Tips on flying a helicopter?

[Simas 12]

I found that the helicopter cyclic left and right inputs do not match for keyboards and joysticks (bug #0007816). Can anyone with a joystick do a quick test? I wonder if it's just my hardware or an issue for everyone. If it's true - it might be just animation related issue, or it could mean that you can fly more "effectively" with keyboards..

See: http://i.imgur.com/N3udoVy.jpg

[ephant 10]

I found that the helicopter cyclic left and right inputs do not match for keyboards and joysticks (bug #0007816). Can anyone with a joystick do a quick test? I wonder if it's just my hardware or an issue for everyone. If it's true - it might be just animation related issue, or it could mean that you can fly more "effectively" with keyboards..

See: http://i.imgur.com/N3udoVy.jpg

http://i.imgur.com/7bZEvwH.jpg.

Yup, exactly the same issue on my side.

edit: I can also confirm that it's not just an animation issue.

edit2: xbox 360 pad - same issue.

Edited April 29, 2013 by Ephant

[Chris_W_2k5 10]

I've been using a PS3 controller configured as an Xbox controller. That seems to work very well for flying helicopters.

[old_painless 182]

Flying with keyboard and mouse here. I think I finally got my head around collective vs. cyclic terminology and what key bindings are not relevant ( I now have empty bindings for the analogue cyclics and the left+right turn).

Just one thing I wondered, while blazing across Stratis: With a cyclic pointing forward (helis angle-of-attack is downward pointing eg. for strafing), does the collective up (Q default binding) have to be pressed constantly, or at least "refreshed" from time to time? I thought that a press of Q would tilt the blades and leave them at that tilt to produce some lift to offset the angle-of-attack, but it seems that i need to push it quite a bit?

There are many places to read, but I found this site useful in that its terminology was quite strict: http://www.rchelicopterfun.com/rc-helicopter-controls.html

Also still contemplating a joystick, since I miss freelook when flying with the mouse and the joystick "hat" ministick could be useful for that

Edited April 29, 2013 by Old_Painless

[nodunit 397]

It worked like that in TKOH, however the collective right now functions by on/off rather than power, so basicly same as arma 2. You want to hold the button down to continuously give collective otherwise it drops to 0%, likewise hold Z to achieve -100%.

You can also bind the Analogue collective settings in which the cyclic can influence lift as well, rather than it being a case of collective giving lift, the angle of attack will help produce it.

[old_painless 182]

Right, thanks. Makes sense that TKOH had a more "correct" system. So I'll hold down my Q or Z button for now :)

And then we can hope for some TKOH improvements into Arma 3

Edit: Just noticed a nice thing with the working instruments in the MH9: there is a dial showing collective! If you hold down Q and get lift, you may read off the lift from that dial as a positive number of meters-per-second. And and as soon as you let go of Q that dial drops to 0, explaining why we have to hold in Q continously. The dial is in the second row of instruments ( they are in a 3x3 grid, IIRC)

Becoming quite fond of the new dials, just too bad that the cockpit view has only the three top ones visible, not the collective one. You need to freelook to see that. Joystick, coming up

Cheers,

OP

Edited April 29, 2013 by Old_Painless

[wildone_106 10]

Collective is weird, you can drop it all the way down the chopper wont descend. Bring on the new flight model already

[old_painless 182]

I'm not really sure that I follow - holding down collective down key (default binding Z) works fine at my end and provides descend. Of course, it doesn't drop like a brick. I am on the stable version of Arma 3 though, not the developer branch one ....

[nodunit 397]

Becoming quite fond of the new dials, just too bad that the cockpit view has only the three top ones visible, not the collective one. You need to freelook to see that. Joystick, coming up

Tap 2 on the keypad once or twice, then you will be able to see the whole dash without the view resetting.

[marcai 1]

What is annoying -and could do with changing- is the fact you lose altitude if you are not directly controlling the helo at all times. If I were to quickly minimise the game or check my map, I regularly come back 5 seconds later to a chopper dangerously close to trees or taking a dip in the sea. Just last night I crashed on a multiplayer server because I was looking for a waypoint set by one of my passengers. If autorotating to the ground is to stop DCed/ AFK helicopter pilots stealing choppers or somesuch, I understand why the feature's there, but it could do with a delay of at least 10-20 seconds; although I believe that the cause is the game ignoring analogue input (my joystick throttle) when the in-game screen is active. Anyone else had issues with this?

[nodunit 397]

What is annoying -and could do with changing- is the fact you lose altitude if you are not directly controlling the helo at all times. If I were to quickly minimise the game or check my map, I regularly come back 5 seconds later to a chopper dangerously close to trees or taking a dip in the sea. Just last night I crashed on a multiplayer server because I was looking for a waypoint set by one of my passengers. If autorotating to the ground is to stop DCed/ AFK helicopter pilots stealing choppers or somesuch, I understand why the feature's there, but it could do with a delay of at least 10-20 seconds; although I believe that the cause is the game ignoring analogue input (my joystick throttle) when the in-game screen is active. Anyone else had issues with this?

If it's a feature then it's not a very good one since they won't impliment moving maps into digitized cockpits. I think this has more to do with the loss of control on the mouse and keyboard, if you go use try to talk via text then the "engine" drops to 0 just the same, leaving you to drop like a rock...saddly this was present in Arma 2's Operation Arrowhead and is NOT helpful in ANY way unless you want a hardcore keyboard typing class. Type fast or you crash and die.

[old_painless 182]

Isn't this simply that lift (collective) drops to zero as soon as you let go of the Q button, cf. above. This way, if you maintain a downwards angle of attack while map reading, you will eventually crash

And if the collective setting stays like in TKOH problem will be solved ?

OK, has been experimenting with a joystick (Logitech Extreme 3D Pro). I found that if I bind the joystick throttle to collective up/down (analogue), the lift or collective will stay at the level determined by the throttle. So no need to keep pushing the throttle, like we have to with eg. Q as key. Note that this nice effect does not happen with the non-analogue controls for collective.

Basically, if the throttle can go from 0 to 100, the 50 (middle) position, is neutral collective (hover if horizontal), while pushing it to 80 will provide lift and dropping it down to 20 will give descend.

So with a joystick and using the analogue versions of collective control, I find the A3 helicopters very manageable.

As for looking at the map while airborne: I tried having set the throttle at a positive lift, and then bringing up the ingame map. This does in no way affect the controls of the helicopter, ie. no loss of lift or altitude. Of course if I had brought up the map at a time where I was on a descend, it will continue the descend while I am looking, but looking at the map while ascending will not suddenly drop the helicopter.

I think the key is to use the analogue versions of collective in the helicopter movement controls, rather than the other collective (unbind those).

Edited April 30, 2013 by Old_Painless

[marcai 1]

After getting myself a Thurstmaster HOTAS stick, I've found what I think may be the most annoying issue of the current control scheme (as far as joysticks are concerned). If flying non-analogue, the throttle is hover when centred; extremely useful and a generally common-sense way of doing things. In analogue mode, with the throttle centred, you instead drop at a rate of 5m/s, which is more than enough to injure your passengers. This would be fair enough, but the slightest move higher than that leads to an ascent of about 3m/s. The distance between hover and death-defying drop is incredibly close, with no apparent method of calibrating the throttle in-game for where you want your 'neutral' spot to be. I've tried calibrating my joystick in system settings and changing the sensitivity options in-game for my throttle to no avail,.

As it stands, I much prefer analogue for feeling more natural and responsive when flying, but it is so very temperamental when coming in for a descent, I'm not sure if it's what I intend to use for actual multiplayer use.

[doveman 7]

After getting myself a Thurstmaster HOTAS stick, I've found what I think may be the most annoying issue of the current control scheme (as far as joysticks are concerned). If flying non-analogue, the throttle is hover when centred; extremely useful and a generally common-sense way of doing things. In analogue mode, with the throttle centred, you instead drop at a rate of 5m/s, which is more than enough to injure your passengers. This would be fair enough, but the slightest move higher than that leads to an ascent of about 3m/s. The distance between hover and death-defying drop is incredibly close, with no apparent method of calibrating the throttle in-game for where you want your 'neutral' spot to be. I've tried calibrating my joystick in system settings and changing the sensitivity options in-game for my throttle to no avail,.

As it stands, I much prefer analogue for feeling more natural and responsive when flying, but it is so very temperamental when coming in for a descent, I'm not sure if it's what I intend to use for actual multiplayer use.

Yeah, I've got the same stick and have the same problem. Tapping Q/Z gives me much more control over the throttle and enables me to easily maintain a hover but it's crazy that the keyboard should be more usable than a proper throttle.

[Laggsy 1]

Yeah, I've got the same stick and have the same problem. Tapping Q/Z gives me much more control over the throttle and enables me to easily maintain a hover but it's crazy that the keyboard should be more usable than a proper throttle.

I had the same issues, but saw a resolved ticket on the feedback tracker on this problem.

Solution was to remove any binding in the 'Collective lower (analogue)'. Then map both + and - of your throttle/slider to 'Collective raise (analogue)'

Try it. It worked for me I know have full control over 100% of the slider when landing.(I use Thrustmaster T-Flight X controller).

Edited May 16, 2013 by Laggsy
Removed duplicate post

[old_painless 182]

Same with my stick, really could use a calibration feature in-game. I have a Logitech Extreme 3D Pro

Edit: thanks for the tip Laggsy, gotta try that out tomorrow

[doveman 7]

I had the same issues, but saw a resolved ticket on the feedback tracker on this problem.

Solution was to remove any binding in the 'Collective lower (analogue)'. Then map both + and - of your throttle/slider to 'Collective raise (analogue)'

Try it. It worked for me I know have full control over 100% of the slider when landing.(I use Thrustmaster T-Flight X controller).

Thanks, I'll try that and see if it fixes the problem for me.

[Larrow 2821]

I had the same issues, but saw a resolved ticket on the feedback tracker on this problem.

Solution was to remove any binding in the 'Collective lower (analogue)'. Then map both + and - of your throttle/slider to 'Collective raise (analogue)'

Try it. It worked for me I know have full control over 100% of the slider when landing.(I use Thrustmaster T-Flight X controller).

I spent quite a while looking at this problem with my X52 not using the full throw of the throttle, im quite happy with it now although BIS still need to look at the lower upper limits matching what you get with the keyboard. You can see my findings in several of my posts in this ticket.

[Saliiim 10]

First Person it, it's actually easier, and a lot of servers will force it anyway. Subtle movements with the mouse, the keyboard is only for the throttle, and the very occasional left/right imput.

Don't bother with the showcase. go into the editor and give yourself an MH-64 (the US helicopter), it's much more agile and responsive, so great for beginners. Just fly around in the editor picking spots to land on, starting easy then getting harder, (such as starting with "some where on the airfield", to "on that really narrow street").

Flying helicopters in ARMA take a metric shit-ton of practice, so you'll have to be patient, don't expect to be hovering near the the edge of Mosques' roofs loading civilians into the chopper within a few hours.

Which brings me onto another topic, avoid auto-hover. Yes it's great for noob pilots when they want to land, but you won't learn anything, just avoid it and land that chopper like a bauus.

Landing is the hardest thing, mastering that will give you a lot of control over your bird, so then you can move onto things such as ground attack.

---------- Post added at 20:40 ---------- Previous post was at 20:39 ----------

Really? I find the opposite is true. Although it might just be that I have a little bit of lag between input and movement, because my computer sucks.

[MissionCreep 12]

I don't have any problems flying and landing choppers, what I do have a problem shooting and hitting targets from the air. Rocket fire is generally fine, I can always saturate the target with rocket fire. But I always find the chopper is to be too unstable to be an effective gun platform. I can be more effective if I come in closer, but then I am subject to accurate fire from the ground. I find if I keep moving, I can't hit anything (except with rockets), and once I'm slow/stable enough to fire accurately, I'm a sitting duck to ground fire. Same with strafing, it seems a "safe" strafing speed is too slow to not be hit by ground fire. And if you go in too hot when strafing, your concentration of fire is completely lost.

Any suggestions, other than learn to fly better!?! I know my reaction times could be quicker with more practice ...

Edited May 19, 2013 by MissionCreep

[old_painless 182]

I had the same issues, but saw a resolved ticket on the feedback tracker on this problem.

Solution was to remove any binding in the 'Collective lower (analogue)'. Then map both + and - of your throttle/slider to 'Collective raise (analogue)'

Try it. It worked for me I know have full control over 100% of the slider when landing.(I use Thrustmaster T-Flight X controller).

Ok, it worked for me too, thanks. On the ground, the throttle fully at one end means no lift, while any other position for the throttle means some level of lift generated. Airborne, I need to check the lift-meter regularly as the pitch also factors in.

[marcai 1]

I had the same issues, but saw a resolved ticket on the feedback tracker on this problem.

Solution was to remove any binding in the 'Collective lower (analogue)'. Then map both + and - of your throttle/slider to 'Collective raise (analogue)'

Try it. It worked for me I know have full control over 100% of the slider when landing.(I use Thrustmaster T-Flight X controller).

Apologies for taking forever to reply to this. I have to say it's an improvement, but is really just the inverse problem for me, now. My 'take off' point is now at about 30% rather than the 60-70% it was before. Whilst it's definitely an improvement for my own (and passenger's) health -not to mention my instruments- it's still not exactly right. I really do wish that it was as clear-cut as the middle of the throttle being hover, up and down being just that. I don't like having to approximate my hover point each time I want to slow down.

[mordeaniischaos 3]

Get either a Gamepad (easy mode) or a joystick with a throttle and PEDALS. No one tells anyone to get pedals, but you need rudder control. It's incredibly important, and a lot of mediocre pilots in Arma are so because they don't use rudders. Any analogue controls will be very useful as you can easily make small corrects. Also, make sure you do not use "turn left" or "turn right" because that is actually a weird combo of rudder and collective left/right. It's much better to use "left pedal" and "right pedal" as I believe they are labeled in controls, because often you'll need to use them without also adjusting collective in the same direction. Especially when taking off/landing, or when trying to "strafe" or even "circle strafe" like you would on the ground.

Having head tracking is hugely helpful as well, because you can easily maintain all control and look around to get proper awareness.

I don't much like flying in Arma 3 either. The choppers are way too twitchy and responsive. Even with analogue controls, small corrections are difficult. And the way that collective increase and decrease works is a bit weird, and the controls are a bit fucked up right now for them with controllers.

Ultimately it just takes practice. I might end up doing that "Basics of Rotary" video I've been thinking of doing to help with the basics. There are a few things that when you figure out help a LOT. One tip I'll give you, is that you should grab the "Workhorse" mission on Armaholic for Arma 2, and that'll help you eventually master the most difficult part of flying once you get the controls set up comfortably and get used to handling: landing and hovering.

[KingScuba 1]

I made a video if you're interested highlighting some basic landings and general how to.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pXIfg40kado

http://www.twitch.tv/kingscuba/b/411449278

[Ezcoo 47]

I don't much like flying in Arma 3 either. The choppers are way too twitchy and responsive. Even with analogue controls, small corrections are difficult. And the way that collective increase and decrease works is a bit weird, and the controls are a bit fucked up right now for them with controllers.

I agree with you otherwise, but I couldn't disagree more on the quoted part. I absolutely love the responsive controls; they have fixed the input lag and weird feeling in controls that was present in A2. It's just a pure pleasure to fly chopper in A3, especially the MH-9 and AH-9 that have pretty neat flight models, they feel light, responsive and quick like I suppose they should (Ka-60 is waiting for the fix to the jet-like flight model though; eg. when you make an U-turn in the air, the speed increases :p). The instant and accurate response of the controls allows you to do the important tiny little tweaks multiple times per second with your cyclic control, which is like it is IRL as well. Just watch vids eg. where pilot is hovering or landing a chopper, see how they make those tiny little fixes all the time. However, I agree that the collective settings and feel are still a little bit weird, I had to map both the + and - of throttle axises of X52 Pro to the analogue collective raise as well and it still feels a little bit weird, not much though. I'm still confident that it doesn't disturb at all when compared to eg. the deadly input lag in A2.

Whoever made the controls so responsive, thank you so much... Love it! :cool: