Helicopters in AA

[blackdog~ 0]

You are listening music like thet when flying heli ? And could someone tell me whats the problem with that anoying voice ( like on fast motion) in the backgroud, ive noticed it during some MP games , and its hard to believe that someone is doing that in purpose ( some kind of modification ? ) cause it spoil all the immersion in a secon.

To answer your first question, I used that music because it was annoying/amusing and also because faced with a choice between Rage Against The Machine and Dr. Bombay, I chose Dr. Bombay.

To answer your second question, I turn my voice pitch all the way up like that to be annoying

I was pretty disgusted with the radio voices (and the fact that they are INCOMPLETE -- there aren't even radio commands for a lot of vehicles and weaponry) so that was my special way of retaliating against whoever allowed that to happen. I guess I kind of take it out on other players too though.

me --> <-- playerz

[PeterEyres 0]

The helicopter Ai is horrendous.

The littlebirds do not explode when they crash or hit the ground

Cobras just do not engage anything, period.

the controls aren't as fun as OFP, but I still haven't set up my joystick, so I will reserve judgment on that for then.

The miniguns on the choppers are really, really strange. The sound of it is all glitchy and you literally waste all your bullets are one single click on the mouse.

[OIK 0]

Are you sure you dont like this music blackdog?

[Maximus_G 0]

Now I never leave the pilots seat. in Sgt. Ace's Aircav mission I am in the air for over 2 hours ferrying people about, doing gunruns in the AH1 and AH6.. great times.

Hi,

played that mission in the role of a "ferry shuttle" yesterday, that was fun for me too!

---

Though it proved to be a difficult task to bring them in safely, under the Shilkas fire.

[max power 21]

Upon reflection about what some previous poster meant about helicopters 'swinging', I think he means about how they rotate from somewhere above the rotors. I agree that that is most vexing!

[Rune 0]

I wonder..... are the only people bashing this flight model using something other then a joystick?

Flying with mouse and keyboard, at first I had great problems with it because of the mixed yaw and roll input on the mouse default setup. But after I changed the horizontal axis on the mouse from from 'left'/'right' to 'helicopter left'/'helicopter right' I can now fly a littlebird down a narrow street at 2ft altitude and do 90 degree turns at the intersections with tall buildings all around me...only problem is it makes aiming miniguns and rockets harder with that setup, but it is perfect for the MH-6. And a huge improvement for all helicopters in my opinion.

[Freshman 0]

Would it be difficult to add some working wheels on those choppers who should have them?

Would be cool if you could drive them out the hangar and things like this.

[otester 0]

Would it be difficult to add some working wheels on those choppers who should have them?

Would be cool if you could drive them out the hangar and things like this.

Ya just turn into a car while your at it

[Big Dawg KS 6]

Would it be difficult to add some working wheels on those choppers who should have them?

Would be cool if you could drive them out the hangar and things like this.

Hey we can do that with scripts, I mean I already made a taxiing chopper in OFP that worked like a charm.

[Maximus_G 0]

What are the controls in "scope" view in Ka-50? It's aligned with longitudinal axis of helicopter and i can't make it move.

[otester 0]

What are the controls in "scope" view in Ka-50? It's aligned with longitudinal axis of helicopter and i can't make it move.

Well just use your joystick?

[Maximus_G 0]

I am sorry, i didn't mean my helicopter doesn't respond to the controls. It's the "scope", i.e. Shkval targeting system view - it doesn't move individually.

[MehMan 0]

Can anybody tell me if the path following system in 1.02 has been changed? I'm wondering if the AI still follows the path like so:

Start at point A

Move to point B in straight line. Stop at point B. Change direction to point C.

Move to point C. Stop. Change direction to point D.

Or has it been changed so that the AI uses the helicopters new ability to bank so that helicopter flight is more smooth and fluent. In 1.01 it's not like that.

[fubarno1 0]

Nope its exactly the same as it was in OFP  

its the one thing that bugs me the most in both OFP and ArmA, something needs to be done with the path following because its a joke when you have a group of Helli's following each other and they have to play the stop, go, stop, go while en-route to waypoints.

the planes handle waypoints totally different to how the Helli's handle them when I would think the Helli's should be able to follow the waypoints smoother and easier than the planes, but with OFP and ArmA the opposite seems to be happening.

it also affects some of the ground forces too.

try this: give a Humvee a number of waypoints on a road set to careless and watch it go through those waypoints with no problems at all, change the Humvee to one with a weapon and it will stop at each of the waypoint for 5 sec's, why adding a weapon should cause it to change how it follows the paths is beyond me, it should not happen.

its like they get to a waypoint and the driver stops and says.

Driver: hey turret are you here with me at this waypoint

Turret: yea i think so, what waypoint are we at

Driver: hang on I'll check the map, waypoint x

Turret: yea I'm at waypoint x too

Driver: Ok I'll drive to the next one now.

its the same with most ground based vehicles to varying degrees, if anything all vehicles if joined as a group and set to safe/careless they should automatically be set to the speed of the slowest vehicle in the group, then if they are moving there should be none of this stop and go malarkey waiting for units to catch up.

[Big Dawg KS 6]

The problem with AI flying helicopters is simple if you think about it. A plane flies very differently from a helicopter, it can only move forward and cannot stop, so the AI must make banked turns. Also, all you have to do with a plane is point the nose in the right direction. With a helicopter, not only do you have many more directions to move in, and the ability to stop in midair, but you have to anticipate movement and time everything right, and there's quite a delay between control input it's result on velocity. So you can see that, with the AI's straight-forward thinking, it would be hard for them to fly helicopters realistically, which requires quite a bit of skill IRL too. And if you notice how they fly, they generally just point the nose toward their waypoint and floor it, so really they are flying quite the same way as they do planes, only it works for planes and not helicopters.

Also, not to contradict my entire post, I have seen AI make banking turns with choppers plenty of times in OFP during strafing runs, though very subtle and at rather slow speeds, but it's still a challenge for them to fly in formation because, again, mainly of the delay involved with controlling helicopters and their tendency to accelerate in bursts of speed (by the time it takes to realize the lead chopper is moving forward, it's already accelerating while the rest only then begin to pitch forward, and they won't be able to accelerate right away).

[Scrub 0]

Right. They need a 'through' or 'route' waypoint that just sends another vector to bank to without preparing to stop. The 'move' command is really a 'move to', without thought of future WP's, or the passage from one to another.

[Big Dawg KS 6]

Right.  They need a 'through' or 'route' waypoint that just sends another vector to bank to without preparing to stop.  The 'move' command is really a 'move to', without thought of future WP's, or the passage from one to another.

Indeed their next waypoint is not considered until their current one is reached, but again AI aren't advanced enough to think ahead like humans.

[Scrub 0]

Don't really have to change the AI, just need a WP to switch targets without the proximity 'prepare to stop'. Just like engaging, when I hand off another target they do not stop-turn-engage, they continue on and around to engage in a fluid manner.

[fubarno1 0]

Indeed their next waypoint is not considered until their current one is reached, but again AI aren't advanced enough to think ahead like humans.

AI are as advanced as the coder wrote the AI code to be, but considering BIS re-wrote the handling parameters for the helicopters why do they still follow the same characteristics as the Helli's in OFP when following waypoints?

As the AI approaches the waypoint they decrease speed from maybe 190 to 40 make the turn then its nose down to 200 again until they reach the next waypoint then flare again to around 40 and just repeat the same cycle, its no wonder the rest of the AI can not keep up with the leader because once they have slowed to the required 40 the leader is already off making speed of about 120.

The AI should be able to bank into the turn to the next waypoint without having to slow down enough for the tail rotor to point them in the right direction, it is just poor coding and the more I see things happening in ArmA that were happening in OFP just re-enforces my view that BIS just threw a lot of stuff together to build ArmA, concentrated on the pretty aspect of it without considering the changes that also needed to be made within the core of the engine.

Each waypoint has a certain set of parameters that depending on the unit following them and the type of waypoint deployed depends on how the AI respond on reaching that waypoint, my solution would be that as a airborne unit gets closer to a move waypoint at a set distance that waypoint is deleted so the AI then automatically progress to the next waypoint with minimal interruption in flight speed that would make the AI smoother in following flight paths, and change the AI from needing to go hell for leather from one point to the next make it a steady build-up of the speed up to 160 which I think is the normal cruising speed for the UH-60 but at around 5000 feet so it should be a lot slower the closer to the ground you are.

[Pierrot 0]

Maybe AI doesn't know the next way point but one. AI reaches the way point, then after that a new way point is given to him. So he repeats stop and go.

[funnyguy1 0]

In case you haven't seen it yet. Look at what ThePredator done in his authentic sound&weapon mod.

cobra laser

link to the topic

[NapalmBob 0]

Has anyone used the map editor in Commanche 4? Each waypoint has a radius around it, when the AI enters that radius they turn to face the next waypoint while keeping their speed constant. And the radius is adjustable too.

And are there any good points, I haven't bought it yet and this entire forum isn't helping

[frederf 0]

OFP/ArmA waypoints also have a radius set into them. I don't know if a 100m radius waypoint would allow smooth waypoint transitions.

[Big Dawg KS 6]

OFP/ArmA waypoints also have a radius set into them. I don't know if a 100m radius waypoint would allow smooth waypoint transitions.

It doesn't work that way, that only randomizes the location of the waypoint.

[frederf 0]

No way, you can have a waypoint with a larger "trip" radius so you only have to get within 30, 50, 67meters to trip it.