Fluid Movement System (BIS please read)

[Rg 0]

<span style='font-size:12pt;line-height:100%'>*UPDATE*</span>

Here is a quick <span style='font-size:12pt;line-height:100%'>VIDEO</span> that shows the lacking stealth aspect of the game and how it can easily be improved....

HQ download - http://files.filefront.com//;7312889;;/

LQ youtube stream - http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oZGnFJvkJKE

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I posted a similar idea a while ago, but its more apparent to me now then ever. We need some kind of fluid movement system (I would post this in mods/addons discussion, but if this was to be modded, we would need something from BIS). Now, it should actually be pretty easy implement. Please take a few minutes and hear me out (also a small video below for extra clarification).

There is a problem with slight movements in this game. Especially when in cities or towns, where player control is very important. Right now, the tactical walk forward/diagonal/side is just too fast and is clunky when you want to make small movements/adjustments. For example, you are clearing out a town at an aggressive pace, but you slow down when leaning out from some corners that are dangerous. You want to keep up this effective fast pace, but if you use the current side tactical walk and come out from behind cover at that speed, you will probably get shot, because the movement is too fast. It’s either that or come to a halt and inch out by tapping A or D slightly. Now, doing this really separates you from the game and the control of your player. There should be a fluid way of doing this.

Even though the thought of this may sound difficult, it should actually be quite easy. Take the crawl animation for example. I am not 100% sure, but it looks like slow and fast crawl are the same animation, only one it slower then the other. So, if this is true, that it’s the same animation, but only stretched or shortened depending on what speed you want to go (slow or fast), it should be possible to do the same thing for walk and run.

Right now we have a walk that is a little bit too fast and a run (more like a jog) that is a little too slow. If you put the “evasive forward†to the side (not think about that button right now), why not make the current RUN be the “the slower paced animation†and then make the “evasive forward animation†the FAST RUN? As for the tactical walk, make the current WALK the “FAST WALK animation†and then make a slower version of the walk animation, so you can make very slow movements and small adjustments.

Since a matter of changing the speed of your current animations should be quite easy, all you have to do is make a key bind to trigger the different speeds. If you use splinter cell as an example (yes, I know this a completely different game, but the movement system is quite genius), the best/easiest method would be to use your mousewheel to control the speed of your current movement. Let’s say the default speeds are what it currently is - fast walk and slow run. All you would have to do is push the mousewheel up to run faster and back down to run at the default slower pace (Or if that is not possible, make the mousewheel up a toggle function). But then maybe the inverse is applied for walking. The default is a fast walk and if you want to walk very slow, you push the mousewheel down. Now, your probably saying, “but the mousewheel is currently assigned to the action menuâ€. Well, it shouldn’t be difficult to assign an “action menu button†so when you press and hold it, you can use your mousewheel to move up or down in the action menu. Then when you let go of that button, you go back to controlling your movement speed – UP for fast run / DOWN for slower walk. The same thing can hopefully be applied for crouch walk – the faster crouch walk by default / snail pace by mousewheel DOWN.

It would look like this.....

- Walk (slow) = mousewheel DOWN when in walk mode

- Walk (fast) = default speed

- Run (slow) = default speed

- Run (fast) = mousewheel UP when in run mode

To be as clear as possible, view a quick <span style='font-size:12pt;line-height:100%'>VIDEO</span> example of this.....

HQ download - http://files.filefront.com//;7288539;;/

LQ youtube stream - http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uFONgO5OGNA

Yes, the game has almost been released everywhere, but why not improve the game anyways? It’s not like the users will have to learn anything new, well besides holding ONE button for the action menu control. By default the animation speeds will be what users are used to, except now they have so much more control by just pushing the mouse wheel up or down depending on the movement they are currently using.

There are many people still complaining about the clunkiness of the player movement (the old ofp complaint). While you guys definitely improved it since then, there still can be a more satisfactory solution. By adding this small control option, it will make movement in general much smoother and give the user much more control, not to mention close quartet combat and stealth play will benefit greatly by this addition.

*Please, consider this. If you don’t want to take the time to apply it to this game, PLEASE make it possible for modders. Now, I’m not a modder, but I think it would be possible by key binding. It might not be as smooth of an implementation as if you guys were to do it (we might not be able to have a slow crouchwalk if UP&DOWN mousewheel are already assigned (not sure what complications might arise)), but “I think†all we would need is a “temporary function†action button (hold - to bring up the action menu / release - to perform action). I’m not sure if the default button is the middlemouse button (I personally use the space bar for action), but even then all you have to do is hold it down and scroll, then release to “perform actionâ€. This would allow us to use the mousewheel for animation speed without having a conflict with the action menu.

Thanks for spending the time to read this. If you understand this concept I am trying to get across and have something intelligent to say, please share (In my last topic, people didn’t read thoroughly, so I got a lot of misunderstanding posts).

[kestrel7e7 0]

Splinter Cell used a movement system in which the mouse wheel was used to step between 10 different movement speeds, from super slow stealth to super fast sprint. It worked VERY well and felt dynamic, realistic and responsive.

[KaiserPanda 0]

If nothing else, it'd be nice if the movement was less rigid and tied to the animation of the player. It feels like a lack of control. Good suggestion.

I came here to make a suggestion thread, too, but I'll just append it here:

Add a camera shake/buck! It's such a simple trick, but it does wonders in games like Half Life 2. Adds to the feel of explosions, tanks firing, etc.

[Iroquois Pliskin 0]

Splinter Cell used a movement system in which the mouse wheel was used to step between 10 different movement speeds, from super slow stealth to super fast sprint. It worked VERY well and felt dynamic, realistic and responsive.

Responsive? It was a lagging piece of shit.

Current system is ok.

[kestrel7e7 0]

Responsive?    It was a lagging piece of shit.

Movement control needs to be realistically responsive, not overly responsive like arcade FPS games that have player accelerations of hundreds of Gs; 0 to 30km/h in 0.01 seconds. The time it takes to use the mousewheel to scroll up to full speed is a realistic limitation of the human body's ability to accelerate from rest to a fast sprint.

[Iroquois Pliskin 0]

Responsive?    It was a lagging piece of shit.

Movement control needs to be realistically responsive, not overly responsive like arcade FPS games that have player accelerations of hundreds of Gs; 0 to 30km/h in 0.01 seconds. The time it takes to use the mousewheel to scroll up to full speed is a realistic limitation of the human body's ability to accelerate from rest to a fast sprint.

I'll see how fast you can accelerate your body and produce movements when bullets start flying above your head.

[Commando84 0]

i like the current system i never had much problems with it.

[mcpxxl 2]

I like it because i like smoothnes

[Monkwarrior 0]

Very good suggestion.

Slow movements are too abrupt, I agree.

Monk.

[messiahua 0]

I sign my vote for this!

Suggestion #2460

[dmarkwick 261]

Hidden & Dangerous 2 had this system, and I have to say it worked pretty well. It worked best around and inside buildings.

I had a superb game of cat & mouse with a friend once in the bombed-out street map, we would creep around buildings where we suspected the other was hiding, up the stairs, around corners etc, sometimes going as slow as possible to reduce sounds that would give us away.

On the slowest setting, there was a random chance that a footstep would make an inadvertent scuffle or knock, and it was a really good mechanism for tension when closing in on your prey

[Boborish 1]

I think this is really unnecessary, I like the current system more.

[maddogx 13]

I think this is really unnecessary, I like the current system more.

I didn't read the whole post but as far as I understood it, there would be no actual change to the current controls, only a kind of additional "slowdown" key for slower movement levels.

Therefore the current system would still be present, but with a bit more movement variety for those of us who want to use it. If you didn't want to use it, you could just decide not to and nothing would change.

This is the best kind of proposal because it would make everyone happy, so it is by no means unnecessary.

[Scrub 0]

Edit: wrong topic

[bootleg soldier 2]

Would get my vote as it's a simple matter of adding 2 new key commands, wheres the harm in that, you would not even have to use it.

Good idea mate, glad to see you did a bit of thinking before posting, these kind of ideas nearly always fall on deaf or awkward ears so heres hoping

Best Regards

Bootleg

[fireship4 0]

I like the idea a lot.

[messiahua 0]

If it'll be implemented in future, I would like to see control system exactly like in Splinter Cell. I think, that 2 additional keys would be not enough, you should be able to fluently control your movement and the best way is with mouse scroll and for example 10 "speed stages" from very slow to very fast.

Also with this you don't need that slow walk switch and fast forward, so two more free keys to use for anything else. But the problem is action menu, which is activated by mouse wheel up and down, so there should be some thinking first - how to solve it.

The second problem - animations (you would need x10 more animations for each move direction ). And I think, that this is major one, which won't allow to make such system in arma. Maybe only through some kind of dynamically modified animations...

[Dallas 9]

Easy fix, it's already there. Lower your weapon to lower your walking speed any further. Then take that small step closer to the corner and lean to take that peak. If there's something interesting round the corner, press fire once to raise the weapon and press fire twice to fire. Now I know you say: "Oh but I want to keep my rifle raised." Then I respond: "Why would you want to expose your rifle and warn the enemy before you peak?"

Anyway my mousescroll is reserved for my action menu.

[Rg 0]

Thanks for the positive responses so far.

Therefore the current system would still be present, but with a bit more movement variety for those of us who want to use it. If you didn't want to use it, you could just decide not to and nothing would change.

This is the best kind of proposal because it would make everyone happy, so it is by no means unnecessary.

Exactly . It won’t hurt anybody and will benefit many.

If it'll be implemented in future, I would like to see control system exactly like in Splinter Cell. I think, that 2 additional keys would be not enough, you should be able to fluently control your movement and the best way is with mouse scroll and for example 10 "speed stages" from very slow to very fast.

Also with this you don't need that slow walk switch and fast forward, so two more free keys to use for anything else. But the problem is action menu, which is activated by mouse wheel up and down, so there should be some thinking first - how to solve it.

The second problem - animations (you would need x10 more animations for each move direction ). And I think, that this is major one, which won't allow to make such system in arma. Maybe only through some kind of dynamically modified animations...

The problem with your 10 “speed stages†is it would change the movement system of this game entirely. That’s why I asked for an “optional†slow walk/fast run, because it leaves the controls the same for people that don’t want this feature, but people that do want it, it would be right there for them to use. No harm no foul.

To you (Messiah2) and Dallas,

from my post, “Now, your probably saying, “but the mousewheel is currently assigned to the action menuâ€. Well, it shouldn’t be difficult to assign an “action menu button†so when you press and hold it, you can use your mousewheel to move up or down in the action menu. Then when you let go of that button, you go back to controlling your movement speed – UP for fast run / DOWN for slower walk.â€

I still wonder why games haven’t moved away from the old on/off walk/run system. Your choice of only 2 speeds is too limiting. As in real life, you should be able to move from a creep pace to a full sprint smoothly with different stages of speed in-between.

[-CS-SOBR-1st-I-R- 0]

I admit... I was too lazy to read all of your post so I decided to watch the video.

And I must say.... great, I like the idea very much and share your opinion !

Thanks very much... Id really welcome it if this would get far enough to be in the game as a matter of fact.

[andersson 285]

The second problem - animations (you would need x10 more animations for each move direction ). And I think, that this is major one, which won't allow to make such system in arma. Maybe only through some kind of dynamically modified animations...

I think you can use the old animations, just change the animationspeed. It looked good in the movie when played at lower speed.

[Blanco 0]

I always loved that system in the H&D & Splinter Cell series.

But in Arma we already need the scrollwheel for the actionmenu & quickcommand system...

There are other things that could be improved imo.

Like assigning commands and move & attack orders in queue. You always have to wait until the unit is in position before you can give the next order. That's lame

[DaRat 0]

Just another feature that BIS won't be able to make the AI use, and as such another 'embarrassment' if you will. IMO it won't happen.

Sounds pretty useless anyway - just move at the normal speed incrementally!

[kestrel7e7 0]

Sounds pretty useless anyway - just move at the normal speed incrementally!  

For a game that relies so much on stealth and cover the clunky, sticky and jerky movement system in ArmA is pretty piss poor. The primitive on/off walk/run movement is a hang up from old-school arcade FPS games that hasn't changed with the times. It needs to be more like a flight simulator with analog or stepped digital throttle control, TIR head tracking was taken from flight sims, why stop there?

It's crazy to think the military are using the OFP/ArmA movement in VBS1 (& 2) when Hidden & Dangerous 2 and Splinter Cell 1, 2, 3 & 4 (hardly hardcore sim games) have already demonstrated and perfected far superior alternatives.

I think this should be high on the Arma 'to-do' list because it has a major impact on every part of the soldier experience and is essential for ArmA to be taken credibly as the 'hardcore war simulator' it makes itself out to be.

[mr reality 0]

I still wonder why games haven’t moved away from the old on/off walk/run system. Your choice of only 2 speeds is too limiting. As in real life, you should be able to move from a creep pace to a full sprint smoothly with different stages of speed in-between.

Console games tend to have better movement systems. Take Oblivion for example, the more you push on the left stick the faster the character will move. As keys don't move down in increments your resticted to the mouse wheel, which is often used for other things. Although it sounds like a great idea i really don't want to have/remember to press another key just so i can get my action menu to work. ArmAs controls are complicted as it is.

I'm not a trained typist so i find pressing all these keys just so i can lower my weapon and walk slower a bit of a strain.