FlexiAI (WIP) discussion

[fabrizio_t 58]

Wow, this is very comprehensive. Do I take it that different factions use different values and tactics then? Or is that already modelled into the game? Looking forward to this one! :D

Side does not really matters for FlexiAI.

These features are activated on a per-group basis, so you can have different groups with different ROE settings for the same side.

It's up to mission designer's choice whether activating these scripts and customiziong ROEs for some/all groups.

[froggyluv 2136]

Looks and sounds amazing!

I've been wanting something like this: AI that actually sizes up a situation before attacking -for so long!

This could take missions immersion to a whole new level, knowing that they're may be an AI squad out there with their sights trained on you, but you don't know it yet :D

Hopefully all of the issues you've faithfully been reporting on Bug Tracker will be resolved so this beast can play out proper like.

Keep going mate and take all the time you need!

[mrcash2009 0]

The improved AI holds fire while trying to evaluate enemy strength.

= Much like Hybrid Command System, should be hard-coded to ARMA2 out of the box :)

Says everything that's needed to be said, great work and thanks for more details, clears things up a little.

[fabrizio_t 58]

= Much like Hybrid Command System, should be hard-coded to ARMA2 out of the box :)

Can't agree more.

Thx.

[extreing 10]

great job, remember fight vs monkey is not funny great AI for 2 sides is de correct :) great job Congratulations for you work

espero tu addon :)

I wait your addon

He(She) remembers fight against monkeys is not entertained, that the AI of both decrees is equivalent..

xd sry for my english

more ai supressing in low morale for retreat:)

[turin turambar 0]

Great job Fabrizio! Very promising. It will give a new dimension to the game, with a realistic ROE behavior.

One question. do you count the special firepower between different types of groups? I mean, if a infantry squad, without any AT weapons in their arsenal, have a contact with a mechanized, specialized anti-infantry group (say a shilka and a btr90) the should calculate the odds of winning correctly (in other wods : 0% chance of winning) looking at their lack of at weapons and anti infantry capabilities of the enemy.

[fabrizio_t 58]

Great job Fabrizio! Very promising. It will give a new dimension to the game, with a realistic ROE behavior.

One question. do you count the special firepower between different types of groups? I mean, if a infantry squad, without any AT weapons in their arsenal, have a contact with a mechanized, specialized anti-infantry group (say a shilka and a btr90) the should calculate the odds of winning correctly (in other wods : 0% chance of winning) looking at their lack of at weapons and anti infantry capabilities of the enemy.

That's exactly what FlexiAI is trying to do.

SIDENOTE:

Actually, for AT units, FlexiAI takes in account not only the soldier class itself, but also the remaining quantity of AT ammo. So if a FlexiAI group has say ONLY a single use M136 then it may decide to engage some (light) armor, provided it's not outnumbered/outgunned. Then if target is missed or not destroyed the group is likely try to disengage and retreat, since all AT ammo is depleted.

Don't hold your breath for AT units though.

The problem with them is that in ArmA2 they mostly don't stand a chance against armor.

They're detected and wiped out so quickly they're almost useless.

Also their animations are just too clunky and slow and they normally keep switching weapons instead of targeting armored threats.

Finally let's hope BIS will give to some AT units the possibility to fire from prone position (this is modeled in ACE2 i think).

That may lead to some better survivability.

Edited October 26, 2009 by fabrizio_T

[raptor 6 actual 13]

Love the work mate, just love it.

The reason is because, in real life, not everyone just runs straight out and engages the enemy. Sometimes you have to use your brain housing group to realize the best way to win is to avoid detection.

Your work, along with many others here, are finally putting the intelligence into Artificial Intelligence.

Good luck with the progress.

[froggyluv 2136]

Also their animations are just too clunky and slow and they normally keep switching weapons instead of targeting armored threats.

.

Any idea why this is the case? As far as I remember, this wasn't so much a problem in OFP. I remember the mission in Resistence where you command a couple of RPG'ers from the hills to ambush a Tank convoy and I remember them firing pretty promptly.

It seems like maybe the code that tells the AT'er to definitely take out that rocket and shoot it is being delayed or debated or something. Similar to the way that the AI sometimes stops cold in his decision making capabilities when you surprise him in close quarters.

Really hope this gets fixed someday.

[Alex72 1]

It's up to mission designer's choice whether activating these scripts and customiziong ROEs for some/all groups.

This sounds really super Fabrizio and im checking your progress like a nut! :)

However i would like to ask you if you could make the explanations in the script(s) (or if you release some document with it) simple so that script-retards like myself can use it without having to clog the forum too much. That would really be appreciated as we do want to see your scripts in many missions - even from beginner mission designers. :)

Regards

Alex

[fabrizio_t 58]

This sounds really super Fabrizio and im checking your progress like a nut! :)

However i would like to ask you if you could make the explanations in the script(s) (or if you release some document with it) simple so that script-retards like myself can use it without having to clog the forum too much. That would really be appreciated as we do want to see your scripts in many missions - even from beginner mission designers. :)

Regards

Alex

I'll do that of course.

Activating FlexiAI for any groups is pretty simple though, it's a matter of just executing a SQF script (with some params) from group leader's INIT field in editor ;)

[kremator 1065]

Will it be possible to have FlexiAI as a mod? That way ALL troops will be affected as default.

EXCELLENT work so far mate!

[Sonsalt 0]

Great work,

Here are some further ideas concerning the effectiveness of AI combat behavior

- Throwing hand grenades beyond visible range (over walls and last known enemy positions).

- Using M203 and AT weapons against enemies in buildings and bunkers.

- increase effectiveness of suppressive fire (MGs should suppress more while others flank)

[turin turambar 0]

Will it be possible to have FlexiAI as a mod? That way ALL troops will be affected as default.

EXCELLENT work so far mate!

This is a good point, it may present conflicting behaviour in some missions, but i think it will be worth the problems. Because if it is only used as a custom script, in the end it will be used only for a few user created missions, even if the idea is excellent.

[mrcash2009 0]

I think as a script it will be the best anyway for flexibility, because as you say having it overall would then need for it to be not included when you want to play a mission/campaign as it may effect that.

But a release with script/pbo version wouldn't hurt, but then im not the one making it so it might be too easy for me to say that :)

Activating FlexiAI for any groups is pretty simple though, it's a matter of just executing a SQF script (with some params) from group leader's INIT field in editor

Yes nice and simple, just how arma makes it :)

[markushaze 10]

Originally Posted by Kremator View Post

Will it be possible to have FlexiAI as a mod? That way ALL troops will be affected as default.

EXCELLENT work so far mate!

This is my question since the beginning of this thread.

is it possible, to have ALL AI ( friendly and enemy ) reflect your, more intelligent behavior?

i can imagine:

2 specop teams from opposite sides meet near a town, they don't ( yet ) know of each other....... the outcome ... damn.. it would be fabtastic ;:-=)

great work man, looks very interesting :-)

[fabrizio_t 58]

Will it be possible to have FlexiAI as a mod? That way ALL troops will be affected as default.

EXCELLENT work so far mate!

Don't take me wrong, but i don't know whether it would be a good idea or not.

I think for example SP campaign would probably not work at all with these scripts activated by default, since it's not designed to cope with the additional degree of variability the tweaked AI is introducing.

Most user created missions will probably fail their objectives too.

I think we'll need new missions, especially thought to actually gain advantage from FlexiAI features.

So creating a mod is not actually in my plans, BUT i'm pretty sure somebody in the community will be able to convert my scripts into a mod, if needed and really worth the effort ;)

---------- Post added at 04:05 PM ---------- Previous post was at 04:03 PM ----------

This is my question since the beginning of this thread.

is it possible, to have ALL AI ( friendly and enemy ) reflect your, more intelligent behavior?

i can imagine:

2 specop teams from opposite sides meet near a town, they don't ( yet ) know of each other....... the outcome ... damn.. it would be fabtastic ;:-=)

great work man, looks very interesting :-)

It would be possible of course, it's up to the mission designer will.

Great work,

Here are some further ideas concerning the effectiveness of AI combat behavior

- Throwing hand grenades beyond visible range (over walls and last known enemy positions).

- Using M203 and AT weapons against enemies in buildings and bunkers.

- increase effectiveness of suppressive fire (MGs should suppress more while others flank)

Very useful ideas, problem is lack the skill to do this kind of unit-level "micro" scripting.

With FlexiAI I am mostly focusing on basic squad-level "macro" scripting, since it fits more my limited skills and there's a lesser chance my work will be entirely obliterated by some patches fixes.

Edited October 27, 2009 by fabrizio_T

[Cyteless 10]

I see how this affects small firefights, but how will this work on large scale battles? Will it work essentially in the same way, only with quicker reactions?

Looking forward to it, it looks great so far.

[spirit6 51]

Is the improved AI behavior not picked up by editing the FSM's? Most of their behavior is hidden in there already, making it possible to tweak stuff layered.

I have been busy with AI FSM's but mainly for the pilots some while ago (i hated the stuka bomber behavior) and i thought this would be the most logical technical place. But then again, i am totaly noobish in this area is it.

[snkman 351]

So creating a mod is not actually in my plans, BUT i'm pretty sure somebody in the community will be able to convert my scripts into a mod, if needed and really worth the effort ;)

Well i think A.I. Enhancement like you do better should stay script based, becouse everything else would force players to use AddOns and would kick them from the server if the AddOn is not present and loaded. So in my mind script and mission based A.I. Enhancement is way better. ;)

Of course i know today the community preffer the AddOn ( Plug and Play ) methode but think twice and you will agree.

Edited October 27, 2009 by SNKMAN

[fabrizio_t 58]

I see how this affects small firefights, but how will this work on large scale battles? Will it work essentially in the same way, only with quicker reactions?

Looking forward to it, it looks great so far.

Actually i am focusing on tactical enhancements, whose benefits are mostly noticeable in limited scope firefights. That said these enhancements would also work on large scale battles, but their contribution may not be decisive: in my opinion success in a large conflict would rely more on better strategy than into simple tactical maneuvering.

Also the CPU footprint of FlexiAI on large numbers has still to be checked.

[Simon C 0]

I think addons are the better solution, as I simply don't save all my missions, and if I don't save it, how can I use the AI scripts? If, for example, I wish to test an AI feature, I can't do that unless I fiddle around putting scripts into mission folders and running them from init lines. It's far easier and more convenient to use an addon that runs the scripts at the start of each mission, just like GroupLink 3 was.

[fabrizio_t 58]

Is the improved AI behavior not picked up by editing the FSM's? Most of their behavior is hidden in there already, making it possible to tweak stuff layered.

I have been busy with AI FSM's but mainly for the pilots some while ago (i hated the stuka bomber behavior) and i thought this would be the most logical technical place. But then again, i am totaly noobish in this area is it.

FSM would be the right choice, but i have very little experience in handling them.

Some time ago i tried editing FSMs in ArmA and i found the job quite difficult due to lack of documentation and because of the "touchy" behaviour of these files.

Never tried editing them in ArmA2, so FlexiAI uses plain .sqf files.

Edited October 27, 2009 by fabrizio_T

[paragraphic l 2]

Isn't something like this the perfect change to get a new module in the game?

Having this as a module which you only have to sync to group leaders so they use the script.

I thought that's where the module system was created for. Just my 2ct

Looks great

[cole 0]

Isn't something like this the perfect change to get a new module in the game?

Having this as a module which you only have to sync to group leaders so they use the script.

I thought that's where the module system was created for. Just my 2ct

Looks great

You're a genius! In my opinion, this is absolutely the best choice! Modules instead of scripts and/or automatically-activated-addons.