Jets DLC Official Feedback

[nodunit 397]

Hahah, brilliant, gotta love those "Doh!"moments.  
No worries it happens to us all :), just glad there was a solution. 

[TheRealSaOk 4]

The new planes seem very nice, but again why there is only one mission and its again some uninteresting showcase? Again official mission content that is using 0,1% of the editor potential. You cant ignore how it directly affects sales. Why would normal players buy a DLC that basically have nothing "out of the box" to play.

 

Its a big shame to look how off you can work on the game serie. OFP had increadible campaigns, ArmA1 had very good one, ArmA2 near excelent (until buggy warfare missions in SP). I guess the ArmA3 campaign was good (only played the first episode), but the DLC mission content have been dissaster poor. Where is proper Warfare and Evolution in MP and creative mission content in SP. ArmA2 hype still showed BIS were much into having dynamic mission consept and its very possible and easy task to do. But somehow official  mission content is holding game much back.

SaOk

Edited June 9, 2017 by R0adki11
removed flame-baiting comments

[Wiki 1558]

 

57 minutes ago, TheRealSaOk said:

The new planes seem very nice, but again why there is only one mission and its again some uninteresting showcase? Again official mission content that is using 0,1% of the editor potential. You cant ignore how it directly affects sales. Why would normal players buy a DLC that basically have nothing "out of the box" to play.

 

Its a big shame to look how off you can work on the game serie. OFP had increadible campaigns, ArmA1 had very good one, ArmA2 near excelent (until buggy warfare missions in SP). I guess the ArmA3 campaign was good (only played the first episode), but the DLC mission content have been dissaster poor. Where is proper Warfare and Evolution in MP and creative mission content in SP. ArmA2 hype still showed BIS were much into having dynamic mission consept and its very possible and easy task to do. But somehow official  mission content is holding game much back. I could help any day, but instead getting blocked away. Spanel should really look into what is going on.

SaOk

 

I can agree here.

Some usermade missions are much better than the official showcase.

The VTOL showcase is nice though, but the jet showcase, not that much.

 

This one is much better IMHO

[AV8R_Six 110]

I am still getting feedback from teammates that the F/A-181 Black Wasp II Gun is ineffective against ground troops and vehicles.  It's confirmed splashes in close proximity with no damage to the AI.  Anyone else noticing anything NERF with this aircraft?

[iratus 71]

2 hours ago, AV8R_Six said:

I am still getting feedback from teammates that the F/A-181 Black Wasp II Gun is ineffective against ground troops and vehicles.  It's confirmed splashes in close proximity with no damage to the AI.  Anyone else noticing anything NERF with this aircraft?

 

It's a 20mm cannon right? Those are all kinda whimpy against vehicles and Infantry (especially well protected CSAT troops). The splash radius is kind of small and the direct hit damage leaves a lot to be desired. The Buzzards external twin-cannon and even the Blackfoots turret cannon have the same problems.

[AV8R_Six 110]

5 minutes ago, iratus said:

 

It's a 20mm cannon right? Those are all kinda whimpy against vehicles and Infantry (especially well protected CSAT troops). The splash radius is kind of small and the direct hit damage leaves a lot to be desired. The Buzzards external twin-cannon and even the Blackfoots turret cannon have the same problems.

Afirm...but even in the Buzzard, I get more kills with Guns then with the new NATO fighter. But the Buzzard has exploding rounds right?

[iratus 71]

2 minutes ago, AV8R_Six said:

Afirm...but even in the Buzzard, I get more kills with Guns then with the new NATO fighter.

 

Weaker than the Buzzards Gun? Wow!

[AV8R_Six 110]

@iratus

Yep, but this was on Wasteland and there may be AI power/strength considerations!

AV8R

[iratus 71]

1 hour ago, AV8R_Six said:

@iratus

Yep, but this was on Wasteland and there may be AI power/strength considerations!

AV8R

 

Ah, okey. So we should probably do some vanilla testing. Depending on my lazynes I might do some strafing runs today

 

Edit:

So I did some limited testing fooling around* in the editor. My findings are surprising to me:

• I found it generally easier to hit with the slower Buzzard.
• The Black Wasp's 20mm gun was more effective on Ifrits than with the Buzzard's Twin Cannons. I actually had the feeling of getting better hits at the Ifrits with the Buzzars, but they resulted in less damage.
• Damage vs. Infantry (I used CSAT VR Entities) was significantly better on the Buzzards Twin Cannons than on the 20mm Gun of the Black Wasp II. This could have to do with the slower approach and better hits however.
• All in all the Effects where somewhat weak, with the exception of the Buzzards Twin Cannon vs. Infantry.

 

 

Disclaimer: To 'test' this I actually flew attack runs on static and well visible Targets. The accuracy was therefor dependent on my crappy pilot skills. Shots on Target, engagement range and other factors where not verry consistent, the results of this thest are relatively inaccurate because of this. A more controlled testing environment would be necessary to get propperly compareable results. I decided to post my results anyways, maybe they are still of some value.

[AV8R_Six 110]

I noted the guns effects in Air to Air combat and thought that it might be do the the increased damage model and progressive accumulation damage before destruction.  My friends were reporting that air to ground straitening on troops in the open and light ground vehicles seem to have no effect, but I'll go back to them and tell them they are just bad shots!

AV

[iratus 71]

6 minutes ago, AV8R_Six said:

I noted the guns effects in Air to Air combat and thought that it might be do the the increased damage model and progressive accumulation damage before destruction.  My friends were reporting that air to ground straitening on troops in the open and light ground vehicles seem to have no effect, but I'll go back to them and tell them they are just bad shots!

AV

 

These are the same observations I made too. 20mm Cannons seem to be verry good at damaging/destroying planes and helicopters, but I had considerable problems when engaging ground targets. Infantry is hard to hit in combat situations because the 20mm ammo has a small effective explosion radius, so there is only a small area of effect. As for light vehicles: Those Ifrits I shot at in my tests actually took little damage even from the Black Wasps cannon. Some lost a wheel or two and two of them (engaged by the Black Wasp II) had their engine knocked out, but most of them would still be operable in some fashion. I had no crew in them, so I can't tell if they would have been taken out - but I doupt it.

A couple of months ago I tried to destroy a Zamak ammo truck with the Buzzard's 20mm twin cannon during a mission and had problems. We switched to other ammunition to make sure it's been destroyed.

I don't know how well 20mm ammo does IRL. Maybe it's realistic that it is not overly effective against MRAPs. But it feels somewhat weak, especially against targets such as trucks who are not armoured.

[HaseDesTodes 62]

i just ran few tests in the editor (not flying, 40m distance to rule out spread):

 

Spoiler

 

BW II vs Infantryman (indirect hits to a wall behind him, around 1m distance to wall): around 50 rounds to kill

BW II vs Strider (side, center of mass): 40-50 hits to destroy

BW II vs BTR-K (side, center of mass): around 250hits to destroy

 

Wipeout vs Infantryman (indirect hits to a wall behind him, around 1m distance to wall):1 burst (20 hits) to kill

Wipeout vs Strider (side, center of mass): 1 burst (20 hits) to destroy

Wipeout vs BTR-K (side, center of mass): 2 burst (40 hits) to destroy

 

Shrika vs Infantryman (indirect hits to a wall behind him, around 1m distance to wall): 3 rounds to kill

Shrika vs Strider (side, center of mass): ca. 30 hits to destroy

Shrika vs BTR-K (side, center of mass): around 130 hits to destroy

 

Neophron vs Infantryman (indirect hits to a wall behind him, around 1m distance to wall): 1 burst (10 hits) to kill

Neophron vs Strider (side, center of mass): 1 burst (10 hits) to destroy

Neophron vs BTR-K (side, center of mass): 3 burst (30 hits) to destroy

 

Buzzard vs Infantryman (indirect hits to a wall behind him, around 1m distance to wall): around 95 rounds(19 bursts)  to kill

Buzzard vs Strider (side, center of mass): 40-45 hits (9 bursts) to destroy

Buzzard vs BTR-K (side, center of mass): around 195 hits to destroy

 

Griphon vs Infantryman (indirect hits to a wall behind him, around 1m distance to wall): around 30 rounds  to kill

Griphon vs Strider (side, center of mass): 40-50 hits  to destroy

Griphon vs BTR-K (side, center of mass): around 210 hits to destroy

 

 

 

don't nail me on the exact numbers, especially for the infantry, as i always needed to adjust them to the jet cannon, but you can clearly see some things.

 

20mm twin cannon sucks against infantry, even though it looks like it uses HE ammo.

all 20mm cannons are not realy good against infantry, especially, due to the rate of fire and the limited ammo.

Neophron and Wipeout have the best cannons for air to ground combat, just as you would expect of CAS planes.

DLC jets have splash damage, even if it doesn't look like it.

[Sniperwolf572 758]

If you are rolling on the ground with some speed, and the throttle is at 0:

- The wheels on the Shikra don't rotate.
- The rear wheels on the Buzzard don't rotate, the front wheel starts to rotate really slowly.

[jerminhu 25]

I have a issue with landing VTOL vehicles and need some help.

 

VTOL vehicles will now instantly throttle up to 100% once the landing gears touch the ground. The second they are airborne, they would then instantly throttle down to 0%, falling straight down and blow up.

[AV8R_Six 110]

13 hours ago, jerminhu said:

I have a issue with landing VTOL vehicles and need some help.

 

VTOL vehicles will now instantly throttle up to 100% once the landing gears touch the ground. The second they are airborne, they would then instantly throttle down to 0%, falling straight down and blow up.

Is your throttle on Analog or Digital and are you in autohover mode or manual VTOL engaged?  Try them in each configuration but not both...i.e., disengage digital thrust and set analog up and down for the same axis.

[Tweestrijd 0]

On 2017-5-18 at 1:21 PM, Tweestrijd said:

First off i'd like to say i am loving the new content and all the improvements made.

 

I do have a few questions:

 

1) Is the 'throttle % indicator' in the UI ever coming to helicopters? I was very glad to see this indicator implemented for jets but i had been hoping it would also be used for helicopters, was it a deliberate move not to use it for helicopters or was this just an oversight? I fly helicopters a lot and i use a H.O.T.A.S setup, i think anyone who uses analogue throttle would greatly enjoy being able to see just how much throttle they are using at any given time. This wouldn't even mean changing the way throttle inputs are handled like the changes made to plane throttle where they are made 'analogue' even for keyboard users, the simple addition of the throttle % indicator in the UI would suffice. 

 

2) In the jets showcase there is mention of a function in one of the 'hints'. The third point in the 'Targeting camera' hint screen says: "To re-center camera to boresight or marked target press undefined".  I have looked at every single control input and i can't seem to find this function/keybind, is this an oversight? [Solved: Center look - under View controls.]

 

3) Is there a chance that the wheelbrakes for planes will be seperated from the 'decrease throttle' input just like they where for helicopters in AFM? It would make life a lot easier and operations more realistic if pilots would have control over their wheel brakes just like they do over their airbrakes.

4) Was the keybinding for collision lights left out intentionally or was this an oversight? I use collision lights extensively when flying nighttime operations with multiple vehicles and the option to switch the collision lights on/off without having to go back to my mouse and use the scroll menu would be a real improvement. Seeing as most everything is already bindable it seems odd to leave out the collision lights.

 

5) Is there a chance that the 'open/close ramp' action might also be added as a keybinding?

 

6) Is there a chance of control profiles being implemented, so that you can save and load your keybindings? I'm having to save the files from my user profile folders as backups for when my H.O.T.A.S. setup isn't recognized anymore (at random) and i have to rebind all my keys manually, which happens more than i would like.

 

Thanks in advance for any replies!

I think it's strange that I am not getting answers to these questions, I've tried pm'ing people and I've tried repeating them here but nothing seems to work.

These questions aren't that difficult to answer, are they?

[saul 24]

1) Is the 'throttle % indicator' in the UI ever coming to helicopters? Not likely.

 

3) Is there a chance that the wheelbrakes for planes will be separated from the 'decrease throttle' input just like they were for helicopters in AFM? Yes, they already have been. We have dedicated key for wheel/air brake, throttle is separate with new system

 

4) Was the keybinding for collision lights left out intentionally or was this an oversight? Can't comment/don't have such information.

 

5) Is there a chance that the 'open/close ramp' action might also be added as a keybinding? Can't comment/don't have such information.

 

6) Is there a chance of control profiles being implemented, so that you can save and load your keybindings? Most likely no but it's not a bad idea :D

[fn_Quiksilver 1636]

Praetorian turret is probably able to fire at targets too far away, compared to the others.

[POLPOX 778]

I found incorrect image (mirrored) for Shikra.

 

"a3\air_f_jets\plane_fighter_02\data\Numbers\Fighter_02_number_05_co.paa"

"a3\air_f_jets\plane_fighter_02\data\Numbers\Fighter_02_number_06_co.paa"

[Tweestrijd 0]

On 2017-6-17 at 8:00 AM, saul said:

1) Is the 'throttle % indicator' in the UI ever coming to helicopters? Not likely.

 

3) Is there a chance that the wheelbrakes for planes will be separated from the 'decrease throttle' input just like they were for helicopters in AFM? Yes, they already have been. We have dedicated key for wheel/air brake, throttle is separate with new system

 

4) Was the keybinding for collision lights left out intentionally or was this an oversight? Can't comment/don't have such information.

 

5) Is there a chance that the 'open/close ramp' action might also be added as a keybinding? Can't comment/don't have such information.

 

6) Is there a chance of control profiles being implemented, so that you can save and load your keybindings? Most likely no but it's not a bad idea :D

Thanks for the reply!

 

1) Why not? Would it be hard to implement or is there some other reason I'm not seeing? :)

 

3) Yes but the airbrake key doesn't apply wheelbrakes effectively. The ones I mean are the brakes that are applied when I put my throttle from 1% to 0% and my plane does a dramatic stop, this stop is far more abrupt than when just applying the airbrakes. These powerfull brakes are still bound to throttle and judging from the severity of the braking power they are similar to wheelbrakes, they feel exactly like the wheelbrakes on helicopters in AFM. I don't know if I'm explaining this correctly but i hope you understand what I mean, these brakes are very powerfull and not bound to the old or the new brake keys.

 

4 and 5) Do you know who might know more about these kinds of things? Me and a most people I know that fly with stick or hotas setups would really enjoy these simple things.

[lex__1 422]

The action of the left and right pedals makes the aircraft turn left and right.

But I noticed when turning to a large angle, accompanied by the appearance of a left or right tilt plane.
Is it just me, or does someone else get it?

 

[oukej 2911]

1 hour ago, lex__1 said:

The action of the left and right pedals makes the aircraft turn left and right.

 

But I noticed when turning to a large angle, accompanied by the appearance of a left or right tilt plane.
Is it just me, or does someone else get it?

This is a desired effect. IRL this is caused by lift differences between each wing introduced by their different AoA or area vs. stream when skidding.

[lex__1 422]

19 minutes ago, oukej said:

This is a desired effect. IRL this is caused by lift differences between each wing introduced by their different AoA or area vs. stream when skidding.

Yes. Thanks I got it.

I read, in this action compensation is necessary ailerons.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rudder

[Tweestrijd 0]

1 hour ago, lex__1 said:

The action of the left and right pedals makes the aircraft turn left and right.

But I noticed when turning to a large angle, accompanied by the appearance of a left or right tilt plane.
Is it just me, or does someone else get it?

 

That is how it works in real life!

[Aleft9 0]

Gentlemen, I know you've poured your heart and soul into this DLC. It took quite some time to create the models for the amazing airplanes, the Aircraft Carrier, and new flight crew models you provided to us, How ever, If you guys wouldn't mind, I would like to make a suggestion to add a free update to the Jet DLC Pack. So with how modern US aircraft Carriers work, there are of course fighter jets and helicopters that get launched every so often. But we also use the E-2 Hawkeye and C-2 Greyhound cargo airplane as well as an Electronic Warfare jet the EA-6B Prowler (Now being replaced by the EA-18G). Is it possible to flush out the Carrier Airplanes to include some form of these newer aircraft like a "futuristic" E-2 Hawkeye which provides a MASSIVE Radar boost to near by Friendly aircraft in the Area it's operating as well as maybe creating a new type of Electronic Jamming equipment that you can mount in the F-181 to allow it to JAM and disrupt enemy Radar and Radar locking weapons with in a set radius from the plane. Also maybe including a new Carrier Style Cargo UAV or just the new "futuristic E-2 with out the massive Radar dish" would be really cool for immersion for some players to "RP" out carrier flight deck operations. Also I would recommend adding Airplane towing tractors that allow us to reverse aircraft would be a huge thing as well. Towing tractors are a massive part of aircraft carriers because they allow the carrier to move airplanes into position on the catapult, move aircraft onto elevators, etc. Plus it's a pain in the butt to set up airplane rearming stations that work well on the carrier so having the towing tractors would be awesome!!! Also I noticed that the bomb cart that you guys demoed on the jets dlc trailer isn no where to be found in the asset editor so adding a couple of missile carts and bomb carts that we can move around would be great too (They act as mobile re-arming stations that players can move around and rearm aircraft with) One more quick point I would like to make, Maybe when you guys have the opportunity to do so, if you could add working elevator ramps to the Aircraft Carrier with more flushed out interior area's. That would be AWESOME. (Look to the FFAA mod or the Nimitz mod for more details on those ship interiors or take a tour of a real carrier and see what you guys can do.