ALiVE - Advanced Light Infantry Virtual Environment 1.0 (GA)

[SavageCDN 231]

1 hour ago, zuzul said:

Hi everyone,

 

I'm discovering the Alive mod with great pleasure.

I'm working on a asymetric warfare on Tanoa island and I may need your advices: it will be for 4 to 10 players max, mostly 5/6 on the average.

It will be a BLUFOR played on domination against Syndikate on assymetric.

My question is how to balance the numbers of opposition forces to keep something playable for so few players? 

Any other advices or recommendation will be much appreciated. 

 

Regards,

 

Zuzul

 

Heroes will have some good suggestions for you... basically testing is your best bet.  Let the mission run through for a few hours (run in editor at 4 x speed) so that you get a feel for how things will go without players (ie: how the AI do on their own), then adjust your numbers from there.

[zuzul 81]

1 minute ago, SavageCDN said:

 

Heroes will have some good suggestions for you... basically testing is your best bet.  Let the mission run through for a few hours (run in editor at 4 x speed) so that you get a feel for how things will go without players (ie: how the AI do on their own), then adjust your numbers from there.

Thanks for the tip, I'll do that tonight to check this out.

I'm basing myself on the mission template "Insurgency (Altis)". I assume the values in the Alive modules  inside are corrects. 

[SavageCDN 231]

2 minutes ago, zuzul said:

Thanks for the tip, I'll do that tonight to check this out.

I'm basing myself on the mission template "Insurgency (Altis)". I assume the values in the Alive modules  inside are corrects. 

 

I would double-check any of the settings from the template just to ensure it is what you want in your mission.  Don't forget to do a player test as well with a few guys on the server before you have your 'official' mission running... to iron out any MP-related problems.  Check the wiki for any questions and post on the ALiVE forums if you are stuck.

 

http://alivemod.com/wiki/index.php?title=Main_Page

 

http://alivemod.com/forum/

 

[HeroesandvillainsOS 1504]

@zuzul SavageCDN's advice is basically the most important thing for balancing an insurgency mission. Let the mission run for a few hours with Virtual AI debugged so you can see what's going on and whether the insurgents and/or friendlies are too many or too few over time. I also debug OPCOM Installations in the Admin Actions option in the ALiVE menu often when doing the fast forward sim as well.

 

One thing to consider is, Insurgents can only replenish their forces by establishing civilian recruitment centers. So let's say you see way too many insurgents after a few hours. To counter that, you can:

 

1. Reduce the amount of civs on the map (I don't like this option unless performance is bad)

 

2. Increase the number in the Assymetric Commander module for min civs present to make a recruitment center (default is 2 and raising this is something I do often).

 

3. Reduce the amount of simultaneous objectives for the Asymmetric Commander (default is 10 and lowering this is something I do often).

 

4. Other obvious stuff like increasing the number of friendly spawns, or decreasing their objective filtering in the CIV/MIL obj modules.

 

Whether you outnumber them, or the insurgents outnumber you on mission start is really a matter of taste. Just remember when testing...only humans can physically destroy and remove insurgent HQ's (such as civ recruitment centers) from the map. With that in mind, fast forwarding and watching the mission for a few hours is still your best bet, if you keep in mind you'll be removing some of those installations as they pop up when you're physically playing.

[scottb613 285]

Hi Folks,

 

Military Placement - Custom Objectives - working with ALiVE ORBAT - Unsung - on the relatively new Cambodia map (Hero's Index)...

 

Trying to use the Custom Objectives - it seems there is no way to control the spawn radius of troops by using a TAOR Marker like on the other placement modules ??? Seems troops are spawned up to a thousand yards or more from the module - no matter the size ? Only reason this is an issue is there are plenty of rivers and it seems AI won't cross water - no matter how small ?

 

Anyone have any ideas - much appreciated...

 

*** Note: Think I learned something new with ORBAT - if used - you can't change the load outs in the mission editor's arsenal - must be changed in ORBAT itself - correct ???

 

Thanks...

 

Regards,

Scott

[HeroesandvillainsOS 1504]

@scottb613 Custom Objective modules don't use TAOR markers. They place groups/objectives, within a radius, in clusters, within the defined size of the custom objective itself.

 

Example: Let's say you place a Custom Objective module with a size of 50. Where that module is placed, units/an objective will spawn within 50 meters of the module.

 

 

[scottb613 285]

Hi Hero,

 

Thanks so much for the response - yeah - that's how I thought it should work... Very simple mission - OPFOR has (2) Custom Objectives Modules with no other placement modules -  the one I am sitting on that spawns 0 troops (king of the hill) - and another 500 yards away - with a 25 meter size - that spawns (8) Infantry that I would expect to attack my hill - some of the OPFOR troops are spawned 1000 meters or more out...

 

Regards,
Scott  

[HeroesandvillainsOS 1504]

53 minutes ago, scottb613 said:

Hi Hero,

 

Thanks so much for the response - yeah - that's how I thought it should work... Very simple mission - OPFOR has (2) Custom Objectives Modules with no other placement modules -  the one I am sitting on that spawns 0 troops (king of the hill) - and another 500 yards away - with a 25 meter size - that spawns (8) Infantry that I would expect to attack my hill - some of the OPFOR troops are spawned 1000 meters or more out...

 

Regards,
Scott  

Ok. Talking this through with one of the devs, this is intended behavior.

 

"it's possible for profiles to spawn as far as 500 meters from their profiled position (where profiled position is whatever was assigned during the placement module work)."

 

So I guess this is because so many groups are set to spawn at a single objective, or rather, that's how I'm interpreting it. So in other words, they'll profile where the objective is but physically spawn up to 500 meters away (if I understand correctly). If you lower the number from 8, or use several modules with 2 groups set to spawn or so, they'll *probably* spawn in more reliable positions but I'd have to test. Just a guess on my part.

 

I'm now curious to see what would happen if you tried to spawn an absurd number at a single objective, like 100, but that's another conversation for another time. :)

 

To verify, try setting up a similar mission on Stratis as the one you made, with just ALiVE and CBA. I have a feeling it will act the same way, sending some groups away from the module/objective position when you get close enough for them to spawn.

 

 

[spyderblack723 407]

Quote

must be changed in ORBAT itself - correct ???

 

Correct.

[HeroesandvillainsOS 1504]

So I decided just for the heck of it to run that custom objective group test! One map, one man, one objective, ONE HUNDRED group spawns!

 

In the editor, I placed ALiVE Required, Virtual AI, AI Commander, and one Custom Objective module over Agia Marina on Stratis set to spawn 100 infantry groups, using the default module settings:

 

 

I made sure to keep myself spawned on the bottom of the map. This is the result when the 100 groups were virtualized:

 

And then when I teleported myself near them. Notice the clock and how long it took for them all to spawn in the game world lol (hint, the answer was around 4 minutes. Not bad at all consider this is probably around 400+ actual soldiers, and also impressive is how they basically didn't despawn and teleport anywhere when physically spawning in):

 

Soldiers galaore! Wow. It was a sausage-fest! Every nook, every cranny. Every place you could imagine was just swimming in soldiers patrolling around. And surprisingly, my FPS was fantastic.

 

Photos can't really do this experiment justice. The amount of dudes walking around was just totally bonkers. Anyway, seems to work exactly as I described earlier. Doing the same test with just 2 groups instead of 100, you'll see they cluster closer to the module and the default radius:

[scottb613 285]

Hi Hero,

Hah - that's just crazy... I think half the fun with ALiVE is throwing down modules just to see what happens... Thats a very cool little test and well documented... Well done - sir...

I messed with this some more last night - I tried using (2) separate Custom Objectives - with only (4) units each to see if I could get them to spawn closer to the placed module - seems to work a little better - the modules are flanked by rivers on both sides and in the heart of the jungle - so maybe that pushes my troops a bit further out ?

I did notice some groups swimming the river to get to their objective - while others just stalled at the shoreline... I'm not sure of what the rhyme or reason is with that....

I also noticed - I can't seem to weight the Custom Objectives using the size and importance variables... When left at the default 50/50 - too many units where staying behind at the spawning objectives and not mounting an offensive up the hill... I changed the settings to 10/10 and 90/90 - seemed to have no effect... The idea is - I'd like to use the two spawning Custom Objective Modules - to strictly spawn troops - I'd like to see all the troops attack up the hill towards the Custom Objective Module I am occupying... The Military commanders are set to BLUFOR (Invasion) and OPFOR (Occupation)... The Custom Objective Module that doesn't spawn troops that I am sitting on belongs to OPFOR...

I was also wondering if I could randomize the inclusion of the Custom Objectives - so maybe some battles would have (4) units - others might have (8) - etc etc etc ??? So any given battle - you really don't know what you're going to be up against...

Any suggestions on how to improve this behavior ?

This is kind of a "Hamburger Hill" in reverse - where the USMC holds the fortified hill position...

Thanks...

Regards,
Scott


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[HeroesandvillainsOS 1504]

@scottb613 Remember, you are spawning objectives here. Whether groups are spawning with the module or not, custom objectives are objectives, and its OPCOM's job to man and protect them, based on size and priority. If you want groups to spawn on a location and head somewhere else, manually place the groups yourself making sure they are virtualized, and place a high priority custom objective where you want the groups to go.

 

Don't quote me but in the editor I think you can set a percent chance that the module spawns at all. Like 50% it spawns and 50% it doesn't. Again don't quote me but I think each editor module has this option. Take a look and see and maybe it will accomplish what you're hoping to accomplish with randomization. If randomization is available, anyway.

[scottb613 285]

Hi Hero,

As always your insights are most welcome and appreciated - hmm - I'll try creating groups directly and syncing them to the Military Commander as well... As far as the priority - it just seemed the values had no effect no matter how I set them... Yeah - I've seen the probability - but wasn't sure if it would work with all the syncing going in... More things to try...

Certainly appreciate all the efforts of the ALiVE team as well - just a can't I use Arma without it... Bravo Zulu !!!

Regards,
Scott


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[HeroesandvillainsOS 1504]

@scottb613 Don't sync the groups to anything other than the Virtual AI module (assuming you use the option in the Virtual AI module to virtualize synced units).

 

To sync the group properly, just sync the group leader. The rest of the group will automatically virtualize. If it's a manned vehicle, sync the vehicle and not the occupants, and if it's a vehicle with a group leader standing outside the vehicle, again just sync the leader to Virtual AI.

[scottb613 285]

Hi Hero,

Really - I thought the Military Commander would have to know about it to be included in its force pool ? Just the Virtual AI will do that ?

Will try it as you stated...

Thanks...

Regards,
Scott


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[HeroesandvillainsOS 1504]

14 minutes ago, scottb613 said:

Hi Hero,

Really - I thought the Military Commander would have to know about it to be included in its force pool ? Just the Virtual AI will do that ?

Will try it as you stated...

Thanks...

Regards,
Scott


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

As long as they are virtualized, they get included/counted on mission start in the original starting group numbers that LOGCOM uses to determine battle casualty replacements.

 

You can have a properly working mission with Military Logistics even without spawning a single group from a module and just manually placing all the groups yourself. I know because I've done it and it's a dreadfully painful way to make a full blown mission, but hey, I like pain occasionally if the mission is cool. :)

[froggyluv 2136]

 

 Any recommended CQB heavy, alive missions - can be on any map - i just need it for testing

[HeroesandvillainsOS 1504]

50 minutes ago, froggyluv said:

 

 Any recommended CQB heavy, alive missions - can be on any map - i just need it for testing

Hi Froggyluv! I can't personally think of any offhand that really push CQB as the primary means of fighting, though if this is for testing, it would be pretty simple to set one up.

 

Did you need help getting started? I can always help you or even make you something super quick and dirty if you don't feel comfortable with modules.

 

Or you could always grab one of anyone's that's already in a released state and just unpack it and crank up the CQB. 

 

My mission Inshallah is on Workshop and there is definitely breathing room for higher CQB density you could always tinker with too. I have it set to 10% with pairs set to spawn in insurgent controlled areas. You could probably set it to 20% no problem (especially for testing since the FPS hit wouldn't be as important), and even use the feature to pre-place some CQB locations on top of it.  

 

If you wanted to avoid additional mods, I have one on Tanoa you could do the same treatment to.

 

Otherwise, just place ALiVE required, Virtual AI, Military AI Commander, a synced Military Placement Civilian Objective and/or Military Placement Military Objective, then place an unsynced CQB module (synced if the Commander is Assymetric if you want), adjust the settings within and you'll be good to go. 

[froggyluv 2136]

 

 Thanks Heroes I see how it works and got it up and running

 Cheers

[zuzul 81]

Hi there,

 

I want to say first a big THANK YOU for the Alive mod. This is simply fantastic. I love it, my team loves it, this is quite perfect.

I got a little question: does the vanilla vehicule respawn works with Alive? I might have done something bad in the vehicule respawn module, but I better ask you before checking my mission.

 

Second point: I don't see any French translation of the radio messages and tasks. I haven't checked the repository yet, but will it be of some help to you guys if I do it?

 

Regards,

 

Zuzul

 

[katipo66 94]

8 hours ago, HeroesandvillainsOS said:

Otherwise, just place ALiVE required, Virtual AI, Military AI Commander, a synced Military Placement Civilian Objective and/or Military Placement Military Objective, then place an unsynced CQB module (synced if the Commander is Assymetric if you want), adjust the settings within and you'll be good to go. 

 

Cool, so that's barebones way to populate whole map with bad guys, what difference does syncing the CQB module to Ai commander set to assymetric make?

[tupolov 520]

2 hours ago, zuzul said:

Hi there,

 

I want to say first a big THANK YOU for the Alive mod. This is simply fantastic. I love it, my team loves it, this is quite perfect.

I got a little question: does the vanilla vehicule respawn works with Alive? I might have done something bad in the vehicule respawn module, but I better ask you before checking my mission.

 

Second point: I don't see any French translation of the radio messages and tasks. I haven't checked the repository yet, but will it be of some help to you guys if I do it?

 

Regards,

 

Zuzul

 

If you are wanting to respawn player vehicles, ensure they are not "virtualised" and use vanilla respawn as required. Combat support units have their own respawn mechanism.

 

French translations would be awesome, merci beaucoup! There's a fair few stringtable.xml files in ALiVE where you can add translations. Unfortunately, our task system is not set up for translation yet, we can implement that if are willing to do the translations :)

[zuzul 81]

2 minutes ago, tupolov said:

If you are wanting to respawn player vehicles, ensure they are not "virtualised" and use vanilla respawn as required. Combat support units have their own respawn mechanism.

 

French translations would be awesome, merci beaucoup! There's a fair few stringtable.xml files in ALiVE where you can add translations. Unfortunately, our task system is not set up for translation yet, we can implement that if are willing to do the translations :)

yep, no vehicule virtualised, should be an error on my side.

 

I'll check the stringtable files and propose you a translation, hopefully this summer.

 

Regards

[reaper lok 82]

21 hours ago, HeroesandvillainsOS said:

As long as they are virtualized, they get included/counted on mission start in the original starting group numbers that LOGCOM uses to determine battle casualty replacements.

 

You can have a properly working mission with Military Logistics even without spawning a single group from a module and just manually placing all the groups yourself. I know because I've done it and it's a dreadfully painful way to make a full blown mission, but hey, I like pain occasionally if the mission is cool. :)

 

 

I have recently been messing about with just using the CUSTOM OBJECTIVE MODULE and some some success with randomizing start locations by using empty markers synced to the CUSTOM OBJECTIVE MODULE.

 

E.G:

 

1.  Select a cool custom composition to use within the custom objective then sync several empty markers to the custom objective module.

2.  Find some good locations where the composition could spawn without interruption (obstacles) then move the empty markers to these locations.

3.  Place down a Task module (standard BIS Task module) and use an "attachTo" line on code to attach it to the CUSTOM OBJECTIVE MODULE.

task1 attachTo [aliveobjective1, [0, 0, 1] ];  *Make sure you name both Task Module and Custom Objective

4.  You can even mess with the Task Module settings to move the Task from being placed directly on the composition (so you can search for it - yet know its radius etc).

 

Advanced Options:

Set a trigger also attached to the CUSTOM OBJECTIVE MODULE with a Radius of your choice and create a capture and hold scenario.  This may require the use of the below script code inside the triggers condition field to detect virtualized ALiVE units.

((count ([getposATL thisTrigger, 50, ["EAST","entity"]] call ALIVE_fnc_getNearProfiles)) > 0);

 

*Google search ALiVE script snippets - it will take you to the relevant wiki page :)

 

Also:

Maybe set up an enemy HQ area away from the main AO (using the basic ALiVE modules) and use the LOGISTICS module to set up a reinforcement pool to help send troops to your CUSTOM OBJECTIVE.

 

I have had some pretty good success with the above but I am no way a script guy or code guy.....I just beg borrow and steal from this great community ;)  

 

Sidenote - I as running a custom mission on Malden this week and got hammered by static mortar teams as I approached the East Airfield.....although it ended in a bloody mess (my blood).....it was outstanding hearing the enemy fire and the shell leaving the tube, the short wait, approaching scream of the mortar round then a massive boom!  Then darkness.

 

 

 

[zuzul 81]

Hello,

 

I may have a stupid question (i wasn't able to find the answer in this forum, sorry if it has been asked before): what is the use of sending SITREP and PATROLREP to the IA commander? Does it have impacts on the game itself or is it mainly for the players use? 

 

Also, I want to mute the playing character to report everything on radio (like spotting ennemies): there is some mods to do it, but is there one you know is working great with Alive?

 

Regards,

 

Zul