Syria - What should we do if anything?

[Baff1 0]

Only if Syria goes to war with Turkey.

If Turkey is attacked.

If Turkey attacks Syria, then NATO has no obligation to join in.

[W0lle 1050]

Well in the first paragraph they say:

Turkey's government has called an emergency security meeting amid reports that one of its fighter jets was shot down by Syrian security forces.

Two paragraphs later it is:

Prime Minister Recep Tayyip Erdogan has told a news conference there is still no confirmation of what brought the jet down, nor of the fate of its two crew.

So in other words: no one knows anything at all except that the old F-4 crashed and pilots survived. Not the first Phantom they lose by accident.

[Tonci87 163]

And we don´t know who shot it down (if it was shot down) maybe the rebels did it to provoke a Turkish reaction.

[Nicholas 5]

I guess it was just confirmed by the Syrian military.

Syrian military says it downed Turkish fighter jet

The Syrian military has said it shot down a Turkish plane "flying in airspace over Syrian waters", according to state-run news agency Sana.

[Nicholas 5]

I wonder how this will play out?

Turkey says it will take ‘steps’ after determining that Syria shot down missing jet

[ProfTournesol 956]

And we don´t know who shot it down (if it was shot down) maybe the rebels did it to provoke a Turkish reaction.

Conspiracy theory isn't always valid, even if it sounds fun.

[Tonci87 163]

Conspiracy theory isn't always valid, even if it sounds fun.

That isn´t a conspiracy, it is a strategy. I guess the rebels would be quite happy if Turkey attacks the syrian army.

[fraczek 4]

That isn´t a conspiracy, it is a strategy. I guess the rebels would be quite happy if Turkey attacks the syrian army.

Still, one not that much likely I think. The FSA have access to what, at most some liberated MANPADS? And by first accounts, the F4 was downed while still over Turkish waters, which would be a pretty difficult feat for an older handheld MANPADS like Strela or something like that. Of course that is just speculation based on few public sources and "claimed" performance envelopes.

[NoRailgunner 0]

Tonic87 stop talking BS:

Turkey's President, Abdullah Gul, has said the Turkish fighter jet shot down by Syria's air defence forces on Friday may have violated Syrian airspace. Mr Gul said it was routine for warplanes flying at high speed to cross borders for short distances. Syria has said it engaged the aircraft in its airspace "according to the laws that govern such situations", and that it crashed into the Mediterranean Sea. The Turkish and Syrian navies are searching for the two crew members.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-middle-east-18562210

[slatts 1978]

Conspiracy theory isn't always valid, even if it sounds fun.

In fairness to him, he wrote it before it was posted the Syrian Army confirmed they did it.

Plus it doesn't sound invalid at all, The rebels are in a desperate situation and you never know what they might do. Would you be able to tell who fired a SAM or AA guns? If no one claimed responsibility, the finger would point to the Government side and not the rebels and the rebels know that. (But didn't in this case.)

[ProfTournesol 956]

In fairness to him, he wrote it before it was posted the Syrian Army confirmed they did it.

Plus it doesn't sound invalid at all, The rebels are in a desperate situation and you never know what they might do. Would you be able to tell who fired a SAM or AA guns? If no one claimed responsibility, the finger would point to the Government side and not the rebels and the rebels know that. (But didn't in this case.)

What i meant is that always searching behind the facts what "could have happened" is sometimes a little overdone, particularly here. Anyway, Syria confirmed.

[Bozkro 1]

I'm not even sure anymore. Let the failure U.N do there apparent job, and "try" and restore peace within Syria.

[-GR-Operative 10]

This is starting to get out of control. I wonder if Syria would have shot that plane down in other circunstances.

I mean, if you look at it from other angle, it's like a warning.

[gammadust 12]

Take it with a pinch of salt:

Syrian source claiming "an unidentified aerial target violated Syrian airspace" "[hit] 1 kilometer away from land" "[crashing] 10 kilometers from the beach".

Sana attaches this map.

The story as changed so many times it is hard to have an idea. Anyway, both sides seem to prefer to tone down the incident. Let's see how this turns out.

[dekster 1]

Well at least it shows Syrian airspace isn't penetrable like Lybian.

[Nicholas 5]

Well at least it shows Syrian airspace isn't penetrable like Lybian.

Because Russia provided them AA missles.

[Daniel 0]

Well at least it shows Syrian airspace isn't penetrable like Lybian.

Not exactly, it's not as if this old Phantom had an accompanying SEAD mission. I'm sure Syrian airspace could be made penetrable if NATO commit enough resources.

[dekster 1]

Because Russia provided them AA missles.

Yes I know, I also read Iran has spec ops on the ground and Russia also has troops providing support.

Nato/US is not going to start a war in Syria, it's not worth it.

[ProfTournesol 956]

Yes I know, I also read Iran has spec ops on the ground and Russia also has troops providing support.

Nato/US is not going to start a war in Syria, it's not worth it.

And Lebanese Hezbollah, supported by Iran, are crossing the border very often.

[Bozkro 1]

Is the UN even in Syria any more? I thought they were pulled out, there isn't much news of the horrible "peace-keeping" force, taking part in these situations, since they know, and so does practically, the entire world know about there failures in, Bosnia, Rwanda, Lebanon, Chechen, Haiti and now Syria. Like honestly.. It's more of a shame. The United Nations should be disbanded.

[slatts 1978]

Is the UN even in Syria any more? I thought they were pulled out, there isn't much news of the horrible "peace-keeping" force, taking part in these situations, since they know, and so does practically, the entire world know about there failures in, Bosnia, Rwanda, Lebanon, Chechen, Haiti and now Syria. Like honestly.. It's more of a shame. The United Nations should be disbanded.

They are still there, they stopped the observer missions due to the fact they were unarmed and constantly being shot at. And it wasn't a peace keeping force.

Peace keeping missions need to be agreed by UN members, which why Chechnya was a "failure", as it wasn't agreed to let them in.

I cant think of any failures in Lebanon. Isreal still attacking Lebanon isn't the PK fault. Thy are meant to keep both sides on their side of the blue line. There's piece of isreali tank armour in the main Irish DF barracks and names on a memorial of lads killed in action to say we at least did what we were supposed to.

Bosnia, I'm sure you mean the massacre when the dutch forces left, that was one incident that ruined the UNPK ops forever, yet there are more good then bad.

The UN being disbanded? Pah. More good is done but most people fail to see it.

[eble 3]

Turkey invokes article 4 of the NATO treaty.

Conflicting reports the wreckage has been found in syrian waters, though Turkey say it was in international waters.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-middle-east-18568207

[ProfTournesol 956]

What amazed me is seing such a plane outside of a museum.

[PELHAM 10]

Hi all, back from holiday. Very strange event isn't it? Why no warnings, why the unusual agressiveness?

The wreckage has been located in over 1300m of water which makes Syria's claim that the jet crashed 10km off Om al-Tuyou doubtful. If you look at this nautical chart of the area:http://www.charts.noaa.gov/NGAViewer/56041.shtml

Waters of that depth don't occur until more than twice that distance from shore. It looks more likely that the jet was flying in international airspace. Even if it did fly a few miles inside Syrian airspace, why the shootdown, usually nations issue a formal protest when this occurs? Syrian radar would have been able to track the jet from takeoff at Erhac Airbase, it's only 100 miles from the Syrian border. The Syrian account doesn't add up.

With the Russian arms shipments and their determination to keep their naval base at Tartus, defections from the airforce and army, intimidation of UN observers, civilian massacres etc. was this done to change the headlines? What a crackpot regime.

Edited June 24, 2012 by PELHAM

[Iroquois Pliskin 0]

It is called baiting a whole Alliance into a binding legal resolution, which will end up with bombs raining down the skies over Damascus, courtesy of yours truly. :D

Have a nice Summer, folks.