Campaigns

[nominesine 0]

Operation flashpoint delievered a huge, brilliant campain with characters that resembled real people. They had fears, they got boored, they didn't like to be under the rain of fire, they became happy when they got time off... and they had compation for eachother. The whole conflict was engaging, and the characters was brilliantly written. Hell, even the briefing had a well written diary in each mission. The same thing with both expantion packs, packing hours of fantastic single player gameplay.

I couldn't agree more.

[andromedagalaxe 10]

I am signing this thread, too. It's not really a campaign, just a showcase. Except for the first mission, I really don't feel a part of a major war, just ... here's how you can use the ULB, etc. And the ...

you are flown to the top of a mountain to use the enemy AA to take down 3 planes on one pass

that was totally tacked on and like a COD mission or something, totally not the spirit of the game. I for one actually really liked the Arma 2 campaign because there was a consistent story and a progression.

[ediko911 10]

It really is strange how BIS try's to create the most realistic game out there and creates such unrealistic and silly campaign's, while CoD for example create arcadish games and try to make the most serious and deep campaigns. Funny heh?

[Heatseeker 0]

They even model the terrain after the real thing and everything.. its so easy to gather reference material these days, a waste really.

[pj[cz] 2]

Hi,

regarding this "issue" I am all for the paid DLC way to bring some uber campaign gameplay. It wont devide the comunnity as the content will stay the same but for us the "singleplayer junkies" a 40 mission epic campaign will be more than worth, lets say 15$. And in this topic i must remember that not only campaigns but also epic single scenarios need to be mentioned. I think that BIS can make a lot of good with producing single missions like Ambush from OFP or Blood Sweat and Tears from Arma1 as free downloadable content for their newest games

[almanzo 144]

They even model the terrain after the real thing and everything.. its so easy to gather reference material these days, a waste really.

The tools they made are state of the art... I mean, you could make a decent feature like film with the ARMA 2 engine given the ressources, yet the campains feel empty.

[vini_lessa 10]

I would like to observe that, while not reaching the greatness that OFP campaign´s had, ARMA 2 vanilla actually DO have a great campaign that contains elements from roleplaying and strategy genres well meshed with a nice story and great atmosphere. It was one of the most compelling gaming experiences I had in my life (I really got emotionally moved when I found out that

the orthodox father was the head of the rebels

, and that my decision in that moment would have a big impact in the outcome of the war).

The problem with it is that its scope is too ambitious for the developers to implement, mainly the last 2 missions and Manhattan. I think if these missions were trimmed a bit ( and the game had more playtesting overall by the time of its lunching ), it would have received a much better response from fans and critics overall, and could even be praise as one of the greatest war experiences in gaming nowadays.

That said, I agree with the topic autor and would like to suggest we create some kind of poll or signatures topic for establishing in a more acertive way the importance of the single-player campaign for the game community.

Oh, and I agree with the coleague that sugested the developers could release a new campaign to OA through paid DLC (one that makes the game justice). I would pay for that.

Edited July 5, 2010 by vini_lessa

[ProfTournesol 956]

I fully agree with the OP and most of the replies here, i'm now bored with making my own missions in the editor, i'm looking forward a non-warfare-at-all campaign with non rambo style missions, but normal human beings with their feelings and fears. Down with all-mighty-Razors-and-warfare things !

[almanzo 144]

My intention of this thread is exactly that. I am more than content with the contents of both game engine and units. Some performance trouble still to, but mostly everything works perfect.

A nice, well balanced campain for download is worth a lot. I could have payed alot for both the red hammer campain and the resistance campain for OFP without the extra content also. It would definatly be worth the money.

[vini_lessa 10]

Down with all-mighty-Razors-and-warfare things !

Oh come on, am I the only one who actually likes Harvest Red?

Cant believe that. With the exception of some really flawed points (and premisses, as the awful last mission), I even think it has some nice aspects that OFP: CWC lacks - mainly the roleplaying element at some points (manhattan´s “Oblivion with guns†moments). Besides it, I think its story and premise is a really plausible one, depicting an armed conflict in a very realist way, with all the contact with population and the totally human reaction from the protagonists (Razor team) in various points in the plot (the group dialogue after

father fiodor´s death comes to mind

.

Granted – I also think OFP: CWC is a more memorable experience overall, for its epicness and multi-angle storyline – but to dismiss Harvest Red as a bad campaign, as some people seem to imply, is totally unfair. If its played with the latest patch, it is a great experience (that beats easily all OFP expansions - Resistance, Red Hammer – in scope as in execution).

Edited July 5, 2010 by vini_lessa

[almanzo 144]

vini_lessa:

Well, I have a few points to back that up. It seems like it all boils down to taste with this one. For me, I find the characters shallow and cheezy. In real life, no special forces team would ever, ever engage an assault on any base ever. SF teams can be forward observers, saboteurs and so on, but they are never tasked with clearing out enemy bases. Your pretty much dropped down on a 250 km2 map with a gun in your hand, 4 mates and a to-do list with places all over the area. Missions like this is well planned beforehand in real life, and the same team is not assigned on several tasks at once so far away from eachother leaving them to deside what to do when.

There are people who like the campain, for me it was a huge turn off. The two main points is that RAZOR decides the outcome of the war like some super team, like modern day superheros with guns. The other is the characters, they are simply to cocky, arrogant and blunt.

I still love ARMA2 very much. Coop with ACE and other mods together with a dedicated, serious group have been unbelievable. Moments I've had with this game in multiplayer will be remembered along time.

[vini_lessa 10]

Almanzo, I respectfully disagree.

I think your distaste for Harvest Red (and love for OFP) may be obscuring your judgement - In fact, all your points regarding the operational behaviour of Force Recon units are wrong. But first things first..

Well, I have a few points to back that up. It seems like it all boils down to taste with this one. For me, I find the characters shallow and cheezy

.

Granted, some points are indeed cheesy. But others are not, and I think that in the end, the consistant and humanly reactions of group (like the group´s reaction to the mass grave in the beginning, or the killing of father Fiodor near the end) surpass the inconsistant and cheesy ones. On the other side, OFP also has some cheesy moments. For eg: the guy that is like a stereotypical war movies "the joker guy that everybody knows will die later" (the one with the small voice. Kozlowsky? ). He is a pile of cheesy quotes, in my opinion.

But, in the end, this is your ONLY point prone to taste, as the others are all objectively wrong, at least according to wikipedia. Lets see..

In real life, no special forces team would ever, ever engage an assault on any base ever. SF teams can be forward observers, saboteurs and so on, but they are never tasked with clearing out enemy bases

According to this wiki entry, one type of mission used by SF around the globe is "Direct Action":

in the context of military special operations, direct action (DA) consists of: "Short-duration strikes and other small-scale offensive actions conducted as a special operation in hostile, denied, or politically sensitive environments and which employ specialized military capabilities to seize, destroy, capture, exploit, recover, or damage designated targets. "[1]

The United States and many allied countries consider DA one of the basic special operations missions. Some units specialize in it, such as the 75th Ranger Regiment, while other units, such as US Army Special Forces, have DA capabilities but focus more on other operations.

Aside from that, this wiki entry cites one of the types of missions conducted by USA Force Recon companies..

Black operations are the missions that require direct action (DA). They are the opposite of green operations missions, where the Force Recon operators basically "look for trouble". Depending on the situation and the target location, the FORECON operators usually conduct direct action missions within the artillery and naval gun support fan; these operations demonstrate "small-scale" shock and awe.

Examples are the seizures and occupation of gas/oil platforms (GOPLAT) and the Visit, Board, Search, and Seizure (VBSS) of ships during Maritime Interdiction Operations (MIO), as well as orchestrating close air support, a vital skill exercised in DA missions

Now the next point..

Your pretty much dropped down on a 250 km2 map with a gun in your hand, 4 mates and a to-do list with places all over the area. Missions like this is well planned beforehand in real life, and the same team is not assigned on several tasks at once so far away from eachother leaving them to deside what to do when

Well, that same wiki entry cites how they operate. Lets see..

They are fully capable of operating independently behind enemy lines performing unconventional special operations, in cohesion of conventional warfare

and..

The Force Recon platoons operate farther inland than their division Recon counterparts, penetrating deeper into enemy territory from their assigned littoral (coastal) region within a force commander's 'tactical area of responsibility' (TOAR). They operate in such great distances that they are beyond the boundaries, or fan, of any artillery and/or naval gunfire support (NGFS); unlike their division Recon brethren, whose operations are strictly within the artillery and gunfire support fan.

And about their versatility for getting out of their "default" surveilance niche..

However, what began as a 'key hole' patrol could become a 'sting ray' patrol with little warning. The versatility of FORECON is demonstrated when missions quickly turn, planned or not, from a deep reconnaissance patrol to a direct action engagement.

So, Almanza. As you see, the operational behavior of the Razor Team in-game is not beyond its real counter-part. Or at least, is not SO beyond it. The story necessities may make it a bit further, I agree (I tihnk the plot element of Miles killing by Lopotev may be the best justification here), but nothing that a exceptional situation in real life wouldnt ask for, in my humble opinion.

On the other end, OFP: CWC has its share of unrealistic or suspect behaviors - as the Huey chopper pilot that ends piloting an A-10 Thunderbolt - is that realistic? Not at all..

So, as I said in the beginning, it seems to me your love for OFP (and distaste for Harvest Red) are obscuring your judgement. That said, theres nothing wrong with you not liking HR, apples and oranges and all that. And hey - we´re on the same boat here man! ;)

Edited July 6, 2010 by vini_lessa

[Laqueesha 474]

ArmA II's campaign wasn't half-bad. It was fairly decent. Operation Arrowhead's campaign on the other hand...

[nerdwing 13]

Oh come on, am I the only one who actually likes Harvest Red?

I liked it personally. But I really -REALLY- think it should have been broken up into smaller parts, rather than have you driving all around the country (Manhattan and Razor Two). Thats my one big complaint, aside from the Warfare implementation in the very end.

[Jonn 10]

I agree with the OP 100%

The end of the campaign was a WTF moment for me, Just wen i was getting into it they pull the plug on me, I was so mad lol.

Edited July 6, 2010 by Jonn

[frederf 0]

Harvest Red when the mission just tells you "This is your goal, here are some tools. Figure it out." I thought WOW, FINALLY a mission that assumes an IQ > 50 on the part of the player. It was really satisfying to make some choices, do some recon, and do it for yourself.

The warfare crud at the end was really disappointing. It could work on a long-term scale except warfare is just too cluttered with fast spawning trash and mindless ant-trails of suicide soldiers.

[mant3z 1]

+1

I want to know what happens with pilot in campaign Eagle Wing after he left the island on the boat!

That was brilliant idea for good campaign! I was thinking that Operation Arrowhead will continue this story.

[jakerod 254]

Vini made a good point about CWC's unrealistic nature. Nichols piloting 4 types of aircraft before the war is over (UH60, AH1, AH64, A-10). It is still probably my favorite though followed by Resistance, Harvest Red, The PMC one, and the others were just okay. I haven't been able to play OA's yet.

[Pulverizer 1]

I liked how simple and fun CWC campaign missions were. Arma2 was just boring and tedious.

[Murphe 0]

I enjoyed Harvest Red. I made the smart choice after reading about all the bugs to wait until it was fixed, so I wasn't put off in that regard. I liked the open mission idea, but didn't love it, a sandbox mission for a sandbox game. I thought that might be the direction BIS where headed but I think most people wanted a return to the OFP format of multiple characters. And BIS being BIS, they listened. However I think the OA campaign is too short for this to work properly though. But after all it is an expansion with a lot of new features and improvements, more than Resistance did iirc, so I can't really complain

I like the idea of BIS pouring a few more resorces into another full blown campaign and releasing it as paid for DLC. I would certainly pay for that.

[Shadow NX 1]

Due to the tropical temperatures in my rooms i just could finish the Arrowhead campaign last night.

Overall i was impressed by it, the nicely made cutscenes and many script ideas like the halo jumps really make it a intresting experience.

However as many already said it was way too short, just when you get in the mood its over and you think... what thats it???

What i also dont get is why there is tons of unused content, the czechs, KSK, the foreign press and doctor models that just were used as dead bodys and many other things that i was hoping to see in the campaign even if it were just in a cutscene or a little side mission.

But anyway its an expansion and it cost me 22Eur so i got lot more than i paid for anyway.

I once heard rumors of a Soviet side Afghanistan campaign DLC but it seems this idea was dropped... and as it is a rumor it might just been a rough idea by someone if at all.

Personally i would pay a good 10-15Eur for a really long and OFPish campaign DLC that would feature lots of cutscenes and should be completely voiced offcourse.

[l mandrake 9]

+1 for a full OA campaign as paid DLC (with a few new units too). My credit card is ready and waiting :D

There are 3 things you need for a fulfilling SP experience: story, story and story.

[5133p39 12]

I totally agree with what was written in the 1st post.

The bad ass attitude of the "actors" was so annoying.

I know its probably realistic as there are lots of stupid idiots in any army, but please, no more.

Also the missions are messed up - for example the last mission of the campaign,

where you have 3 objectives:

1. Save the hostages
2. Destroy all SCUDs
3. Capture or kill Aziz

In the notes it says that destroying all SCUDs is a priority - but if you go for it first, you will find the hostages dead,

because surprise surprise the enemy will kill them before you get to them!

And ofcourse i was dumb enough to go for the SCUDs first, because it was a "priority".

This is just one example of wrong mission design or at least of wrong task description, there is something like that in every mission.

Or the mission "Coltan Blues", when you attack the mine.

What a brilliant idea to send simple SpecOp to shoot down 3 attacking airplanes!

Realism my ass.

Not only that this untrained soldier wouldn't have a chance to take down even one aircraft with that crappy AA gun,

but more importantly, what was the BLUEFOR airforce doing at that time?

I have to admit, i wouldn't be against it if it was funny or easy, but it was FRUSTRATING.

It cost me at least 15 loadings (with the loading taking approx. 1 minute) of previous saves until i was able to hit all three aircrafts

(and i do not consider myself to be a complete noob when it comes to playing OFP/ARMA).

So, next time (if there will be a nextime), please, bring us some decent, fun, but also logical campaign.

Or you know what? Bring us back the good old Armstrong, that would be probably best :)

[Shadow NX 1]

+1 for a full OA campaign as paid DLC (with a few new units too). My credit card is ready and waiting :D

There are 3 things you need for a fulfilling SP experience: story, story and story.

I guess making a full OA campaign as DLC would piss many people off.

I rather have a completely new unrelated storyline that could also include some more units like OPFOR Special forces.

And by that i dont count the black turban guys of the Takestan Army... In OFP it was always bit scary to see spetsnaz parachuting down or jumping out of a BMP as you knew these guys with the black bandanas were better than the ordinary foot soldier.

Good old times.

[NoRailgunner 0]

Sorry to play the evil one - but I dont see that BIS are going to make any good long and believable campaigns for the ArmAversum. Its not their cup of tea anymore and the lack of good voice actors is very unfortunate too.

Good old times are slowly fading away...

...but you can always reinstall OFP to get a real flashback and see that there are still some good people working on it and releasing their work. ;):)