really... no omnidirectional movement?

[BurntByHellfire 1]

id be willing to help come up with a really good control scheme, much better than the one they have now for the xbox controller that would map pretty close to every function to the game when im done with it

[xendance 3]

Not that I remember. If it was, I really don't see myself having insalled it in '07. I've never had GFWL on my PC, but I've played through the Crysis 1 SP campaign multiple times.

Oh wait, it wasn't GFWL, it was Games for Windows (not Live): http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Games_for_Windows_titles

[BurntByHellfire 1]

i just realized another problem... see, i couldnt use the xbox controller with armas control scheme.. i had to create a control scheme of my own because arma doesnt even allow you to invert the Y axis.. just the fact that you cant even so much as invert the axis shows me that the people at arma really couldnt care less about any reasonable support for controller and i think theyre alienating a pretty big market of people who dont want to be forced to sit at a desk to play their games

[dmarkwick 261]

i just realized another problem... see, i couldnt use the xbox controller with armas control scheme.. i had to create a control scheme of my own because arma doesnt even allow you to invert the Y axis.. just the fact that you cant even so much as invert the axis shows me that the people at arma really couldnt care less about any reasonable support for controller and i think theyre alienating a pretty big market of people who dont want to be forced to sit at a desk to play their games

But you were able to get the axis behavior you wanted right? It's not like you couldn't manually reassign the Y axis to be reversed, an activity only slightly more complex than selecting "invert"?

As for the topic in general, I don't really see much gamplay advantage to omnidirectional movement more than what we already have. I can already go in pretty much any direction I wish while looking in other directions. As far as I can see, there are at least, what, two different XBox controller profiles to choose from? That seems to me plenty for a game not designed for controller play. ArmA requires a mouse to aim IMO, but then I feel that way about any 1st person shooter.

I think you have to bear in mind that ArmA is first & foremost a keyboard + mouse game. It has support for controller, but only as an afterthought, it is not designed for controller play. For a start, the F1-F12 keys and number keys make up a large part of ArmA gamplay, and for that you need a keyboard plain & simple. The only time I would think a controller has any advantage over K+M would be in vehicles.

But I understand there are people who just wish to use a controller rather than K+M, and that's fine. None of my business :) But I don't think that the controller setup needs to have any great amount of time spent on it. As far as I've seen, the current controller support seems to be just fine.

[BurntByHellfire 1]

lets face it though.. games are only "mouse and keyboard" games because thats what they can be sure everyone with a PC has.. doesnt mean its necessarily the best, or that support for other interfaces shouldnt be added because it does cut out a huge market.. with steam box coming out soon and a pretty large number of people coming to PC from consoles, a better emphasis should be placed on some kind of better controller support so those coming from console can use what theyre comfortable with (im actually more accurate with a thumbstick than a mouse.. trust me, ive tried it both ways on the BF4 demo).. also, steam will put a big emphasis on controller as well

as for the inverted axis thing.. in order for me to do that i had to delete the pre-configured scheme and reconfigure the controller from scratch.. its not hard, i have an xpadder profile made up to allow me to do pretty much everything anyone else playing arma can do.. even leaning and stance modifiers on my controller as well

also.. im trying out a new interface for PC gaming.. its a bit of a hybrid to controller and mouse.. its basically mouse/nunchuck where the nunchuck will be a playstation navigation controller i ordered (usable with the motioninjoy driver).. this gives me a thumbstick, d-pad, 2 face buttons, a PS button, trigger, L1, and a clickable thumbstick giving me a total of 17 mappable functions, not including the analog axis' and double that with a set selector.. so itll be interesting to see how the nunchuck/mouse setup works

just saying though youd be suprised of the number of people on PC that wouldnt mind a more relaxed way of playing (not at a desk), the number of PC games that will be hooked up to a living room television when steam box is release, and that the xbox 360 and playstation 3 will be obsolete soon and a very large portion of the people i played with on xbox have purchased the components to build a gaming PC as opposed to pre-ordering a new console... so the number of people that want to use a controller is going to be getting very big, very soon.. potential market of millions and if a few small configuration tweaks or UI tweaks to be enabled while a controller is being utilized is all it takes to cash in on a market, why wouldnt you do it?.. its not like you have to remove any current features or abilities.. just implement by default a real, legit, and usable control configuration like the one ive been working on

Edited October 6, 2013 by BurntByHellfire

[laverniusregalis 10]

Mouse+keyboard is still better than a controller for a milsim unless you're in a chopper or plane, in which case you might as well be using a proper joystick...

[Tonci87 163]

lets face it though.. games are only "mouse and keyboard" games because thats what they can be sure everyone with a PC has.. doesnt mean its necessarily the best, or that support for other interfaces shouldnt be added because it does cut out a huge market.. with steam box coming out soon and a pretty large number of people coming to PC from consoles, a better emphasis should be placed on some kind of better controller support so those coming from console can use what theyre comfortable with (im actually more accurate with a thumbstick than a mouse.. trust me, ive tried it both ways on the BF4 demo).. also, steam will put a big emphasis on controller as well

as for the inverted axis thing.. in order for me to do that i had to delete the pre-configured scheme and reconfigure the controller from scratch.. its not hard, i have an xpadder profile made up to allow me to do pretty much everything anyone else playing arma can do.. even leaning and stance modifiers on my controller as well

also.. im trying out a new interface for PC gaming.. its a bit of a hybrid to controller and mouse.. its basically mouse/nunchuck where the nunchuck will be a playstation navigation controller i ordered (usable with the motioninjoy driver).. this gives me a thumbstick, d-pad, 2 face buttons, a PS button, trigger, L1, and a clickable thumbstick giving me a total of 17 mappable functions, not including the analog axis' and double that with a set selector.. so itll be interesting to see how the nunchuck/mouse setup works

just saying though youd be suprised of the number of people on PC that wouldnt mind a more relaxed way of playing (not at a desk), the number of PC games that will be hooked up to a living room television when steam box is release, and that the xbox 360 and playstation 3 will be obsolete soon and a very large portion of the people i played with on xbox have purchased the components to build a gaming PC as opposed to pre-ordering a new console... so the number of people that want to use a controller is going to be getting very big, very soon.. potential market of millions and if a few small configuration tweaks or UI tweaks to be enabled while a controller is being utilized is all it takes to cash in on a market, why wouldnt you do it?.. its not like you have to remove any current features or abilities.. just implement by default a real, legit, and usable control configuration like the one ive been working on

Let´s face it M+K is the best input method for FPS Games, especially for tactical FPS.

[BurntByHellfire 1]

then tell me.. whats the keyboard offer that other devices dont?.. when people talk up mouse and keyboard they almost always use the mouse for their arguements.. so what does a keyboard provide that a controller with 17 buttons.. over 30 of them when you add a set selector button.. what does the keyboard provide.. a more comfortable layout?.. no, aah, maybe it provides a better means of movement?.. nope, not that either.. hmm, in arma, i actually use my left trigger for a variable zoom.. if i lightly push the trigger my sight comes up.. if i pull it down more itll actually zoom in depending on how far its pushed... im sure the keyboard can do that.. right?.. aah, no

so really all you have in your arguement is the mouse, and there are better ways to get every single thing i just mentioned above, while still using a mouse for aiming

[dmarkwick 261]

then tell me.. whats the keyboard offer that other devices dont?.. when people talk up mouse and keyboard they almost always use the mouse for their arguements.. so what does a keyboard provide that a controller with 17 buttons.. over 30 of them when you add a set selector button.. what does the keyboard provide.. a more comfortable layout?.. no, aah, maybe it provides a better means of movement?.. nope, not that either.. hmm, in arma, i actually use my left trigger for a variable zoom.. if i lightly push the trigger my sight comes up.. if i pull it down more itll actually zoom in depending on how far its pushed... im sure the keyboard can do that.. right?.. aah, no

so really all you have in your arguement is the mouse, and there are better ways to get every single thing i just mentioned above, while still using a mouse for aiming

I would say that the main thing the keyboard offers is the F1-F12 keys necessary for unit(s) selection, and the 1-10 keys necessary for the order(s) selection.

[swiftn7 1]

...and the fourth thing i mentioned benefits mouse people as well, and thats the ability to change the zoomed-in aim sensitivity seperate.. i cant imagine any of these features being all that difficult or requiring more than a small patch to implement

This is implemented on the hardware side already. Most gaming mices have buttons to set programmable sensitivity rates. So you just zoom in, set-up your mouse with one click and you are good to go. Why doesn't your superior gaming rig have this feature?

[Tonci87 163]

then tell me.. whats the keyboard offer that other devices dont?.. when people talk up mouse and keyboard they almost always use the mouse for their arguements.. so what does a keyboard provide that a controller with 17 buttons.. over 30 of them when you add a set selector button.. what does the keyboard provide.. a more comfortable layout?.. no, aah, maybe it provides a better means of movement?.. nope, not that either.. hmm, in arma, i actually use my left trigger for a variable zoom.. if i lightly push the trigger my sight comes up.. if i pull it down more itll actually zoom in depending on how far its pushed... im sure the keyboard can do that.. right?.. aah, no

so really all you have in your arguement is the mouse, and there are better ways to get every single thing i just mentioned above, while still using a mouse for aiming

Well why should I use/buy something different when I have a mouse to aim and a keyboard to do all the other stuff.

Something that can be really important in Arma: Placing Markers on the Map. I doubleklick with my Mouse and write in the Text with my Keyboard. Can´t do that with a Gamepad.

[mr_centipede 31]

I'm sorry for being ignorant, but what is this omnidirectional movement thing?

[Cathrynn 10]

For me it's all about comfort and speed so I use a controller in my left paw and a mouse in t'other. If, on the other hand, I use a k/b instead of a controller I'm constantly having to take my eyes away from the screen to look for the correct button to press, which isn't ideal when I'm in contact; but with a controller I don't need to look, everythings there at my finger tips, very comfortable too.

Mr_Centipede: I think it's movement in all directions.

[maddogx 13]

I'm sorry for being ignorant, but what is this omnidirectional movement thing?

Essentially, movement in an arbitrary direction with finer control over speed, as made possible by using an analog input device.

The standard keyboard input method only allows you to move straight ahead/left/right/back (e.g. using W/S/A/D) or diagonally (e.g. W+A or W+D). In other words, only eight movement directions are possible, and only at fixed speeds (since keyboard keys are digital).

An analog control stick could theoretically allow movement in any 360° direction with direct and more nuanced control over movement speed.

[celery 8]

then tell me.. whats the keyboard offer that other devices dont?

Assuming you now have your controller set up for Arma, just disconnect your keyboard. I'm sure you won't miss it for anything.

[das attorney 858]

Nvm. 5 chars

[BurntByHellfire 1]

nah, i dont need to disconnect my keyboard, it keeps disconnecting itself unless the cable is held in just the right position... im waiting for a new one i ordered.. and i do play arma without touching the keyboard.. have mapped everything thats even remotely usable.. for example, i didnt waste buttons by mapping pointless things like saluting, sitting down, lowering the rifle, etc.. besides basic moving and shooting and changing weapons, grenades, crouching/prone, etc, ive also mapped the compass, the watch, leaning left and right, and even the stance modifier parts.. i also used xpadder a lot so i can change to 3 different speeds with the thumbstick, added a set selector, while im holding the set button which is a bumper button i can still aim, shoot, and move.. have it set so i can lean over and walk while leaned too... so im really not missing anything

im going to try the game the way someone above mentioned it.. with a controller (in my case, a PS3 navigation controller nunchuck thingie) with a mouse.. and i still want the ability to change sensitivity when zoomed in independantly.. and no, im not going to buy a mouse that changes resolution because its pretty dumb to have to push an extra button just to do something that should be done automatically

[MavericK96 0]

then tell me.. whats the keyboard offer that other devices dont?

Like 100 more buttons?

[Cathrynn 10]

I've got all the important buttons I need bound to my controller and gaming mouse, and when I've got an ai squad with me I also use voice commands via VAC; you can even bring up things like the map and compass using voice cmds.

[BurntByHellfire 1]

i didnt even know that about voice commands.. thats pretty cool, ill look that up.. i never play with an AI squad though.. i only play multiplayer with real people

[pd3 25]

Well, as long as developers emphasize mouse + keyboard controls and ensuring they don't suffer the slightest bit, I wouldn't care personally.

However if you want to play this game, of all games with a controller, you're kind of barking up the wrong tree.

By all means try, but this game of all others is very much not conducive controller use.

[CaptainAzimuth 714]

well, i supported this game since the alpha, and ive been hoping theyd offer some common sense aspects to the control interface to the game, such as the ability to have omnidirectional movement.. for a military simulation, its pretty unrealistic when you can only move in one of 8 directions.. now i can understand this not being an issue for people who use WASD movement, but i do not, for the most part i play the game to the full effect without the use of a keyboard

i know, im going to hear people complain about how i need something like 40 keys to play this game, 7 just for movement, 3 for crouching and standing, a button to lower a weapon, one to look around separately from the gun, lowering the weapon but most of these functions just aren't even remotely useful for actual game play..

Sorry, but after reading this, you have contradicted yourself. Look, the only thing that a controller should be used for is vehicles. As for the Infantry part, it is an almost absolute must to use Mouse and Keyboard, with the exception of those who have Head tracking devices such as Track IR. That being said, you may have to either just go with the flow, or deal with it. This wasn't a product designed for Console to begin with, much less Controllers used for Console.

[BurntByHellfire 1]

im creating a new pinnacle profile for this game, and using my PS3 controller.. this control scheme is much more intuitive than the one i had before which i was able to map everything to.. but this ones much, much better.. i kind of abandoned the idea on making it exactly battlefield-ish and went for just making it an all around better control scheme.. and im utilizing the d-pad a lot for certain things

ill give an example.. i push the square button to reload.. just tap it, and you reload.. if i double tap the button, ill actually raise/lower the rifle, but if i hold the square button, while holding it, i can do all sorts of things weapon related.. up/down on the d-pad then becomes next/previous weapon, left and right toggle the pistol and grenade launcher, tapping the left trigger while holding square changes optics mode, and hitting the throw button changes the throw item while holding the square button... so basically all weapon-switching or tweaking is done essentially by that one square button, as this button has its own set to do all of that

another thing i mapped is this.. when i push the left trigger, my aiming down the sight pops up, and once my trigger reaches full forward, temporary zoom comes up.. so i can zoom in at will simply by pushing this trigger in all the way vs only part of the way.. and while holding this button, the d-pad performs various functions relating to what you may need when aiming.. such as up/down being zoom in / zoom out

i used to have it set up so holding the throw button would change the grenades as opposed to tapping it.. but this new method is a lot quicker... i also have crouch/prone/stand on one button and i essentially have all the weapon/view and most of the infantry controls mapped and havent even touched the X, O, or triangle buttons, nor the start, select, L1, and without pushing any of those behavior modifier buttons ill probably set up the d-pad to provide a 8 more functions, four for just tapping the button, four more for holding them (such as compass/watch), and the right bumper will probably take care of all the stance modifiers, lean, etc

what ill probably do is set up the x-button for selection stuff.. tap the x button for the default select, hold the x-button and use the d-pad to navigate through possible things i can select (like facing a backpack and scrolling through whats inside) and then selecting the selected item by simply releasing the x-button.. cool thing is that ill be able to have this profile decrease zoomed-in sensitivity for me as well.. so ill be just fine with accuracy via controller

in all i think once im done with this profile this is going to be a phenominal control scheme for this game.. so does arma need a mouse and keyboard?.. nope :D.. however, better thumbstick movement support or the ability to have a different control scheme for flying would be a big help.. mostly because id like to use the same flying control scheme i use for war thunder but ill have to make do for now.. (wonder why armas xinput control scheme couldnt be half this in depth?)

[ricogs400 1]

A lot of people are missing the control scheme that some people use a controller for, and the OP already stated, which is left hand on controller for movement with a controller stick, and right hand mouse. This gives precise aiming control, but a better feel for walking by pushing a stick instead of keys. This is what I use because I hate a key press to control walking/running.

[Cathrynn 10]

I've tried a number of different ways to control walking and running but find a controller to be the best, it seems more natural and intuitive that way, not to mention much more comfortable when your in a long mission.