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avibird 1

What is bohemia's real business plan/direction for the ARMA game engine in the future

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I know ARMA is like legos and burger king (have it your way) but this zombie thing is killing me and most of the new clientele are worse then the typical run and gun console players that usually play battlefield,COD,GRAW RB6 ect at least they were into a military game and not RPG/MMORPG. What's next for DAY Z adding vampires that you need to stake in the heart or werewofls that you need to cap with a silver bullet to kill.

I am happy for BOHEMIA and there recent success financially and with expanding the game engine use for other games ie take on helicopters, command carrier, and now Iron Front Liberation 1944 however, this has me very concerned about the future of the real tactical shooter presents in the market. I have been a long time supporter of bohemia going back to the split with codemasters and have always been in bohemia's corner. Bohemia said that ARMA 2 was going to be the last game in the series a while back so when AO,BAF/PMC content was announced as well as ARMA3 people stopped thinking about the statement the company made a while back. What is the real long term direction (market plan) for the company? Is it outsourcing the game engine to other developers to use as they see fit. Is it making more RPG/MMORPG titles? Lets face it real tactical shooters like ARMA is a small target market. Why do you think all the others have changed the fundamental game core? To capture a bigger piece of the market share. I truly hope we are not seeing this shift from bohemia. Only time will tell the truth.

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I know ARMA is like legos and burger king (have it your way) but this zombie thing is killing me and most of the new clientele are worse then the typical run and gun console players that usually play battlefield,COD,GRAW RB6 ect at least they were into a military game and not RPG/MMORPG. What's next for DAY Z adding vampires that you need to stake in the heart or werewofls that you need to cap with a silver bullet to kill.

I am happy for BOHEMIA and there recent success financially and with expanding the game engine use for other games ie take on helicopters, command carrier, and now Iron Front Liberation 1944 however, this has me very concerned about the future of the real tactical shooter presents in the market. I have been a long time supporter of bohemia going back to the split with codemasters and have always been in bohemia's corner. Bohemia said that ARMA 2 was going to be the last game in the series a while back so when AO,BAF/PMC content was announced as well as ARMA3 people stopped thinking about the statement the company made a while back. What is the real long term direction (market plan) for the company? Is it outsourcing the game engine to other developers to use as they see fit. Is it making more RPG/MMORPG titles? Lets face it real tactical shooters like ARMA is a small target market. Why do you think all the others have changed the fundamental game core? To capture a bigger piece of the market share. I truly hope we are not seeing this shift from bohemia. Only time will tell the truth.

1. day-z is a mod. One designed by a BIS developer in his own time afaik, but still a addon. A2 is still the lego of games. It didn't change anything, you can still can have your private games just as you want it.

2. TKOH is, at least in POV, a commercial R&D project, that had the scope to develop further the engine, and test a certain market for further possible games.

3. Carrier Command is NOT using RV generation engine.

4. Iron Front is not developer by BIS, but by a third party game developer who licensed the engine from BIS.

i really don't understand the point you are trying to make here? The fact that BIS is running a business?

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Well we should be glad that things are expanding for BIS I wouldn't worry too much. ArmA III is going to be a further developement of ArmA II. Iron Front liberation looks pretty cool, have seen a gameplay video and in the end it is ArmA.

DZ has definetely helped to gain new players. It shows you just, how you can achieve something completely different regarding the normal core play.

Furthermore I'm actually glad they didn't stop with ArmA II. I've played BIS games for ten years now and I'm not getting tired of playing it. It's the game of the games in IMO.

Nothing has really changed apart from new players discovering ArmA and the awesomeness of the game.

ArmA can be everything you want it to be . . . you know that . . . so what's the big deal?

cheers. ;)

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i really don't understand the point you are trying to make here? The fact that BIS is running a business?

Yes BIS is running a business that was satisfield with it's market share of the tactical shooter population. As we know this population of players has been on a steady decline for years. The overall market demands are small compared to other game types so the overall profits have been minimum over the years. How can you not see or understand my point. It's hard to walk away from the money once you get a taste that is my conern for the future of arma as we know it. Only time will tell how this how thing will play out.

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...and another ranting and whining thread from my old friend. So far, what are your contributions to the armaverse, i mean, beside those threads and posts in here which moves absolutely nothing?

Or in the words of another great man: "Don't ask what BI can do for you, ask yourself what you can do for BI".

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Well DayZ is imo a popular mod because Zombie themes are actually popular. AFAIK persistent database and looting stuff is new to public Arma MP. Imo BIS could use these newly / tested knowledge/insights and add it to A3 MP - for example: a player selects a faction (NATO/Resistance/Iranian Forces) and plays (alone/in team) through certain missions on Limnos. Just imagine this as big pvp/tvt or coop mission on Limnos..... survive/adapt/win. Why BIS should change the core military part of its cashcow or even replace it? Can someone be 100% sure that on A3 release people will still like to kill Zombies or play "horde mode"/"fraggfest" ad nauseum?

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Bohemia said that ARMA 2 was going to be the last game in the series a while back so when AO,BAF/PMC content was announced as well as ARMA3 people stopped thinking about the statement the company made a while back.

I had always thought that this was just a rumor, not official. I had never seen any official statement.

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I had always thought that this was just a rumor, not official. I had never seen any official statement.

Indeed, I think they once said that they didn't wanted to be limited to the milsim genre only and somehow that's passed into legend as the certain end of ArmA.

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They're doing great obviously and BIS is leveraging multiple projects to further R&D their engine platform RV. You got VBS and TKOH.

The strategy for Arma 3 this time around is playing it safe, more development time, and testing for a more stable launch to avoid negative press and further disregard towards the Arma franchise.

DayZ exposing more people to the Arma franchise and increasing sales dramatically.

If BIS partnered up with EA or Activision I would start to worry but as of now BIS has grown a lot since I joined the forums in summer 2009.

Also happy that talented people in the community are being acquired by BIS to work on projects for salary that they used to just do for fun and on their own time.

Great stuff! :D

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BIS are not a Charity, they have to make money. They have it harder than most though as they need to continue to please the core fans while also trying to attract new customers. Games like ToH and Carrier Command will help them expand their market (especially as the latter is to receive a console release). Also by releasing stuff such as Take On Rearmed they are trying to attract people to the Arma market by cross polonation.

Ultimately though they have to make money, which means attracting new customers so in some respect they have to keep one eye on what is going on in gamer world and try and apply some of that to make their products more attractive without straying from the core ideals. I guess the alternative, if they want to stay niche is to go to a subscription model.

In the case of DayZ I imagine the sales boost would have been unplanned and somewhat of a nice surprise, but it will have opened their eyes as to the possibilities. You can bitch and moan about the new guys coming in, but without them BIS would find it hard to survive. Most will move on to other things, but some will stay and perhaps go on to make the next killer mod...

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Here is a basic rundown of their business plan. I've made the important parts bold and underlined.

However, we had to also learn to operate as a business in a sense and we need to carefully align our plans to keep the company operating well. We are again at a stage when we are working on numerous announced and secret projects, alongside supporting all the many released titles that are still played by our users. It's difficult but there is no other way for us. Unlike in the early years of the massive success of the original OFP, we rely on sales of new projects in order to sustain the company. Part of the reason is that the original game was made by a team of eight, whilst something of Arma 2's scale required a team nearly ten times bigger. So unless we focus on much smaller games there is no way we can sustain development unless we are able to work on multiple projects in parallel.

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I hope they decide to go more in the direction of Day Z, mil sims are fun but are too niche IMO, but I guess that's why they add mod support

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I hope they decide to go more in the direction of Day Z, mil sims are fun but are too niche IMO, but I guess that's why they add mod support

Hi and welcome

if BIS would do that they would loose most probably the core fan base existing since OFP CWC was released. I hope they will not go in such kind of direction with ArmA. rather develop a Zombie game standalone which has nothing whatsoever to do with the so called Mil-Sim aspect of the ArmA series.

I hope that with ArmA III the Armaverse will be improved furthermore and developed upon.

Cheers

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I want vampires and werewolves .... code it for me :)

We already have Wizards and Magic now don't forget! That's all we need with those fantasy boys waffling on about DPS and AOE and all that malarky!! Now, where did I put my D20?

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I hope they decide to go more in the direction of Day Z, mil sims are fun but are too niche IMO, but I guess that's why they add mod support

Hi and good bye. Seriously Arma is a milsim game. The Mod Support gives us the possibility to make everything we wnat out of that mil sim, but its always a mil sim in the first place.

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rather develop a Zombie game standalone which has nothing whatsoever to do with the so called Mil-Sim aspect of the ArmA series.

Isn't the milsim gameplay one of DayZ's trump cards? Don't we already have L4D and such for the less realistic experience?

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Isn't the milsim gameplay one of DayZ's trump cards? Don't we already have L4D and such for the less realistic experience?

Hi Celery

don't get me wrong DayZ is a great mod which will be definetely improved over the time I guess. Well if they would develop a Zombie stand alone game based on the Arma engine it would be fine for me too.

It's just that I don't want BIS to lose identity. Hewlitt pointed out to use less mil-sim aspect to favour and cater a broader audience and player base . . . to get out of the niche market. Well at least I understood his post this way.

I favor any mod who gives something new to the gameplay. DAYZ just demonstrates that ArmA can be whatever you want it to be.

cheers mate :cheers:

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Hullo all

A tricky subject this.

Whilst the success of the DAYZ mod is a good thing for BiS, I wonder if it will push them toward a less niche market and just produce milsim stuff for the military/training market?

I hope not.

Hopefully, they can support both the milsim player and the *average* game player in the future.

The only issue I have with the dayz mod, is that it would be nice if one could filter out their servers from the MP browser as thy take up a lot of space.

The influx of "CoD kiddies" into Arma2/OA proper is only irritating on public servers until they are absorbed into the style and ethics of Arma gameplay.

I've had some great missions with guys who have bought the game purely for DAYZ and then just stumbled into the standard game. That's good for Bis and for the milsim community.

That said there's still clans who are Arma/OFP vets and they still have a sucky "holier than thou" attitude. I'd rather play with folk who are nice team players no matter their experience.

Rgds

LoK

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Bohemia Interactive won't change ArmA to make it "less hardcore", they aren't going to change it to cater to a wider audience. This is why they are also producing games such as Take On Helicopters and Carrier Command. They also have other titles such as Alpha Prime ??, a first person corridor shooter, when they acquired other studios.

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Myke my old friend you are a pompous one:cool: When I have the knowledge to help out a player in this community I do my best to point them in the right direction. Yes, I don't have your ability to read and write codes and never will but I do my part helping others when I can on this forum. I have been passing the word about bohemia and OFP/ARMA games for the last ten years anytime I have a opportunity. So yes I think I have done my part within my limits. We don't see eye to eye but that's cool. We can agree to disagree without the insults because you hurt my feelings:rolleyes:

So when ARMA3 rolls out and Bohemia looks at the profit lines and determines that day z has made more money in a short period of time then ARMA3 would make for them why would they not turn in that direction. It's a business after all and I fully understand that. Only time will tell how this whole day z plays out.

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I doubt DayZ´s success will affect the gameplay and game design choices of BI in regards to the Arma series. The strength of DayZ are the strengths of Arma. Open world, realistic, deadly gameplay. Add to that its own unique features, and you have a winning combo. Without Arma´s realistic framework, DayZ would be "just another Zombie Mod".

It is just "cashing in", so to speak, on the recent Zombie craze. Zombie stuff is popping up everywhere. You can even buy eotech sights with zombie themes now.

Also agree with Avibird on how to treat newbies. Be nice. The game itself is tough enough to sort the wheat from the chaff. Only those who care will stick around. That won´t be any different with Arma 3 in the long run, especially when it comes to modding. I just hope there will be an influx of new people who are less stuck up and rivet-count-y.

(You know, so that we get mods with gun-toting rabbits again: http://ofp.gamepark.cz/index.php?showthis=10805 or cool unusual addons like this: http://ofp.gamepark.cz/news/pics/sectionpics/RHSAerosan.jpg)

Arma 3´s community should be about serious fun. Fun sometimes is crazy. I hope BI will take this into account and modify the mod-tools to be easier to use, or at least supply decent learning resources with the game that enable the player to use them from the get-go. Oh, and definitively add the modding suite as an installer option with Arma 3!

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I don't think that BIS thought "oh, a Zombie mod generated a huge amount of sales" but more likely "oh, a user-made mod generated a huge amount of sales". This time it was about Zed's, next time it might be something completely different. That said, BIS made it all right.

BIS main product is the RV Engine, which is designed for authentic military simulations. As you know, it is dangerous for a company to rely on one single product only, so they might have thought about for what kind of game the RV engine would also be capable. Result: ToH.

Also IF is good for the RV engine. The IF developers licensed the engine so BIS will get feedback from this side to further improve the RV engine. BIS can, in this case, focus on the engine since issues with scripts, mission and content aren't their issues.

Knowledge and improvement from those 2 projects do help to improve the engine further from which ArmA 3 definately will benefit.

And to spread the portfolio even a bit wider, there is Carrier Command which even uses a completely different engine.

I guess BIS does exactly know where their strength's are:

- authencity

- moddability

- aftersale support (read: this forum here)

So for ArmA, i see the future being positive.

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Expanding the market and exploring new product areas is stuff that BIS should be and is doing - but I doubt they will drop the core product yet. The fact that the Arma series is fully modable is a great stength and I doubt they are piling all this investment into the new engine for Arma 3 just to drop it after one product launch - regardless of how much a surprise the DayZ mod is.

Also, even though DayZ is a pretty remarkable example, there are probably less obvious sales increases as a result of other mods too. I know several people (at least six) who bought Arma just to play I44 and one guy (ok, not going to affect that sales chart much!) who bought it just for the UNSUNG mod. There has to be other examples. So to drop it all just for Zombies would probably be a bit shortsighted - as someone said the next trend might be Vampires, werewolves or Wizards!!

Having said that there's no harm in them adding something officially to Arma 2 or 3 that helps the Zombie genre!

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Regarding the DayZ mod, I have never seen the servers so full and I mean full! So this means that either a) a lot of new customers for BIS or b) a lot of new customers for BIS. Win, Win situation. End of the day you need Arma to run the mod...

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