Ukraine General

[aleksadragutin 9]

OK then, go ahead and say where the investigation is wrong.

I just did. It's wrong to pull conclusions with insufficient info.

Edited January 10, 2015 by aleksadragutin

[Tonci87 163]

At this point you are just flamebaiting.

[aleksadragutin 9]

At this point you are just flamebaiting.

This was my whole point ever since I replied to your comment in which you wrote that the Russian soldiers did it. And it's a very important point, that you shouldn't take lightly.

[Tonci87 163]

This was my whole point ever since I replied to your comment in which you wrote that the Russian soldiers did it. And it's a very important point, that you shouldn't take lightly.

I wrote what the Spiegel wrote, for you guys who don´t speak german. Still you are thinking that the Russians and the separatists didn´t do it, please tell us why.

[aleksadragutin 9]

I wrote what the Spiegel wrote, for you guys who don´t speak german. Still you are thinking that the Russians and the separatists didn´t do it, please tell us why.

The last picture shows the BUK with one missile less on it as it is transported out of the area. That BUK couldn´t have been operated by the Ukrainians since it was in rebel territory the whole time and the rebels don´t have the training to operate it. Russian soldiers did it.

Doesn't really look like a quotation to me, but oh well.

[Tonci87 163]

As always ignoring the argument at hand....:rolleyes:

[aleksadragutin 9]

As always ignoring the argument at hand....:rolleyes:

Ignorance is a bliss, after all.

[surpher 1]

(Bellingcat) SU-25, MH17 and the Problems with Keeping a Story Straight

Bellingcat has examined much of the evidence and claims related to a Buk missile system being used, in particular tracking a Buk controlled by separatists on July 17th and finding the same Buk in Russia in late June in our report Origin of the Separatists’ Buk. In this piece we’ll examine claims relating to the use of a jet fighter to shoot down MH17, which reveals not only continual inconsistencies between the various claims made by the Russian government and presented in the media, but also examples of outright and provable falsehoods being presented by the Russian government and media.

[mistyronin 1181]

( The Guardian ) East Ukraine summit looks unlikely to happen as violence spikes in region

A planned meeting between the leaders of France, Germany, Russia and Ukraine aimed at finally putting an end to the war in east Ukraine appeared uncertain on Sunday, as violence in the region spiked.

A spokesman for German chancellor, Angela Merkel, said she was not ready to travel to Kazakhstan for a planned summit on Thursday and would not go unless she saw evidence of real commitment from Russia to implement an earlier ceasefire plan. The comments came after Merkel spoke with the Russian president, Vladimir Putin, by telephone on Sunday.

[Maio 293]

The person who posted this claims it was filmed in Krasnodon. The license plate of the car in front of them seems Ukrainian, but it's hard to tell due to the foggy windshield. Could someone please translate what they are saying?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kulTLXFjqw4#t=57

Edited January 11, 2015 by Maio

[Tonci87 163]

Well those troops definately aren´t Ukrainian. One of the APCs with the ZSUs on top had hammer and sickel painted on it´s back. that symbol isn´t popular with the Ukrainian forces.

[ballistic09 241]

Well those troops definately aren´t Ukrainian. One of the APCs with the ZSUs on top had hammer and sickel painted on it´s back. that symbol isn´t popular with the Ukrainian forces.

Or, you know, the multiple BPM-97's and GAZ-3937 Vodnik are a pretty dead giveaway as well... :p

What's next T-50's and Ka-52's? Oh wait... :rolleyes:

Edited January 12, 2015 by Ballistic09

[Maio 293]

Well those troops definately aren´t Ukrainian. One of the APCs with the ZSUs on top had hammer and sickel painted on it´s back. that symbol isn´t popular with the Ukrainian forces.

That's obvious :) I was primarily interested in what they were saying as it might hint to their location.

[beastcat 14]

The person who posted this claims it was filmed in Krasnodon. The license plate of the car in front of them seems Ukrainian, but it's hard to tell due to the foggy windshield. Could someone please translate what they are saying?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kulTLXFjqw4#t=57

They are mostly just discussing the passing vehicles, but also saying that Ukrainians definitely don't have vehicles like those (1:51 "Yea, Ukrainian forces definitely don't have those") with the woman adding something about america. They go on complaining about the war, power outages and so on. They later notice that some vehicles drive off the road. At the end the guy says "Don't try your luck (fate)" and everybody collectively says that he should put away the phone. So yeah, its in Ukraine.

[Maio 293]

They are mostly just discussing the passing vehicles, but also saying that Ukrainians definitely don't have vehicles like those (1:51 "Yea, Ukrainian forces definitely don't have those") with the woman adding something about america. They go on complaining about the war, power outages and so on. They later notice that some vehicles drive off the road. At the end the guy says "Don't try your luck (fate)" and everybody collectively says that he should put away the phone. So yeah, its in Ukraine.

Thanks :)

App. the story behind it is that those soldiers disarmed Odessa Battalion:

http://www.microsofttranslator.com/bv.aspx

[oxmox 73]

EU leaders raise hopes of Putin breakthrough over Ukraine

Foreign policy coordinator points to ‘limited but positive’ signals from Russia and raises possibility of sanctions relaxation

EU leaders have talked up the prospects of a breakthrough with President Vladimir Putin over Ukraine amid a divisive debate over whether to ease or lift European sanctions on Russia.

There is a growing sense in EU capitals and in Moscow that Putin is looking for a way to save face on eastern Ukraine where Russia supports rebel separatists because the collapse of the oil price and the rouble, and the impact of sanctions are causing great distress to the Russian economy.

“We have a feeling they really want a lowering of sanctions,†said Edgars RinkÄ“viÄs, the Latvian foreign minister. “This is an opening we can use.â€

The French and the Germans are at odds over whether to ease sanctions on Moscow, while the Americans are likely to take a dim view of relaxing the pressure on Putin.

“If there is no change in Russian behaviour and they [EU] don’t continue the sanctions, that would be absolutely extraordinary. We don’t want to contemplate that,†said a senior US official.

But argument is raging within the EU over the efficacy of sanctions, over their impact on Russia’s imploding economy and on European business.

The Czechs, Slovaks, Hungarians, and Austrians are fierce opponents of sanctions, while Berlin and Paris are increasingly on opposing sides. President François Hollande of France spoke this week of the need for sanctions to be stopped, while Merkel stressed on Thursday that they have to be continued, subject to Russian behaviour.

http://www.theguardian.com/world/2015/jan/08/eu-leaders-russia-putin-breakthrough-ukraine

NATO's Stoltenberg sees slight improvement in eastern Ukraine: paper

Fighting between Kiev's forces and pro-Russian rebels has eased in eastern Ukraine, NATO Secretary General Jens Stoltenberg was quoted on Monday as saying, although he voiced concern about the risks to local people.

"We have noticed that there are still Russian military personnel on eastern Ukraine territory that support the separatists," Stoltenberg told German newspaper Die Welt according to interview excerpts released in advance.

"But we also observe that there are fewer clashes recently," he said. "Fighting continues in parts, but there are signs of a slight improvement."

http://www.reuters.com/article/2015/01/12/us-ukraine-crisis-nato-idUSKBN0KL01J20150112?feedType=RSS&feedName=topNews

Edited January 12, 2015 by oxmox

[Bashka_IF 1]

http://www.strategic-culture.org/news/2015/01/12/kiev-bohemia-ball-satan-eat-cake-from-russian-baby-liver-volunteer-video.html

On December 28, Kyiv «Bar Hot» metropolitan bohemians eating “Russian child.†The event was called “The award Vatnik year.†The menu was burgers “House of Trade Unions,†“Liver volunteer†and tincture “Veteranka.â€

The main guest was the Russian human rights activist Elena Vasileva.

The music of Russian pop singers glamorous get-together with laughter and jokes to cut the cake, “decorated†baby lying on the Russian flag. His carefully cut along the face and body, and the girls behind the scenes happily asked “cut off their tummy.â€

[beastcat 14]

Thanks :)

App. the story behind it is that those soldiers disarmed Odessa Battalion:

http://www.microsofttranslator.com/bv.aspx

They disarmed Ukrainians and got russian vehicles?

[sudayev 27]

^ Did you know that peasants of Bandera did this to Polish children during genocide of Poles in lands of today's western Ukraine

Some sort of sick sense of humour. Ugly and beyond words :/ People from the cake video - who have such ideas are complete imbeciles or have very selective memory or maybe both.

Edited January 12, 2015 by Sudayev

[Maio 293]

They disarmed Ukrainians and got russian vehicles?

That's what the person who posted it claimed. The translation was off...

[beastcat 14]

^ Did you know that peasants of Bandera did this to Polish children during genocide of Poles in lands of today's western Ukraine

Some sort of sick sense of humour. Ugly and beyond words :/ People from the cake video - who have such ideas are complete imbeciles or have very selective memory or maybe both.

It's a parody of russian media, don't overanalyze it. Yes its tasteless, but thats it.

Correctiv - Flight MH17: The path of the Buk

For our investigation into the downing of MH17 CORRECT!V-Reporter Marcus Bensmann has been several times in Eastern Ukraine as well as in Russia. There he did not only talk to witnesses, he also took a lot of pictures. We compare these pictures with the ones that were collected through researchers for the investigative team Bellingcat and confirmed the accuracy of the Bellingcat verification during visits to the venues. The pictures clearly show the path of the BUK missile. We also publish additional pictures, among them some pictures of the missile launch site.

The BUK was shipped from the eastern Ukrainian city of Donetzk via the towns of Zuhares and Tores to Snizhne. The transport was made along the road N21 connecting the rebel strongholds Donetzk and Luhansk. Bellingcat was able to determine the BUK’s identification number 3*2.

The BUK launcher was transported on a truck with a white cab. The truck owner said separatists had stolen the truck from his rental firm. After the launch that destroyed MH17, the BUK was reloaded on the truck and filmed shortly after in Luhansk. By then a missile was missing.

At the time of the missile launch all the towns in the launch area were controlled by separatists. However the Russian Ministry of Defense reported Ukrainian BUKs were stationed nearby.

We were able to show the BUK was constantly on the move through separatist territory. Here is our documentation of the route.

The BUK unit drove across embattled territory. The part of the route from Kursk to the Ukrainian border is also well documented. The research project Bellingcat has reconstructed the entire route. The only uncertainty is where the launch pad crossed the border.

This one should be in english. Nvm.

[Dwarden 1124]

quite strong arty barrage hit airfield recently

[mistyronin 1181]

quite strong arty barrage hit airfield recently

Vive the official "ceasefire"...!

[Tonci87 163]

That looks like multiple GRAD launchers unloading into a small area (really nothing unusual in that conflict). Would be interesting to know what was there that they deemed important enough to eradicate.

The video description might give a hint. The separatists issued an ultimatum to the Ukrainian soldiers on the Donetsk airport to leave or face destruction. My guess is that the area in the video is where that destruction was beeing prepared. Maybe a staging area, maybe a few arty or MLRS pieces.

[Sub-Human 10]

Russia sent UP TO 160-170 T-72 (!!!) tanks to Ukraine's rebels.

http://sled-vzayt.livejournal.com/1730.html