release over steam

[KaiserPanda 0]

Blizzards meathods are harmful and invasive. Valve is good about that sort of thing.

Valve isn't logging your in-game chatting, the only place there with your personal information would be the sales dept and only if you bought online from them, nobody cares about your forum posts... Stop being a conspirital loon. Valve is using information to improve the way they make games, not to steal your car and kill your dog. They make all the information they've aquired public, even! You can view it all, here:

http://www.steampowered.com/v/index.php?area=stats

I think a Steam distribution would be great for Armed Assault. Wider user base, automatic patching, more money straight to BIS. It doesn't limit the game to using Steam, either. I don't think the in-store version of Red Orchestra comes with Steam, and I know that Dark Messiah won't.

I've never encountered any Steam-trouble, I only started using it 3 years ago. Since then, I've purchased the bulk of my games over Steam. It uses an insignificant ammount of resources running in the background, and about 1/3 that of a web browser when maximised.

[GBee 0]

http://www.steampowered.com/v/index.php?area=subscriber_agreement

Quote[/b] ]7. USER GENERATED INFORMATION

"User Generated Information" means any information made available to other users through your use of multi-user features of Steam or to Valve through your use of the Steam Software. User Generated Information may include, but is not limited to, chat, forum posts, screen names, game selections, player performances, usage data, suggestions about Valve products or services, and error notifications. Subject to the Valve privacy policy referenced in Section 1 above, as applicable, you expressly grant Valve the complete and irrevocable right to use, reproduce, modify, create derivative works from, distribute, transmit, broadcast, and otherwise communicate, and publicly display and perform the User Generated Information and derivative works thereof in any form, anywhere, with or without attribution to you, and without any notice or compensation to you of any kind.

That's beside the point however. The model used by Steam is entirely unnecessary to retailing a game online, that's what I object to and it may not bother you, but it bothers me Like I said, I couldn't care how little information they collected or how little resource it used it's still more than they need or I'm prepared to give.

[Dwarden 1125]

Kaiser ROO retail contain Steam because whole game is MP concept and was build upon Steam itself (it's must part) ...

DM is different story ...

anyway after Psychonauts, City Life and Roboblitz there is another neat news before Xmas and Steam :

Quote[/b] ]Valve has just announced that major publisher Activision is the latest game industry company to pledge support for Valve's successful Steam digital delivery service. Today's deal will see four Activision games on the service: Infinity Ward's Call of Duty and Call of Duty 2, Grey Matter's Call of Duty United Offensive, and Neversoft's Gun.

[hoak 0]

As it's clear ARMA will be distributed digitally; I think this poll should be restarted!  Obviously Steam is not the most people wold perfer to get the game in a box.

But, the game is going to be sold via an digital distro provider, which will be the only way some of us will be able to buy ARMA, and if your only choices were Steam or some other distro service like D2D I can't imagine anyone would choose D2D...  

A much more germane and constructive poll should be made comparing digital disro services as we're obviously going to be stuck with one, and all of them I've tried are absolutely horrible compared to Steam.

[Dwarden 1125]

well You can think of Steam as "example" ...

anyway if You know anything else for PC than these i already mentioned

Steam (known, loved, hated, 10+ milions users)

Direct2Drive (big player thanks to IGN behind but problematic due to licencing and update scheme)

Gamers Gate (some neat titles yet fresh and small so risky)

TotalGaming (small but solid)

Boonty Box (terrible thing)

Triton/xStream (bacrupt/closed already)

then feel free to post ...

[EiZei 0]

Of course there is always the "download the data files, enter your key and validate it on the main auth server"-model that defcon and LFS seem to use.

[berghoff 11]

Yes that would be nice also.

[COBRA EATER 0]

I far prefer Punkbusters method of simply disconnecting you anytime a cheat is detected.

well now punbuster is set up with another thing called punksbusted and this will also create a global ban from your account, and sometimes even your IP. as far as steam, I have RO:O and i have only 1 issue, load time for the game.

[Dwarden 1125]

I far prefer Punkbusters method of simply disconnecting you anytime a cheat is detected.

well now punbuster is set up with another thing called punksbusted and this will also create a global ban from your account, and sometimes even your IP. as far as steam, I have RO:O and i have only 1 issue, load time for the game.

you mismatch different types of ban in short (but this should be in PB poll thread anyway so if place "could" move posts i will be happy for) ...only in PB enabled servers

1. there global PB HW ban, this apply across all PB supported games and it's for SERIOUS break of EULA (Consider like direct attack on PB AC functionality)

2.there is PB global game ban, this apply only WITHIN single game title after cheat was detected (with some delay)

3. there are various PB violation kicks for cheat detections before they are "upgraded" into point 1. or 2. or degraded to false alarm

4. there exist PB violations kicks for various sw and os rights usually nothing to worry about

and then exist bans from volunteer communities which analyse PB server logs with 1-4. and additional info (like PBSS pictures) to create "CUSTOM" ban lists for server admins ...

heh hopefully it's readable

[Baff2 0]

Punksbusted is a conglomerate of server hosts that all use Punkbuster.

They all share their server banlists. This is not a feature of Punkbuster, but simply how a group of admins are using it. The "Global Ban" isn't global. It's global amongst those server admins that use the Punksbusted banlists. Regular Punkbuster servers are unaffected.

Even if I hacked Punkbuster and got banned from using Punkbuster completely, I would still be able to play online in non Punkbuster enabled servers.

The important part here is that my game is still playable online. My consumer rights have not been infringed.

[BloodOmen 0]

I dont think anyone likes steam, i got banned on my old steam account, for tweaking with console commands

[Dwarden 1125]

I dont think anyone likes steam, i got banned on my old steam account, for tweaking with console commands  

u cant be banned on Steam for using console tweaks so please go away with that stories ...

Steam != VAC/VAC2

[Dwarden 1125]

shameless bump (this is biggest STEAM related thread so it's better than create new one)

i post as I would like to see ArmA steamed for multiple reasons:

- huge market 13+ millions active users > chance for new arma player blood > higher sales more money for BIS turns into more patches, updates and free content

- low cost to maintain and constant flow of sales till end of STEAM (more like end of world)

- AMD.ATI distribues now STEAM as part of theirs drivers (even bigger market to reach)

- nearly hassle free implementation (i bet Czech beer StarForce and SecuROM needs more work now)

- possible to register ArmA key with STEAM account (ArmA keys are enough complex to work)

* solves problem with keygens, fake UIDs and so on

- possible to integrate VAC2 anticheat into ArmA like it was done with Red Orchestra OstFront 41-45

(btw. VAC2 and PB are able to COEXIST !!! so this not interfere with my little pro-PB campaign

* solves out most of blatant cheating

- play ArmA anywhere, anytime (ofc if you got broadband

- more and more publishers joining STEAM , latest news :

THQ joined STEAM with titles like Company of Heroes, Titan Quest, Full Spectrum Warrior, Supreme Commander, S.T.A.L.K.E.R.: Shadow of Chernobyl , Warhammer 40k serie etc ...

- soon to be introduced complete tournament and matchmaking system plus community system (sorta like XBOX Live but better)

i'm sure i forgot tons of reason why to get ArmA on STEAM ...

against ?

except ATARI or other publisher 'deals' preventing this i see no real reason against ...

for whiners and complainers about STEAM please try post 'new and original' MYTHS

[ombas 0]

shameless bump (this is biggest STEAM related thread so it's better than create new one)

i post as I would like to see ArmA steamed for multiple reasons:

- huge market 13+ millions active users > chance for new arma player blood > higher sales more money for BIS turns into more patches, updates and free content

- low cost to maintain and constant flow of sales till end of STEAM (more like end of world) :)

- AMD.ATI distribues now STEAM as part of theirs drivers (even bigger market to reach)

- nearly hassle free implementation (i bet Czech beer StarForce and SecuROM needs more work now)

- possible to register ArmA key with STEAM account (ArmA keys are enough complex to work)

* solves problem with keygens, fake UIDs and so on

- possible to integrate VAC2 anticheat into ArmA like it was done with Red Orchestra OstFront 41-45

(btw. VAC2 and PB are able to COEXIST !!! so this not interfere with my little pro-PB campaign :)

* solves out most of blatant cheating

- play ArmA anywhere, anytime (ofc if you got broadband :)

- more and more publishers joining STEAM , latest news :

THQ joined STEAM with titles like Company of Heroes, Titan Quest, Full Spectrum Warrior, Supreme Commander, S.T.A.L.K.E.R.: Shadow of Chernobyl , Warhammer 40k serie etc ...

- soon to be introduced complete tournament and matchmaking system plus community system (sorta like XBOX Live but better)

i'm sure i forgot tons of reason why to get ArmA on STEAM ...

against ?

except ATARI or other publisher 'deals' preventing this i see no real reason against ...

for whiners and complainers about STEAM please try post 'new and original' MYTHS :)

arma on steam would be great, imo.

more people playing, more sales for bis, some type of anti-cheat for those concerned about that.

steam is stable and has been so for years, regardless of whining from players who had a problem with it in the past. i mean who hasn't had a problem with a piece of well-used software? i was there for the steam beta and have used it ever since. it is amazing what valve has done with it over the years.

perhaps the bis business manager could cut a deal with the current publishers for a piece of the steam pie ?? contracts are made to be rewritten if not broken. :-)

[Balschoiw 0]

Quote[/b] ]for whiners and complainers about STEAM please try post 'new and original' MYTHS

Latest myth: There are regions on this planet where you do not have access to supa-dupa-ultra-fast internet connections. I happen to live in such a region. Every patch I have to download today has to be downloaded at another location. Steam would end my gaming. Period. There is just no way that I would be able to get the download on my machine done with a connection of 8KB/sec downstream.

Steam = End of Arma for me and I guess I am not alone with this problem.

[UNN 0]

I have Red orchestra via steam and it's never been a problem. I can backup the game onto disk if I want to re-format my HD, it takes steam about 2 minutes to validate the copy once I restore it.

For people like Balschoiw, you can still buy the game on CD and download patches from another source. The only thing you have to use steam for, is validating your copy of the game when you want to play.

[Yeb 0]

I totally agree with you Dwarden, you also forgot to say games are linked to an account, so, you won't have to buy the game again if you lose cd or have to format once registred on steam network.

Moreover,the steam business model is almost perfect for little developper: a vast market with a marketing target obviously easy to find, easy marketing processus like ads, no more dvd packages to produce.

The main problem of steam at the moment are the prices for obvious reasons (not to compete with traditionnal sell ways, etc...) and the obligation to have an internet connection, this condition cuts the access to a huge amount of players (and hence consumers). This argument (all of them of course) can be discussed though.

The other problem, imo, is that the owner of steam are developers, hence, there are advantages and disadvantages, for instance, they are potential competitors, so why other developers would give money to a competitor? Link to an interesting interview of Scott Miller about it. On the other hand, valve knows the developer job better than a publisher.

Going to steam involves also a risk, what would happen if valve gets bank rupted and has to close steam though they seem having already envisaged this situation.

I'm sure there are other reasons why no more publishers "steams" their games, but as you said, there are plenty of reasons "to steam" arma.

By the way, i'm not in games business at all and the points above are more assumptions, thus, it (is? :d) can be BS.

[Lasse Lillebakken 0]

It's only a matter of time before digital distribution takes over the publishing process completely.

[Dwarden 1125]

Quote[/b] ]for whiners and complainers about STEAM please try post 'new and original' MYTHS

Latest myth: There are regions on this planet where you do not have access to supa-dupa-ultra-fast internet connections. I happen to live in such a region. Every patch I have to download today has to be downloaded at another location. Steam would end my gaming. Period. There is just no way that I would be able to get the download on my machine done with a connection of 8KB/sec downstream.

Steam = End of Arma for me and I guess I am not alone with this problem.

Steam content servers are spread around globe ...

steam downloads resume whenever You pause (so you can download even on unstable 56k)

in case of damaged files only damaged ones are redownloaded, not whole game

plus You can download game via e.g ultra fast campus network

and then backup onto CDs or DVDs or HDD etc.

at Your original 'slow' location Your then install from backup media

may i say another myth busted ?

* tho for perfect bust externally downloadble Steam patch packages would solve it

---

BTW. Yeb nice of You to mention SCOTT MILLER ...

so they (3DREALMS) were so afraid of VALVE they signed deal with Distream (TRITON) service ...

that service went down, bancrupt and left headache all around (w/e losses u can imagine)

guess where is now Prey published and distribued ?

right , it's STEAM

(that article is in light of latter events total example of choice mistakes

think about it from other angle

e.g. XBOX LIVE is driven by MS which develops own games too , so in theory they may see sale numbers ...

about many publishers not on STEAM ... it's mainly because of bad blood (e.g. Sierra vs Valve lawsuit, i remember some some fights with EA, EPIC was also against STEAM in past but now it's more like neutral)

guess the success and money talk decide about rest of big publishers to join the pack or they sign with MS LIVE for Windows (Vista)

[ht-57 0]

F**K steam!

nuff said!

[ebns72 0]

I've never understood what the fuss over steam is about - for me, it works great with no problems and has a very convenient system.

[december 0]

Every game I have played on Steam has been flawless. No hassles, fast DL, secure servers (no cheats) and I can DL games to any computers that I wish to play on.

[WTE_Grendal 0]

I think that Steam would be a great way for BI to distribute ArmA. It would have to be better than the download distribution they are using at the moment. From my experience, Steam has got the digital distribution right and are the best at it.

It would certainly help out with the curbing multiplayer cheats if BI used Steam player authentication for online play. We might also find that you would be able to download mods directly from the game server you are joining to play, which is how it works for Red Orchestra, HL, CS etc. All played via a Steam login.

For those with limited internet connectivity, you would still be able to buy the game on DVD and play it offline. For instance, I purchased Half Life 2 via steam, but I can still play the single player game without having to connect to a Steam server.

[Sc@tterbrain 0]

So are we talking a Steam only, or DVD only release. I would have no problem with a release on Steam so long as I have the option of buying a physical copy.

Maybe someone can answer this:

Would a Steam release then mean I would be required to have it running in the background like with HL2?

Not cool with that.

[Maciver 0]

Steam release would be fine with me. I played the original DoD for years. The system is pretty streamlined now.

Quote[/b] ]Would a Steam release then mean I would be required to have it running in the background like with HL2?

Not cool with that.

Probably you would, but i never tried without it. I'm not sure what the problem is with this though. It takes hardly any resources. Less than teamspeak.