces, especially with the way the military is gearing up to unifying all of the units better.

Just a little correction. The 82nd didn't jump into Iraq, that was done by the 173rd. And before them, companies from 5th and 10th Special Forces Groups were already in country a few days prior.

[ShrubMiK 0]

I find it rather ironic that everybody here is agonising over whether it's going to be US Army or USMC...when what I would really like, just for a change, is a game which doesn't feature US forces at all.

I know it's hard to believe, but there are one or two other countries in the world with sizeable and capable modern military forces

[Benoist 0]

I would like a game a more real setting. What the hell is doing the USA in Chernarus anyway?

A setting where the Czech Republic is invided by enemy (Russian if you want the normal BI setting) and the Germans come to the rescue, or france. But not the US, it's not something personal, but you are in other side of globe.

But, now that I read what I wrote Germany liberating Czech Republic it's a bit ironic.

Alos, I would like the russians to be the "good" guys.

[jakerod 254]

I would like a game a more real setting. What the hell is doing the USA in Chernarus anyway?

A setting where the Czech Republic is invided by enemy (Russian if you want the normal BI setting) and the Germans come to the rescue, or france. But not the US, it's not something personal, but you are in other side of globe.

But, now that I read what I wrote Germany liberating Czech Republic it's a bit ironic.

Alos, I would like the russians to be the "good" guys.

Other Places the U.S. is on the other side of the world from:

Iraq

Afghanistan

Korea

Germany

Japan

Historical Examples

Europe

Africa

Vietnam

Korea

Japan

Phillipines

I wouldn't mind it being the Germans, French, Brits, Dutch or most other countries coming to the rescue. How do you know that Russia is not the good guys?

[eble 3]

I'd guess as much if you were russian, you would assume 'you' are the good guys.

Unfortunately to sell a game in a major way we have to have yanks on the front, be it, the airforce, army, marine etc.

I wouldn't worry about whether it's based on the army or marines anyway, arma addons are forward compatible so we will have heaps of addons ready or almost ready on day one.

We all know BI give us the base game and the community makes it a more well rounded/balanced and a living game.

sorry couldn't help myself:

Other Places the U.S. is on the other side of the world from:

I'll use a soccer analogy:

Quote[/b] ]

Afghanistan   1 - nil to the US and Friends deep in the first half - most likey extra time will be required.

Korea - 1 all draw -  US and friends

Germany - came on as a late substitute and stole the winning goal from the russians

Japan - again late to the party but did most of the work won 2 - 1

Iraq - 3 nil to the US - only after the match realised they played the wrong team in the wrong country.

Southy

[DWillyEfect 0]

Might be because they already have a bunch of artwork and assets. The "Team Razor" seems way corny though .

Why not make them the navy seals instead? More believable..

I bet Sony owns the rights to the Seals with their SOCOM series of games

[baddo 0]

I find it rather ironic that everybody here is agonising over whether it's going to be US Army or USMC...when what I would really like, just for a change, is a game which doesn't feature US forces at all.

*claps hands*

Yes!

But I think it doesn't matter anymore for this game. Surely they aren't going to change it at the point of development they are in now with ArmA2.

But I hope they could have the courage in the future to try some other country than the USA in a military game such as ArmA/ArmA2.

One option would be to have the USA normally in the game like they are now. And then have another campaign with a completely different setting, which would not have USA at all.

They could target the advertizing of the game. In USA the USA campaign would be emphasized. Let's say the other campaign is Germany against something. So in Germany they could advertize the German campaign and leave the USA campaign for much less attention. People would be told it is there but it would not be the main selling point for Germans. And vice versa for the Americans regarding their version.

Yes it would be more work to create two about as big campaigns and all artwork needed. But it is something BIS could take into consideration. They have to be aware of the fact that there are a lot of people in the World who are bored of seeing the USA in almost every wargame and always as the good guys.

[savedbygrace 2]

The U.S has allied countries across the globe and are pretty much involved in many conflicts wether directly or indirectly. So their presence seems practical. But I agree that a combined arms campaign with other countries would be great to play through. To see special forces from various countries cooperating with their regular armies would be a great immersive and creative storyline as they fight against the common enemy that is tearing this world apart(terrorists, with no specific nationality). I loved the BWMOD, Swiss mod Frenchpoint mods and others in OFP as they provided infantry with accompanying armor and transports that were specific to their countries. This however should not be the focus of BIS. Let them develop the engine, perfect the AI, animations, and other details that are needed to pour a solid foundation that the community can work from. Then, if it is as good as OFP was, the following and dedication to invest in it will be even greater. We the community are greater contributors when the cause is worthy. Everything hinges on the core build of AA2 and what BIS decides will be a decent release of material.