Ukraine General

[spooky lynx 73]

What an obsession for you. How many neo nazis fighting alongside so called DPR ? The most far right regime in Europe isn't Putin's one ? All that is pathetic. Yes there are neo nazis in Ukraine, are they ruling the country ? What was there score in the last presidential elections ?

Yes, how many except notorious Milchakov?

The most far right regime in Europe is Putin's? Sure, it is far right regime with many national regions with two or three official state languages, with many nationalities represented in parliament, government and state agencies.

Yes Ukrainian nazis rule the country as they freely have illegal armed detachments, they freely harass anyone including state employees, they kill anyone who is against current regime. Score? Who cares about the score if it is possible to do whatever you want without any prosecution?

I don't know about that.

But I do know that 'Russian defender' Putin took side of Chechen extremists Kadyrov father and son, who told Chechens 'kill 100, 200 Russians if possible'. Now they are national heroes and the father is even getting his own statue. Great job!

Some US persons say the same. So what?

[Sub-Human 10]

Some US persons say the same. So what?

No, they do not. But you always have to talk about USA, right? It's never about Russia or Putin. Enjoy getting paid for writing this drivel online?

[spooky lynx 73]

No, they do not.

Yes they do.

But you always have to talk about USA, right? It's never about Russia or Putin.

I don't like when phoney accuses anyone in dishonesty.

[Sub-Human 10]

Yes they do.

I don't like when phoney accuses anyone in dishonesty.

Haha, I don't know if you're stupid or what.

In Russia, former terrorist calling for jihad of Russian civilians (not Americans, not Europeans) receives National Hero status, becomes leader of Republic, gets statue in his honor.

In USA, a former general expressed his opinion that Russian agression in Ukraine can only be stopped by killing not Americans, but by killing Russian soldiers.

To recap: thanks to Putler, an anti-Russian terrorist is considered a Russian hero. It is equivalent to Bush giving a medal to Osama Bin Laden and allowing him to become governor of California.

[astral4eg 10]

In Russia, former terrorist calling for jihad of Russian civilians (not Americans, not Europeans) receives National Hero status, becomes leader of Republic, gets statue in his honor.

And for this, Putin has a very large dislike in Russia.

Chechnya and the neighboring Muslim republics have a very big problem in Russia, but officially it prefer not to speak.

[spooky lynx 73]

Haha, I don't know if you're stupid or what.

In Russia, former terrorist calling for jihad of Russian civilians (not Americans, not Europeans) receives National Hero status, becomes leader of Republic, gets statue in his honor.

In USA, a former general expressed his opinion that Russian agression in Ukraine can only be stopped by killing not Americans, but by killing Russian soldiers.

To recap: thanks to Putler, an anti-Russian terrorist is considered a Russian hero. It is equivalent to Bush giving a medal to Osama Bin Laden and allowing him to become governor of California.

Despite of all the words said that terrorist made much more in the way of struggling with terrorism than many of those who said "We must fight terrorism!". And despite of all the words about partnership and international laws our western neighbours do everything possible to ruin our country - from building and keeping a number of military bases around to paying internal 'opposition' that is formed by former corrupt officials who don't care about the people at all.

Edit.

As I've been banned from 'Russophobia General' thread (funny indeed, nice way to avoid discussion through labeling opponent payed troll and forbidding him to post, that's really free and democratic behavior:D), I'd reply here;

How Russian 'patriots' really care about their veterans:

Another opinion on this photo.

BTW what a nice wave of the same posts with this photo...

P.S. If you ban me here - let it be.

Edited May 11, 2015 by Spooky Lynx
Freedom of speech my ass...

[oxmox 73]

Special Report: Russian soldiers quit over Ukraine (Reuters)

Some Russian soldiers are quitting the army because of the conflict in Ukraine,

several soldiers and human rights activists have told Reuters.

Their accounts call into question the Kremlin's continued assertions that no Russian soldiers have been sent to Ukraine, and that any Russians fighting alongside rebels there are volunteers. Evidence for Russians fighting in Ukraine – Russian army equipment found in the country, testimony from soldiers' families and from Ukrainians who say they were captured by Russian paratroopers – is abundant.

Until now, however, it has been extremely rare to find Russian soldiers who have fought there and are willing to talk. It is even rarer to find soldiers who have quit the army. Five soldiers who recently quit, including two who said they left rather than serve in Ukraine, have told Reuters of their experiences.

http://www.reuters.com/article/2015/05/10/us-ukraine-crisis-soldiers-specialreport-idUSKBN0NV06Q20150510

Russia 'lost 220 troops' in Ukraine - Nemtsov report (BBC)

An investigation by Russian opposition activists has concluded that 220 Russian soldiers died in two major battles in eastern Ukraine.

The report includes data compiled by the opposition politician Boris Nemtsov, who was shot dead in February.

The 64-page report, called Putin - War, has been published on the Open Russia news website.

Russia denies Western accusations that it has sent regular troops and armour to help the rebels in eastern Ukraine.

It details how 150 Russian soldiers were killed in the key battle for Ilovaisk, a small town in the Donetsk region, in August 2014.

More recently, it says, 70 Russian soldiers died in the battle for Debaltseve, which fell to pro-Russian rebels in February, after the Minsk ceasefire deal was signed.

Most of the report is based on facts that have already appeared in Russian and foreign media during a year of conflict in Crimea and eastern Ukraine.

But colleagues of Boris Nemtsov say putting them together makes a very compelling case for accusing Vladimir Putin of waging the war in Ukraine for his own ends.

There are plenty of Russians aware of their country's involvement in eastern Ukraine, who nevertheless find it acceptable because they believe Moscow is supporting those who wish to be independent of the government in Kiev. Mr Yashin and other opposition activists don't call that "support" - they accuse Mr Putin of masterminding and directing the war to boost his failing popularity.

Kept under wraps

A leading economist who contributed to the report, Sergei Aleksashenko, estimated Russia's spending on the rebellion in eastern Ukraine to be 53bn roubles (£665m; $1bn).

The report says relatives of the 150 soldiers killed at Ilovaisk received 2m roubles each (£25,100; $39,000) after agreeing not to reveal how the men had died.

However, relatives of the 70 who died in Debaltseve were given no compensation from the Russian defence ministry, the report says.

--> By that time soldiers sent to fight in eastern Ukraine were being released from the regular army, to make it look as if they were volunteers, according to the report.

http://www.bbc.com/news/world-europe-32705610

* "disguised as volunteers", we were exactly talking about this possibility already last year.....

What about the regular troops NATO/US was talking about who mainly work in special roles i.e. advisor, organisation, special equipment .......

Edited May 14, 2015 by oxmox

[Sub-Human 10]

(Russian) Putin. War

Only available in Russian so far, here's Google Translation:

Google Translated

[Rydygier 1317]

The law recognizing the legal status of freedom fighters, including members of the UPA, signed

So, they in the same law prohibit communistic and nazi (always good to see both together in such context) symbols and propaganda and confirming once more as heroic their own bandits and own kind of crimes. The more, they want to punish everyone, who would "insult the memory" of those bandits. The truth is never insulting, but they apparently refuse to recognize this as a truth or, the worse, don't care. It's just one of the signals, they don't care not only about the truth, but also about Poland or relations with Poland. They chose to build own future on the lies about the past, doing the same thing, Russia does: whitewashing.

BTW, I wonder, if there is any country/nation on this world ready to accept the whole truth about the own history, just like that. I guess not. Just some are not ready more, than others.

[Tonci87 163]

The law recognizing the legal status of freedom fighters, including members of the UPA, signed

So, they in the same law prohibit communistic and nazi (always good to see both together in such context) symbols and propaganda and confirming once more as heroic their own bandits and own kind of crimes. The more, they want to punish everyone, who would "insult the memory" of those bandits. The truth is never insulting, but they apparently refuse to recognize this as a truth or, the worse, don't care. It's just one of the signals, they don't care not only about the truth, but also about Poland or relations with Poland. They chose to build own future on the lies about the past, doing the same thing, Russia does: whitewashing.

BTW, I wonder, if there is any country/nation on this world ready to accept the whole truth about the own history, just like that. I guess not. Just some are not ready more, than others.

Well Germany is very accepting.

[John Kozak 14]

Despite of all the words said that terrorist made much more in the way of struggling with terrorism than many of those who said "We must fight terrorism!". And despite of all the words about partnership and international laws our western neighbours do everything possible to ruin our country - from building and keeping a number of military bases around to paying internal 'opposition' that is formed by former corrupt officials who don't care about the people at all.

Edit.

As I've been banned from 'Russophobia General' thread (funny indeed, nice way to avoid discussion through labeling opponent payed troll and forbidding him to post, that's really free and democratic behavior:D), I'd reply here;

Another opinion on this photo.

BTW what a nice wave of the same posts with this photo...

P.S. If you ban me here - let it be.

That post you referred to does not give *any* proof for its accusations. Just a lot of dirt throwing disguised with "let me tell you how it really is" false expert flair. In other words, it is total paid BS.

Is that blog your source for all info?

Edited May 16, 2015 by DarkWanderer

[Rydygier 1317]

Poroshenko knelt in front of the Polish graves in Bykivnya

Other source about the same event

President of Ukraine during a ceremony in Bykivnya, where lie the victims of the communist regime, remarked that "he did what he should have done" in the signing of the act of glorifying the Ukrainian Insurgent Army.

"The Ukrainian state has done what he was supposed to. Now the rest is up to historians and the government should take care of the future" - said Petro Poroshenko.

[Sub-Human 10]

Captured GRU sergeant.

[BlenderRUS 6]

Nothing special... just meat for the ukrainian soldiers :)

[mistyronin 1181]

(Reuters) Ukraine says it will prosecute captured Russian soldiers for terrorist acts

Ukraine on Monday accused two captured Russian servicemen of having killed Ukrainian troops in fighting in its east and said they would be prosecuted for "terrorist acts".

The Ukrainians seized on the capture of the two Russians, both wounded, to support their accusations of direct Russian involvement in the separatist conflict despite a ceasefire signed in February. Russia denies active military involvement.

[Tonci87 163]

So, is this going to be the counterpart to Russia still holding the Ukrainian pilot in prison?

[BlenderRUS 6]

(Reuters) Ukraine says it will prosecute captured Russian soldiers for terrorist acts

Almost every month they "catch" special forces soldiers with documents (!) of GRU (like CIA) officers and rifles... and of course, all of this were fake ;)

This two guys could be a former russian soldiers and nothing unusual here because there are many volunteers from Russia (inc. ex military), former Soviet republics and even EU countries.

[mistyronin 1181]

Almost every month they "catch" special forces soldiers with documents (!) of GRU (like CIA) officers and rifles... and of course, all of this were fake ;)

Yeah, also families in Russia found their serving relatives dead, also fake I guess...

Russian soldiers desert and escape to other countries and explain how they were forced to go to fight in Eastern Ukraine, also fake too... :j:

(Vice) Russian Soldiers Have Given Up Pretending They Are Not Fighting in Ukraine

(Vice) 'It Is a Government Crime': The Coffins of Russia's Ghost Soldiers In Ukraine Are Coming Home

[BlenderRUS 6]

Yeah, also families in Russia found their serving relatives dead, also fake I guess...

Russian soldiers desert and escape to other countries and explain how they were forced to go to fight in Eastern Ukraine, also fake too... :j:

(Vice) Russian Soldiers Have Given Up Pretending They Are Not Fighting in Ukraine

(Vice) 'It Is a Government Crime': The Coffins of Russia's Ghost Soldiers In Ukraine Are Coming Home

I have 3 friends who dismissed from the regular army and went to fight for Donbass. Maybe this deserters just wanted to immigrate - I dont know, but actually government dont need to send troops because there are many skilled volunteers.

I've heard this story about this guys from 106th Airborne Division and maybe it can be truth, but this story really strange - Russia have enough volunteers.

Another story that government can *unofficially* support people from Donbass with vehicles and equipment.. but EU and USA does the same.

[ProfTournesol 956]

but EU and USA does the same.

Much much less obviously.

[mistyronin 1181]

Another story that government can *unofficially* support people from Donbass with vehicles and equipment.. but EU and USA does the same.

EU and USA Govs do support the sovereign Gov. of Ukraine's officially, and sell them equipment and in a lower scale train them, it's true. They are not hiding it. But it's logical, and legal according to all International Conventions.

On the other hand the Russian Gov. (Putin) ordered an illegal hidden military invasion of the sovereign Ukrainian territory of Crimea, and illegally annexed it to Russia. The Kremlin also promoted a violent uprising in Donbass through his FSB officer Strelkov and is fueling it sending troops and equipment.

All of them against the International Conventions, that's why Russia is now a pariah in the international sphere, and not even some of their allies want to be involved with Putin, like Belarus or Kazakhstan.

(BuzzFeed) Putin Describes The Moment He Gave Secret Order To Invade Crimea

(Moscow Times) Russia's Igor Strelkov: I Am Responsible for War in Eastern Ukraine

(RFERL) Lukashenka Declines Invitation To Moscow Victory Day Parade

(Defense News) US Trainers To Deploy To Ukraine

(USA Today) Pentagon sends more equipment and aid to Ukraine

(The Telegraph) General Sir Richard Dannatt condemns armoured vehicle transfer to Ukraine

The former head of the British Army has condemned a decision to deliver dozens of redundant British military armoured vehicles to the Ukrainian government as “nothing short of immoralâ€.

General Sir Richard Dannatt, who served as Chief of the General Staff between 2006 and 2009, said the Saxon armoured vehicles, which the Ukranian military are planning to convert for use in their fight against Russian-backed separatist forces – are “quite uselessâ€.

Edited May 19, 2015 by MistyRonin

[BlenderRUS 6]

EU and USA Govs do support the sovereign Gov. of Ukraine's officially, and sell them equipment and in a lower scale train them, it's true. They are not hiding it. But it's logical, and legal according to all International Conventions.

On the other hand the Russian Gov. (Putin) ordered an illegal hidden military invasion of the sovereign Ukrainian territory of Crimea, and illegally annexed it to Russia. The Kremlin also promoted a violent uprising in Donbass through his FSB officer Strelkov and is fueling it sending troops and equipment.

All of them against the International Conventions, that's why Russia is now a pariah in the international sphere, and not even some of their allies want to be involved with Putin, like Belarus or Kazakhstan.

(BuzzFeed) Putin Describes The Moment He Gave Secret Order To Invade Crimea

(Moscow Times) Russia's Igor Strelkov: I Am Responsible for War in Eastern Ukraine

(RFERL) Lukashenka Declines Invitation To Moscow Victory Day Parade

(Defense News) US Trainers To Deploy To Ukraine

(USA Today) Pentagon sends more equipment and aid to Ukraine

(The Telegraph) General Sir Richard Dannatt condemns armoured vehicle transfer to Ukraine

Thats not logical because ukrainian government came to power in a result of the revolution and started to kill own people which wasn't agree with that, even journalists a month ago.

There are many videos of drunk bandits in ukrainian uniform firing a mortar, ran over kids, bombing citizens in cities - there are many of such terrible things happens in Ukraine.

US follows politics of "bloody revolutions" - thats a fact and gets a profit. But I dont understand why some EU countries supports them.

Also, Igor Strelkov is not actual FSB officer. He quit his job in 2013. And statements like: "The Kremlin also promoted a violent uprising in Donbass" are insane, its started much earlier - when first molotov coctail was throwen on Kiev's Maidan.

And if you are talking about International Conventions - where you have been when USA/NATO has bombed:

- Panama'89,

- Somali'93 (during civil war),

- Yugoslavia'95 (without UN permission),

- Yugoslavia'99 (also without UN permission),

- Afghanistan'01 (as a result - about 500'000 citizens were killed),

- Iraq'03 (more than 100'000 citizens casualties, and no chemical weapon?)

[aleksadragutin 9]

International conventions are not even good for wiping your ass anymore. Plus, if US is helping the current Ukraine gov which it recognizes, why can't Russia back the DPR/LPR, which it also recognizes?

[ProfTournesol 956]

International conventions are not even good for wiping your ass anymore. Plus, if US is helping the current Ukraine gov which it recognizes, why can't Russia back the DPR/LPR, which it also recognizes?

Because Donbass is in Ukraine, not in Russia.

[Rydygier 1317]

"We are scouts"