DirecxtX 12 for ArmA 3?

[vegeta897 13]

As far as I know, nowhere outside the EU has ruled it unlawful to tie software to hardware, so customers outside the EU will have to purchase a new licence if they wish to install Windows 10 on different hardware.

According to this FAQ from yesterday, that isn't true if you have a retail license.

[doveman 7]

According to this FAQ from yesterday, that isn't true if you have a retail license.

Retail licences were never tied to hardware as far as I know, it was only OEM licences that MS tied to hardware, so only those are affected by the EU rulings (which didn't involve MS directly but established the principle for all perpetual software licences. Software that is provided on a subscription basis, e.g. 1-year for £50, was specifically excluded in the ruling).

[vegeta897 13]

Bratwurste said regardless of having retail Windows 7/8, you'll have to buy Windows 10 again after 1 year for new machines. But the FAQ I just quoted says he's wrong.

[doveman 7]

Bratwurste said regardless of having retail Windows 7/8, you'll have to buy Windows 10 again after 1 year for new machines. But the FAQ I just quoted says he's wrong.

Ah sorry, I didn't notice he'd said that. Yeah, I agree that's not the case.

[CaptainAzimuth 714]

I believe a few people have been running Arma 3 on Windows X already, and claim to notice great performance boosts, and FPS. I'm half tempted to try the Insider build myself, having been accepted into the Insider, I have yet to actually use it's access due to only using one system. I choose to rather not risk anything, at least until RTM, despite how stable the recent builds claim to be. From what I've heard, it's quite promising.

[Brisse 78]

I believe a few people have been running Arma 3 on Windows X already, and claim to notice great performance boosts, and FPS. I'm half tempted to try the Insider build myself, having been accepted into the Insider, I have yet to actually use it's access due to only using one system. I choose to rather not risk anything, at least until RTM, despite how stable the recent builds claim to be. From what I've heard, it's quite promising.

Been running it on my laptop for a while, and despite having the latest version there are plenty of bugs. I would not install on my primary desktop PC at the moment.

I have been reading some gaming benchmarks online (you will find lots by searching) and it seems going from 7 to 8.1 boosts your performance just slightly, at about 1%. Windows 10 then steps back 1 or 2 percent and brings it down below Windows 7 performance. That may change with the release version though, since there lots of data logging going on in the Technical Preview.

Gaming performance is roughly the same though. There's no way anyone could subjectively tell 7, 8 and 10 apart. Of course, that will all change in a big way when Dx12 games start rolling out this fall.

[brightcandle 114]

Gaming performance is roughly the same though. There's no way anyone could subjectively tell 7, 8 and 10 apart. Of course, that will all change in a big way when Dx12 games start rolling out this fall.

Games designed and written on DX12 sure, those that weren't aren't likely to see much of a boost. Arma 3 wont see any useful boost at all when its ported due to the bottlenecks the profiler pointed out as being elsewhere.

[waxman 5]

Games designed and written on DX12 sure, those that weren't aren't likely to see much of a boost. Arma 3 wont see any useful boost at all when its ported due to the bottlenecks the profiler pointed out as being elsewhere.

I would just like to point out that Project cars has patched internally to DX12 and they get a 30-40% increase in Fps, that's a game that was not designed for DX12 and sees a significant increase.

[Armitxes 36]

I would just like to point out that Project cars has patched internally to DX12 and they get a 30-40% increase in Fps, that's a game that was not designed for DX12 and sees a significant increase.

With DX12 even +100% FPS increase was measured for some games, but at the end we can only wait to see how A3 profits from this :)

Most cards, even newer ones, aren't fully DX12 compatible. Only partial support.. many factors will play a role.

There are claims that some unreleased AMD-GPU even reached +800% extra performance boost but that could be just marketing.

Edited June 24, 2015 by Armitxes

[waxman 5]

With DX12 even +100% FPS increase was measured for some games, but at the end we can only wait to see how A3 profits from this :)

Most cards, even newer ones, aren't fully DX12 compatible. Only partial support.. many factors will play a role.

There are claims that some unreleased AMD-GPU even reached +800% extra performance boost but that could be just marketing.

I believe that all GCN 1.0+ and Kepler+ cards are DX12 compliant however DX12 is only the smallest subset of new functionality there is also going to be additional functionality that these cards do not support in fact I don't believe any current cards support all the DX12 functionality. This is very similar to the introduction of DX11 with DX11.1 and DX11.2 being 'oprional' sets of functions.

I would be very very happy with 800% performance improvements :D

[CaptainAzimuth 714]

Been running it on my laptop for a while, and despite having the latest version there are plenty of bugs. I would not install on my primary desktop PC at the moment.

I have been reading some gaming benchmarks online (you will find lots by searching) and it seems going from 7 to 8.1 boosts your performance just slightly, at about 1%. Windows 10 then steps back 1 or 2 percent and brings it down below Windows 7 performance. That may change with the release version though, since there lots of data logging going on in the Technical Preview.

Gaming performance is roughly the same though. There's no way anyone could subjectively tell 7, 8 and 10 apart. Of course, that will all change in a big way when Dx12 games start rolling out this fall.

I figure that's what BIS plan on doing with the Expansion update, is incorporating DX12 somehow in Engine.

[DancZer 65]

I figure that's what BIS plan on doing with the Expansion update, is incorporating DX12 somehow in Engine.

It's logical choice btw. They have lot of time to do it and after that they can tweak it with smaller updates.

As things goes with A3 i don't worry now. I feel the difference between A2 and A3 era and i bet BI will do they best, just as they did with DLC-s.

[Vasily.B 529]

My fresh buyed GPU (year ago) doesnt support DX12. Does it mean i need to buy another GPU!? I feel it : Game have better performance on DX 12, BUT game can be re-optimized on DX 11 as well. Why it uses 30-40% GPU, 40-50% one of 4 CPU cores, keeping rest of cores about 20-30% ? THIS should be reworked, no Dx-12. People who have support of DX 12 will be able to play DX 11 games, people who havent DX12 support, will not be able to play Arma 3 at all.

[Greenfist 1863]

My fresh buyed GPU (year ago) doesnt support DX12. Does it mean i need to buy another GPU!? I feel it : Game have better performance on DX 12, BUT game can be re-optimized on DX 11 as well. Why it uses 30-40% GPU, 40-50% one of 4 CPU cores, keeping rest of cores about 20-30% ? THIS should be reworked, no Dx-12. People who have support of DX 12 will be able to play DX 11 games, people who havent DX12 support, will not be able to play Arma 3 at all.

You mentioned elsewhere you have R9 270C, right? It supports DX12. (DX12 Ready AMDs)

And people with DX11 will still be able to play. It will not be removed.

[Vasily.B 529]

You mentioned elsewhere you have R9 270C, right? It supports DX12.

And people with DX11 will still be able to play. It will not be removed.

My card doesnt support Dx 12 - only 11.2. But if we will be able to play, then fine.

[linuxmaster9 101]

My fresh buyed GPU (year ago) doesnt support DX12. Does it mean i need to buy another GPU!? I feel it : Game have better performance on DX 12, BUT game can be re-optimized on DX 11 as well. Why it uses 30-40% GPU, 40-50% one of 4 CPU cores, keeping rest of cores about 20-30% ? THIS should be reworked, no Dx-12. People who have support of DX 12 will be able to play DX 11 games, people who havent DX12 support, will not be able to play Arma 3 at all.

 

If they moved to Vulkan API instead of DX12, all AMD GPUs beginning with first gen GCN as well as any GPU that supports OpenGL 3.1 spec would work with Vulkan API. My 7970Ghz would work for example.

Games designed and written on DX12 sure, those that weren't aren't likely to see much of a boost. Arma 3 wont see any useful boost at all when its ported due to the bottlenecks the profiler pointed out as being elsewhere.

It would be better if they moved to the Vulkan API which will officially be released by the end of 2015. With Vulkan, Every version of Windows from XP to 10 and every version of Mac OSX and Linux Kernel 4.x will support the API. It would not limit the benefits (which are essentially the same as DX12) to only users of Windows 10.

[chortles 263]

Not that that factored in their decision making, not least because of how explicitly Linux/Mac support is lower priority...

[linuxmaster9 101]

Not that that factored in their decision making, not least because of how explicitly Linux/Mac support is lower priority...

My point was not about the Linux/Mac ports. It is about the universal benefit the Vulkan API would have regardless of the OS version you are running as long as it is XP or newer tech. With DX12, you are locking out anyone who chooses not to 'upgrade' to Windows 10. Keep in mind that Windows 10 is not really "free" you are agreeing to be Microsoft's new product. They will use the data they collect from you (it is in the EULA) to target advertisements and other services towards you. Microsoft is moving to a service company versus a standard software company. It is moving to Windows as a Service. They require you to have a Microsoft Account to use Windows 10. They want you to use OneDrive. Skype. Every Microsoft service or product. The more of the ecosystem you use, the more they make from advertising to you or selling the data they collect on you to 3rd party companies. Google does something similar as does Apple. the difference is that Google lets you choose things like: which platform to use, if you use gmail, youtube, etc. It lets you make choices. That is something that Microsoft and Windows 10 don't.

You may have noticed that it is much more difficult to set your own default browser for example.

 

The underlying point of this is that with directX 12, you are limited to essentially ONE platform version if you want the benefits of DX12. with Vulkan, you are free to choose the platform. You will still receive all the benefits of the API. Both APIs achieve the same thing. they just do it their own ways.

[chortles 263]

And I'm saying that choosing DX12 is a sign that (in correlation with the lower priority of Linux/Mac) suggests that they did not consider what you described to be a problem for them... I'll note that Bohemia has more than once described Enfusion as multiplatform, suggesting that they do consider that a priority for future titles, but IIRC they haven't made any public remarks about DX12 vs. Vulkan for that.

[mobile_medic 43]

 

 

They require you to have a Microsoft Account to use Windows 10

 

As I understand it, you are not actually required to have a microsoft account tied to your windows 10 install. Though, it will make some things a pain in the ass if you don't.

[Vasily.B 529]

Wel, i'mnot so up to date, but this Vulkan API seems to be pretty good, and if there is so much benefits..... hmm. If any BOhemia Developer is reading this, lets write about it - is there any plans for Vulcan or DX 12?

[chortles 263]

Bohemia has on multiple occasions stated interest in DX12 but have been silent about Vulkan, much less its potential support in their future engine (which is not a direct descendant of Arma 3's).

[Vasily.B 529]

Bohemia has on multiple occasions stated interest in DX12 but have been silent about Vulkan, much less its potential support in their future engine (which is not a direct descendant of Arma 3's).

AFAIK it potential support is same as directX. I'm not up-to-date mean i dont know how status have this project - when it will be released for sure. For me it seems more fair tot he players than DX12, but choice is for Bohemia.  Users who doesnt have GPU supporting DX12 will still have stuttering and low fps (me for example) even after tweaking system, bios, and game itself it will still be laggy. THIS IS NOT FAIR FOR THOSE USERS.

[fareast 20]

My card doesnt support Dx 12 - only 11.2. But if we will be able to play, then fine.

 if ur card support 11.2 it does support the basic dx12..

[heavygunner 179]

AFAIK it potential support is same as directX. I'm not up-to-date mean i dont know how status have this project - when it will be released for sure. For me it seems more fair tot he players than DX12, but choice is for Bohemia.  Users who doesnt have GPU supporting DX12 will still have stuttering and low fps (me for example) even after tweaking system, bios, and game itself it will still be laggy. THIS IS NOT FAIR FOR THOSE USERS.

As already pointed out, your card supports DX12.

You should inform yourself before claiming that certain actions would be unfair.