seba1976 98 Posted July 15, 2014 I fail to remember, was it there since OFP? Or was it introduced in Arma 1? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Sniperwolf572 758 Posted July 15, 2014 I fail to remember, was it there since OFP? Or was it introduced in Arma 1? Introduced in Arma 1. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
seba1976 98 Posted July 15, 2014 Introduced in Arma 1. Another Festivus miracle! :) Another thing to rethink BIS. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
fareast 20 Posted July 16, 2014 stamina not recovering under 100% load..even in prone position..is it intentional? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
St. Jimmy 272 Posted July 16, 2014 stamina not recovering under 100% load..even in prone position..is it intentional? I believe so. Drop something small and it recovers but the rate is veeery slow. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
MavericK96 0 Posted July 16, 2014 I wish they would call "hold breath key" the steady aim key" instead. Because it is correct that holding breath doesn't necessarily make your aim better. Hold breath key to me represents controlling your breathing, making sure to align the sights properly, concentrating, steadying you hands to the best of your ability etc. In real life I try to shoot after exhaling. I don't hold breath. The problem is, the in-game function actually is holding your breath. If you hold it too long and then let go, your aim goes all crazy as if you are winded. If it's truly changed to a "controlled breathing" key then the functionality needs to reflect that. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
msy 22 Posted July 16, 2014 AI is cheating again! I set them (3 ai) cycling the way with full speed then when they are tired I begin to attract them to fire at them then they find me from 250m away and quicklly kill me with 3 bullets! They even don't need to go prone! Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
nikiforos 450 Posted July 16, 2014 AI is cheating again! I set them (3 ai) cycling the way with full speed then when they are tired I begin to attract them to fire at them then they find me from 250m away and quicklly kill me with 3 bullets! They even don't need to go prone! This is the main problem for me. People will always ask for more realism but unfortunately this goes only for human players and not for AIs. So have fun with your realism now getting head shots before u catch your breath. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
seba1976 98 Posted July 16, 2014 I hate to say it, but I predicted this will happen. It doesn't make me happy. I'll quote myself now, just because I'm tire. The AI will have a field day now. One can hear their celebrations :). Take for example the difficulty to fire a rifle. If concessions (in detriment) of realism were not made, by the time you could effectibly shot your rifle towards the AI, you would have 20 shots coming your way. I'll believe in this, the day I'll see AI resting before attacking players. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
swazi 10 Posted July 16, 2014 I hate to say it, but I predicted this will happen. It doesn't make me happy. I'll quote myself now, just because I'm tire. Just imagine that AI manages to keep fatigue low, as should you (the human player), if you are the leader AI follows if you are combat ready they are, as it should be.... same for opfor AI running to attack you, they are combat ready as it should be, it would be wrong if they would engage winded... if they would follow the same rules, the result would be the same, they would be combat ready because that is the right thing to be... because they don't follow the same rules of fatigue, they are faster from A to B, but that's all, the moment you engage them there would be no differance, because they would take care to be combat ready, and fetigue system is not so heavy that a little sprinting from cover to cover to shoot has any drastic affect on you or potentially on AI... Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
-Coulum- 35 Posted July 17, 2014 Just imagine that AI manages to keep fatigue low, as should you (the human player), if you are the leader AI follows if you are combat ready they are, as it should be.... same for opfor AI running to attack you, they are combat ready as it should be, it would be wrong if they would engage winded... if they would follow the same rules, the result would be the same, they would be combat ready because that is the right thing to be... because they don't follow the same rules of fatigue, they are faster from A to B, but that's all, the moment you engage them there would be no differance, because they would take care to be combat ready, and fetigue system is not so heavy that a little sprinting from cover to cover to shoot has any drastic affect on you or potentially on AI... meh, no. Ai should be effected just as the player is. Maybe they should get a bit of handicap bonus because they are dumb as rocks, but If I, or the mission maker force a squad of ai to spring a kilometre they should not be engaging with the same efficiency as a Ai that has been camping. I am just unsure why people don't think BI will deliver on this in due time... Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
seba1976 98 Posted July 17, 2014 I am just unsure why people don't think BI will deliver on this in due time... Maybe because it's not in their public road map that anyone can check? Or because the last time they changed AI behaviour was in Arma 2 OA 1.60? Or because there's the rumor they don't have the people involved in AI behaviour development anymore? Or because they've given many signals to indicate they want to invest in the MP arena to not having to fix the AI dilemma, by getting rid of it? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Jona33 51 Posted July 17, 2014 For now it might just be best to set a timeout on each waypoint for 20 seconds or so, particularly if they've run a long way, then they can recover a bit before moving on. It's not ideal but it means they shouldn't run themselves into the ground. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
-Coulum- 35 Posted July 17, 2014 Maybe because it's not in their public road map that anyone can check? Or because the last time they changed AI behaviour was in Arma 2 OA 1.60? Or because there's the rumor they don't have the people involved in AI behaviour development anymore? Or because they've given many signals to indicate they want to invest in the MP arena to not having to fix the AI dilemma, by getting rid of it? hmm. I disagree. BI has invested in improving ai. You are right that they have not done so to their behaviour, but fatigue and wounds have nothing to do with behaviour. In fact BI has shown interested specifically in balancing ai skills and abilities with humans. Further more ai aim is already effected by wounds - just not nearly as much as it should be. Thus hopefully that is just a matter of tweaking. I don't think they are effected by fatigue, but, if BI could make wounds effect aim, I am sure they can also make fatigue effect aim. Of course if these things come it will be at BI's regular pace... But I am very confident that it will happen eventually. I guess we will see... Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
seba1976 98 Posted July 17, 2014 You are right that they have not done so to their behaviour, but fatigue and wounds have nothing to do with behaviour. In fact BI has shown interested specifically in balancing ai skills and abilities with humans. ... if BI could make wounds effect aim, I am sure they can also make fatigue effect aim. The AI behaviour is totally involved in the case of fatigue, because the AI should plan in advance to consider it. The restrictions BIS can stream line to the AI right now are going to be bad. The AI will not stop to consider fatigue, and BIS can only apply the effects on them. If behaviour is not involved, the AI will not plan for these changes as you would, and they will just be punished for it, which will render them useless. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
swazi 10 Posted July 17, 2014 (edited) meh, no. Ai should be effected just as the player is. Maybe they should get a bit of handicap bonus because they are dumb as rocks, but If I, or the mission maker force a squad of ai to spring a kilometre they should not be engaging with the same efficiency as a Ai that has been camping. I am just unsure why people don't think BI will deliver on this in due time... that is just my point, you shouldn't make AI run and get tired, you should make a mission so the ai is combat ready, or AI on it's own makes sure they are combat ready. and at the end you have the same situation, you against combat ready AI. now if you want to make a mission where you engage tired AI where they can't hit you, if that is what you want than put AI accuracy 0. edit: i'm for having rules true for all AI and human. but there are exceptions. in this case there is no need for AI fetigue, or that need is minimal. There is more chance that AI with fatigue would be even worse than it is now. having to calculate how tired are they and whatnot... in the end it's better this way... Edited July 17, 2014 by swazi Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Cormega 0 Posted July 17, 2014 For me, the slowmo running is tolerable to some point but after 50% fatigue and up it is completely awful. It is like bullet time. It feels so wrong and unnatural. Not to mention cheap. agreed, they have made the fatigue system worse imo. It sucks because I really want to like this game, but as it stands, I can't and don't recommended it to any of my friends. The fatigue and gun sight swaying is an absolute game killer. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
St. Jimmy 272 Posted July 17, 2014 Now that I've tested more myself the fatigue and weapon sway I got to say this is dam good :cool: Now that there isn't so much lateral sway made it better. Shooting while jogging is very unaccurate but if you toggle walk you can hit easily. When you're stationary you can hit easily and holding breath seems to slower the sway so you can compensate it and not just totally stop the sway. This is nearly perfect. Other people videos I saw that many people just show the sway but they didn't show how you can fight against it. Good job! Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
NoPOW 59 Posted July 17, 2014 Still think the ARCO's and MRCO's optics suffer from the current state of the fatigue (sway) mechanics... Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
raspu86 92 Posted July 17, 2014 Fatigue state seems to drop within seconds now. From 1 to 0 within 30 seconds while prone. I liked the sway and fatigue settings better (except lateral movement) before the dev branch update changed it again. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
NoPOW 59 Posted July 17, 2014 (edited) Fatigue state seems to drop within seconds now. From 1 to 0 within 30 seconds while prone. I liked the sway and fatigue settings better (except lateral movement) before the dev branch update changed it again. Yes, it should wear off slower than you gain it (even while prone), but it doesn't... EDIT: (Image updated) Edited July 20, 2014 by NoPOW Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Greenfist 1863 Posted July 17, 2014 (edited) 30 seconds with what gear? It takes about 3 min 30 sec if you have a heavy loadout. 15 seconds if you have nothing but a blue baseball cap on. (In prone) With heavy gear you can max your fatigue in 10 seconds. So the fatigue can take 21 times longer to wear off than to gain it. Edited July 17, 2014 by Greenfist Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Bouben 3 Posted July 17, 2014 agreed, they have made the fatigue system worse imo. It sucks because I really want to like this game, but as it stands, I can't and don't recommended it to any of my friends. The fatigue and gun sight swaying is an absolute game killer. I was talking only about visuals. I enjoy both sway and fatigue system. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
call_911 10 Posted July 18, 2014 Please please at the very least put the fatigue/stamina back they way it was b4 latest patch IMO this is far worse, I realise this is a combat sim but I dont see the point in not being able to function let alone defend yourself against an AI that already is hard to begin with. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
faire 10 Posted July 18, 2014 I have played for few hours yesterday and had no problem with fatigue at all. How much were you loaded? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
