An objective look on ArmA III's initial release content.

[nes4day 2]

Just going through ArmA 3's facebook feed, and can't help but notice the amount of people complaining about the lack of content for A3's release. (That and FPS issue which I'm not experiencing, so no comment)

So I've decided to take a a quick look at initial release package volume for all ArmA titles in history.

Please note that for OFP (aka ArmA CWC), the free addon content were omitted from the count, but since I'm doing that off memory, I might've gotten some wrong.

Also note that different variants of the same vehicle/weapon were not counted (and this was done by my judgement as in what is "variant")

And the vehicles that are of the exact same models in A3 are counted as 1 entry only (eg, the Mk6 mortar, and the UAV/UGVs)

I did not count the statistic weapons as I'm simply not that interested in them, and not because I've forgotten.

Ok, let's get started.

Firstly, aircraft

As you can see, A3, though do not lack in rotary, does indeed lack some fixed winged support.

Other Military Vehicles

Note that proper artillery use was not introduced unit A2.

Other vehicles

Note that UAV was introduced in A2 and subs in A3

Moving on to weapons.

Rifle

So A3 doesn't lack weapons, it's just that A2 had a ridiculous amount of them.

Also let's not forget that A3 introduced the attachment system (hooray!)

Other weapons

Note that the A3 shotgun is an unconfirmed one, some tell me it's there, other's say no, I can't find it, but here it is anyways.

Maps

Ok, this one was tricky, while I was able to get the precise data for Altis and Cherno, Sahrani and the old OFP maps were bit more difficult.

After some searching and unscientific calculations, I've put Sahrani at about 120sqkm of land area, and since by comparison, the main islands from OFP are about the same size as Sahrani when combined, that's where those data came from.

Sorry about that.

And finally

Playable missions (Single Only)

The campaigns are counted by "playable missions", cutscenes, maps, etc omitted.

So to me, A3 in most parts, is just another regular content release, with a couple of minor (ok, maybe not minor), omissions.

I personally, besides the lack of fixed wing and the missing shotgun (KSG-12). Am not displeased with the A3 initial package, but it does feel a bit "lite".

As much as I'm a supporter of the "quality over quantity" approach, a bit more stuff (planes, shotgun, bikes), would've been great, but again, I won't complain.

And also, yes, I'm aware that I've left out a lot of things, such as attachments, explosives etc, but this is just a general opinion piece, not my term paper, so unless I get really bored, they won't be included.

Anyways, I'm just posting this here to see what everyone else thinks. And I might put up a few up graphs if this thread gathers some traction.

Thank all

And sorry about the long post.

Edited September 14, 2013 by nes4day

[XCess 0]

I think people are just mad we didn't get a tractor.

[mistyronin 1181]

Good analysis! *applause*

[MavericK96 0]

What I am seeing is that, on the whole, ArmA 2 has a lot more content. I believe that is what people are complaining about. Saying that ArmA 2 has a "ridiculous amount" of weapons doesn't excuse ArmA 3. The predecessor should not outshine the sequel.

[KeyCat 131]

Some good stats you are providing! I'm not to worried as BIS said more will come but I do miss lots of the small stuff like sandbags, lamps, searchlights and so on.

All the small stuff we have in A2:OA combined with the composition feature adds alot when making missions. BTW, anyone seen any updated Editor Addon to get the trees and bushes in th editor?

/KC

[wgaf 10]

Are you counting reskins as separate vehicles?

[Robertqx 10]

Some good stats you are providing! I'm not to worried as BIS said more will come but I do miss lots of the small stuff like sandbags, lamps, searchlights and so on.

All the small stuff we have in A2:OA combined with the composition feature adds alot when making missions. BTW, anyone seen any updated Editor Addon to get the trees and bushes in th editor?

/KC

Did BIS specifically say that more vehicle / weapon / environment / planes content would come, or have they just said that the SP missions will be released?

[chortles 263]

Two more CAS fixed-wing aircraft (one for BLUFOR, one for OPFOR) were already announced... no word on other aircraft, vehicles or weapons though. :( I'm guessing "no" on environments except as paid DLC or standalone expansion, but then again they've never so much as hinted at more than Stratis and Altis so it's not as if the community was expecting more than those two.

[Robertqx 10]

Oh, by environment I just meant more detail / stuff in the current Stratis / Altis maps. Overall I think the islands themselves are awesome in scale and accuracy.

[nes4day 2]

I think people are just mad we didn't get a tractor.

For me personally, that would be the bus. :P

What I am seeing is that, on the whole, ArmA 2 has a lot more content. I believe that is what people are complaining about. Saying that ArmA 2 has a "ridiculous amount" of weapons doesn't excuse ArmA 3. The predecessor should not outshine the sequel.

True, but ArmA 3's weapons are not "lacking" as some people were suggesting (FB/Youtube comments).

Are you counting reskins as separate vehicles?

No. Reskin's are not counted, nor are the same gun with different scopes etc.

Two more CAS fixed-wing aircraft (one for BLUFOR, one for OPFOR) were already announced... no word on other aircraft, vehicles or weapons though. :( I'm guessing "no" on environments except as paid DLC or standalone expansion, but then again they've never so much as hinted at more than Stratis and Altis so it's not as if the community was expecting more than those two.

If that is true then that would be good news, but I've heard nothing of the sort. We can only hope.

[nodunit 397]

I'd like to see graphs wherein content from Arma 1 is evicted from Arma 2, then we'll see just how much content it has on its own.

For example, the abrams and T-72 are from Arma 1 so there goes a strong portion of your MBT. Shilka was in Arma 1 as well, as was the A-10, the AH-1Z, the Mi-8, UH-60, BMP-2, H-9's, BRDM's, UAZ, and lets not even get started on the weapons.

The reason Arma 2 had so much content from the start is because much of it was brought over from Arma 1.

Edited September 14, 2013 by NodUnit

[KeyCat 131]

Did BIS specifically say that more vehicle / weapon / environment / planes content would come, or have they just said that the SP missions will be released?

Yes, check out the SPOTREP's on the A3 website. Can't remember exactly what page but it's there. Exactly how much more content will be added to A3 only BIS knows but judging from my past expererience things will be fine but it will take some time.

/KC

[XCess 0]

I know Arma3 has it's future setting and all that, but I would have liked to see the content from the old games ported over. Seems a waste really, surely it wouldn't take too much work to polish them up a little and throw them in?

[nes4day 2]

I'd like to see graphs wherein content from Arma 1 is evicted from Arma 2, then we'll see just how much content it has on its own.

For example, the abrams and T-72 are from Arma 1 so there goes a strong portion of your MBT. Shilka was in Arma 1 as well, as was the A-10, the AH-1Z, the Mi-8, UH-60, BMP-2, H-9's, BRDM's, UAZ, and lets not even get started on the weapons.

The reason Arma 2 had so much content from the start is because much of it was brought over from Arma 1.

That's an excellent idea, I might do that when I get bored again this weekend.

I know Arma3 has it's future setting and all that, but I would have liked to see the content from the old games ported over. Seems a waste really, surely it wouldn't take too much work to polish them up a little and throw them in?

I read Marek Španěl's interview, apparently they are going to release A2 content package so that we can import them to A3 like we did for ArmA to ArmA 2.

[wgaf 10]

I'd like to see graphs wherein content from Arma 1 is evicted from Arma 2, then we'll see just how much content it has on its own.

For example, the abrams and T-72 are from Arma 1 so there goes a strong portion of your MBT. Shilka was in Arma 1 as well, as was the A-10, the AH-1Z, the Mi-8, UH-60, BMP-2, H-9's, BRDM's, UAZ, and lets not even get started on the weapons.

The reason Arma 2 had so much content from the start is because much of it was brought over from Arma 1.

Which is *exactly* what makes arma2 such a popular and excellent game.

Its enormous amount of content...

This is the first release where we've been robbed of content from previous games.

[nodunit 397]

That's an excellent idea, I might do that when I get bored again this weekend.

I also forgot to add that OFP gained a large portion of vehicles through patches and the Resistance expansion as well, as did A2 (Ah-64D came into Arma 2 with a patch, as did the AH-64 in OFP, SU-34 came into Arma 1 via patch) with Operation Arrowhead and its DLC..can't say for Arma 1 however.

Ultimately one progressed off the other and gained even more over the course of their life time.

Which is *exactly* what makes arma2 such a popular and excellent game.

Its enormous amount of content...

This is the first release where we've been robbed of content from previous games.

On the contrary, the more I think about it. If you evict all content brought into a game that was part of its previous game then it will match up better. Almost all of the weapons are brand new whereas Arma 2 borrowed the base M16, AK's and more Arma 1 along with its tanks and several helicopters. Heli's being the weakest for original because you have the kasatka from PMC, greenforce (one day I'll remember that name) and H-9's from Take on helicopters, and then the fixed wing is from the Czech forced for Arma 2.

The tanks are new, the cars are new, the APC's are new whereas Arma 1 vs Arma 2.. same UAZ's, partially mixed HMMWV's, same bluforce attack and transport helo (just painted differently), same american tank, same russian tanks save for T-90, same BRDM, same BMP, same opfor transport helo, same rocket launchers, mostly same machine guns, see what I mean? It wasn't Arma 2's content to begin with, it was Arma 1's ported, and that doesn't count for creating new.

People want to talk so badly about copy and paste or reskins yet thats a great deal of what Arma 2's vehicle base was, yet nobody cared, why?

The ChDKZ, CDF, NAPA, and Russia in Arma 2 used much of eachothers armament, especially the first 3, they weren't nearly their own side as much as the greenforce.

Oh sure they had more vehicles but they were just reskins of the other sides BMP, UAZ, BRDM, Mi-8, ZSU-23, or T-72.

Edited September 14, 2013 by NodUnit

[nes4day 2]

I also forgot to add that OFP gained a large portion of vehicles through patches and the Resistance expansion as well, as did A2 (Ah-64D came into Arma 2 with a patch, as did the AH-64 in OFP, SU-34 came into Arma 1 via patch) with Operation Arrowhead and its DLC..can't say for Arma 1 however.

Ultimately one progressed off the other and gained even more over the course of their life time.

I actually have tallied all those as well, just got lazy and didn't do a combined table and didn't finish off all the graphs :P, maybe if get around to a round two, I will include the patches, the dlcs etc to see where ArmA 3 might end up like in the future.

[dm 9]

Best thread on A3 content so far. Nice work nes4day!

I agree with NodUnit tho, would like to see a bit more of a breakdown on the content details - especially that "stuff that came from the previous title is not counted" one.

Which is *exactly* what makes arma2 such a popular and excellent game.

Its enormous amount of content...

This is the first release where we've been robbed of content from previous games.

1. Its not the content that makes the Arma series popular. Its that you can do anything with that content.

2. Ergo: If you're playing Arma for the content alone, you're doing something very wrong.

3. What makes you think you're entitled to all the content from the previous game?

[r71 0]

Where are all the trigger sounds in the editor, was looking to add like a dog bark to a trigger and did not find the sounds all the other games had :(

Oh wow I don't even think you can pick like civ car red or blue its just random lol

Edited September 14, 2013 by R71

[mihikle 2]

Well you have to ask yourself... If they could put all that effort into making new A2 content, why couldn't they do it for A3? :/

[zukov 490]

Well you have to ask yourself... If they could put all that effort into making new A2 content, why couldn't they do it for A3? :/

+84 mihikle

[nes4day 2]

Well you have to ask yourself... If they could put all that effort into making new A2 content, why couldn't they do it for A3? :/

Well, like mentioned earlier, a large portion of A2 wepons/vehicles were from A1, which I might demonstrate with a graph later if I ever get this report done, but ok. Um yea.

[13islucky 10]

Very good post. It really does put things in perspective.

One thing though, there were two unconfirmed shotguns that were seen in previous official footage: The M1014 and the KSG-12. If I find any pictures I'll post them.

http://www.imfdb.org/images/c/c7/Arma3_ksg.jpg (591 kB)

Edited September 14, 2013 by 13isLucky
Added pics.

[fitzee 7]

People want to talk so badly about copy and paste or reskins yet thats a great deal of what Arma 2's vehicle base was, yet nobody cared, why?

Hi.

I'm not here to bitch, moan or cry, lol, but IMHO the difference between Arma2's and Arma3's copy/paste is in Arma 2(just like its predecessors) bluefor and opfor had their own equipment. In ArmA3 things have been copy/pasted to different factions.

If you cant understand the difference there then I guess there really isn't anyway to explain it...

I guess the game will be better some time after they release the old content for modders. With any luck it wont cost $5 per vehicle like the payware mod team charges for addon cars in rFactor2.

[celery 8]

The tanks are new, the cars are new, the APC's are new whereas Arma 1 vs Arma 2.. same UAZ's, partially mixed HMMWV's, same bluforce attack and transport helo (just painted differently), same american tank, same russian tanks save for T-90, same BRDM, same BMP, same opfor transport helo, same rocket launchers, mostly same machine guns, see what I mean? It wasn't Arma 2's content to begin with, it was Arma 1's ported, and that doesn't count for creating new.

People want to talk so badly about copy and paste or reskins yet thats a great deal of what Arma 2's vehicle base was, yet nobody cared, why?

The ChDKZ, CDF, NAPA, and Russia in Arma 2 used much of eachothers armament, especially the first 3, they weren't nearly their own side as much as the greenforce.

Oh sure they had more vehicles but they were just reskins of the other sides BMP, UAZ, BRDM, Mi-8, ZSU-23, or T-72.

In Arma 2, you have lots of different assets for each side. In Arma 3, you have lots of the same assets spanning multiple sides, even the main factions, which understandably makes people say it's copypaste (within the game itself). It doesn't matter much if they've been in some other game, what's important is that they're in this one and they can be used to build interesting scenarios.