Request of mlod for basic rifleman

[granQ 293]

Mods, addons is the backbone of arma, arma2. Really..

and we can do weapons, vehicles.. and everything.. (i do hope we get the source models as in arma1).. however, most mods/addons that wish to do any sort of unit creation really depends on getting a mlod out to look on.

So please, BIS give us this, no documentation or anything just the mlod.p3d and it will be enough for a long long time when it comes to support mods...well at least some time :p

[Big Dawg KS 6]

BIS has always released sample models in the past. Just give them time (we also need tools of course).

[twisted 128]

BIS has always released sample models in the past. Just give them time (we also need tools of course).

I remember from arma1 that when the mlods are released is when things really kick off in modding sense

[granQ 293]

BIS has always released sample models in the past. Just give them time (we also need tools of course).

I know, I am expecting the same, I just want the basic rifleman to be released to really "kick start" as twisted say.

I do hope for a full release, some documentation, visitor and maybe animation tools.. but a soldier.mlod is very much needed.

[Jackal326 1181]

If this were a petition, I'd sign it. The lack of sample models, particularly the head model, is hampering the entire modding process. MLODs of all BIS units would be nice too.

[scubaman3D 0]

MLODs of all BIS units would be nice too.

I don't know if I agree. I think its an interesting discussion. I might suggest that the release of all BIS MLODs would stifle the addon community.

I'll give 2 examples from A1 that I think illustrate my point:

After the release of the MLODs, many of the weapon addons which followed were just unoptimized cut/paste jobs. It seemed that it was mostly the large mods who had their own modelers came out with truly original weapon content.

A second example can be found by looking at Jonny's stuff. Same thing happened here. He came out with some original content and then many of the character stuff which followed, used his models, rearranged and retextured, etc...

I would be happy with a couple sample models of each type but releasing all MLODs again might have the same result. Besides, we still have the ArmA1 MLODs to make hacked models from - for those who wish to. :)

I'm not against sharing - I'm just FOR variety and originality.

[granQ 293]

. He came out with some original content and then many of the character stuff which followed, used his models, rearranged and retextured, etc...

I'm not against sharing - I'm just FOR variety and originality.

ok, they might not been very orginal, and i hate m4 addons.. but I do understand some people want them. I don't really care for it one way or another, but the soldier.mlod is really needed even for good/great addon makers to really kick start things.

AND if the release of hmmwv and so on gives us 2000 silly retexutres from 100 people doing the "same", at least we got 100 new possible modders.. we all started somewhere, and everyone knows its way tougher now then back in ofp days or earlier.. so why not help them some.

[rocket 9]

The MLOD's will change extensively during the bugfixing process. So I wouldn't expect any release of any MLOD's until after bugfixing has been completed, and after new tools have been refitted and released.

[[aps]gnat 28]

BIS's MLODs are essential for developing proper working content.

My ArmA1 content (not copies of BIS MLODs except where "bits" were needed) would never had seen the light of day without the essential technical source info these models and supporting files provide.

Configs are 1 half, Model.cfg and MLODs are the other half.

I too say the sooner BIS release the Tools and MLODs, the sooner the community has the potential to reach the amazing size and variety of OFP.

Leave it too long, and half the community will have moved on to the "next big thing".

[r3volution 0]

I'd put my name down on the petition.

The OFP/Arma community is built around nothing if not mods and modding, and it could provide a powerful point of difference between OFP2: DR and Arma2 if there's a powerful modding scene already happening for Arma2 by the time OFP2 is released.

I can't quite understand those who think that a proliferation of addons due to wholesale release of the mLod files is bad because some are of low quality. I, and I think many others would consider that it's fairly easy to ignore poor quality cut & paste addons and that the minor inconvenience of ignoring the shite is definitely worth it for the gold that is also produced. Besides which, nobody makes you play the crappy mods, last time I checked at least... ;)

[scubaman3D 0]

I can see all of your points and I don't strongly disagree. I would, however, like to point out that I am not "against" the release of any BIS MLODs - as some of you have implied I have said. I will repeat again what I wrote in my first post:

"I would be happy with a couple sample models of each type[i.e. 2-3 vehicles, 2-3 soldiers, 2-3 weapons, etc...] but releasing all MLODs again might have the same result. Besides, we still have the ArmA1 MLODs to make hacked models from - for those who wish to."

We all can still learn a lot from the A1 MLODs (exception character models) and to be honest, I would really be surprised if BIS releases all of the MLODs from A2.

[granQ 293]

yeah, i am on your side here Scuba.. just hope we can get an officiall word from BIS soon..

really, I don't mind if we get a "not bug fixed charater model", it would be enough to get us all started.

Please BIS, it isn't much asked (just upload one file, compared to all the bug fixes, all the requests on tools, documentation and so on)

[schroeder 0]

Yes, to begin with, one soldier mlod would be fine (like the first release for armed assault). I doubt they need so much time to do so: everything's ready since the game has been released :D Doing so would allow us to fix the problem of the colision lod that prevent us from using arma1 soldiers in arma2 inside buildings and to fix the errors of the shadow lod with arma1 soldiers. Let's hope the first release will occur asap... :bounce3:

Edited July 22, 2009 by schroeder

[da12thMonkey 1943]

My only real desires for the ArmA 2 sample MLODs are:

Soldier (sleeves up an sleeves down)

Female

Weapon (ones with unique inverse kinematic anims like the Mk.48)

Dog

Skeleton for creating custom character .rtm files

I reckon these would be sufficient for us to get a decent idea of how the models are rigged for their respective animations. The sleeves up soldier is so we can have the mapping for the entire face texture panel; an asset that will be used on almost all soldier models.

For the rest I'd be quite happy using the old ArmA MLODs, personally.

[Guest RKSL-Rock]

Im with Scuba really. As long as there is enough to get a good understanding of the engine and learn from I'm happy.

I think a sample from each class would be fine. I don't think we need all the files in MLOD format

I would like to request a decent example building that has the partial damage system implemented.

[Chris1986 0]

i dont see what the big problem is with releasing all the MLODs , fair enough alot of people will just change colours and parts of certain things but that is far from a problem . I know what you are saying it will make most addons unique and not just re-tex but im sure all those who have the skill to make unique addons wont just say ah F??k it i will just use the BIS MLODS instead of my own gucci model wich i have spent days/weeks or months making .

BIS could release a tool to unpack ODOL format so then people could unpack what they wanted but im sure there would be far to many people having hissy fits about this so itll never happen .

[scubaman3D 0]

I know what you are saying it will make most addons unique and not just re-tex but im sure all those who have the skill to make unique addons wont just say ah F??k it i will just use the BIS MLODS instead of my own gucci model wich i have spent days/weeks or months making

But I guess this is my point. People who come to this conclusion should better determine to become established addon makers themselves. Not have a reputation of making hack-job addons.

We should encourage individuals in this scenario to learn more and practice creating. This is the idea behind RKSL's project for beginners - to share knowledge and provide a helpful environment for these individuals...the rest will come down to hard work and motivation.

[Chris1986 0]

@ Scubaman : i do see your point dont get me wrong , but i really cant see the harm in releasing all the MLODs like they did in A1 . I suppose in a ideal world a tool that allows you to un-pack ODOL would be mega ,would also save alot of HDD space too ( A1 MLOD roughly 1.8gig? ) , but its not going to happen unless there is another tool to protect community content .

But like alot of people have said the A1 MLOD's where more to cross ref selection's , geo's and mem lods so aslong as we get what is needed to create addons without a giant arse i suppose it isnt a real biggy . Lets just hope its soon aye!

[rocket 9]

but i really cant see the harm in releasing all the MLODs like they did in A1

The harm is commercial. Companies generally don't share their source assets for free, because other companies could use them to generate their own assets. You can easily export 3ds files from Oxygen. It's quite unheard of for a company to do that, I can't think of another example of a game studio giving out its source assets. And I wouldn't assume that they absolutely will do that for ArmA2, as there may be some rights issues depending on where the source came from. I would imagine we will at least receive sample MLODs as we originally did with ArmA.

Also, if I was BIS, I'd want to wait and see how well ArmA2 sold. If it sold very well, I'd either make my own expansion pack or sell the rights for someone else too (such as Queens Gambit). Releasing modding tools before this will potentially impact on that, and would be a hard sell to any investors.

[DaSquade 0]

Rocket does make a very correct point with his last comment:

Also, if I was BIS, I'd want to wait and see how well ArmA2 sold. If it sold very well, I'd either make my own expansion pack or sell the rights for someone else too (such as Queens Gambit). Releasing modding tools before this will potentially impact on that, and would be a hard sell to any investors.

I think the main reason why QG didn't sold good, was the fact this community was shaped over years that for extra contence you shouldn't be paying for as one day someone would make something for free. Might sound harsh, but i'm sure a lot of people were simply not up for it to spend XX€ for a QG expansion. Ok, it might not of been the best and greatest contence...but still.

I suppose BIS missed the ball from the beginning (well they do made RH etc...) and on the other hand, making it such an open sources package is what it made so good and addicted if it is your cup of tea.

Offcourse we are used to get our samples in the end and i'm sure one day we will have some. I agree the main purpuse should be educational, so one (good) example of each class/feature would be a big help. I suppose it is for BIS easier to release a model then to write a full guide...in the end, a model says more then thousend words.

I understand the example models are a great resource for beginner and that will lead to an other batch of copy/past models. I guess, put your ego aside and let the storm pass.

I'm all for creativity and doing it all from scratch, but i guess not everybody shares that same point.

[Chris1986 0]

@Rocket : yeah i see your point on the commerical side of things but as BIS have released MLOD's from A1 i am guessing that they will be releasing them for A2 with the same disclaimer's etc . If you had read previous post's it was all long the lines of people doin copy/paste addons and not people using the models for other games , wich is why i said there would be no harm in releasing a large amount of MLOD so then people who enjoy re-texturing normal BIS content can do so . A lump of the A1 addons where BIS MLODs from the big MLOD release with stuff added onto them , e.g hummers , weapons , helis etc wich im sure alot of the guys who created these would of taken alot longer and maybe not of resulted in such a good addon without the MLOD's .

I think the more community content out there the better weather it is re-tex of a BIS m4 or a model made from the ground up either way credit goes where crdit is due imo .

[modemmaik 53]

Samples should help mod starters and help the rest to sort some issues out (e.g. Cargo shadow, recoil etc.).

But I agree, that some QG-style expansion might be on the roadmap. Anyways, I stay with A1 until some samples are released.

I agree with the un-pack ODOL, because the ODOL format is no protected format, just a precompilation that includes all needed info for the engine. Additionally someone should develop a "cryptor" by changing some bits in the ODOL format to give better protection against unpacking.

[Shadow NX 1]

I may be wrong but my guess is a release of all Mlods wont happen as this was more a rescue in the ArmA1 times to save the product with more people starting to mod.

As Arma" sells well i doubt they release much, hopefully at least a soldier or two and maybe a dog

[schroeder 0]

I may be wrong but my guess is a release of all Mlods wont happen as this was more a rescue in the ArmA1 times to save the product with more people starting to mod.

As Arma" sells well i doubt they release much, hopefully at least a soldier or two and maybe a dog

Very true, the release came after that some genius could convert ODOL to MLOD (???Synide???)

Such a release could help modders though to convert arma1 mods to arma2: let's pray and beg ;-)

Edited July 23, 2009 by schroeder

[[aps]gnat 28]

No problem with an expansion pack ...... if it was any good ! QG was very weak.

Its not as if releasing the tools & models now is going to result in some uber user mod. any time soon, that'll do a commercial release out of sales.

A good commercial mod like "OFP:Resistance" would have out done any mod ever developed during ArmA1 time. And I dont see much difference for ArmAII

I suppose in a ideal world a tool that allows you to un-pack ODOL would be mega ,would also save alot of HDD space too

Come come ..... no one here wants an unpack tool bacause that then means everyones models / addons can be ripped, not just BI's. I would have a "hissy fit", partly because I said I'd protect the authors 3d model, but I can't if an unpack tool is released to the general public.

I think a sample from each class would be fine. I don't think we need all the files in MLOD format

Yes, but not all single samples would cover all arrangments. Example Mi17 has twin turrets, but Cobra has missile proxy plus more, so which one would you choose!

the rest will come down to hard work and motivation

Yes, but I'd rather spend 5 minutes finding out from a sample model what the correct memory point is to define a UAV "pilot" view, than spend months guessing and begging for the info. Thats not "hard work", thats just unnessisary lack of information.

Rockets points are very valid, amazing they did it, and I hope very much no low-life distributed a ripped BI model, but they did it once and I really hope they'd do it again.

EDIT: Just thinking, in many cases if they ripped out the first few resolution LODs to protect themselves a bit .... that would likely still be useful.

.

Edited July 23, 2009 by [APS]Gnat