Terra, Sol, Stella - Scientifically Precise. But Luna is acting a little loony :p

[rehtus777 10]

A few years ago when I was playing ArmA 2 (2011), I set the game for the exact time and day in the present (current real time). There was a Full Moon outside my window, but in the ArmA 2 simulator, it was showing the Moon in a Quarterly Phase. So, I started to investigate the Phases of the Moon in the Simulator. I realized that the Lunar Calender was off by 10 days - give or take a day. After hearing the Dev's say in Video's from Gamescom last year that the Stars were set in the exact time and position, I started to do some investigating on ArmA 3 to see how accurate the Sun, Moon, and Stars where in-game....here is what I came up with:

[side note - Before I go on, it must be said that I am not here to "Nitpick" BIS, but to help them make the Greatest and Most Realistic Military Simulator out on the Market...bar none. I believe ArmA 3 is on the way to winning the GOTY for 2013 and I just think this simulator is incredible - I'm hooked.]

I have a copy of the program "Starry Night" - one of the best Astronomy Programs out there (other than a NASA program, of course), so I used this program to cross check ArmA 3's Astronomy Program that run their Solar System in the simulator. I used one set of coordinates on the Starry Night Program so that I could match it up with an object on Agios Efstratios (Stratis). The object I used was the Nikos Sialmas Monument (The Spartan) on the most Southern tip of the Island. I did this so I could have an "Exact" spot on the Earth where both the Starry Night Program and the ArmA 3 program lined up. Those Coordinates on the Terra are - 39° 27' 56.58" N. 24° 59' 10.84" E.

Once I got both the Astronomy program and ArmA 3 lined up in the Earth, I then turned my eyes upward. Now it was the moment to use Time, Space, and Azimuth to figure out how accurate the ArmA 3 Stars Program is mathematically. I went to the default date of the Editor - 6 July 2035.

Sol: I put the Sun up in the sky at 17:00 hours (Local Stratis Time) in the ArmA 3 editor and I clicked on preview - I turned West - and pulled out my Compass. I lined up the sighting wire on the cover of the Compass with the Sun

The Azimuth of the Sun was 274° (It should be noted that I was using the Magnetic Compass within the game...it uses Magnetic North, while the Starry Night Astronomy Program uses exact Azimuth numbers (True North) I'm not sure how much Declination comes into effect with this simulator as it pertains to the Magnetic Compass, but it doesn't seem to be to far off from True North). So, the two numbers will vary a little due-to-the-fact that the Magnetic Compass is usually off just a few degrees here and there. Now, when I programmed Starry Night for 6 July 2035 (17:00 Agios Efstratios / Stratis time), the Azimuth was 276°. Impressive! ArmA 3 was showing promises of being very very accurate. So, I tried other times and dates - the Sun was always in the exact time and space within the ArmA 3 simulator. BRAVO!!! [side note: I wanted to do Sunrise and Sunset's, but the ArmA 3 horizon 'hazes' out, so that wasn't possible].

Stella: I decided to check on the Stars. First, I wanted to check the accuracy of the compass as it related to Polaris (North Star), so I lined up the Compass with Polaris....BINGO...right on the numbers - Azimuth 0°

Now, I had to pick an obvious object in the sky that was always on the move since Polaris is the only fixed object in the sky.....so I used the Constellation "Pleiades" - it is a very pronounced Constellation in the ArmA 3 Sky.

Once again, I lined up the sighting wire of the compass with Pleiades at 6 July 2035 (02:35) and the Azimuth was 59°. I then pulled up the Starry Night Program - set up the same exact time and place on Pleiades and the Azimuth was 63°. Very close. Again, the Magnetic Compass was most likely throwing it off a bit....but the height of Pleiades in the sky was spot on and the direction was very close. I also checked other Constellations and the same result every time - Time, Space, and Azimuth were always very close or right on the numbers. EXCELLENT!!!! You could use the ArmA 3 Star Program as an Astronomy Program to locate certain obvious stars in the exact time and place on Agios Efstratios .

Luna: Next, I decided to check on the Moon. Here is where I ran into problems. The Moon is an important part of the ArmA series. As we know, the Night Vision works much better with the Moon out and the enemy can see us more easily with the Moon being Full....so the Moon is IMPORTANT for the simulator. So, I checked with the ArmA 3 Editor and the nearest Full Moon to the 6 July 2035 date in the simulator is 10 July 2035. Then, I checked with the Starry Night Program and the actual Full Moon of that month is on 20 July 2035 - a difference of 10 days (give or take a day - I don't know when the exact time the Full Moon occurs in ArmA 3, I only have visuals). I decided to also check other dates on the Calender and I got the same results - the Phases of the Moon are not correct. Curiosity got the best of me, so I decided to check ArmA 2 and cross reference it with Starry Night.... I got the same results. I also cross checked ArmA 2 to ArmA 3 - I used same time and dates clear up to July 2020 and the Moon Phases matched each other in those two simulators (example - 27 June 2020 in ArmA 2 has a Full Moon; 27 June 2020 in ArmA 3 has a Full Moon. Btw, the precise / real Full Moon is 6 June 2020). This tells me that BIS is using the same Star Program that they used in ArmA 2 for ArmA 3.

Conclusion: I'm looking for the Perfect-As-Possible ArmA 3 Simulator. The Sun and Stars are "Right on the Money" / Scientifically Precise. But the Moon is off.....HUGE. I'm keeping BIS aware of this situation. Most likely, they know about this "bug" or "error" in the programming. I hope they fix the Moon and it's Phases. Some are saying, "Who Cares...it's close enough?" Maybe. But if the Stars and Sun are Precise, then why NOT the Moon? Other than the Sun, the Moon is the Second most critical object in the sky for Warfare because it relates to Night Vision. I guess I'm a "Purist" / the "Obsessive Compulsive" Type....looking for the Perfect Simulator. Anyway....

Thanks for reading this post. BIS, you're awesome. Carry on.

Oorah.

Edited March 10, 2013 by rehtus777

[Fuse 1]

/salute

Good work. This is the kind of thing that seems minor but will bug the hell out of anyone who notices. (Which now includes me. Thanks a lot! :p)

Have you submitted this on the tracker so I can upvote?

[rehtus777 10]

/salute

Good work. This is the kind of thing that seems minor but will bug the hell out of anyone who notices. (Which now includes me. Thanks a lot! :p)

Have you submitted this on the tracker so I can upvote?

No, I have not. But I will now, thanks. ;) Most likely, BIS knows about the BUG....I'm not sure if they can fix it since it is a continuation of the ArmA 2 program. It could be a real mess to fix it. I just wanted them to be aware of it "just in case"......

[Nicholas 5]

Great research rehtus777!! I never thought of doing something like this, I might have to fire up Starry Night and see the results for myself!

Please do submit this to the feedback tracker!

[dsi24 12]

Check out this ticket, seems like the co-ords on the statue aren't accurate.

IDK how this will change your calculations though!

[rehtus777 10]

Check out this ticket, seems like the co-ords on the statue aren't accurate.

IDK how this will change your calculations though!

Where did you find those coordinates? When I cross checked the Stars and Sun, the Azimuth was right on the money. No way Stratis is in the Southern Hemisphere (Capetown, South Africa), the North Star is in the Sky and Pleiades was right on the Azimuth numbers every time I checked....this means that my Latitude had to be close and in the Northern Hemisphere.

As for Feedback tracker, someone already beat me to it.... but I voted for it.

Edited March 10, 2013 by rehtus777

[rübe 127]

Yep, moonphases have been always off - and as far as I know they've never been fixed, since it could have easily broken existing missions (since the moon influences the tides...).

But as you've already noted, the state of the moon is an important factor for any night mission, which is why I really hope the devs finally fix this!

And hey, why not add some commands to query the state of the sun/moon too (I think I've written some tickets/feature requests in the arma2 bug tracker at some point...).

Pretty please :)

EDIT: just for reference:

- https://dev-heaven.net/issues/32153 (ArmA2 Moon phases should be in sync with real world Moon phases)

- https://dev-heaven.net/issues/26941 (new commands: sunrise, sunset)

- https://dev-heaven.net/issues/26940 (New script command: moonphase)

Edited March 10, 2013 by ruebe

[rehtus777 10]

(since the moon influences the tides...)

Excellent point. Wouldn't it be fantastic if BIS could fix the Moon and then create Tides? WOW, that would just blow away the gaming community. I wonder if this is even possible? You would then have to plan your invasions around the Tide and Moon (just like D-Day). :cool: That would be the Ultimate MOD.

Edited March 10, 2013 by rehtus777

[NordKindchen 12]

We are the most annoying community out there:D

Great work btw! ^^

Ps: Imagine if you would find such a concern in a bugtracker of COD or BF3^^ I am pretty sure Activision and DICE are glad we are not their community=P

Thumbs up!

Best regards

[gammadust 12]

+1

Would love the increased accuracy of these ephemerides. One thing i noticed (i am actually working on a mod that messes with time) is that the in-game time is Solar time, not local time (ie. dependent on conventioned time tables for country in given lat/lon).

Also opened a ticket regarding the fact that currently Moon and Stars only fade in after the deep night darkness kicks in, when they should be visible by both twilights = earlier in dusk & later in the dawn. Vote it up if this type of stuff interests you :)

[dsi24 12]

Where did you find those coordinates? When I cross checked the Stars and Sun, the Azimuth was right on the money. No way Stratis is in the Southern Hemisphere (Capetown, South Africa), the North Star is in the Sky and Pleiades was right on the Azimuth numbers every time I checked....this means that my Latitude had to be close and in the Northern Hemisphere.

As for Feedback tracker, someone already beat me to it.... but I voted for it.

That's not my ticket, I have no idea how it works but it sounds like they found the value in a config file somewhere.

[kilroy the nerd 14]

Someone should check solar/lunar eclipses and look to see if ArmA 3 let's you see the Sun's corona! :P

But seriously, not bad. Also, I'm going to have to start using star maps now, curse you!

[johncage 30]

the game needs a downed pilot mission to put that star navigation to good use

[rehtus777 10]

We are the most annoying community out there:D

Great work btw! ^^

Annoying? Yes we are But it's only because we love the ArmA Series and we love BIS :don 12: and BIS loves us.

And "Thank You", btw.

---------- Post added at 05:46 AM ---------- Previous post was at 05:40 AM ----------

+1

Would love the increased accuracy of these ephemerides. One thing i noticed (i am actually working on a mod that messes with time) is that the in-game time is Solar time, not local time (ie. dependent on conventioned time tables for country in given lat/lon).

Also opened a ticket regarding the fact that currently Moon and Stars only fade in after the deep night darkness kicks in, when they should be visible by both twilights = earlier in dusk & later in the dawn. Vote it up if this type of stuff interests you :)

Ephemerides.....how appropriate being a Greek word and all :p You hit on something very interesting - it would be great to show the Dawn Stars fading out and the twilight stars slowly become visible as the Sun goes below the horizon. The ULTIMATE simulator would have the Planets, Eclipses, Comets, and Meteors zipping across the sky.... would that be asking too much? :D One thing at a time, I guess. But the Moon Phases should be fixed.

---------- Post added at 07:02 AM ---------- Previous post was at 05:46 AM ----------

Someone should check solar/lunar eclipses and look to see if ArmA 3 let's you see the Sun's corona! :P

But seriously, not bad. Also, I'm going to have to start using star maps now, curse you!

I've wondered weather a Solar Eclipse occurs in ArmA 3....but it would take a long time to find one that occurs over Stratis and most likely the Sun would probably be in a default in the program to be in front of the Moon when they line up.

Yes, I use the Stars to find my way sometimes. I usually look for the Big Dipper and that points me North.

@JohnCage. I believe that AmrA 2 has a scenario where a downed pilot has to find his way back to the base just using the Stars.....no map, compass, or GPS. Yes, someone needs to make that Scenario....... but Stratis is too small for that to work effectively. Most people know Stratis pretty well by now, so when Altis comes along, the "Downed Pilot" Scenario at night just might be a good idea.

Edited March 11, 2013 by rehtus777

[Beagle 684]

I believe that AmrA 2 has a scenario where a downed pilot has to find his way back to the base just using the Stars.....no map, compass, or GPS. Yes, someone needs to make that Scenario....... but Stratis is too small for that to work effectively. Most people know Stratis pretty well by now, so when Altis comes along, the "Downed Pilot" Scenario at night just might be a good idea.

That had been in in Operation Flashpoint, the original from 2001. The mission "escape from prison" was part of the campaign, the character was Cpt. Nichols shot down and captured over Koljujev and escaping into the night and navigating by the start to make it back to own Special Forces was just one way to fullfill the mission.

[rehtus777 10]

That had been in in Operation Flashpoint, the original from 2001. The mission "escape from prison" was part of the campaign, the character was Cpt. Nichols shot down and captured over Koljujev and escaping into the night and navigating by the start to make it back to own Special Forces was just one way to fullfill the mission.

Sounds like an awesome mission. I never played "Flashpoint" - I didn't join up for service in the ArmA era until 2010. But there is a homemade scenario for ArmA 2 where you are a downed pilot and you have to find your way back to safety only using the Stars to guide your way while avoiding the enemy.

[rehtus777 10]

That's not my ticket, I have no idea how it works but it sounds like they found the value in a config file somewhere.

Okay, thanks for the heads up on that one. But again, Stratis is in the neighborhood of being in the right latitude and longitude on the Earth according to my calculations.

[kernriver 4]

Where did you find those coordinates? When I cross checked the Stars and Sun, the Azimuth was right on the money. No way Stratis is in the Southern Hemisphere (Capetown, South Africa), the North Star is in the Sky and Pleiades was right on the Azimuth numbers every time I checked....this means that my Latitude had to be close and in the Northern Hemisphere.

As for Feedback tracker, someone already beat me to it.... but I voted for it.

Doesn't this look like a Moon seen from Southern Hemisphere? Just look at the Man on the Moon. I thought we were fighting on a Greek island? :confused:

[Jex 1]

Great work..dare I say Stellar? ;)

[Von_Emmy 1]

http://www.fileden.com/files/2008/2/16/1762516/The%20Moon%20arma3.jpg

Doesn't this look like a Moon seen from Southern Hemisphere? Just look at the Man on the Moon. I thought we were fighting on a Greek island? :confused:

Indeed, it does :confused:

[gammadust 12]

Yes, that is a southern moon!

Yet the big dipper, polar star are recognizable in the sky. This is inconsistent.

[kamaradski 10]

I found the ticket, it is here: http://feedback.arma3.com/view.php?id=2291

[kernriver 4]

I tried to get the message across when first dslyecxi's video came out.

The Moon at the end of the first video looks as it's seen from southern hemisphere. Why?

Hate to quote myself, but doesn't this strike you as odd? What's the deal?

If Arma3 is taking place in northern hemisphere, the Moon should not look like that, the "man on the moon" is in totally wrong position.

Is it just an error, or did BI change the campaign story? I think it's a bug or something...

[mr burns 131]

Solar eclipse!

Finding out they don´t "work as intended" in ArmA2 was quite disappointing.

Aurora borealis would be shweet aswell, i remember kegetys added some scripted ones to his winter islands for OFP.

That had been in in Operation Flashpoint, the original from 2001. The mission "escape from prison" was part of the campaign, the character was Cpt. Nichols shot down and captured over Koljujev and escaping into the night and navigating by the start to make it back to own Special Forces was just one way to fullfill the mission.

bah, could´nt wrap my head around such things back then.

Took the hard way, reloaded several times, finally managed to steal chopper, brought mayhem on my captors and pussy-GPS´d my way back home :D

[dnk 13]

Well, it "isn't" a Greek island anymore, so it could be anywhere...