Marksmen DLC Weapon Feedback

[roberthammer 582]

Feedback:

MK14. It looks amaizing but non of the scopes seem to look proper on the rail attachment on top. If you take the dms it olmost hovers above the rifle instead of being on the rail

Well yea that's the price for the short rail

[das attorney 858]

Is it just me, or are some of the weapons looking really oversized? The ASP-1s trigger guard is big enough to fit an average sized persons four fingers through. Or is that just because the weapons all have these massive calibers and look big because of the magazines or what?

They do look like they're scaled for orks or trolls in Shadowrun/other fantasy rpg.

[nkenny 1057]

Is it just me, or are some of the weapons looking really oversized? The ASP-1s trigger guard is big enough to fit an average sized persons four fingers through. Or is that just because the weapons all have these massive calibers and look big because of the magazines or what?

I agree. It seems like BIS is going down the Warhammer 40k Bolter path of futurism rather than the sleek, miniaturized, and tacti-cool we're commonly seeing today.

-k

[call_911 10]

Is the occasional HEX screen appearing for everyone? I get that an the random prompt to visit the store, also get a lockout popup when trying to use the Soflam. Yes I have the DLC Bundle. Yes I know it happend for the Heli DLC also just thought maybe BI had it sorted this time around.

[Brisse 78]

Is the occasional HEX screen appearing for everyone? I get that an the random prompt to visit the store, also get a lockout popup when trying to use the Soflam. Yes I have the DLC Bundle. Yes I know it happend for the Heli DLC also just thought maybe BI had it sorted this time around.

How many times does this need to be repeated? STEAM DOES NOT SUPPORT EARLY ACCESS TO DLC. Once it is officially released everything will be fine.

[petek 62]

Is it just me, or are some of the weapons looking really oversized? The ASP-1s trigger guard is big enough to fit an average sized persons four fingers through. Or is that just because the weapons all have these massive calibers and look big because of the magazines or what?

Agree - really do look like they should be scaled down a bit.

[probad 44]

The current ballistics are weird as hell, sometimes a shot seems to penetrate clean through one guy leaving him fine but kills the guy behind him. Headshots are unreliable even with large caliber weapons like the MAR10, sometimes people die to single legshots but survive 2 headshots.

EMR needs camo silencers, preferably a dedicated type distinct from the standard 7.62 silencer. Current 7.62 silencer also is misaligned to all barrels [low on the Mk18 and noticeably clipping on the EMR].

Maybe also match tones more closely, a "khaki" scopes is not even close to a "khaki" silencer. Same goes for backpacks though, there are some atrociously colored khakis [ex khaki assault pack iirc].

[TheMightyMooseKing 10]

I've played around with the new guns and gear for a few hours so far and I think there are a few things that should be balanced for realisms sake.

1. I think that the guns chambered in .338 and similar calibers should do more damage. .338LM is said to be one of the most effective anti personnel bullets in use today and a definitive step above .308(7.62x51) yet in game the guns chambered in these calibers don't really feel too different when compared to guns chambered in 7.62x51 or 7.62x54.

2. There seems to be some sort of texture issue with the black variant of the MAR-10, the weapon's details seem to be somewhat distorted.

3. Not directly gun related but I think that the new grenadier vest is somewhat overkill for regular use by grenadiers I think the new model should be used as a supplement to the new Special Carrier Rig and a new model similar to the regular Carrier Rig and Carrier Lite Rig should be created.

So far though the DLC really looks great and I'm definitely looking forward to seeing the bipods.

[CaptainAzimuth 714]

I've played around with the new guns and gear for a few hours so far and I think there are a few things that should be balanced for realisms sake.

1. I think that the guns chambered in .338 and similar calibers should do more damage. .338LM is said to be one of the most effective anti personnel bullets in use today and a definitive step above .308(7.62x51) yet in game the guns chambered in these calibers don't really feel too different when compared to guns chambered in 7.62x51 or 7.62x54.

2. There seems to be some sort of texture issue with the black variant of the MAR-10, the weapon's details seem to be somewhat distorted.

3. Not directly gun related but I think that the new grenadier vest is somewhat overkill for regular use by grenadiers I think the new model should be used as a supplement to the new Special Carrier Rig and a new model similar to the regular Carrier Rig and Carrier Lite Rig should be created.

So far though the DLC really looks great and I'm definitely looking forward to seeing the bipods.

I agree with most of these. I think they should introduce APDS/Other .338 rounds, or make the existing .338 more realistic. The round by default is Anti Material, and yet in the Arsenal, it takes around 2-3 shots to kill, when it should be one.

[gibonez 18]

I agree with most of these. I think they should introduce APDS/Other .338 rounds, or make the existing .338 more realistic. The round by default is Anti Material, and yet in the Arsenal, it takes around 2-3 shots to kill, when it should be one.

One can hope they just completely redo the damage system. Current one is no good imo.

[razor6014 35]

From what i found the 338 wont pierce heavy chest rigs .. yet will have so much impact force they would probably break a few ribs

so if you want to defeat heavy body armor you would need AP rounds ..

Edited March 11, 2015 by Razor6014

[twisted 128]

From what i found the 338 wont pierce heavy chest rigs .. yet will have so much impact force they would probably break a few ribs

so if you want to defeat heavy body armor you would need AP rounds ..

One thing I haven't heard of for this dlc is how weapon impacts will affect the things being hit especially characters. An impact like this should cause the Target to fall down instantly rather than twitch. Then if they are not damaged too much they can get back up. This includes players as well as ai.

[TheMightyMooseKing 10]

One thing I haven't heard of for this dlc is how weapon impacts will affect the things being hit especially characters. An impact like this should cause the Target to fall down instantly rather than twitch. Then if they are not damaged too much they can get back up. This includes players as well as ai.

I believe that this is similarly if not as important as the implementation of the bipods. I think that depending on the caliber and velocity a character should react with anything from flinching (pistols and 5.56) to falling down and getting injured(.338LM), of course body armour would play a huge role here.

[CaptainAzimuth 714]

I believe that this is similarly if not as important as the implementation of the bipods. I think that depending on the caliber and velocity a character should react with anything from flinching (pistols and 5.56) to falling down and getting injured(.338LM), of course body armour would play a huge role here.

They already have the ability to make a character fall down in game. They could use that feature, and connect it to high velocity rounds like .338 and above. If you survive a hit, you should fall sown given the force behind that round, it would jack you up. But it shouldn't take 3 rounds to kill someone with Lapua Magnum, vest or no vest. I've seen that stuff pierce through sheets of heavy steel.

[razor6014 35]

They already have the ability to make a character fall down in game. They could use that feature, and connect it to high velocity rounds like .338 and above. If you survive a hit, you should fall sown given the force behind that round, it would jack you up. But it shouldn't take 3 rounds to kill someone with Lapua Magnum, vest or no vest. I've seen that stuff pierce through sheets of heavy steel.

some examples :

Normal rounds do not go through steel plates,

now i don't mind taking 3 shots if the bullets are normal ball ammo and the target has the heaviest vests on them.

If they introduce AP rounds they should only be AP capable to 800 m anyway.

some aditional data :

http://i.imgur.com/NQODIuG.jpg (159 kB)

Note the energy values

Edited March 12, 2015 by Razor6014

[roberthammer 582]

Still the .338 in A3 is weak , it should have the same damage as .408 but with much less penetration

A3 7.62x51-  hit=12

A3 .338NM  - hit=14

A3 .338    - hit=16

A3 9.3x64  - hit=18

A3 12.7x54 - hit=20

A3 .408    - hit=24
-----------------------

A2 .338 (8.6x70) - hit=26

Edited March 12, 2015 by RobertHammer

[razor6014 35]

Still the .338 in A3 is weak , it should have the same damage as .408 but with much less penetration

A3 7.62x51-  hit=12

A3 .338NM  - hit=14

A3 .338    - hit=16

A3 9.3x64  - hit=18

A3 12.7x54 - hit=20

A3 .408    - hit=24
-----------------------

A2 .338 (8.6x70) - hit=26

Lets look at it like this ...

7.62 Nato |150 grn bullet | Energy at 500m : 976

.338 LM |300 grn bullet | Energy at 500m : 2715

.408 CT |419 grn bullet | Energy at 500m : 5639

energy is in ft/lbs

I'm sorry but there is no universe where the .338LM would deliver the same impact as .408

the value might be closer to - hit=18 same as 9.3x64 currently but nowhere near the .408

[roberthammer 582]

Lets look at it like this ...

7.62 Nato |150 grn bullet | Energy at 500m : 976

.338 LM |300 grn bullet | Energy at 500m : 2715

.408 CT |419 grn bullet | Energy at 500m : 5639

energy is in ft/lbs

I'm sorry but there is no universe where the .338LM would deliver the same impact as .408

the value might be closer to - hit=18 same as 9.3x64 currently but nowhere near the .408

If the .338 had 18 hit then it be should fine but the 9.3x64 isn't stronger than .338 and still has a higher hit damage

.338, 300grn bullet - 6,632 J

9.3x64mm, 293 grn bullet - 5,854 J

also .338 Norma Magnum is better than 9.3x64mm

Edited March 12, 2015 by RobertHammer

[Brisse 78]

I used Bakerman's Community Ballistics Calculator to calculate hit value for "Lapua Scenar GB488 VLD" which is a bullet used in the .338 Lapua Magnum cartridge. Guess what. The number "16" came out of it :)

[razor6014 35]

If that is the 250 grn bullet that would be somewhat correct in relation to the .408

the hit value should represent the energy value of the bullet

so lets look at the energy

7.62 | 500m : 972 | 1000m: 366 | 1500m: 230

.338 | 500m: 2715| 1000m: 1407| 1500m:785

.408 | 500m: 5639| 1000m: 3664 |1500m 2295

based on this even when you go for the lighter bullet which drops the energy value by about 74 ft/lbs

in hit value it is still to close to the 7.62 rather than smack in the middle of the two , not to mention it has about 3x more energy than the 7.62

[zimms 22]

At least you know Pettka is following your discussion closely. ;)

[CaptainAzimuth 714]

Well I can dig AP .338 a one shot kill then, given it's effective of up to 800 meters, this is actually how it was in Arma 2. I also believe that a regular .338 rifle should then be 2 hits to kill. You get hit once, given you survive, you'd have broken bones and probably in severe pain. Second shot though, should be enough. Your jacked up already and get another powerful punch, should either make you wish you were dead, or die all together.

Seeing as you all have explaind a lot, I would then like to Request the Addition of AP rounds for guns in the DLC that can support them. It would make sense, as a lot f people actually use AP .338, and it's hard not to considering the benefits.

[Brisse 78]

Well I can dig AP .338 a one shot kill then, given it's effective of up to 800 meters

Effective out to 800m? Are you kidding me? Did you know that the longest recorded sniper kill in history was made with the .338 Lapua Magnum? It was made in November 2009 by Corporal of Horse Craig Harrison at a range of 2 475 meters. He used a Accuracy International L115A3 chambered for the .338 Lapua Magnum.

One of the design criteria of the .338 Lapua Magnum was that it needed to penetrate commonly used military body armour out to at least 1000m.

7.62x51 NATO in a sniper rifle however is effective out to around 800m.

[razor6014 35]

Effective out to 800m? Are you kidding me? Did you know that the longest recorded sniper kill in history was made with the .338 Lapua Magnum? It was made in November 2009 by Corporal of Horse Craig Harrison at a range of 2 475 meters. He used a Accuracy International L115A3 chambered for the .338 Lapua Magnum.

One of the design criteria of the .338 Lapua Magnum was that it needed to penetrate commonly used military body armour out to at least 1000m.

7.62x51 NATO in a sniper rifle however is effective out to around 800m.

I am aware of that record .. im also aware that poor man probably was not wearing a chestrig

[gibonez 18]

I can't help but feel that all this arguing as to what the damage the rounds do would be solved if even something as simple as bleeding and injuries was added to Arma.

Get tagged in the chest by a .338 lm at 1500m , you arent instantly killed but are then bleeding profusely and your movement is severely hindered and the more you move and faster your heart pumps the faster you bleed out.