Hostages taken in khobar

[MLF 0]

Booby trap or not doesn't change a thing about roping down when the pilot doesn't have the skill to get low quickly.  You are either checking for traps or you are jumping/roping down.  They were going in trap or no trap.

so he has no skill the pilot eh but was able to hold a hover over the building at 4-5 foot above the roof top with the back end lower then the front? He did get down quickly.

Maybe they favour jumping because they could see if there where traps in palce on the roof instead of just roping in blind, i was suggesting the jumped in because it was the safer of the two options.

[MLF 0]

Victims of the Saudi Attack

One American

One Briton

One South African

One Swede

Eight Indians

One Italian

Two Sri Lankans

Three Saudis

Three Filipinos

One Egyptian

Source BBC

[Pathy 0]

How tastless would it be if i made a joke about at least it being multicultural?

Meh, those Chinook pilots were pretty good i'd say....better than OFP pilot AI anyway......

[theavonlady 2]

How tastless would it be if i made a joke about at least it being multicultural?

They intended it to be multicultural - their culture and everyone elses - and it's no joke:

Quote[/b] ]Gunmen hunted "infidel" Westerners

Sun 30 May, 2004 11:30

By Samia Nakhoul

KHOBAR, Saudi Arabia (Reuters) - "Are you Muslim or Christian? We don't want to kill Muslims. Show us where the Americans and Westerners live," Islamic militants told an Arab after launching a shooting spree on Westerners in Saudi Arabia.

The four gunmen, aged 18 to 25 and wearing military vests, grabbed Abu Hashem, an Iraqi with a U.S. passport, in front of his home in the Oasis compound in Khobar but let him go when he told them he was a Muslim.

"Don't be afraid. We won't kill Muslims even if you are an American," he quoted them as saying.

The Oasis compound, where suspected al Qaeda militants held about 50 foreigners hostage, was the last target in a rampage that struck oil firms and residential compounds in the oil city of Khobar where at least 17 people were killed on Saturday.

Saudi commandos rescued most of the hostages on Sunday after storming the building where the militants had seized them.

Some of the hostages, mostly Westerners, were taken to hospital and others to hotels but most were too shaken to speak to journalists. There were reports that the gunmen had killed several hostages, but details were unclear.

Some of the foreign residents interviewed said they wanted to leave the oil-rich Gulf state which has waged a year-long campaign against militants loyal to Osama bin Laden's al Qaeda.

Abu Hashem, the director of a Saudi firm who has been in Khobar for six months, said he wanted to move to Bahrain.

He said the four gunmen had been polite and calm.

"They gave me a lecture on Islam and said they were defending their country and ridding it of infidels," he told Reuters at Qusaibi hotel.

"The gunmen were so polite. I cannot comprehend this politeness they showed me because I am a Muslim and this cruelty to others," said Abu Hashem, who declined to give his first name.

He said that while talking to the gunmen he saw the bloodied body of a Swedish cook who worked in the compound. He had been shot dead.

An American, a Briton, an Egyptian, two Filipinos, an Indian, a Pakistani and nine Saudis, mostly security men, were also killed on Saturday, security sources said.

"JIHAD AGAINST INFIDELS"

A purported al Qaeda statement claimed responsibility for the attack. The group has repeatedly vowed to rid the Arabian peninsula of "infidels".

Lebanese Abdulsalam Hakawti, a 38-year-old financial director, was at home with his wife and two-year-old son when he heard someone storm through the door of his villa in the Oasis complex. They ran upstairs with one militant in hot pursuit.

"Asalam Alaykum," Hakawati said he told the militant using the traditional Muslim greeting.

"(The gunman) told me 'Our jihad is not against Muslims but against Americans and Westerners' and asked me to show him which villas had Americans and Westerners."

Hakawati, who escaped last year's deadly suicide bombing on a housing compound in the capital Riyadh, said he told the young bearded gunman, dressed in a T-shirt and navy trousers, that he had only been in Khobar for three days.

There have a string of attacks in Saudi Arabia in the past year, including suicide bombings and shootings.

"These militants have robbed us of any feeling of security," said Abu Yasser, a 42-year-old Jordanian whose Oasis villa became a refuge for several terrified neighbours.

"This is home, I have been living in this country for 40 years and I would not leave. The country has changed but I won't leave, all my family is here," he said.

[MLF 0]

yea they were asking for ppl's ID's because it states there religion on them

[drewb99 0]

Ethnic cleansing is never a fun thing

[Billabong81 0]

I heard the terrorist even killed some kids o ntheir way home from school. That is just disgusting. Hopefully this will open some of the politicans eyes. Al Quada (spelled correctly?) needs to be stopped. Hopefully we will catch more of their main men soon .

[Baron Hurlothrumbo IIX 0]

Don't be ridiculous, religion is *never* a cause of evil

[bn880 5]

Booby trap or not doesn't change a thing about roping down when the pilot doesn't have the skill to get low quickly. You are either checking for traps or you are jumping/roping down. They were going in trap or no trap.

so he has no skill the pilot eh but was able to hold a hover over the building at 4-5 foot above the roof top with the back end lower then the front? He did get down quickly.

Maybe they favour jumping because they could see if there where traps in palce on the roof instead of just roping in blind, i was suggesting the jumped in because it was the safer of the two options.

I did not say no skill, he flies a helicopter well, especially for a Chinook. Anyway, no, piss poor insertion, innocent people were being executed inside, and it really didn't matter ot them if one rescuer got blown appart by a grenade or pipebomb did it...

like I said, there are many htings we may not know about which made the operation better than that roof drop off by the Chinook, but if _that_ was it, then pray hostages in Saudi Arabia.

[theavonlady 2]

What's going on?

Quote[/b] ]Saudi security forces ‘allowed the killers to escape’

WILLIAM TINNING and DONNA ABU-NASR in Khobar June 01 2004

SAUDI authorities struck a deal with al Qaeda hostage-takers which led to three of them escaping, it was claimed yesterday.

Checkpoints set up across Saudi Arabia also failed to trace three Islamic militants who went on the run following Saturday's attacks in the eastern oil city of al Khobar.

The allegation of collusion involving Saudi Arabian security forces emerged amid fears that the latest terrorist outrage in the country may have a knock-on effect on the global economy by sparking further rises in oil prices.

...............................................

[bn880 5]

I don't know what exactly is going on, but many hostage takers (apparently most) escaped and 22 people were killed, sounds a lot like a crummy rescue operation. Or what a deal, hmm, nice place to live in.

[SpongeBob 0]

This is like the TV series G.I Joe, where every episode the bad guys (Cobra) attack something, the good guys (GI Joe) counter attack, capture a bunch of Cobra's foot soldiers, but the leaders always manage to get away (all piled in the last trouble bubble or whatnot), and the good guys just stand around watching the bad guys get away, saying something like "let them go, they won't bother us anymore, if they do, we'll be ready for them. YO JOE!"

[theavonlady 2]

This is like the TV series G.I Joe

More like Keystone SpecOps.

[MLF 0]

i doubt anyone could have done anything about the 20 dead, but getting paid to let em go seems a bit

[ran 0]

i doubt anyone could have done anything about the 20 dead, but getting paid to let em go seems a bit

there's always something that can be done to prevent the hostage takers to take any more lives ... and there are allways 30 bullets in your magazine and buddies down the street to prevent the baddies from escaping.

All this somewhat reinforces my opinion toward middle-eastern HRT and security services.

[hellfish6 7]

All this somewhat reinforces my opinion toward middle-eastern HRT and security services.

I wouldn't want them rescuing or defending me.

[theavonlady 2]

Two out of the 3 escapees killed by SA forces:

Militants Allegedly Linked to Khobar Attack Killed

But all is not quiet in the land of Saud:

U.S. Military Attacked in Saudi Capital

Quote[/b] ]The attack on the Americans came just days after gunmen opened fire and took several hostages in a raid on a compound in the eastern oil city of Khobar. Twenty-two people, mostly foreigners working in the oil industry, were killed in that raid, which ended after commandos raided the compound. One gunman was wounded and arrested; three others escaped.

A brief U.S. Embassy statement said shots were fired Wednesday morning on two vehicles carrying U.S. military personnel near a Saudi National Guard compound where a U.S. training unit is based.

The convoy returned immediately to the compound. The statement said a driver, whose nationality was not given, was slightly injured. It was not clear if the driver was shot.

"Saudi Arabian authorities are investigating the incident," the statement said.

Saudi security officials had said earlier that no one was injured in the shooting. The conflicting reports could not be immediately reconciled.

BTW, anyone know what happened to AceCombat?

Is he American and his family packed up and left?

Or did something terrible happen to him? For example, was he banned by Placebo?

[Placebo 29]

Or did something terrible happen to him? For example, was he banned by Placebo?

I was wondering the same thing the other day, well not the part about Placebo banning him, I'm sure he would never do anything mean like that

[shinRaiden 0]

The Scotsman

The Herald

The Age - AU

Reuters

Deepikaglobal.com

First slow insertions, now leaky perimeters?

-- edit --

point of clarification: the official spin is that the terrorists said that they had the hotel and an industrial compound wired to blow, and that they'd set it off and kill the rest of the hostages if they weren't let out. Intial demands for safe passage were initially denied, but later relented on the prospects of a major facility being blown up.

[drow 0]

explain to me how two "militants" escape from "approx. 40 commandos"

some commandos

[aviel 0]

ahhh stupid special saudian forces!!!!. 5 hostage keepers escaped!!! AND 20 HOSTAGES DIED!!!

[Baphomet 0]

This just makes me mad. Sick piles of crap. This had better not happen where I live.

Furthermore. I don't know how someone can say something like: "religion is never a cause of evil". Religion is created by human beings. Human beings commit vile acts on it's behalf. As evidenced in this case. That's enough of a correlation for me to assert that, yes. Religion causes more tension than it tends to allay.

Where's this "reuters TV section". I know posting direct links is taboo because of the apparent content, however I'd like a nudge in the right direction?

I want to see the full insertion.

[FSPilot 0]

Furthermore. I don't know how someone can say something like: "religion is never a cause of evil". Religion is created by human beings. Human beings commit vile acts on it's behalf. As evidenced in this case. That's enough of a correlation for me to assert that, yes. Religion causes more tension than it tends to allay.

Humans, not religion, cause evil.  You can't blame an entire establishment because a few radicals misinterpret the doctrine and take it to the extreme.

Ooh, and about the helicopter: I doubt jumping out of a hovering helo is something a lot of people would do quickly, especially when the thing is wobbling like a see-saw (either due to the pilot or the sudden loss from weight of people jumping out). It looks like one of the last guys almost broke his leg too.

[Jinef 2]

Well, the CH-46 is a utility helicopter, not an assault helicopter.

The pilots did marvelously well considering what a fucking shitty assignment they got. I think actually the CH46 has overhead throttle like the Sea King - the co pilot would be on the throttles and the pilot the collective, cyclic and anti torque. The coordination needed between the crew to get that big bastard to that position that quickly without crashing and whithout killing their cargo - bloody job well done. We fly sea kings that are much more manouverable and honestly - for a straight in landing with no circuit - fucking incredible.

As for the special forces, well they certainly lost the element of suprise when the hostage takers heard two gas turbines and rotor wash 30 feet over their head.

This is an example of a hasty decision to assault without too much consideration of how bad tactically a move it is.

[miles teg 1]

This just makes me mad. Sick piles of crap. This had better not happen where I live.

Furthermore. I don't know how someone can say something like: "religion is never a cause of evil". Religion is created by human beings. Human beings commit vile acts on it's behalf. As evidenced in this case. That's enough of a correlation for me to assert that, yes. Religion causes more tension than it tends to allay.

Where's this "reuters TV section". I know posting direct links is taboo because of the apparent content, however I'd like a nudge in the right direction?

I want to see the full insertion.

I can see how you can make that corellation between violence and religion.   However, the sad fact is that even without religion, humans will just replace religion with ideology and kill each other over political ideologies.  

In essence, human beings have many different belief systems and some people will violently attack the belief systems of others or violently defend their own belief systems if they come under attack or threaten their tribe, church, secular organization's, or nation's belief system.

How many millions died during the Cold War all over the world in the horrific proxy wars in Latin America, SE Asia, and Africa?

That kinda puts things in perspective.

As for the Saudi commando assault, I agree that the helo landing on the roof was pretty damn spectacular for a helicopter that big. It perhaps was not the brightest move to go in and assault the place without first attempting more negotiations but then again, that would have given the terrorists more time to secure their defensive positions and create more booby traps.

The worst thing however was the fact that with ALL THOSE TROOPS surrounding the building, that some of the terrorists escaped. That is just mindblowing that any could have escaped without inside help.

Chris G.

aka-Miles Teg<GD>