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[GBee 0]

I definitely like what I see so far, though I do hope there will be a few more vehicles added - I definitely feel that the South should have a MBT, like the Patton.

I'd disagree about the south having a MBT, but they should have a couple more vehicles at least. Maybe a light tank/recon vehicle but non-US in origin - anything from the older UK lineup seems like a believable and interesting addition i.e. a spartan, scorpion, saxon, sabre

They should also have artillery and something like a static tow launcher. A couple of *old* model SAM batteries, wouldn't hurt the believability of the scenario - some second hand Russian equipment maybe.

Why non-US equipment you ask? Well few countries use stuff exclusively from one supplier. A back water country like Sahrani would buy whatever was on offer and a lot of it would be on the second hand market. They would also opt for the best value for money - an MBT is expensive and less effective in a defensive roll than buying a several static or man-portable AT weapons (inc AT mines etc).

[GBee 0]

I've just been reminded by a picture in another thread. The South could use their own ambulance too - on eof the various models based on the Land Rover Defender seems believable as they already have Defenders.

[Heatseeker 0]

I dislike the vehicle selection .

Why a cobra instead of an apache?

Why a AV8 instead of the A10?

M113's instead of Bradley's?

Vulcans? Arent these phased out?

mh/ah6 Littlebirds? Camels?? Zodiacs?

And then modern us soldiers with all new ACU cams?

Sure OPF had its inacuracies but not this much.. its like the vehicles were randomly chosen with complete disregard to realism.

I know they have been working hard on this but when we think BIS we think realism and/or simulation, not... Zoldner .

I also know someone is going to say:

"The comunity will make it more realistic!"

I dont take things for granted, addon creation takes alot of hard work and time and isnt always bug free or "consistent" with the game's content in terms of style and configuration.

This post might sound depretiative, im sure some will disagree and others just want the game today and will complain later... i've been waiting for the next BIS game for years, dont know if this will make any diference but i just had to let it out... again.

[Messiah 2]

the cobra and the harrier i assume is because they want to try and pass these guys off as marines.

the rest of the list is a little more bizarre, but who cares.

[martinovic 0]

Wow, i think the vehicle park and equipment in this game is total bullshit!

M113A3 is plausible a bit, but the Vulcan is completely unacceptable on the US side. They use M113s and ACU?! So the US army ships ACU to soldiers it is unwilling to supply with APCs better then that tin can m113? Why is there a stryker in there if no bradley? The US doesn't just send strykers everywhere, even if they want to see how it fares in a conventional field of battle like north sahrani, they would sure send in some bradleys.

No T-80 for the NS but a Ka-50? Yea right you can use the "it's just a game and needs some balance" argument but then why don't the northerners have some good tanks? They don't have Hinds either?! They have some old mi-17s but no hinds to accompany them? So the north just up and bought some really expensive KA-50s out of the blue without having any experience with attack helicopters?

Why are their soldiers wearing friggin interceptor bodyarmor?! Even if BIS concocts some story about the US shipping some interceptors to the NS (which is highly unlikely since they are commies), even then it should be a rarity and not be worn by every two bit communist conscript... aah nothing makes the least bit sense in this game.

[Messiah 2]

oh well... dont buy it then if BIS' equipment choice is so insulting to your senses

has anyone considered that BIS have to weight up conflicts of interest when it comes to what they make in Arma? If they were to create an all out Marines equipment game, with everything and anything the Marines use, where would that leave poor old BIA trying to sell VBS2 to the US Marines, who could just as well buy Armed Assault for a considerably smaller sum? (putting the the points about EULA and complete sims aside)

If you dont like the equipment, then learn O2 and do something about it... or go play BF2, which sports an oh so much more realistic equipment list and simulation

[martinovic 0]

oh well... dont buy it then if BIS' equipment choice is so insulting to your senses  

Ok, i won't.

[Messiah 2]

well, that was easy to resolve

[Commando84 0]

messiah you are todays thruth teller!

[CsonkaPityu 0]

You know, now that i've seen the vehiclepark i have to say BIS made some really bad choices...

The vulcan is just silly, makes the game arcadey - i was hoping that it would be on the resistance side, but no it's with the US military. In real life the vulcan simply isn't viable. How is it going to shoot down an attack helicopter that can fire a missle at it from 8 km? Same thing applies to the shilka... the US doesn't fear these weapon systems anymore... much less use them.

Even in flashpoint it was a huge stretch to have the vulcan put in...

ArmA isn't realistic, not with these choices in vehicles. Unless the vulcan and shilka are useless like IRL then it's ok to have them in the game i suppose, maybe the vulcans are some ancient leftovers the americans use because of the situation. I'd muchrather have them spend time on MT-LBs or some other actually used vehicles but meh.

I think BIS just went lazy and facelifted the older vehicles from Flashpoint... i'd scratch all the civilian vehicles for a hind, mt-lb, bradley or anything... seriously all the vehicles in ArmA are old flashpoint vehicles and this annoys me (two exceptions are the landrover and the harrier).

What's that Hokum doing there anyway...

Quote[/b] ]The KA-50 is a state-of-the-art and powerful battle helicopter which is in limited service with the Russian Air Force. This aircraft is not fielded. Only a handful of prototypes exist, and it has not yet been approved for full-scale production. There are two versions of the Hokum. The Ka-50 Hokum-A is a single seat close support helicopter and the Ka-52 Hokum-B two seat trainer and combat version.

http://www.fas.org/man/dod-101/sys/ac/row/ka-50.htm

[Jezz 0]

It's strange that the north has these brdm-2(normal/spandrel) varients but no gaskin, it would atleast nutralise america's air advantage a bit (harrier but no su-25). The choice of viehicles for both sides seems very randon and not well thought out

ps: anyone else noticed the t-72 has the wrong gun on the commanders position(DSHK instead of NSV)

[Balschoiw 0]

Quote[/b] ]Unless the vulcan and shilka are useless like IRL

Oh be careful, the Shilka has been used in as an effective weapon of house cleaning and is a feared weapon in infantry assaults. I´m not saying that they are still used for the initial purpose, but they have found a new role in infantery assaults.

Just my 2 cent

[zedderzulu 7]

Argh - personally I don't mind the vehicle selection just at the moment because I'm quite confident there's more we haven't seen yet. Maybe not oodles and oodles, perhaps just a handful, but I am still confident. Ish. But for the time being I'm not going to say "Where's the bloody Su25?" until I bring the game home out of the shops, or download it, then install it and find the option missing in the mission editor. And until then I'm just happy to get the bloody game.

But yeah, if it does all fall through vehicle wise, who's up for a TC or just mod where all the addon makers group together to make a single standard mod that has the US, Northern and Southern forces fleshed out the way we as a whole want them - and when I say "standard" it would be something that everybody would be in a position to want to download, so there is as few as chances of MP incompatability as possible.

I really do think the community would be able to pull this off together. We could have something ready in a matter of months and could be something we add to and improve for years to come. Though I hate to sound like I'm adding my voice to a scratched record but seriously - if we don't like what we see, BIS have given the oportunity to change almost anything we want - and add to it.

[Talyn 33]

For all we know BIS could be planning to release other vehicles along with patches like they did with Flashpoint.

[dm 9]

I have to agree with the general feeling of the last few pages of the thread.

Some choices are "good" others just dont make any sense.

On the U.S. side:

<span style='color:green'>Strykers, ACU soldiers, UH-60, 5Ton Trucks and Hummers - these fit together, the "new" Stryker Brigades operate all this equipment, and are likely to be deployed to such a scenario as Sahrani. Ok, the hummer models are "wrong" and have their issues, but in the bigger picture they "fit" (at least they aren't M151 MUTTs)</span>

<span style='color:red'>AH and MH-6. These really dont make any sense. Operated exclusively by the 160TH SOAR, they wouldn't be deployed with a "regular" unit like a Stryker Brigade.

M113 and M163. On the Resistance side, these would make sense. For the US they really wouldn't be part of a frontline deployment. As seen in Iraq, the M113's are only used by rear-echelon units. M2A1/2 Bradleys and M6 Linebackers (based on the Bradley) would make MUCH more sense here.

AH-1Z and AV-8B Harrier. Sahrani also makes sense as a USMC deployment. But in context with the other units either the AH-1Z needs to be an AH-64 and the Harrier an A-10 or the M113 needs to be AAVP7 the Stryker a LAV-25 and the UH-60's need to be UH-1N/Y or CH-46. Either making it a complete US Army or USMC deployment, not a mixture of the two.

The M1A1 also fits with the USMC deployment, as the US Army mainly uses the A2 model in frontline operations.

The M2 is suitable for either deployment, just not on that tripod.</span>

<span style='color:green'>The M119 105mm gun also suggests an Army deployment as the USMC uses the M101 or M198 howitzers.

The Boats would fit for either deployment.</span>

The East side makes more sense in the whole, but has some glaring issues

<span style='color:green'>MI-17 makes sense, used by a LOT of countries</span>

<span style='color:red'>KA-50... no way, MI-24 or something like a Puma/Cougar would make more sense.

The Shilka is a hard one to place - although it is no longer a "critical" threat to fast aircraft, it is still in widespread use, and poses a threat to helicopters (its all well and good being able to fire missiles at it from 8km, but if you dont know its there, it can still be leathal)

The Boat - as with the M2 "problem" in OFP, the Zodiac seems to have fallen into the "appears to be used by both sides" category

Mounted DShK - good, but not on that tripod unless its fitted with the AA kit.</span>

<span style='color:green'>BMP-2, BRDM, T-72 all make sense, however, the BMP-2 might be better as a BMP-1 or some Type XX Chinese "knock off" variant.

UAZ/Ural the wheeled vehicles are ok, widely used and make sense.

AGS-17(assumed) again, widely used, and on the right height tripod.

D-30(assumed) Artillery again "fits"</span>

And the resistance (for the 4 vehicles they have) is fine.

Terrible as this all seems, I'm just interested in the engine. All these content issues can (and will) be fixed. Would just be nice if it was right from the start.

[Average Joe 0]

Im going to assume these are Old pics, Or maybe BIS thought it was fun to put vehicle names in a hat?.

I agree with you folks tis abit random.

Good Post DeadMeat.

[deanosbeano 0]

Quote[/b] ]Terrible as this all seems, I'm just interested in the engine. All these content issues can (and will) be fixed. Would just be nice if it was right from the start.

could not have put it better myself.

[GBee 0]

BIS have already said they have a believable reason for including both Army and USMC units.

Personally I imagine it's something like this - The army are there to train the South Sahrani army. When attacked they are reinforced by the USMC as they can be deployed to the area faster than the Army. This makes more sense than Army reinforcements would in the same situation, after all we're talking about an island in the Atlantic.

For this reason I don't see the mix of Army/USMC units as being wrong in any way. Unless in-game they are operated by the wrong branch ...

The M113 & variants - I think they get that one wrong, but have also realised their mistake. They recently re-skinned it for the South Sahrani Army which is a good move and it may be that the US skinned versions are only being left in the game because it was better than throwing them away. I expect you will only see these as South Sahrani units in the campaign.

[dm 9]

BIS have already said they have a believable reason for including both Army and USMC units.

They did/do? Must have missed that one then

[Daniel 0]

That's all well and good for the campaign, but for other missions we still won't have either a full US Army or USMC contingent.

Meh, roll on ArmA release in England.

[GBee 0]

BIS have already said they have a believable reason for including both Army and USMC units.

They did/do? Must have missed that one then

It was covered in one of the recent interviews - just don't ask which one, there have been too many. Someone can probably remember and come up with the exact quote.

[kernriver 4]

Those arty pics that Chipper posted are just great! Especially the second one (east), D-30 howitzer. I served on one when i was in the army, so i'm quite familiar with it. I can't wait to see how operating it is simulated, if at all...if it's good, i'll spend a lot of time on Northern Sahrani side

[chipper 0]

I think BIS needs a real military advisor. They might have one but, Marek's buddy who was in the Czech Army isn't good enough....

[brataccas 0]

finally a pic of a TRACTOR!!!

[sanctuary 19]

Personnally, i am more disapointed by the amount of different vehicles i see in the equipment menu, doesn't OFP feature more than that already ? I was expecting a lot more.

I just hope this equipment listing is far from being complete.