BIS, Please Read This

[Nutty_101 0]

It does that to a small degree. The other problem is that you can see anyone's CDID in the game buy just connecting to the server. They should remove that to the clients. No need for a client to obtain that information.

It's nice to be able to record player ID's for banning purposes. Makes it a lot easier than scrolling up on the server console (which is not always possible, especially on rented servers). It's also a simple way to verify identity. Sure, ID's can be changed fairly easily by anyone with a little knowhow. It remains a method for filtering out amateurs (which are the majority of malicious users).

Yeah, but any client that connects gets that information within the first 200 or so packets of information. The problem is that anyone can have that and they are using a tool to reverse that key into their system. Then they run off and get people banned from the servers when in reality it's not that users fault. So to be honest your not banning anyone. Plus i have been watching the Beer server lately cause it holds the most players and there are quite a few people who cheat on that one. Daily i cannot tell you how many keys i have seen that just don't look like they are real. I saw one user connect with a 66**66 key then that exact name came later with some 477xxx number. Had to be the same person as their face file was from the same location. People are also using the tank shells to kill people in the game with or the harrier bombs to level city's. The one i have seen is where they create an object then add shells to it, then use set damage to set them off thru a create vehicle init line. I am trying to decipher the locality on the packets but either i am starting to get close or i am just fooling myself.

I have also noticed on evo servers people are screwing with the publicvariables. It will come down with one thing and a few moments later i have seen people jump up in rank via the publicvariable. I am guessing to defeat that there will have to be some sort of check on it. Who knows.

I am hoping to get further this weekend on figuring it out as i have been putting it into some things i am working on. That way we can have some control over our servers to block this. The only down side is that MP map makers will need to do some work to create everything from the server. Nothing on the client's side. It can be done, i do it. Just takes some work to really think about security of your missions and the server.

[Dwarden 1125]

even if you remove that option for clients to see CDID then what prevents 'bad guy' to run own server ...

wrong way of thinking ...

also if you implement any UID system You need ensure it can't be easily abused, faked or tricked ...

unlike ... actual situation ...

[=jps=sgtrock 4]

BTW, I'd appreciate it if someone who is in a position to do so PLEASE file a bug report covering the case reported by Nutty_101 in this thread.

TIA.

Already done :

http://bugs.armed-assault.net/view.php?id=2700

BTW you ARE in a position to do so also, it's not "certain special people" that can submit bug reports or change requests.

I understand that. The issue for me is that I didn't have any logs because I'm still waiting for the Linux binary to come out.

[ggxjimmy 0]

as its so easy to make cheats, why not make a seperate program, just like TKC's program that detects bombs spawned and stops them instantly. this only needs to be run on the server PC.

if anyone has skills in C++/VB. whatever these boring fools use to make the cheats PM me. im interested in the idea and know someone who could maybe make the program for me

call there bluff and use the same technology there using....

im bored spamming #userlist every time a players connects and then reading a god damn note pad i have with all these ID's

get it sorted BIS. join STEAM or punkbuster. dont make something yourself. why reinvent the wheel when its been made already and with better metal....money i bet..all about the money...

[=jps=sgtrock 4]

Heck, just being able to have access to something simple like id's sv_pure variable would be a nice start.

[Nutty_101 0]

as its so easy to make cheats, why not make a seperate program, just like TKC's program that detects bombs spawned and stops them instantly. this only needs to be run on the server PC.

if anyone has skills in C++/VB. whatever these boring fools use to make the cheats PM me. im interested in the idea and know someone who could maybe make the program for me

call there bluff and use the same technology there using....

im bored spamming #userlist every time a players connects and then reading a god damn note pad i have with all these ID's

get it sorted BIS. join STEAM or punkbuster. dont make something yourself. why reinvent the wheel when its been made already and with better metal....money i bet..all about the money...

That's what i am working on now. Not sure the impact but i am just making a program that will block the createvehicle command. Thats what they use to spawn things anyway. If anyone knows other commands i should be watching for let me know. As i was saying though it will only work on the server and nothing else. So map makers will have to ensure they work on the server for all things being created. You can do it easy, i do it.

[afforever 0]

hm, what impact would block createvehicles will have on maps like Evolution, where you get respawn of vehicles?

[Nutty_101 0]

hm, what impact would block createvehicles will have on maps like Evolution, where you get respawn of vehicles?

None, if they are created on the server. Not the client. The client is where they are creating the items to destroy and cheat. So if we block out that information then we can stop some of the cheats. Don't know how much it will work with evo. If they create something on the client side then your mission will break and the clients will desync.

[maddogx 13]

We can't just have the server block every bomb that is created on the client side, because not all client-created bombs are illegitimate. For example when a player is flying a harrier and drops a bomb, it is created client-side too. Basically any server-side anti-cheat script would have to compare all client activity to the actual mission scripts and decide whether the player could have legitimately created any munitions, or whether they were created by an illegitimate third party script.

Even if that was possible (which I doubt), it's not the solution we want. The cheaters should not have the possibility of creating random bombs in the first place, but sadly the way ArmA works gives anyone with a bit of scripting experience almost limitless possibilities. Once the mod signing tools are out, I hope it will put a stop to those kind of hacks.

[Guest]

A programm which watches all actions by every user would need a huge amount of server power like checking the reload time of weapons like AT, compare impactdamage etc...I think...

[ggxjimmy 0]

i could live without noobs droping bombs in bezerk from planes anyways. who really cares if one plane doesnt work. people would soon learn.

as for server load. the program need only scan the most annoying aspects of the cheat pack. bomb dropping and TK is the main ones. next thing they will just spawn thousands of gubas like they used to.....so boring to recreate the same old rubbish. all we have to do is update as it goes along. i know the cheaters are up for a challenge they have nothing better to do anyways..

same thing in every game you play. glory hunters, people always pick the easiest team. cheating is one of the most simple things you can acheive on gaming. shame they dont apply there skills as they really are talented to anti cheating. where they would be really praised and hunted for the skills by good companies...maybe they are just kids with a little insight and dont have the depth required to make anticheats...bring it on...

[Tactician 0]

You will not be able to stop griefers with scripts. Anyone that can run arbitrary script commands locally (i.e. through a scripting console) has complete control over the gameplay and can defeat any mission editor's feeble attempts to stop him. Having a competent admin present is your best bet, unless the griefer actually has the admin-killing "powers" described in the first post.

Personally, I've never seen anyone do this kind of thing in ArmA. Stick to servers you trust.

[celery 8]

Not belonging in the current conversation, but is it possible without a cheat involved to pick up someone's weapon and that weapon having more bullets than the magazine should be able to carry? I recently played a game where I killed a player and his SAW had 201 bullets left.

[Nutty_101 0]

Once the mod signing tools are out, I hope it will put a stop to those kind of hacks.

The signature system has been broken, thus how they do it now. This is not going to be the answer. We need something that sits on the server side.

I dunno what else to do to help people out with this one. I am running out of ideas.

Also Maddog, can you add something to the anti cheat? It would be to catch people using the speed hack. Very simple check on the system to figure out if they are using it or not.

[maddogx 13]

Once the mod signing tools are out, I hope it will put a stop to those kind of hacks.

The signature system has been broken, thus how they do it now. This is not going to be the answer. We need something that sits on the server side.

I dunno what else to do to help people out with this one. I am running out of ideas.

Also Maddog, can you add something to the anti cheat? It would be to catch people using the speed hack. Very simple check on the system to figure out if they are using it or not.

I was doing some work on ArmAAC up until about a week ago, mostly trying to figure out why it affects join time so much (especially for evolution). I even sent Suma a PM about it but recieved no answer. Until I've figured that out, ArmAAC will probably cause more problems than it does good, so won't be adding any new features just yet. I know for a fact that the "real cheaters" can still move freely on ArmAAC protected servers. At the moment only people using basic config hacks can be stopped, but even the built in signature checks can do that much better.

It's still uncertain whether I'll be continuing work on ArmAAC beyond a final version that fixes the current problems, because there doesn't seem to be much point. ArmA is a great game, but the whole MP architecture simply wasn't designed with cheaters in mind, so they can basically do whatever they want with little effort. I find my interest drawn more toward the creative aspects of the game - i.e. mission and addon making. I've been talking with Sickboy about implementing my explosion FX into Six pack, which at the moment seems like a far more interesting project. After that I have a few ideas for some SP and perhaps MP missions.

I'm finding it increasingly unproductive to wage a kind of "cheat/anti-cheat war" against the cheating communy, because it's exactly what they want and they will always find ways to get around anti-cheat methods. Every game that is played online has its share of cheaters and ArmA, due to it's vulnerable multiplayer architecture, is probably the worst case, even though the cheating community is fairly small. Private multiplayer communities and the single player component will probably keep the game going in the long run, but unless BI make some serious changes to the net-code, I don't see much success for ArmA in the online multiplayer public.

Well, this answer turned into a rant, so I'll rest my case here.

[SWAT_BigBear 0]

We do appreciate all of your efforts MadDogX.

The cheats/ers have taken it's toll on many others than myself over the years, thus friendly coop games is all I will play. It's not just ArmA... it's a plaque everywhere.

[jtec 0]

I really think a new law needs to be passed through that will punish people who hack or cheat on games. Sounds harsh but when you dont get much time to play and some idiot ruins your free time then they should suffer for it not you and others on the server. Basically this is our spare time and we are using up parts of our life to get some enjoyment out of a product we have bought with hard earned money. These scum come along, ruin your game and then laugh at you. Really are saddo's!

[maddogx 13]

I really think a new law needs to be passed through that will punish people who hack or cheat on games.  Sounds harsh but when you dont get much time to play and some idiot ruins your free time then they should suffer for it not you and others on the server.  Basically this is our spare time and we are using up parts of our life to get some enjoyment out of a product we have bought with hard earned money.  These scum come along, ruin your game and then laugh at you.  Really are saddo's!

It would be hard to pass a law against something like cheating. It's a nice thought, but we won't be seeing anything like that because there are no grounds for it. And even if there was a law against it, those who cheat now wouldn't care anyway. Sharing copyrighted material on the internet is illegal and loads of people still do it.

The problem is the whole anonymity of the internet. People can act however they want without real repercussions, so everyone basically shows his true face. People who act disruptive in online games are doing it because they need to do it, not just because they want to. It's not really about "creating a new way of gaming" for them, like most antisocial communities claim - that's just the fassade. They are doing it because they either need other people to think they are extraordinarily skilled (competitive cheating) or because they want to destroy other people's fun in the game (disruptive cheating). In both cases it's a psychological disorder. The latter is the real problem for us right now because disruptive cheaters cannot be reasoned with. The more you get angry with them, the more fun they have. Most people find that hard to understand - and I don't blame them, because it's hard to imagine the mindset of someone who has such serious mental problems.

They're like the kids who kick down sand castles on the beach after other kids have spent hours building them up. No, scratch that - they most likely are the kids who kicked down sand castles. There's the same logic behind it: destroy what other people enjoy and make them angry.

[Nutty_101 0]

Gotta agree with ya maddog. I have noticed of late that there are fewer and fewer public servers left open along with fewer people playing it seems. I used to see at least two servers of 60 people now i am lucky to see 20 people on a server.

Maybe it will recover later on.

[Dwarden 1125]

i really wish some of what i posted half year before ArmA release was implemented ...

http://www.flashpoint1985.com/cgi-bin....t=51110

oh well ...

[sickboy 13]

i really wish some of what i posted half year before ArmA release was implemented ...

http://www.flashpoint1985.com/cgi-bin....t=51110

oh well ...

Im happy they didn't, otherwise the game was even more unfinished with even more bugs than it already had when it came out.

Let's see what BIS can do for us after the release of the Expansion etc.

[guyguy1 0]

we caught a cheater in our server and kicked/banned him, but he used the PlayerID program from tkc and got in and caused carnage again, so banning people doesn'twork

[Jack-UK 0]

@Guyguy, tried locking the server? just type #lock and as far as i know they cannot connect if the lock is on... just keep it locked for 5/10 minutes and the cheater will get bored of conect + auto kick and should feck off somewhere else. =)

[Backinthetxt 0]

If you all are so good at getting information on people, equip your server with netlimiter 2 pro, get the fuckers IP and ban him out using netlimiter. Create a rule for netlimiter not to allow him to connect to your server period and that will fix these noob ass hackers for the most part.

[1436 1]

Ok sorey to but in in 3 optins i see.

make a program that scans the Vitural servers memorey to detect Anomilys. that make sure no other script runs onley the ones in the mission. the game server files are in w:\c\Poseidon\lib\ in the "vitural object" so maby a tool that can view it thoes files

Make arma server "server side" onley. wont stop aimbot/d3d hack/unlimited ammo.

Make a Program based on sockets2 that will record ip's on players conected. old ofp use to record ips when a player conected via -netlog maby that can be used again. or any program that will record ips on port 2302 that can be used with a servers logfile

Why dont all you savy c++ vb guys fourm a Anti arma cheating group?

i know thare is a video of them in rl preching about "the way of the cheater" that shows thare faces hehe