Ukraine General

[oxmox 73]

Carefully here, this is just an interview release from the russian yellow press not officially from Moscow or Russia like some media want to believe. At least this was the case yesterday.

[ProfTournesol 956]

Carefully here, this is just an interview release from the russian yellow press not officially from Moscow or Russia like some media want to believe. At least this was the case yesterday.

(ITAR TASS) Russian Investigative Committee analyzing evidence in case of Malaysian Boeing crash

Earlier, the Investigative Committee spokesman said investigators have received evidence of involvement of a Ukrainian military aircraft in the Malaysian Boeing’s crash

[x3kj 1247]

The pro-Russian forces without the Kremlin support wouldn't last much time against the Ukrainian Army.

Just because the pro russian forces likely stand no chance against the ukrainian army in the open field battle does not mean the conflict will be resolved and stability will be achieved. Just saying.

[beastcat 14]

TASS - Investigation of MH17 crash in Ukraine violates all ICAO norms - Lavrov

MOSCOW, December 25. /TASS/. All norms of the International Civil Aviation Organization /ICAO/ are being violated in the organization of investigation in the crash of Malaysia’s MH17 flight in eastern Ukraine, Russian Foreign Minister Sergei Lavrov said in an interview with the Kommersant daily.

“Today, when the tragedy with the Malaysian Boeing is being slurred over and we are the only ones to urge to pay attention to the fact that the investigation is unduly dragged out, our Western partners keep silent or at best are saying that about one year more is needed,†he said.

“The way the investigation is organized is a separate topic. All norms of the International Civil Aviation Organization are being violated, Ukraine’s security services are directly involved in this investigation,†Lavrov stressed. “A country, where a crash take place, can take part but not “call the shots†as is happening now.â€.

[aleksadragutin 9]

TASS - Investigation of MH17 crash in Ukraine violates all ICAO norms - Lavrov

Even Lavrov uses the term "Western partners".

[beastcat 14]

The Washington Post - Russia’s illegal prisoners of war

Mark Feygin is a Moscow lawyer: "At his news conference in Moscow last week, Russian President Vladimir Putin refused to recognize that my client, pilot Nadiya Savchenko, and 30 other Ukrainian service members being held in Russian jails are prisoners of war. This challenge to yet another universal norm demands a strong response from other nations."

Savchenko’s innocence of this charge can be easily established: Telephone logs show that she was captured an hour before the attack that killed the journalists. But that is not the point. Under the Geneva Conventions, she cannot be charged with a criminal offense at all. If she did anything wrong, she is answerable only to international justice under the laws of war.

Putin’s reluctance to recognize that the Ukrainian captives are POWs is understandable. Russia says that it is not a party to the Ukrainian conflict, even though by the standards of the Geneva Conventions, it unquestionably is. The separatists are armed, trained, supplied and directed by Moscow. In Crimea, Russia occupied and annexed a part of Ukrainian territory. If this does not make Russia a participant in a war, what would? And if it does, my client is Russia’s POW.

But even if the war were solely between the Ukrainian government and the rebels, it is still governed by the Geneva Conventions as an “internal armed conflict†— in which case, Savchenko is a POW of the rebels who has been illegally transferred to Russia. Russia has no business trying foreign combatants under its internal criminal code. If it is not at war with Ukraine, it should release Savchenko immediately."

He would never lie. Did Russia ever lie? This sounds legit.

Edited December 26, 2014 by beastcat

[surpher 1]

(The Telegraph) Secret dead of Russia's undeclared war

Anton Tumanov gave up his life for his country - but his country won’t say where, and it won’t say how.

His mother knows. She knows that Mr Tumanov, a 20 year-old junior sergeant in the Russian army, was killed in eastern Ukraine, torn apart in a rocket attack on August 13.

Yelena Tumanova, 41, learned these bare facts about her son’s death from one of his comrades, who saw him get hit and scooped up his body.

[Tonci87 163]

“On August 11 we were given an order to remove the identification plates from our military vehicles, change into camouflage suits and tie white rags on our arms and legs,†the soldier wrote. “At the border we received supplies of ammunition. On the 11th and 12th we crossed onto Ukrainian territory. On August 13th at lunchtime our column was hit by a rocket strike, during which Anton Tumanov died. At that moment we were in Ukraine, in Snezhnoye (a town not far from Donetsk).â€

[...]

Comrades of Mr Tumanov corroborated the account given to his mother, telling Mr Krivenko that the young sergeant died when a volley of Ukrainian Grad missiles hit their ammunition trucks on the territory of a factory in Snezhnoye (known as Snizhne in Ukrainian). They estimated 120 men had died in that attack alone.

Probing the deaths can be a risky business. Lyudmila Bogatenkova, a 73-year old representative of the Soldiers’ Mothers Committee in Stavropol, suddenly found herself charged with fraud after she investigated deaths in Snizhne.

[...]

Lev Shlosberg, a local MP in Pskov in western Russia, says there is an atmosphere of secrecy and fear around the casualties. He is campaigning to find out how twelve paratroopers based in the town met their deaths in the summer. After he first wrote about it in a blog post, unknown assailants pounced from behind as he walked near his home, knocking him down and beating him unconscious. Thugs also threatened reporters who visited graves of the paratroopers with “never being seen again†and slashed their car tires.

“A great many Russian servicemen have died in Ukraine and their families are outraged but they don’t speak out because they are afraid for their lives,†says Mr Shlosberg, who recovered after hospital treatment. He says he has spoken to relatives of the dead and to soldiers who fought in Ukraine against their will but they are desperate to remain anonymous. “People in Russia today live in terror of the authorities.â€

As I said, the situation for the relatives of the dead is absolutelly inhuman.

[surpher 1]

(Atlantic Council) How a Retired Russian Army Officer Sends ‘Volunteers’ to Fight in Ukraine

Yefimov is a former Special Forces (spetsnaz) officer who now heads the Sverdlovsk Oblast Fund for Special Forces Veterans. In an interview with Yekaterinburg Online, a local news website, he told of sending between 150 and 250 fighters to Ukraine’s Donbas war zone this year. While he says his fighters are “volunteers†rather than mercenaries, they are paid salaries: from $1,000 per month for a low-ranking enlisted man to $2,000-4,000 for officers.

[Sub-Human 10]

I have heard the Russian losses in Ukraine are about a third of the OVERALL Afghan losses during their 10 year war. I don't have an English source, but if that's true, then I'm honestly surprised the Russian population is not asking any questions!

[ProfTournesol 956]

I have heard the Russian losses in Ukraine are about a third of the OVERALL Afghan losses during their 10 year war. I don't have an English source, but if that's true, then I'm honestly surprised the Russian population is not asking any questions!

That would mean 5 000 killed, that's too many IMHO.

[aleksadragutin 9]

I have heard the Russian losses in Ukraine are about a third of the OVERALL Afghan losses during their 10 year war. I don't have an English source, but if that's true, then I'm honestly surprised the Russian population is not asking any questions!

Don't think it's possible for so many Russian soldiers to die in this war.

[Sub-Human 10]

That would mean 5 000 killed, that's too many IMHO.

Sorry, I meant "up to a third of the overall casualties" - not just killed, but also wounded.

Of course it might be false, but these are supposedly the claims of human rights organizations in Russia. I don't think they pulled a number out of thin air.

Edited December 29, 2014 by Sub-Human

[ProfTournesol 956]

Sorry, I meant a third of the overall casualties - not just killed, but also wounded.

Killed (15 000) + Wounded (54 000) = 69 000 => one third would be 23 000, that's enormous for such a small scale conflict. A few hundreds would be my best bet.

[Dwarden 1125]

well afaik there're known cases where whole column of 'volunteers' got destroyed and several cases of transport truck/apc full of soldiers ...

that easily skyrocket the KIA list

[Tonci87 163]

Read surphers link above one of the survivors claims that in that attack alone over 100 soldiers/volunteers died.

[Jona33 51]

Could the statistic be 5,000 wounded or killed in Ukraine (i.e. a third of actual deaths in Afghanistan). Still sounds pretty high though, even taking into account the massive casualties sustained in artillery barrages and the like.

[beastcat 14]

Meanwhile in Crimea

The current (19.12.2014) issue of the Sevastopol Pravda

"For socialism, soviet leadership, borthers union!"

The article about stalin is called "Great Stalin" and the article on the right side is about how the USA and NATO are supposedly ammasing their military in Ukraine.

Also these are supposedly BPM-97s in Ukraine as another red flag item.

Heres the corresponding video:

Edited December 30, 2014 by beastcat

[negah 26]

Those BPM-97s look quite a lot like the old SdKfz 250/251 and their soviet successors BTR-152.

Quite interesting how such an old design is somewhat used again.

Please let me witness the comeback of the Pz IV :)

[beastcat 14]

Meanwhile in Donetsk

http://youtu.be/twDlAeO35yY

[eddo36 16]

1. Treat every weapon as if it were loaded.

2. Never point a weapon at anything you do not intend to shoot.

3. Keep finger straight and off the trigger until you are ready to fire.

4. Keep weapon on safe until you intend to fire.

Those who don't follow the weapon safety rules should never be allowed to touch a gun. If he did that in the US, he would have been severely disciplined.

Edited January 1, 2015 by Eddo36

[Bashka_IF 1]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wnUdc2fD9pg

[Beagle 684]

Those BPM-97s look quite a lot like the old SdKfz 250/251 and their soviet successors BTR-152.

Quite interesting how such an old design is somewhat used again.

Please let me witness the comeback of the Pz IV :)

The separatist have reactivates some tanks from museums, they have a IS-3 runningn again for example.

[oxmox 73]

Oliver Stone: Ukraine's revolution was CIA 'plot' (IBT & TMT)

Hollywood film producer Oliver Stone has said he wants to make a four-hour documentary telling the "dirty story" of the overthrow of former Ukrainian President Viktor Yanukovych in what he believes was a "coup" organized with the help of the United States' Central Intelligence Agency.

US director Oliver Stone has called Ukraine's Euromaidan revolution that ousted president Viktor Yanukovych a CIA "coup" and claimed that the West played a role in fostering anti-government protests in the country.

The filmmaker, who is not new to conspiracy theories around world events, posted the bizarre theory on Facebook after a four-hour interview with Yanukovych, whom he called "legitimate president of Ukraine until he suddenly wasn't on February 22 of this year".

Yanukovych fled to Russia with the help of Russian authorities after being accused of the mass murder of more than 100 protesters from December 2013.

The interview is part of a documentary that the JFK director is planning to release soon and which will be "produced by Ukrainians".

In the Facebook post, Stone maintains that "outside party agitators" were responsible for the Euromaidan killings. "Many witnesses, including Yanukovych and police officials, believe these foreign elements were introduced by pro-Western factions - with CIA fingerprints on it," he wrote.

He cited several examples of alleged CIA involvement in historical coup d'etat: Chavez coup of 2002, Iran coup of 1953 and Chile's in 1973.

In Ukraine, "neo-Nazi radicals forced Yanukovych to flee the country with repeated assassination attempts".

An extremist narrative has been repeatedly used by the Kremlin to condemn the new pro-Western government in Kiev and justify their backing of pro-Russian separatists in eastern Ukraine.

"The truth is not being aired in the West. It's a surreal perversion of history that's going on once again, as in Bush pre-Iraq 'WMD' campaign. But I believe the truth will finally come out in the West, I hope, in time to stop further insanity," wrote Stone.

http://www.ibtimes.co.uk/oliver-stone-ukraines-revolution-was-cia-plot-1481412

http://www.themoscowtimes.com/news/article/oliver-stone-interviews-yanukovych-for-documentary-on-u-s-coup-in-ukraine/514013.html

Oliver Stone is one of the most famous filmmakers in Hollywood, neverless it sounds this planned documentary will raise controversies......................

Edited January 2, 2015 by oxmox

[mistyronin 1181]

Everyone is entitled to it's own opinion, but that last statement is a huge exaggeration.

The most famous alive Hollywood filmmakers are Martin Scorsese, Quentin Tarantino, Woody Allen, Francis Ford Coppola, Steven Spielberg, Clint Eastwood and if you want even James Cameron...

Some would add also Peter Jackson, Ridley Scott, George Lucas and so on... But Oliver Stone is quite far from the main Hollywood directors.

Oliver Stone is one of the most famous filmmakers in Hollywood, neverless it sounds this planned documentary will raise controversies......................