official complaint to BIS

[Balschoiw 0]

Quote[/b] ]well yes it is cool but at this stage its just ofp repacked with some pro's and con's this game could be so much more and it should with its retail price taken into consideration "expensive" and it surely is a nice island to be a criminal on there is no police to be seen anywhere

Arma has never been announced as a totally new game. It has evolved from a pure expansion (like it was intended) to a new game engine with loads of new features. If you can´t explore them, there´s noone else to blame than you.

There were numerous reviews out there for everyone to read that pointed out both, the bugs and the cool stuff. there was even a demo where you could playtest it. So how does it come that you are now SO surprised that it´s not a totally new game ?!? What should it have been ?

Arma- the hunt for the holy soldier grail in outta space ?

And the term expensive is ridiculous. It´s not a full - price game. Full price games here are around 60 Euro and more, Arma was 39 Euro....

I usually check a product before I buy it, if you don´t do that don´t come screaming.

[Commander-S.R. 0]

to Balschoiw

Well of course did i test the game/demo and from what i have read about this game the past 4 years it was surposed too be a new game or at very least an improvement to the old but you know the only thing improved is the graphics and some minor things in the game... if this was meant to be a development of ofp it sucks big time BIG TIME! and the retailprice in the country where i live is 58 euro's and that is expensive!!!

The ultimate realistic combat simulation experience brought to you by the creators of Operation Flashpoint*. recharges in a new engine with additional fresh, modern time setting. Freedom of action and immersive complex environments blended with unique touch of total realism return in this new game.

This is what bis wrote on their website about arma.... (New Game)

[Scrub 0]

Balschoiw, hehe, you're on it.  BIS put SO much into ArmA that people will be using this same complaint when Game 2 comes out - 'This looks just like ArmA only with roleplaying and better foliage' (good statement BTW, I think I'll make it my sig)

@S.R. Commander - 58E is not cheap.  That's about what I bought my Czech copy for, with shipping to U.S.  

(it is a new engine, and it is a new game, as it could not be directly added on to OFP for code and legal issues)

[Balschoiw 0]

Quote[/b] ]the graphics and some minor things in the game...

Yeah sure. Have you actually checked the scripting reference ?

Or do make hundreds of units onscreen, that cause no lag at all not make up for some serious improvement ? Or the ability to have multiple gun turrets, which will greatly be exploited by modders, or reworked AI not make up for some serious changes in your eyes ?

What did you want ?

Pls explain what you wanted to have ingame. Be specific pls.

[Commander-S.R. 0]

Dont know what pls means?

But i wanted a massive battlefield where you would have arty, air and naval support a game where the units are authentic and not made up of usmc and usarmy a game where the un playede a bigger role and the enemy was better equipped then a sorry-looking t72 i know that many countries have warzapact weaponry but i also know that many of them have much more then that exampel mirage fighters, bofors weapons and other crappy military weapons that we in the west sells them because its 3grade hardware

[W0lle 1048]

Pls = Please

A clear violation of the forum rules.

§13) Write in English

In the English part of the board please write in English and in the Czech write in Czech. Try avoiding writing in any other language or (internet) slang since the majority of the members most likely won't understand.

[Commander-S.R. 0]

Thank You W0lle for your clarification of that..

[W0lle 1048]

Whole Sahrani as a Battlefield isn't big enough for you? What in the world you want, the whole planet?

There is static Artillery and the game, there are attack choppers and planes - how you can complain about not having air and artillery support?

OK the naval support is ... not existant, but I guess the majority of users can live with that.

For the mix of USMC and Army we already have atleast on thread, there's no need to spread this issue accross the whole forum.

I must admitt that as I fired up ArmA the first time and seen the mix I too thought myself "WTF ?!"

That's something we have to live with now, no matter how many ranting about there is about this. BI won't make a whole set of new addons just to please a few. Not to mention the time this takes.

Same goes for the SLA Units, I personally have no problems with them or their equipment - it's ok.

The community will, once the tools are out, make more Units and vehicles and whatever to keep you busy for years.

[Sennacherib 0]

ok, i read 35 pages, but now i'm really tired. there are detractors, fanatics, some realistic peoples (i suppose).

now i have some questions.

- should i buy Arma? (bugs?, other problems?)

- BIS still work on other patches?

- why BIS released Arma, if the game wasn't finished? (sorry i don't read all the topics)

- why BIS use the players as beta-testers? they should seek investors,and money; to engage some new members for their company. (it's a joke)

- and to finish. why some among of you spend their time to cry. if you don't like this game, you can send your copy, or give it to me.

[boNg 0]

- why BIS released Arma, if the game wasn't finished? (sorry i don't read all the topics)

because they basically made us pay to be beta testers

- edited out some swear words

[INNOCENT&CLUELESS 0]

@Balschoiw:

Quote[/b] ]I usually check a product before I buy it, if you don´t do that don´t come screaming.

I can not remember that a DEMO was available when I bought the game. And a DEMO is usually a DEMO, if you want the full evaluation, you need a full working copy, time limited. The DEMO based on 1.03 or 1.04 would have shown so many bugs, that probably much less people would have bought the game.

[Shashman 0]

I've noticed a trend...

Most of the people complaining, whining and trying to throw their weight around, have only been members of this forum since, or very near the ArmA release dates

It's water off a duck's back for us true BIS fans.

They don't seem to grasp the fact that OFP was (still is) like a fine wine, only getting better with age, and that ArmA is destined to be the same.

So to all the true fans I say, let them whine, let them cry. We know what's coming

[KeyCat 131]

...it was surposed too be a new game or at very least an improvement to the old but you know the only thing improved is the graphics and some minor things in the game...

Commander-S.R. you have obviously not tested it enough. ArmA contains numerous improvements over OFP in many different areas beyond the new graphics!

Yes, there are still issues to be solved but as BIS proved already with patch 1.01, 1.02 and 1.05 they are working hard to fix things. And BIS developers actively listen to and communicates with their customers (try that with EA/Dice for example) if you just are able to express your opinion/issues/critisism in normal adult manner.

Another thing to remember is that it helps a lot to have realistic expectations of what can be done and that your not alone when wishing new/changed/improved stuff. I assume BIS got a long wishlist of their own and will eventually implement some/all of it if time/money allows for it.

That being said, I can understand some of the frustation expressed here on the forums but whining and moaning is way less effective than constructive critisism and will always be!

/KC

[INNOCENT&CLUELESS 0]

@Shashman:

Quote[/b] ]

They don't seem to grasp the fact that OFP was (still is) like a fine wine, only getting better with age, and that ArmA is destined to be the same.

?? I had no plan to buy a youngster and let it become better in my cellar. You know, I collect good wines and a lot of them turning into acid if you select the wrong one or if you store it wrong. And with OFP and ArmA it is like with a different year, there is NO guarantee that ArmA will become as good as OFP.

What I say is that they pulled the wine to early out of the barrel and sold it instead of inviting all of us to try it

[karantan 0]

ok, i read 35 pages, but now i'm really tired. there are detractors, fanatics, some realistic peoples (i suppose).

now i have some questions.

- should i buy Arma? (bugs?, other problems?)

- BIS still work on other patches?

- why BIS released Arma, if the game wasn't finished? (sorry i don't read all the topics)

- why BIS use the players as beta-testers? they should seek investors,and money; to engage some new members for their company.    (it's a joke)

- and to finish. why some among of you spend their time to cry. if you don't like this game, you can send your copy, or give it to me.  

Yea, I'm also interested about those questions (especially the first one), but if you've readed 35 pages of this (I, the mazochist, have readed even more;) ), then you should make up your own mind, as I did.

But let me answer on some of your questions:

"- why BIS released Arma, if the game wasn't finished? (sorry i don't read all the topics)" -- They've been like 'forced' by publishers or something. This 'excuse' has become very common for the developers all around in the gaming world, as all around in the gaming world has become a 'habbit' and a trend of releasing an unfinished/incomplete/cripled products(games). Very sad.

"- why BIS use the players as beta-testers?" -- This also becommed an all around trend and it 'goes along' with the upper thing.

"- and to finish. why some among of you spend their time to cry. if you don't like this game, you can send your copy, or give it to me." -- Because they've (obviously?) buyed a product which don't satisfying their expectations, and because they've (as it seems?) buyed a cripled product for a full price.

[Luciano 0]

Quote[/b] ]Whole Sahrani as a Battlefield isn't big enough for you? What in the world you want, the whole planet?

There is static Artillery and the game, there are attack choppers and planes - how you can complain about not having air and artillery support?

OK the naval support is ... not existant, but I guess the majority of users can live with that.

For the mix of USMC and Army we already have atleast on thread, there's no need to spread this issue accross the whole forum.

I must admitt that as I fired up ArmA the first time and seen the mix I too thought myself "WTF ?!"

That's something we have to live with now, no matter how many ranting about there is about this. BI won't make a whole set of new addons just to please a few. Not to mention the time this takes.

Same goes for the SLA Units, I personally have no problems with them or their equipment - it's ok.

The community will, once the tools are out, make more Units and vehicles and whatever to keep you busy for years.

Yes, artillery that is bugged, making it pointless till they fix it. Not to mention, you need to script it in misions to make it look good. Its not even in the campaign, so you can't use it without making a good mission.

Planes and choppers also bugged when the AI use them. The flying system is screwed up for player vs player fighting in multiplayer. So planes and choppers are useless to many.

If you think otherwise, why do 90% of the coop missions (which are 95% of all the MP missions in ARMA), don't even use them?

Quote[/b] ]The community will, once the tools are out, make more Units and vehicles and whatever to keep you busy for years.

People don't care about more units, and more addons which are uselss unless you use in missions. This game needs some heavy playability tweaks. More units and more guns won't keep it alive a second longer.

And usually nobody bothers modding a dead game. BIS needs to fix all the major bugs before any serious mod team will invest their time and efforts.

[whisper 0]

If you think otherwise, why do 90% of the coop missions (which are 95% of all the MP missions in ARMA), don't even use them?

I suggest you open your eyes wider next time you watch the MP panel

It's more a 50/50 coop/competitive maps atm.

Oh, wait, it's just another pointless Luciano's flaimebait! Darn, he got me once more!

[memnoch 0]

Well who said anything about the game not being cool?

well yes it is cool but at this stage its just ofp repacked with some pro's and con's  this game could be so much more and it should with its retail price taken into consideration "expensive" and it surely is a nice island to be a criminal on there is no police to be seen anywhere??

Expensive? I paid 20 UKP for it here in the UK. I consider that VERY cheap considering the average A+ title will set you back 35-40 UKP . If you went to the movies with your partner and spent 7 UKP each on a ticket for 1.5 hours entertainment, would you feel cheated? I paid over 300 UKP for an almost full set of VBS1 modules, for comparison purposes and this seems to be the better game im many ways.

[Chris Death 0]

Dont know what pls means?

But i wanted a massive battlefield where you would have arty, air and naval support a game where the units are authentic and not made up of usmc and usarmy a game where the un playede a bigger role and the enemy was better equipped then a sorry-looking t72    i know that many countries have warzapact weaponry but i also know that many of them have much more then that exampel mirage fighters, bofors weapons and other crappy military weapons that we in the west sells them because its 3grade hardware

All i can tell you is:

you bought the wrong game because you failed in reading

what 'this game' offers.

Before the game has been released it was possible to see

unit reference may have been pictures and more detailed

info.

Nowhere was written that you'll find any naval warfare

so what's your point on that one?

and btw i can't remember who asked that a few pages before

but here goes:

DeadMeat is not the only BAS member around.

I could swear that i've seen at least EBUD and Tygershark

already posting about ArmA.

AFAIK (as far as i know) shortly before ArmA release EBUD

released a new version of Tonahl aswell.

And why BAS members are not posting too much here is

caused by the same reason which DeadMeat already mentioned: because of ppl who will never be happy with

anything because it's not like they expected it to be.

Bug free games at their release nowadays is not realistic anymore. If this is inaceptable for you, don't buy any new

released pc game at all. If you want this fact to be changed

there's only one option: go and create your own software

company - publish it on your own and show that you can

do better without going into the reds with your first product.

~S~ CD

[Danbri 0]

I've noticed a trend...

Most of the people complaining, whining and trying to throw their weight around, have only been members of this forum since, or very near the ArmA release dates

It's water off a duck's back for us true BIS fans.

They don't seem to grasp the fact that OFP was (still is) like a fine wine, only getting better with age, and that ArmA is destined to be the same.

So to all the true fans I say, let them whine, let them cry. We know what's coming  

I to have noticed a "trend". Just because many of us reg. in feb. or march we have never played OFP or "been with" (whatever that means?) BI.

"us true BIS fans"! How utterly childish!

I have been owning and playing OFP and its updates like so many others since it came out. But i havn´t reg. here before because I didnt need to. OFP worked  (even with alot of bugs) out of the box and Arma hasn´t for MANY of us. Sure, it seems to work very good for others, but dont come to me and say problems like this:

http://www.flashpoint1985.com/cgi-bin....t=55868

are acceptable in ANY game. this things have happened to both NVIDIA aswell as ATI users and as long as BI doesn`t come out and say:

1.It is driver related regardless of manufacturer and nothing else,

or

2.Its a bug in the game

I have a rigth to complain.

"take the game back"?? And just how whould that be possible?

How can I prove that its actually something in the gameengine

when noone from BI can take the time and respond?

Why not just face it everybody, there are customers that are really happy for the game they got, and there are customer who arn´t and nothing anybody says here in these otherwise great forums is going to change that.

And regarding all this shouting about flaming, isn`t this that we ALL are doing, just flaming in its best/worse?

P4 2.8C

ATI X800 PRO

1GB DUAL CHANNEL

AUDIGY2

450W PSU

ETC.

[Jackal326 1179]

I've noticed a trend...

Most of the people complaining, whining and trying to throw their weight around, have only been members of this forum since, or very near the ArmA release dates

It's water off a duck's back for us true BIS fans.

They don't seem to grasp the fact that OFP was (still is) like a fine wine, only getting better with age, and that ArmA is destined to be the same.

So to all the true fans I say, let them whine, let them cry. We know what's coming  

Though we've had our disagreements in the past, I agree with you there Shashman.

[Scrub 0]

Quote[/b] ] when noone from BI can take the time and respond?

Because they're (happy Azide? )  busy responding to others (or have you missed the many personal responses on these forums?), or working hard on getting the game proper.  Yes there's bugs, yes I want them fixed too, but get reasonable: Rome wasn't built in a day - and since no other game can do what this does (to the best of my knowledge), I bet it wasn't either.  Note your damn issue like everybody else and get in line for the fix.  If all the people thinking their impatient, overexpecting attitudes are constructive or somehow beneficial to the fixing of ArmA, they need a serious reality check.

(I should take Sashmans advice...)

[JdB 151]

True as it may be that BIS will fix the known (and as of yet unknown) issues, this is not exactly welcoming to people new to the OFP "franchise" (I hate that word).

Alot of people that already know it love it, and alot of new people hate it because they have no prior experience with BIS.

I'm sure BIS wouldn't have minded doubling their sales as compared to OFP instead of just keeping the same crowd happy

[Danbri 0]

SCRUB:And this (flaming) comment is on the constructive side in your eyes i guess!?

This IS getting laughable. No matter what anybody wrights, someone immediately has to go for it.

As someone said elsewhere, I always thought that OFP-players were adults.

And thankfully, many are

[Commander-S.R. 0]

It seems that people in here easily misunderstand's you

about my wishe's for naval force's it's not that i didn't know it wasn't in the game.. but rather that the ofp game and arma has a huge potential if used correctly so why not lift the game up to be so much more??

as i see it now its not even remotely better then bf2