Where is the Game?

[laverniusregalis 10]

THE TRUTH IS, BIS HAD DEADLINES.

They needed to meet these deadlines, so they released the game and immediately continued working on the campaign. They're working hard to get this done for us, give them a break. You don't have RIGHTS to this stuff in reality, it's like pre-ordering the next Call of Duty because they say they're going to innovate. The difference is that Activision copy+pastes, and BIS has to work hard to get it workable on release and RIGHT a month or two later.

[chrisb 196]

BIS got it wrong, badly wrong.

Whilst trying to appeal to a wider playing audience, and over stretching themselves after all that had gone on, they took one of the few weapons in the game, out, and proceeded to shoot themselves in the foot...;)

[dayglow 2]

BULLSHIT! I get so tired of seeing this fanboy arguement. Where in all of Arma III's advertising does it say that this is meant only to be a Sandbox? That there is no real game and you must make whatever you can, even though you don't know anything about programming, yourself? I really haven't seen a good user mission yet.

Yes, we have been cheated.

Outside of the campaign (yes I'm disappointed it wasn't part of the release) there are the same amount of missions in the past games. User content has always been central to the game since OFP.

[Tacti-Cool 10]

Cheated? Come on, let's not exaggerate. A large majority of players have been participating in the Alpha and Beta stages since march and have received a considerable discount on the price of the game. We have been gradually supplied with improvements and new content and even though there has been an official "release", this will still continue to happen (possibly for years to come). Nothing has changed really for most people with the release...we have a game now that keeps growing and growing (every day if you are on dev branch). BI have not abandoned Arma 3 and are still working on new content. How can you feel cheated? I've paid more money for much worse games that never received any update at all.

Ive been here since Alpha and im not saying that as a bragging point, im sure numerous if not most of the people on this forum have been here since the Alpha, and there's not much improvement, All thats been added is a Satellite Map copy paste island which contains little to no variety, Two original vehicle bodies that have been copied pasted for all 3 armies, One turret body, one HMG and One static AT launcher with 3 different paint schemes. Super soldier AI that require mods to keep them from 1 shotting players in PvE. Forgive me if im expecting variety when looking at a military clash between 3 Military powers of different economic and militaristic camps.

if i could speak of majority, i would say, the majoiry is super happy with arma 3.

If the majority was happy, would there be THIS many threads bashing/ chastising the game?

[OMAC 254]

ArmA is primarily a sandbox, and user content is about 90% of the game.

I disagree with this tripe in the strongest of all possible terms. Check out previous games in the series, back to OFP, for official BIS playable content. Twelve short SP showcases does not cut the mustard, and having to wait for the campaign is a letdown. But for now, you are correct, unfortunately. It is starting to appear as if BIS will start to rely more on user content now, for some reason. I liked it better when user content was just tasty icing on the cake.

Edited September 28, 2013 by OMAC

[laverniusregalis 10]

Ive been here since Alpha and im not saying that as a bragging point, im sure numerous if not most of the people on this forum have been here since the Alpha, and there's not much improvement, All thats been added is a Satellite Map copy paste island which contains little to no variety, Two original vehicle bodies that have been copied pasted for all 3 armies, One turret body, one HMG and One static AT launcher with 3 different paint schemes. Super soldier AI that require mods to keep them from 1 shotting players in PvE. Forgive me if im expecting variety when looking at a military clash between 3 Military powers of different economic and militaristic camps.

If the majority was happy, would there be THIS many threads bashing/ chastising the game?

The happy people aren't on the forums as much as the pissy people. Also, if you don't like Altis you shouldn't have bought A3, because Altis is fantastic.

[dayglow 2]

I disagree with this tripe in the strongest of all possible terms. Check out previous games in the series, back to OFP, for official BIS playable content. Twelve short SP showcases does not cut the mustard.

Really? I seem to remember around 7 SP missions in OFP.

[giorgygr 61]

Well, it's like buying a ferrari and using only the first gear.

Very very nice example ^

I know there are *some people who really want a story (campaign) from any game

(and eventually soon you WILL get your campaign) but..i don't understand the rush to play a somewhat linear story

that has an estimated duration (in game-hours).

I already have 360+ hours and believe me i play 1/10 in comparison with the previous titles (which i rarely EVER played a campaign on those)

ArmA is more than 'canned' gameplay.It isn't a game you must end the campaign to throw it and go to another game.

I play other games too..but ArmA is not part of my games..

[PuFu 4600]

I repeat: i do not like to loiter around with editors and stuff, if i buy a game is because i want ready-to-go fun. period.

wrong game then i guess!

if i could speak of majority, i would say, the majoiry is super happy with arma 3.

you can't speak of majority, sorry...;)

[froggyluv 2136]

Well, it does state right there on the Steam front page:

• Campaign Inbound
  Supplied as free DLC after release, the official campaign will be deployed in 3 gameplay-driven episodes: Survive, Adapt, Win.
  

I can understand the disappointment of expected campaign though, much like I felt when I bought BF3 and they removed all bots and personal battlefields. Yes, they never stated they would include them, but it was somewhat just expected as they had been there before. At least Arma 3 will deliver it at some point while BF3 never will.

Moral of the story for me -I'll never just assume a sequel will deliver all features of the previous title until it's released and I have time to inspect and read reviews.

[das attorney 858]

BIS got it wrong, badly wrong.

Whilst trying to appeal to a wider playing audience, and over stretching themselves after all that had gone on, they took one of the few weapons in the game, out, and proceeded to shoot themselves in the foot...;)

ChrisB,

I have to take exception to what you are saying in your posts.

I don't like to pick on people on this forum for the things they say, but I feel that your constant diatribe about how much better A2 modded AI vs Arma 3 AI is seriously misguided and you are spreading disinformation on the forums.

I'm aware your particular post here contains no info about AI, but I would like to retort given the opportunity.

Arma 3 default AI is far superior to default Arma 2 AI. Whether that is a combination of an easier map to work with (Altis vs Chernarus) or whether it is because of better pathfinding techniques is of little consequence.

The AI work better in their given environment and that is of little doubt imo (after several tests using empirical data - not interpretation).

You may say that "heavily modded" Arma 2 AI is better than Arma 3 AI. I still disagree.

All of the tweaks that can be applied to A2 AI are also applicable to A3 AI. Most of the things you claim as better are in fact scripted and not modded (Modded only involves wrapping up the scripts in a PBO - unless it is config tweaks of which you have said naught). All of these things can be applied to Arma 3 just as well as it's predecessor.

I saw one of your videos in A2 where you remarked that an AI gets up on a building and fires at the enemy (then immediately comes back down to formation after it's doMove is completed).

Somebody called you out on that in the forums and you said in response that you "feel" it is better than stock A3 AI. However, one must consider the nuts and bolts of the situation and look at how the AI interacts with it's environment, the strengths it has, and also it's weak points. You fail to see that even in it's infancy, Arma 3 AI can do all of what "heavily modded" A2 AI can do (if so instructed), and probably more. It is early days with A3 AI, but even just manipulating their waypoints can have really cool consequences. Way beyond what you can do in Arma 2 without serious scripting.

All of the things you enjoy with Arma 2 AI can (and will if I have anything to do with it) end up in this game. Look at the things tpw for example (who is a rabid scripter and sound bloke btw) is doing with AI at this early stage of release. The game's only been out 2 weeks and already, tpw and Mr Flay have worked out a decent supression system (with little to no FPS drop vs the previous iteration in Arma 2: TPWCAI. This isn't an Arma 2 vs Arma 3 rant, but you must appreciate that the times are changing. I daresay, there is more flexibility with A3 AI than A2 AI and will lead to more diverse situations and emergent gameplay.

If you like the gameplay so much playing SP modded AI in Arma 2 and have no confidence in Arma 3 AI, then why go on these Arma 3 forums? You certainly don't offer solutions. Just negative viewpoints about how Bohemia are commercial now and how their AI will never match up to A2.

I can only speak for myself, but as someone who spent lots of time trying to mod & understand Arma 2 behaviour and got VERY frustrated, I can say that the AI in Arma 3 is easier to work with and seems to 'understand' their environment a lot more.

You seem like a decent bloke on the forums and this certainly isn't some sort of personal witch-hunt against you, but I only felt it right to come right back at you about your views on the AI.

Edited September 29, 2013 by Das Attorney

[chrisb 196]

.

Your view, is your view, that's fine, its wrong (imo), but that's life.

[das attorney 858]

Your view, is your view, that's fine, its wrong (imo), but that's life.

Fine. Can you stop spamming threads then with your rhetoric as you have no evidence to back up your view?

If you can come back with some empirical evidence then I'm cool with that and we can talk.

If it's just "your view" then why have you plastered it all over the Arma 3 forums like projectile vomit?

[fn_Quiksilver 1636]

I would laugh at anybody who purchased Arma for linear singeplayer story campaign.

I am an Arma noob and even I am aware that the core value of ArmA is the multiplayer mission editor.

By this time next year there will be a hundred different campaigns for solo or MMO play, many of them will be of higher quality and attention to detail than BI devs can afford to make.

So no, I didn't buy ArmA for a campaign.

I bought ArmA for HUNDREDS of campaigns.

...

There are lots of little irritating things in ArmA 3, but versatility has never been a short-coming.

[Pac Man 10]

So after playing arma1 and arma2, you were actually upset there was no campaign? I for one didn't even acknowledge the Arma1 & 2 campaigns. And I didn't expect to much of a campaign this time either, if any. Lack of content is the least worries atm though. The main concerns for the majority of the people complaining is the medical system, turning speed while prone, being able to carry a backpack and launcher, overall inventory space, weight essentially doing nothing for runspeed and stamina, A2 ports, lack of furniture, duplicate models for sides, a resistance faction being on blufor ... and then ofcourse you have some people who complain about the missing bicycle and jets. All of which can and is being worked on by the community atm. And BIS hopefully. Overall though, if you get down to brass tacks, there's a pretty fair amount of content regarding vehicles and the weapons, which may seem to be a minuscule amount, are very customizable, as you get a "base weapon" to you add whatever attachments you want.

There's plenty of user made SP missions and even campaigns available. Aswell as a gang of MP servers to hop on. Idk about you guys but my server list is extremely populated with full servers.

I would laugh at anybody who purchased Arma for linear singeplayer story campaign.

I am an Arma noob and even I am aware that the core value of ArmA is the multiplayer mission editor.

The official CWC and resistance campaigns from ofp were fantastic. Even redhammer was good. Though after these last campaigns, I don't bother either. Some people think we'll see more good official campaigns, but it's highly unlikely.

Edited September 29, 2013 by Pac Man

[mistyronin 1181]

Well, lets analyze a bit.

Sinecerely i do not care if this is the tenth post speaking about this.

Nice start. I do understand that you feel disappointed, but disrespecting all the forum users it's not gonna solve anything. Just get you kicked.

It is common sense when you buy a game's DVD expecting the whole game and not something like that.

It's common sense to know what product are you buying, not to expect anything else. You had plenty of resources avaliable to document yourself ( from website reviews to this forums ).

If you are lazy to do so, you will be disappointed a lot ( I'm not only speaking about games ).

So...why Bohemia have realesed ArmA 3 if nobody can still play with it? (except for multiplayer? maybe...)

Lots of people in this forums have hundreds of hours in the game, I do and I haven't played MP yet.

I repeat: i wanted something "ready to go".[/Quote]

Then you bought the wrong product. I think that most of Arma players will agree with me that the main OFP/Arma series feature has always been its Editor and its modularity.

Arma is like LEGO, you buy a box with lots of pieces that you can combine as you wish, there is the suggested build in the papers that come inside, but your imagination is the limit.

Concluding, my suggestion is that in the future you should take your time to research before buying a product, then you will know what to expect before paying a cent, and you won't get disapointed.

[Pac Man 10]

...

I noticed the AI doing clever things in A3. Idk if it was a placebo or what, but they seem to constantly flank & use cover better.

[Harbinger2456 10]

You don't have RIGHTS to this stuff in reality

$60 bucks says I've got plenty of rights.

[mistyronin 1181]

$60 bucks says I've got plenty of rights.

$60 bucks says that you have only the established rights in the buying contract and the software customer rights in your country ( in case of EU you have in addition EU rights ), but not more not less.

[Harbinger2456 10]

$60 bucks says that you have only the established rights in the buying contract and the software customer rights in your country ( in case of EU you have in addition EU rights ), but not more not less.

LOL, and if you come out with that crap, then exactly how many customers do you think BIS will have buying their products next time, hmm? Stuff like this spread REALLL fast on the internet. I've already seen some opinions of all this on other forums.

[MissionCreep 12]

i have always find the ArmA's campaing to be really good, of course if you play the game 10h/day you will be foced to expand the game. I was'nt even aware of the existence of User's material.

I repeat: i do not like to loiter around with editors and stuff, if i buy a game is because i want ready-to-go fun. period.

---------- Post added at 21:20 ---------- Previous post was at 21:18 ----------

lesson learned...trust me!

You are joking, right? Arma II campaigns (eg Harvest Red) were unplayable upon release and only functional after several patches (and even then I think were never fully fixed - I don't know because I played them through once and then never again). Community content has always been the way to go. I don't really care that much about the BIS Campaigns. I actually would prefer BIS quit messing with them put more effort into fixing bugs and offer tools to enable the community develop more/better ways for the community to raise the (already high) standards of community modding and missions. In fact, BIS most popular gamemode so far, DayZ, started as a community mod.

Like I give a shit what the unethical, crooked Red Cross thinks. They're just trying to paint over all the unethical stuff they have done.

Go somewhere else to waste your time, troll ...

Edited September 29, 2013 by MissionCreep

[mistyronin 1181]

LOL, and if you come out with that crap, then exactly how many customers do you think BIS will have buying their products next time, hmm? Stuff like this spread REALLL fast on the internet. I've already seen some opinions of all this on other forums.

And you say that because you are a BI investor? Do you think that being angry entitles you to be rude and destructive in this forums? Better, do you think that with that kind of posts you are gonna change anything?

If you care about the game my suggestion is to calm down and try to make constructive criticism and feedback so the devs may improve it. If not, my suggestion would be to forget about the game and occupy your time with something productive, it will make you feel better.

[Pac Man 10]

You are joking, right? Arma II campaigns (eg Harvest Red) were unplayable upon release and only functional after several patches (and even then I think were never fully fixed - I don't know because I played them through once and then never again). Community content has always been the way to go. I don't really care that much about the BIS Campaigns. I actually would prefer BIS quit messing with them put more effort into fixing bugs and offer tools to enable the community develop more/better ways for the community to raise the (already high) standards of community modding and missions. In fact, BIS most gamemode so far, DayZ, started as a community mod.

yeah arma1 and arma2 campaigns were atrocious compared to the former campaigns of ofp. cwc & Resistance was top notch gaming though.

[memphisbelle 99]

Is it actually possibly to become you guys satisfied? ArmA1 was called a Desaster because of the released version...the patches turned it into a great game...ArmA2 was a desaster in release as well...but at the end they turned it into a great game too...and even better....Now they decided to make it official...started an open Alpha and an open beta with discount....they also mentioned that it wouldnt be possible to put the Campaign in the release Version to avoid a Desaster like ArmA2...and what happens? Some people feel attracted to complain nonetheless...so I ask again...is it actually possible to satisfy you guys?

by the way, I have a bad connection as well and I am not crying like the thread starter

[laverniusregalis 10]

Is it actually possibly to become you guys satisfied? ArmA1 was called a Desaster because of the released version...the patches turned it into a great game...ArmA2 was a desaster in release as well...but at the end they turned it into a great game too...and even better....Now they decided to make it official...started an open Alpha and an open beta with discount....they also mentioned that it wouldnt be possible to put the Campaign in the release Version to avoid a Desaster like ArmA2...and what happens? Some people feel attracted to complain nonetheless...so I ask again...is it actually possible to satisfy you guys?

by the way, I have a bad connection as well and I am not crying like the thread starter

You nailed it with this one. Way I see it they release the campaign in parts to prevent it being unplayable for weeks because of bugs. Seems like BIS customers are the worst customers to try to make happy/most pessimistic customers I've ever seen.