Far cry's unscripted ai behaviour

[denoir 0]

Since the video title is "unscripted ai behaviour" I'd say it's a valid speculation

[Placebo 29]

You always believe what you read in the "press"?

[Baron Hurlothrumbo IIX 0]

They are opening themselves up to significant criticism if they are lying, maybe even trades description ;)

Would check their forums but they don't work (ubisoft)

[EiZei 0]

Remember, those videos are always done in the most optimal circumstances..

[Longinius 1]

"Do we know this for sure in Far Cry or are you speculating?

Do you know of any articles/interviews concerning the AI?"

I have met the developers, tried the game on tradeshows and played it at the office.

They told me, that there are basically no scripted events. As far as I know, there is just one and its in the start of the game.

The rest are handled with anchors, which the AI reacts to. And of course predetermined conditions and reactions programmed into the AI.

But you will never see scripted events. Therefor, its unlikely that the game will for example play out the same way even if you play it multiple times.

[walker 0]

Hi all

Hope it still has scripting though otherwise count me out.

I like systems such as OFP that have the ability to augment it at different levels.

I am all for a better AI but I prefer a system like OFP where different modules can be added in.

In terms of Rapid Alplication Development (RAD) such systems grow organicley as OFP has.

A modular object aproach is a far more extensable.

I hope that OFP 2 will be designed that way so that when new and better AI systems develop they are just sloted in.

We already take that aproach in OFP with vehicle, weapon, static object addons, islands and now even skys and gore factor. The vast number of scripted addons and features that so many OFP moders are making from gore addons to special lighting flame effects from artillery suites to support packages and you see why I have always said OFP is the game engine and not the game.

At COC we have continued to improve the extensability of OFP with the CE a strategic interface to OFP, the UA true indirect fire in OFP, swimming (sort of) and yes we are even going to extend OFP AI to the strategic level.

In OFP we do what other people call "Maps" and we call missions and write while eating breakfast a new Island (OFP city sized) is called a MOD in Half Life or Quake a MOD in OFP is a new game in most other game engines.

A well designed, all fits together, works nice on the console, don't need no scripts, game is fine for consoles. I prefer something more powerful.

I see no reason why core elements of OFP can not be designed in the the modular object way. From simulations to AI to world physics right on through. Such a system could control the future gaming market. The company that is willing to do that will.

Kind Regards Walker

[Placebo 29]

New trailer out for those who haven't seen it, makes the game look like an action B-Movie but that's not all bad, looks like it will be fun, and something to play while we're waiting for a real game (Opf2), release date set for Q1 2004.

[mr burns 132]

yummie...watched the new trailer.

the scene from the video where the bad guys fast rope from that osprey-like choper makes me wonder how much diversibility far cry will really offer.

imagine you´ve saved 30 seconds before the chopper appeared and after reloading you take another route. now if the chooper is there ... will the bad guys fastrope into the same tiny space again or do they really search for the best postion to attack you (obviously that wasn´t the case in the video ) ?

also, after seeing the boat ride i am convinced that i´m gonna need a new computer ... again

[Blink Dog 0]

Far cry and Soldner are going to be the suprise hits of 2004 in my opinion. There is an intro vid for soldner out: http://www.gamershell.com/news_BSoldnerBIntroMovie.shtml

[Guest]

Soldner will be a (s)hit IMO

[Placebo 29]

Yeah I was gonna post info about the Soldner intro movie but decided not to because 1. All the Soldner threads are real old and 2. It only shows rendered stuff and while it looks very nice and perhaps is a hint of what we'll get in 5 years or so there's not much point to watching it

[Longinius 1]

"imagine you´ve saved 30 seconds before the chopper appeared and after reloading you take another route. now if the chooper is there"

Depends on if the AI soldiers have requested a chopper before you saved or not...

"... will the bad guys fastrope into the same tiny space again or do they really search for the best postion to attack you (obviously that wasn´t the case in the video"

If its the only location possible to fast rope into in the area, yes. If not, then they will chose the one best suited related to your location.

[Placebo 29]

Hunches or inside knowledge?

[Tamme 0]

I couldn't watch the videos, but I must say that OFPs AI is very impressive and prolly better than Far Cry's though it does behave a little unnaturally sometimes. Still it's no match to SkyNet! The ultimate AI!

[Kuja- 0]

I wasn't really impressed at all.

AI hiding behind obstacles is old news - Halo did it.

Reacting to fire is old news.

Idle animations are VERY old news - I know titles as early as Mario64 had this, and IIRC I've played old 2d console games that had idle animations, albeit extremely primitive ones. The conversations are predetermined and are selected from a pool...it's still scripted, even if the particular one chosen is determined in a random manner. I think it is little different from games such as MP2 which have grunts talking to each other in many places throughout the game.

Backup/Reactions - Nearly all games already have routines whereby AI react to firefights. This game is just putting a pretty facade of animations and sound over the otherwise invisible AI routines.

Whether it is better than OFP cannot be assessed until the game has been played. Looking at it's individual behaviours, the AI looks pretty stupid, but perhaps in action some sort of synergy will arise.

More generally, from that movie the game looks like a retarded, gung-ho/G.I JOE shooter, with an arcade environment and lame voice acting to match.

[Longinius 1]

Quote[/b] ]Hunches or inside knowledge?

Inside knowledge

Quote[/b] ]AI hiding behind obstacles is old news - Halo did it.

Reacting to fire is old news.

Its not the fact that they are doing it thats new, its HOW they are doing it and the fact that they are coordinating their efforts. While you are busy trying to flush out a guy hiding behind some rocks, his friends are working their way around to flank you. If you are really unlucky, some other git is putting down suppressing fire as they move from a covered position.

Quote[/b] ]Idle animations are VERY old news - I know titles as early as Mario64 had this, and IIRC I've played old 2d console games that had idle animations, albeit extremely primitive ones. The conversations are predetermined and are selected from a pool...it's still scripted, even if the particular one chosen is determined in a random manner. I think it is little different from games such as MP2 which have grunts talking to each other in many places throughout the game.

No, it is not scripted. Of course it is taken from a text someplace written in to the game, but it is not a scripted event. It can happen at any time, any place and they can talk about basically anything from football to how stupid their commander is. I wouldnt call that scripted. A scripted event in a game is something that always happens the same way when you activate a trigger.

Quote[/b] ]Backup/Reactions - Nearly all games already have routines whereby AI react to firefights.

Again, mostly through scripts. Once you engage the soldiers at point A, the guys at point B are automatically called up. Here the soldiers will have to reach their radio first to call up people out of audible / visible reach. You can either destroy the radio or prevent them from reaching it to stop reinforcements. Or take out the closest reinforcements to buy you time before attacking your main goal.

Quote[/b] ]This game is just putting a pretty facade of animations and sound over the otherwise invisible AI routines.

Have you tried the game at all?

Quote[/b] ]Whether it is better than OFP cannot be assessed until the game has been played. Looking at it's individual behaviours, the AI looks pretty stupid, but perhaps in action some sort of synergy will arise.

It isbetter than OFP, and worse. Its not the same kind of game at all. You are comparing apples and oranges.

Quote[/b] ]More generally, from that movie the game looks like a retarded, gung-ho/G.I JOE shooter, with an arcade environment and lame voice acting to match.

Take out retarded and you are close to the truth. Its a shooter, not a soldier simulator in any way. Its more like MOHAA, Quake or what not than OFP. That doesnt mean it isnt good though, far from it. And the multiplayer is awesome. With a view distance of over 1 kilometer, you get some intense shoot outs happening.

[Kuja- 0]

oops...read the thread properly this time..

[Kuja- 0]

Quote[/b] ]Hunches or inside knowledge?

Inside knowledge

Quote[/b] ]AI hiding behind obstacles is old news - Halo did it.

Reacting to fire is old news.

Its not the fact that they are doing it thats new, its HOW they are doing it and the fact that they are coordinating their efforts. While you are busy trying to flush out a guy hiding behind some rocks, his friends are working their way around to flank you. If you are really unlucky, some other git is putting down suppressing fire as they move from a covered position.

Quote[/b] ]Idle animations are VERY old news - I know titles as early as Mario64 had this, and IIRC I've played old 2d console games that had idle animations, albeit extremely primitive ones.  The conversations are predetermined and are selected from a pool...it's still scripted, even if the particular one chosen is determined in a random manner.  I think it is little different from games such as MP2 which have grunts talking to each other in many places throughout the game.

No, it is not scripted. Of course it is taken from a text someplace written in to the game, but it is not a scripted event. It can happen at any time, any place and they can talk about basically anything from football to how stupid their commander is. I wouldnt call that scripted. A scripted event in a game is something that always happens the same way when you activate a trigger.

Quote[/b] ]Backup/Reactions - Nearly all games already have routines whereby AI react to firefights.

Again, mostly through scripts. Once you engage the soldiers at point A, the guys at point B are automatically called up. Here the soldiers will have to reach their radio first to call up people out of audible / visible reach. You can either destroy the radio or prevent them from reaching it to stop reinforcements. Or take out the closest reinforcements to buy you time before attacking your main goal.

Quote[/b] ]This game is just putting a pretty facade of animations and sound over the otherwise invisible AI routines.

Have you tried the game at all?

Quote[/b] ]Whether it is better than OFP cannot be assessed until the game has been played.  Looking at it's individual behaviours, the AI looks pretty stupid, but perhaps in action some sort of synergy will arise.

It isbetter than OFP, and worse. Its not the same kind of game at all. You are comparing apples and oranges.

Quote[/b] ]More generally, from that movie the game looks like a retarded, gung-ho/G.I JOE shooter, with an arcade environment and lame voice acting to match.

Take out retarded and you are close to the truth. Its a shooter, not a soldier simulator in any way. Its more like MOHAA, Quake or what not than OFP. That doesnt mean it isnt good though, far from it. And the multiplayer is awesome. With a view distance of over 1 kilometer, you get some intense shoot outs happening.

I'll believe coordinated AI action when I see it. Apparently individuals who d/l and compiled HL2s source code found that much of HL2's "unscripted" AI action wasn't really so unscripted at all. I can't say, not having played the game [no shit I haven't played it, there's no demo or full version] but I would be willing to bet that within 2 hours of playing the game, it becomes apparent that the AI have say 5 or 6 actions they'll take, and everything is just a composite of those actions.

Like hell conversation is not scripted. No matter how large the pool of possible animations and conversations is, it is little removed from totally static conversations triggered by the player, as seen in a billion other games. They're still wholly predetermined.

A scripted event is one that is predetermined, not necessarily one that happens in precisely the same manner. In any case, given enough retries, you'll quickly find that it IS happening in a number of precisely similar ways.

Uhhh. You're trying to tell me that in all other games, when you shoot an enemy and the AI [dumbly] moves to the source of the sound - that is scripted? Try again. Even though it's adding a level of complexity by actually going through the motions of communicating information between the individual AI, it's not *THAT* great.

If you reread what I said, I actually did anything BUT compare OFP with Farcry. I said I wasn't going to compare because that would be useless w/o having played it.

[Sharia 0]

People who use the "This game is shit, it's unrealistic, has a health bar, bitch bitch, gripe, moan, etc..." Gaming was never founded on realism, people! Saying a game is bad because it's "arcadey" isn't that fair... especially when you play Flashpoint, of all games. Come on, do you really think flying the aircraft in OFP is really that realistic?

Then again, I'm that wierd black sheep that likes console/arcade stuff just as much as PC gaming...

Oh, and Far Cry looks class... very halo-esque in the combat dynamics. (Being able to throw a grenade with a single button instead of scrolling through weapons is pretty cool.)

[Longinius 1]

Quote[/b] ]I'll believe coordinated AI action when I see it. Apparently individuals who d/l and compiled HL2s source code found that much of HL2's "unscripted" AI action wasn't really so unscripted at all. I can't say, not having played the game [no shit I haven't played it, there's no demo or full version] but I would be willing to bet that within 2 hours of playing the game, it becomes apparent that the AI have say 5 or 6 actions they'll take, and everything is just a composite of those actions.

Well I guess you'll have to see when you play it then. Not much I can say that will convince you I reckon.

Quote[/b] ]Like hell conversation is not scripted. No matter how large the pool of possible animations and conversations is, it is little removed from totally static conversations triggered by the player, as seen in a billion other games. They're still wholly predetermined.

This depends on what type of conversation you are refering to. If you are talking about player to AI conversation or vice versa, then yes, it will be scripted. That is necessery to drive the story element forward in any game. As for AI to AI conversations, those are random and not pre determined events.

Quote[/b] ]A scripted event is one that is predetermined, not necessarily one that happens in precisely the same manner. In any case, given enough retries, you'll quickly find that it IS happening in a number of precisely similar ways.

A matter of definition I guess. But to most people I think a scripted event is an event that is triggered at a certain point, and always playes out the same way. Much like the scripted missions in for example Medal of Honor.

Quote[/b] ]Uhhh. You're trying to tell me that in all other games, when you shoot an enemy and the AI [dumbly] moves to the source of the sound - that is scripted? Try again. Even though it's adding a level of complexity by actually going through the motions of communicating information between the individual AI, it's not *THAT* great.

No, I am telling you that when reinforcements are magically called in during such events, then its scripted. Like when a door opens up and more AI rush out, or some bunch of guys suddenly arrive from a previously cleared area. That wont happen in Far Cry.

[Placebo 29]

Whether scripted or not scripted that latest movie has made me think I'll have fun playing this game, obviously it's not a game that can be compared to Opf, they will both have their own different strengths and weaknesses. I'm looking forward to Far Cry, the only thing right now that I don't like the look of is the colour scheme, the graphics all look a bit bright and clean and shiny and cartoony (if that makes sense), I prefer things a bit darker/dirtier/skankier.

[Sharia 0]

I prefer things a bit darker/dirtier/skankier.

Is this a reference to your sexual tastes?

[Gollum1 0]

I prefer things a bit darker/dirtier/skankier.

Is this a reference to your sexual tastes?

The last video looks nice, anyway.

[Placebo 29]

I prefer things a bit darker/dirtier/skankier.

Is this a reference to your sexual tastes?

Moderating bots aren't programmed with sexual tastes

[theavonlady 2]

Someone have a link for the latest video(s)?